[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 03-Jan-01 AT 03:58 PM (EST)[/font][p]hi everyone, I picked up the Janury edition of Petersens 4wheel & offroad and found a very interesting article. It tells you how to make your own posi trac rear out of your already installed locker. With an open diff. it is done by welding the spider gears to the side gears. Doing it to a Trac-Lok requires cutting small pieces of metal to bridge over the friction discs. Anybody have any experience with this? I've never heard of such a rig. Also do you think that this can be done with a MIG welder or do I have to break out the ARC? I think after this I am done askin so many questions for awhile. Probably starting to get on peoples nerves. Thanks again, Mike
P.S. Dunno if I should do this but if anyone is interested in a NPG 203 full time transfer case I have one up on ebay.
78 F-150 Custom 4x4 Shortbed 400 C6 straight pipes
77 F-150 Custom 4x4 Longbed 351M hopped up cam,4 on the floor
96 Explorer XLT stock few "look" mods
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It's not what you buy, it's what you build!
1979 F-150 4x4 Shortbed 4 spd 351M mild cam and many other neat thingers
1978 F-150 w/250 front end Supercab 4x4 400 Mild cam
1977 F-150 Longbed 4x4 4s
I don't know for sure, as I've never delved into the depths of the bottomless pit I call a diff., but if you welded up the spider gears, wouldn't that make it impossible for one wheel to spin faster than the other? You do realize that the wheels need to spin at different speeds when you turn, right?
-Andrew
f250_64(No Email Addresses In Posts!), same for yahoo messenger
Nothing, and I mean nothing, stirs the soul, saying I'm a bad MoFo like lettin'em rip with a window shaking, fuel gulpin, carbon monoxide belchin, attention gettin, V-oh my LORD!-8!
This has been done before, I've seen this in several mags in the past. It does work, BUT you'll change the handling of your truck by a lot.
Diffs come in different styles and welding a diff makes it act just like a spool. A spool turns both tires at the same speed. This is great for straight ahead traction, but tough for street use. A spool is cheap traction for special use, I wouldn't do it for a regular truck. Tires will churp around corners and cause excess wear. Handling is changed too.
The best bet for most trucks is some kind of limited slip type rear that will lock or near lock when spin is noticed or will lock and then unlock for turning.
For the front, it depends on if you've got part-time or full-time 4wheel drive. For full time, you need something that will allow wheels to turn at different speeds, at least for turning. For part time, you could go with a locker or partial locker and then only use it offroad. Most prefer a partial locker up front and this allows 3 wheel drive most of the time and 4 wheels some time (usually when one front wheel spins)
I would think hard about this and if you still want to try it, a spool is one of the cheapest diffs to buy, you could buy one, try it and then change back.
Im willing to try it, i have a spare 9" laying around so it's no big deal. Spools are fine on cars so what can it hurt on a truck. Youll just get a few looks when pulling into a parking space. nothing wrong with a little attention. People always quirk them dangerous and erratic handling itll just take a little getting used to as they say in their magazine.."Its generally something that you have to get used to, kinda like a manual transmission, you probably chugged and jerked the thing all the way down the block for a few days until finally getting used to it" But is a manual tranny dangerous? of course not. My project truck isn't running right now but when I do get it going again, i'll let you in on the details. Mike
78 F-150 Custom 4x4 Shortbed 400 C6 straight pipes
77 F-150 Custom 4x4 Longbed 351M hopped up cam,4 on the floor
96 Explorer XLT stock several "look" mods
__________________
It's not what you buy, it's what you build!
1979 F-150 4x4 Shortbed 4 spd 351M mild cam and many other neat thingers
1978 F-150 w/250 front end Supercab 4x4 400 Mild cam
1977 F-150 Longbed 4x4 4s
I hope you have some spare axles in the bed and enough tools to change them in a pinch. It's either that or buy a set of mosier axles-$300 that are garanteed not to break. Stock axles and spider gears with 100,000+ miles on them aren't going to last long.
I have spare everything for the rear so it shouldnt be a problem, I just hope I dont have to resort to it. 4wheel said theres is holding up fine, they said they didnt do any torture tests yet, but they'll let us know when they do. I'll have to grab a Feb. edition and see how things are. I dont really think ill be beating the hell out of it that much ayways.
Thanks,
Mike
__________________
It's not what you buy, it's what you build!
1979 F-150 4x4 Shortbed 4 spd 351M mild cam and many other neat thingers
1978 F-150 w/250 front end Supercab 4x4 400 Mild cam
1977 F-150 Longbed 4x4 4s
i do this in my demo cars all the time..it works fine for that but if you drive it on the highway and turn with it much it wont last long at all....it'll break as the friction doesnt allow the tires to spin at different speeds therefore it causes stress on the rear. just a reminder.
if you travel dirt or gravel all the time then go for it.
