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Old 09-22-2005, 06:21 PM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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Talking jacobs electronics mileage master improvements?

I have a 53 F-250 with a 460 and C-6 with 3:50 rearend and 30 inch tall tires....I CURRENTLY get 13 MPG around town.....I havent been on a trip longer than 50 miles yet, so no idea what it will get on the freeway....I suspect around 15 or so....I am getting ready to put on a Jacobs Electronics Mileage Master.....I'm wondering if anyone else has ever put one on their 460 and if so, how big of a difference did it make? I had one on my 302 in my mustang, and I noticed about a 4MPG gain....
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Old 09-25-2005, 11:52 PM
Uglyhat Uglyhat is offline
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I'll second the question and ask about MSD ignitions as well - mileage improvements anyone?
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Old 09-26-2005, 12:09 AM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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When I put the Jacobs system on my mustang, I accidentaly didnt tie one of the wires up and it drooped down on the headers, and the wire melted through and shorted out thus ruining the Jacobs system. I put a MSD 6A on it after that due to $$$. When I changed to the MSD from the Jacobs, it lost 2 MPG......But that was with a 302 in a mustang.....Not a 460 in a truck.
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Old 09-30-2005, 05:03 PM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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I guess no-one else has tried them......Interesting that the companies would lie to us like that.....We must be the only two in the world to use those systems......
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Old 10-09-2005, 01:08 AM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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Wow, no-one has tried the Jacobs OR MSD systems and noticed a mileage gain.....Interesting. Has anyone tried that "Tornado" thing that fits under your air filter?
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Old 10-09-2005, 08:05 AM
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I've tried neither, but I give the tornado no chance of working. I would like to try the Jacobs system but haven't gotten to it yet.
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Old 10-09-2005, 08:30 AM
Bob Ayers Bob Ayers is offline
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Don't waste your money on these aftermarket add-ons. You can affect your MPG more, by keeping the OEM components (plug wires, spark plugs, filters*,tire pressure, etc.) in good shape, along with changing your driving habits.

* Use the OEM paper air filter, changing it regularly, DO NOT waste your money on air filters like K&N.
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Old 10-09-2005, 11:55 AM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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LOL....Okaaayyy.....I already put a K & N filter on my truck....As well as a Jacobs electronics system. In the past, I have noticed around a 4 MPG cincrease on my mustang when I did just the Jacobs system. Therefore, I know that it DOES help. As for the K & N filter, my E.T.'s went down as a result of using a K & N filter on the same vehicle. So once again, dont say that THOSE dont do anything either. I am trying to keep open minded here and am asking if others have TRIED the tornado on their vehicle.....It sounds to me that you havent tried it yet, so you dont speak from experience, but from what you have heard.
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Old 10-09-2005, 12:16 PM
Bob Ayers Bob Ayers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 53wa2fl
LOL....Okaaayyy.....I already put a K & N filter on my truck....As well as a Jacobs electronics system. In the past, I have noticed around a 4 MPG cincrease on my mustang when I did just the Jacobs system. Therefore, I know that it DOES help. As for the K & N filter, my E.T.'s went down as a result of using a K & N filter on the same vehicle. So once again, dont say that THOSE dont do anything either. I am trying to keep open minded here and am asking if others have TRIED the tornado on their vehicle.....It sounds to me that you havent tried it yet, so you dont speak from experience, but from what you have heard.
You are correct, I haven't used any of the add-ons on any of my vehicles! I guess I was lucky (or smart enough) not to throw my money away. If you do some research like I did, most "honest" people DO NOT see any performance (or MPG) improvements with the K&N air filters, or other ADD-ON
equipment. I would say if anybody reports any improvements, it's due to the
"placebo effect".

