I'm not sure there would be a big initial demand because they would first have to rebuild the trust and demand that was destroyed by the GM 350 diesel fiasco of the late 70s and early 80s. The 350 GM diesel was touted as the ansxwer for light duty trucks and large cars. They sold like hotcakes and were in great demand until the problems became public. Everyone remembers when they or someone they knew (father, grandfather, uncle, friend, etc) had one that they couldn't keep running and couldn't sale due to the reputation they rightfully had. It would take several years of very good service for many people to trust the engine enough for them to buy it and the teething problems of the 6.0 in Super Duties and the publicity surrounding it as well as the early Duramax problems would keep potential customers scared away.
Gm's failed attempt to build a cheap diesel based on the 350 probably set back diesel engine use in the US by 30 years.
You don't seriously believe that do you? GM has no bearing on whether people buy Ford diesels. Ford has always had good luck with Navistar diesel engines(aside from some problems with the 6L), and if they are first to the market with a half-ton diesel, they will absolutely dominate the market. A $3000 option? Am I the only one who doesnt think this is that much? I mean for all the creature comforts people want nowadays, and the vehicles costing into the $50,000 range, whats another couple of months in payments? Diesel is not hard to find, and these engines will have some get up and go to them. I mean who cares what GM did over 25 yrs ago? We all know how "successful" GM was with their diesels up until the Duracrap, so whats the big deal? Most people buying a half-ton diesel will NOT be thinking about that GM 350 conversion piece oshat that they unleashed over 25 yrs ago.
All that being said, I'm sure Ford will be the first to the market with a half-ton diesel, or all the manufacturers will start introducing them into the market around '07
Hey guys, forgive my lack of wisdom but I'm a youngster. Could you guys explain the 350 diesel to me and what was wrong with it, because I wasn't even born when the thing came out and I don't know anything about it.
As far as the subject of whether folks would buy a half-ton diesel: I just bought a 2005 F150 3 weeks ago. If a diesel came out soon I would wait a couple years just in case it pulled a 6.0 (sorry 6.0 owners, thats the only way I could describe it!) and if it was reliable I would definitely trade my truck for it. Diesel is only 5 cents higher in my area and easy to find, so 20+ MPG would easily offset my costs in a few years. I'm a poor college kid, so I would definitely keep it awhile!
All that being said, I'm sure Ford will be the first to the market with a half-ton diesel, or all the manufacturers will start introducing them into the market around '07
I dunno, Chrysler already has a vast array of smaller diesel engines thay could bring over from europe. They really don't have to develpo a new engine.
IMO, I can see a market for a half ton diesel powered by a smaller displacement engine, but other than fuel milage, I don't personally have a use for one. Chances are it won't have more hp than the 5.4 (if it did, it would be pretty close to dethroning the 6.0, ford wouldn't produce smaller engine that has as puch power as the 6.0). My have more torque, but if the displacement is much smaller, it won't be that much.
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2003 F250 SD 4X4 5.4L 4:10 Arizona Beige
1987 Mustang GT
A bunch of motorcycles, other cars, and a Quad.
Regarding a half-ton diesel being slow, it doesn't have to be if it is done right. Motor Trend tested the Touareg TDI last month. 5L V-10, 310hp and 553 lb-ft. 0-60 in 6.3 seconds, quarter mile in 14.6. The vehicle also weighs about 5800 pounds. New diesels are really starting to make some serious torque regardless of displacement. Mercedes' new 3.2L V6 makes up to 376 lb-ft. That Toyota 4.4L I mentioned earlier makes 428 lb-ft. Acceleration should not be a problem if the horsepower rating is near what the gas engines make.
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97 F150 Flareside-3/5 drop, 99-up frt end w/ 00 Harley valance, 18 in ARE rims, black APC headlights, '04 corners and 'L' tails
66 Mustang C-code Coupe
My desire is to see Ford come out with all fuel engines. Gasoline engines that will burn E-85 fuel(85% ethanol), and Diesel Burning a high %bio diesel blend. These fuel blends are coming rapidly to the marketplace as they are so much cheaper per gallon to buy (state tax subsidies). E-85 is about $1.60 to $1.80 per gallon, where as regular unleaded is $2.13/gal. And similar price differences with bio diesel B-20 fuel. www.wnbiodiesel.com/
Last edited by 4wd : 04-24-2005 at 08:17 PM.
Reason: addition
seriously why do alot of people thing diesils are slow
problly because there in bigger trucks geared more for torque
all in the way its geared i mean thing about it the bigger trucks have lower gear ratios for pulling biigger things they could in theory set the gear ratio to were the thing accelerates a whole lot faster
does any one get the what im tring to say
and personally i don't need no damn 5.0l diesil id be happt with like a 2.0l diesil ford puts in the mondeo in europe
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1977 f-150 explorer 302 at (stupidly sold)
1996 Contour GL 2.0L DOHC zetec (not my problem anymore)
2004 ranger xlt flairside
Cummins already has an engine they are testing in a half ton. I believe it is 4.5l v6 and something like 300hp 4something torque. They are running it in a Dodge 1500 but no truck manufacturer has announced using it.
Its epa rated for 2007's emissions and ulsd and what I read of the review it has plenty of power and is fun to drive.
I am into my current ride for awhile but the new fuel efficient trucks may change the game.
Cummins does make a 4 cylinder diesel. Its a 3.9 and many jeep owners swap in the engine. I don't know why they don't use it in half ton use though.
One of my friends just got finished installing a 3.9 into his mid-80's Chevy 4X4 pickup. It has a 700R4 behind it for now. That little engine can really pull the pickup along. Its got plenty of power, and it also makes around 23 mpg. Just another note, the 3.9 IS in fact a 5.9 with two cylinders shaved off.
I don't know if anyone else has heard this, but a 5.6L V8 Cummins was designed for the 1/2 ton Dodge pickup. There is an article on it somewhere, but I do not even know where to start looking. I think that it was in the 300hp 440ft/lb range.
It is hard to say if people would buy a diesel 1/2 ton or not. GM sold the 6.2 and 6.5 in half tons, but sales were not too great. Of course, the engines did not make considerably great mileage, and they eventually carried with them a reputation of unreliability.
In my humble opinion a 1/2 ton diesel is a waste of time by any manufacturer. A small pick up does not have the gvw to put the extra torgue to use. What good is 500ft/lbs. of torque if you can't get things stopped. There is a little more to life than MPG & acceleration.
Remember for every choice comes with it a huge price tag for the company.....that takes away from the bottom line....the part they like the best!
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You don't seriously believe that do you? GM has no bearing on whether people buy Ford diesels. Ford has always had good luck with Navistar diesel engines(aside from some problems with the 6L), and if they are first to the market with a half-ton diesel, they will absolutely dominate the market.
GM did have a great deal to do with people's confidence in diesel engines and people still remember it. Mercedes had a great reputation in making and importing diesels for decades before GM and the GM fiasco destroyed their market and they quit importing diesels for several years because they couldn't sell them simply because diesels had developed a bad reputation due to GM.
The GM 350 diesel was a converted gasoline engine that couldn't withstand the added stress that a diesel engine must withstand.
If they can increase torque and mileage significantly, I think they'd sell like hotcakes. Especially if it'll burn biodiesel. I know I'd try one.
I have a friend that has a '97 (I think, maybe a '96) Chevy K1500 ext cab with the 6.5 turbo diesel and he absolutely loves it. He bought it used with around 30K miles, it's now pushing 200K and he's had no major problems with it. Gets around 20 mpg using it as a farm truck. The 350's of that era were very good motors, but this one outpulls them and gets better mileage to boot.
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