[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Jan-01 AT 01:28 AM (EST)[/font][p]One last thing before I hit the sack, I'm not trying to be smart or nothing but how come the old muscle cars could survive with posi rear but my Ford wont? Really lost on that one. My dad had posi in his 71 charger and he said it never gave him any trouble. I wonder how many driveshafts i'll be twisting up tryin to smoke 'em . My moms done that before in the 77, not a cool thing, and thats not even posi. Thanks again ~Mike
P.S. Got the web page up if you wanna see what I'm workin on right now, nothin special really. http://ourworld.cs.com/krystalmeth2000
__________________
It's not what you buy, it's what you build!
1979 F-150 4x4 Shortbed 4 spd 351M mild cam and many other neat thingers
1978 F-150 w/250 front end Supercab 4x4 400 Mild cam
1977 F-150 Longbed 4x4 4s
The old muscle cars were limited slip. They weren't locked all the time; they had the same type of deal that I've got in my truck, it uses self-energizing clutches and a bunch of stuff I don't understand, so that it unlocks for going around corners.
-Andrew
f250_64(No Email Addresses In Posts!), same for yahoo messenger
Nothing, and I mean nothing, stirs the soul, saying I'm a bad MoFo like lettin'em rip with a window shaking, fuel gulpin, carbon monoxide belchin, attention gettin, V-oh my LORD!-8!
It really sounds like your confused about the differences between a limited-slip, locker, and spool. Your "Posi" in your car was a limited slip. Limited slips are no problem on or off road. Welding your diff does not make it a locker, it makes it the same as a spool. I read that article you mentioned, and believe me, you WILL regret turning your diff into a spool if you drive it on pavement. But I bet your young, so cheers! You might want to look in the off-road forum, they have a great deal of good info on this. Good luck.
If your knuckles ain't bleeding you did something wrong.
'72 F-250 4x4, Dana 60/HD44, FE390 @ 400hp(purt near!), 4-speed, custom suspension w 4" lift, black on black.
>I hope you have some spare
>axles in the bed and
>enough tools to change them
>in a pinch. It's
>either that or buy a
>set of mosier axles-$300 that
>are garanteed not to break.
> Stock axles and spider
>gears with 100,000+ miles on
>them aren't going to last
>long.
>
>Good luck
>Corey
I agree 100% with 400HP794X4, as I have firsthand experience. I broke axles after welding the diff in my 1969 F250 4x4's Dana 60. I beat the !@#$% out of that truck racing everything in sight. Did you notice the magazine did that to a full-floating Dana 60 as well? With a full-floating Dana 60, the wheel won't come off if an axle breaks. With your Ford 9", it's a whole different story... Spools require extremely stout (not stock) axles, and cause handling problems on asphalt if any turning is required. It's not a good feeling when the truck tries to change lanes when an axle breaks while drag racing from a stoplight.
I ended rolling the truck a while later because of the squirrely unpredictable handling of the welded differential. During my rebuild/restoration of that truck, I removed the mess I created and installed a Dana Power-lock diff - far far better. The Trac-loc is OK too. If you have one of these limited slip diffs, fix it by installing new clutch plates. I'll be happy to explain how. Don't destroy one by welding it together - unless you want to trailer your truck to the rock-crawling trail. I cringed when I saw that magazine publish how to weld up a differential.
In other words, don't make the same mistake I made 10 years ago when I was in high school, you might not be as lucky as I was - being able to walk away from my shiny-side-down F250 4x4.
Art
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Here's one of my trucks, the rest are in my gallery...
Art, thanks for the practical experience and the sharing of the tale of woe. That type of story is important for folks to hear. When I read that article I cringed to, figuring kids everywhere would be welding up their diffs. Nothing wrong with them illustrating how to weld your diff, but I do think they portrayed it as an okay street mod which all of us in the know strongly believe to be false. I thought the lack of that distinction made it dangereous. Maybe I'm getting old, but I actually thought about writing in to address it, maybe I still will.
If your knuckles ain't bleeding you did something wrong.
'72 F-250 4x4, Dana 60/HD44, FE390 @ 400hp(purt near!), 4-speed, custom suspension w 4" lift, black on black.
It's deadly dangerous, and illeagle any where! With that said, I would love to talk you out of it, but most of us did it when we were young! so I'm sure you will to! Just remeber this!!! YOU WILL NEVER HEAR FROM ANYONE THAT HAS DONE IT THAT DIDN"T HAVE A FAILURE OF SOME SORT!!! If anyone says diferent, thay are LYING!!!
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few "look" mods
nothing wrong with a little attention. People always quirk them dangerous and erratic handling itll just take a little getting used to as they say in their magazine.."Its generally something that you have to get used to, kinda like a manual transmission, you probably chugged and jerked the thing all the way down the block for a few days until finally getting used to it" But is a manual tranny dangerous? of course not. My project truck isn't running right now but when I do get it going again, i'll let you in on the details. Mike
