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Old 03-28-2006, 03:48 PM
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Talking Here's some very POSITIVE news form the Assemblywoman who introduced this bill!

I just got off the phone w/Assemblywoman Field's office. I had a lengthy & very informative chat with her assistant. I just called this AM & he called back ASAP - I appreciate that!
Ok - here goes. They were asked to introduce this bill on behalf of a downstate group concerned w/fatalities caused by brush guards. Apparently, the injuries suffered by the victims were worse due to the brush guard. I agree that is possible. Keep reading though.......
The purpose of the bill is MAINLY to stop the luxury SUV'ers from adding brush guards for the LOOK of it. We're talking Lexus & Mercedes types - they'd NEVER take their trucks off road! The assembly is working to make sure BOTH sides are taken into account.
The Assembly does NOT want to infringe on the rights of those who have a valid need for the brush guards. They KNOW there are many responsible off roaders who are not blinging their vehicles. They do NOT want to ban us from the right to equip our trucks for the sport of off roading.
Here's the BEST part - THEY WANT OUR FEEDBACK! THEY WANT OUR IDEAS! THEY WANT TO WORK TOGETHER FOR A VIABLE SOLUTION!
I was personally asked to solicit ideas from YOU! We ALL need to get in on this. The Assemblywoman's office already s/w these companies to ask about a removable/break away guard but nothing has been developed - yet!
I suggested grandfathering the guards in & this can be accomplished w/a yearly inspection - a window sticker would show that vehicle was exempt. I also suggested a "user fee" (now wait 1 cotton pickin' minute till I finish!!!!!! LOL!) where NEW vehicles must PURCHASE A PERMIT to install a brush guard! I'd even be willing to pay a fee allowing me to have mine on full time. Now with these suggestions, there are caveats - what about if I buy a new truck - will I need to pay again or can I switch the guard over? I even suggested showing proof of off road activity - a receipt from an approved park for instance. I also pointed out the revenue NYS loses by being off road unfriendly. I suggested they open up state land for us & HE'S GOING TO FORWARD MY SUGGESTIONS! I even appealed to him to be allowed to speak to the entire Assembly. I was told that hasn't been done but he will look into it & TRY to get it approved! Hey guys - I may go to Albany! Let's have a G2G! Where should we do lunch!
I was told several times - WE NEED TO WRITE/CALL & VOICE OUR OPINIONS! THEY WANT AN OPEN, HONEST DIALOGUE WITH ALL OF US!
This Assemblywoman is on the State sportsman committee so she is VERY aware of the rights of people to enjoy outdoor activities. We may get MORE than a way to keep our brush guards - we MAY get places to legally off road! BUT WE NEED TO RESPOND & VOICE OUR OPINIONS! WE NEED TO DO IT NOW!
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Old 03-28-2006, 05:09 PM
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yeah that's great but what about us from places like L.I. that don't have offroad places and are in for the bling. if they are worried about traffic in the city then ban tem in nyc of city limits not just everywhere. if someone get hit how much worse is a bar going to make it
also most of these bars are attached where the bumper is attached to so mabey we need to remove bumpers as well
this has been my agruement in my emails
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Old 03-28-2006, 05:34 PM
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Jason, just got off the phone with Ang a few minutes ago. This bill started down here with Ginny Fields. she is looking for input from "us" truck owners.
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Old 03-28-2006, 05:41 PM
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Good point Jason. That's why I proposed a "registration" of sorts. It could be a windshield sticker or something on the registration & if pulled over, it would exempt us. Face it - there are a TON of LUXURY SUV's that would no more go off roading than I'd end up on Broadway! Those are the people they're targeting. Many of those drivers do develop an aggressive style because they think they're somehow invulnerable to damage & the heck with the pedestrians or small cars. I know that personally, I'm acutely aware of the EXTRA responsibility of driving a large, heavy vehicle & so do any of the truck owners I know.
Jason - think up some ideas & post them. Next time I to talk to the Assemblywoman's office I'll pass them along!
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Old 03-28-2006, 05:47 PM
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Now if you contact her or her office, BE NICE! Her assistant is very anxious to work WITH us & wants our input. We have a wonderful opportunity to help shape a bill that will not hurt us!
I have asked to be allowed to address the Assembly in person & her office is going to look into making that possible. Maybe you can meet me in Albany & ALL of us can show support for POSITIVE legislation! That would be great for us, the website & NYS too!
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Old 03-28-2006, 07:09 PM
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I REALLY don't like the idea of exceptions-registering an aftermarket part. What's next registering class 3 hitches? They keep the rear bumper on my truck from folding down as designed. I did send an email to my local congressman on this issue. I would like to see proof that brush bars are causing more injury than a regular bumper. I really like to see some testing done before a law is passed. .
This bill needs to be lost in committee. It is a very slippery slope to go down. Once it starts down it's very tough to get back up.
Cowlady is is possible for you to get the name of this downstate group? I really like to see the fatality data they have collected. I might do a little background checking on them too. I wouldn't be suprised if this group is funded by insurance companies.....
Don't jump on the more legislation bandwagon with out all the facts!
Since I'm on my soapbox.
How about police cars,towtrucks, even some taxis here. Are they going to be exempted? Do you get less hurt if your hit be them?

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Old 03-28-2006, 07:25 PM
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i am not from the NY, but as an american i would like to put in some input.

someone needs to get to the source of this downstate group and see what data exactly and how it was collected, its very easy to manipulate the facts.

fees and registration? i don't see the purpose, what, more fees will automatically make having a brushguard safer? the point of the whole legislation is because brushguards were deemed unsafe.

and is this downstate gruop, what legimate foundation do they have? i mean in reality can someone just come up with a group and make something up and send it in to the state?

what does the state highway patrol and ntsb have to say about it?

to me its bending the facts, and second of all, it doesn't matter why someone has a brushgyard on, whether its for looks or not, its still america, whats wrong with having something on for looks?

this looks like a manipulations of facts to me by a self interest group who for some reason wants something to their credit.
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Old 03-28-2006, 08:38 PM
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I asked for the name of the groip but the secretary didn't know it. She did however, have the assistant call me back in a very short time.
We had a very productive talk as he asked me to canvass my friends & come up with ideas & suggestions. The fee was my idea as a way to allow us to keep the brush guard on & not have to carry it in the beds of our trucks.
I will try again to get the name of the group but 1 place we can try to find it is from some Lomg Island Dune Buggy group. JDenninger has heard of this group so I asked him to find out more.
All I'm asking for are your ideas. They are going to work on getting me permission to address the Assembly in person - it's never been done! Now that shows me they are willing to listen to what we think & say. Even if I can't speak to the Assembly, at least we have the attention of the Assemblywoman who introduced the bill. She is also on the Sportsman Committee & has a keen interest in protecting our rights.
We're not defeated yet so let's not give up! We CAN do this!
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Old 03-28-2006, 09:23 PM
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ang, found the link for the li beach buggy - http://www.libba.com/
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Old 03-28-2006, 10:05 PM
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My thoughts

After reading everyone's posts here, the new comments on Autoblog, a long conversation with Ang on the phone , and thinking about this for the last hour, here are my thoughts:

1) I am a bit concerned that Assemblywoman Field's office's can not provide the name and contact information for the downstate group that provided the data on which this bill is based. Makes you wonder it there really is a group and if a study was really done.

2) If a study was done, why is it now they are starting to contact the grill guard/brush guard manufacturers? Shouldn't that have been done in the original study? Are they just saying this now to put us off or is this an honest effort to do the right thing?

3) bf250 brings up a lot of good points. I don't think we should allow the ban no matter what. What difference does it make if it is strickly for "bling" factor as Jason stated. Everyone should be entitled to modify their vehicle as they see fit provided it is safe based on "factual" data such as the real safety issue with using front axle lift blocks.

4) We have to be careful what we say and that we don't generalize things as they are doing. For example from your original post Ang, "We're talking Lexus & Mercedes types - they'd NEVER take their trucks off road!" Sorry I have to disagree here. There are a lot of Toyota/Lexus owners that do wheel their vehicles as do Mercedes owners. Maybe not as much as other makes, but there are those that do. I was considering getting a Land Cruiser so I am a member of the Gotham City Land Cruisers and believe me they wheel their rigs. My parents own a Mercedes ML and I am on several Mercedes boards and there are ML owners that wheel their rigs. There are even "soft roaders" that are know to wheel. I know of one Honda CRV (yes you read that right) that wheels regularly at Paragon.

5) As I stated on Autoblog, if this issue is the driver of the grill guarded SUV than deal with the driver not the grill guarded SUV. The driver will be an issue weather or not they are behind the wheel of an SUV, car, or motorcycle.

I am sure that if I think about this more I could go on and on, but those are just a few points that concern me about this. Don't get me wrong people I am all for working with whoever is willing to work with us, but we have to be careful as to if they another agenda and what that agenda is.
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Old 03-28-2006, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdenninger
ang, found the link for the li beach buggy - http://www.libba.com/
JD - was this the group that did the study? Doesn't sound right.
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Old 03-29-2006, 05:20 AM
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No - the buggy group is against the bill but I believe they know who started it. Maybe JD can contact them & ask?
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Old 03-29-2006, 12:50 PM
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We need to get the data and find out exactly what their stand is. Then we can move forward to disprove their data or maybe correct their misperception on the grill guards.

After thinking about this more my main concern is we need to deal with facts, not the emotions and perceptions that are coming up. Right now it does not appear that anyone has the facts least of all us. Look at the comments coming up on Autoblog about this. It is almost all emotional and misperceptions on both sides of the issue.

My other concern is if we concede on banning grill guards for bling purposes what is to prevent them to continue down that "slippery slope" as ken75ranger stated and ban grill guards all together because it will be easier to administer. Then ban replacement bumpers. Then ban trucks and SUVs. I think we need to be looking at this issue very carefully before we help them ban anything.
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Old 04-01-2006, 09:04 PM
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Angela, I can't believe you even put the idea of a "fee" into one of our well-informed, smarter-than-us, legislators. NY has enough taxes and fees already. There are so many laws on the books now that are not enforced. For example the license plate must "be displayed in its entirety" (DMV), no plastic covers or plate frames that the dealers are still putting on new vehicles. I'm writing to each of those on the list individually, they probably won't like it when I call them stupid, and should look at other ways to spend our tax dollars.
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Old 04-01-2006, 09:45 PM
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has anyone gotten any info yet on what group started this and what info they are using so far all my emails have gone unanswered
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Old 04-01-2006, 09:45 PM
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