For a truely independent dyno study of a K&N filter (not paid for by K&N) check out these dyno runs:

http://www.jackphelps.com/ranger/dyno1.htm
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Old 10-09-2005, 01:05 PM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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So Bob, since I HAVE tried the Jacobs Electronics system and noticed a difference...Not only a 4MPG gain, but also a 2 tenths drop in my ETY at the track, I am not an "honest person"? Or maybe that I am seeing a "placebo effect?" I would say that a 4 MPG gain over the course of 2 tanks of fuel are not just a "placebo effect". Further, Since your ET (or elapsed time at the track)is directly reflective of your horsepower output (assuming you have the gas floored the whole time) I would venture to say that a .20 drop in ET equals something. Have you ever been to the drag strip? It is EXTREEMLY difficult to find something short of nitrous that will drop your ET like that. Unless you are having difficulties shifting.....Which since I run an automatic, I dont.

I dont give that Tornado thing much of a chance of working, but I was wondering if anyone else had any experience with it.

As for your "independant test of the K & N filter" This is typical of a SMALL engine which is low on output anyway. Further, they did not do just ONE change in the overall combo....They changed TWO things....They took off the airbox, AND changed the filter. That is typical. In order to KNOW if something has made a difference, you must change ONE thing at a time. Any more than that, and you will not know which product or modification made the difference if any. If you change two things, and notice no change whatsoever, then one modification may have made a difference, but the other made a difference as well...only having the oposite effect and therefore cancelling out the first.

For you to say that ADD-ONS dont make a difference is just plain unintellegent. MOST things such as the tornado are simple "snake oil", but today, I dont know with SOME of the things.......Some are just plain dumb...Like the magnet thing that attaches to your fuel line.....Yeah, thats really going to work....Now, I remember a while back one of the car magazines I get did a test on changing ALL of your oils in your vehicle to synthetics...Just to see if you get any benifits from doing it. Well, they saw a 6-7 hp gain by doing that.....Not much, but it DID make a difference.
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Old 10-09-2005, 09:11 PM
grclark351 grclark351 is offline
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i have a K&N because my filter is $15-$20 on a good day, and i plan on keeping my car for a while. i got the K&N for about $40, do the math.
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Old 10-10-2005, 07:07 AM
Bob Ayers Bob Ayers is offline
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"As for your "independant test of the K & N filter" This is typical of a SMALL engine which is low on output anyway......"

You just brought out a very good point!! Because of CAFE, ALL vehicle manufacturers design their intakes so they will not be restrictive under MAX air flow conditions. Chances are, if you saw an improvement with the K&N, at WOT with a large displacement engine, you would have seen the same improvement with a clean paper filter. Keep in mind this improvement is with a large displacement engine, at WOT. 99.9% of people DO NOT run their engines continuously at WOT, most of the time it's at partial throttle. Therefore, 99.9% of people WILL NOT see an improvement with the K&N
air filter....
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Old 10-10-2005, 10:56 AM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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Actually Bob, A lot of vehicle manufactures DONT design their intake systems for max airflow. They design them to be quiet first. If that silence comes at the expense of a little performance, then so be it....As long as it is quiet. I think the main reason people purchase a K & N filter is the one shown above by grclark351. The cost of buying ONE filter over the course of 15 years far overshadows the cost of buying 15 filters over the course of 15 years. Now, if that filter flows more air, all the better.
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Old 10-10-2005, 11:03 AM
Bob Ayers Bob Ayers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 53wa2fl
Actually Bob, A lot of vehicle manufactures DONT design their intake systems for max airflow. They design them to be quiet first.
You are correct again!!! Noise is created by air turbulence, which cuts down on the efficiency (or to flow at MAX rates) of the intake.
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Old 10-10-2005, 01:16 PM
53wa2fl 53wa2fl is offline
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Not always Bob, the stock air intake snorkle on the older mustangs(79-93) was VERY restrictive and therefore was subsequently removed by many racers. This little mod along with a free flowing filter usually netted around 15 hp. Not much in the grand scheme of things, but it was an increase none-the-less. The air passing through the intake snorkles becomes turbulant which actually cuts DOWN on the amount of flow possible. That is why mandrel bent exhaust is so popular. The noise is made, but the snorkle masks the sound by encasing it. So the noise is still there, but it is inside of the snorkle. Just like when you have your stereo on in the car with the doors shut. You can hear it inside the car, but (if it isnt turned up too loud) I cant hear it outside the car. Now, open the windows up and you have a free flowing car, with the noise escaping.
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Old 10-10-2005, 01:16 PM
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