...and over in the "Dodge-truck.com" forums, some guy just started a thread, "My best friend just bought a 2004 F250 PSD!! Oh the HORROR!!!"

It's alll relative...

 

You wont ever see any hard core facts from him. Just mindless rants and Ford commercial quotes.

 

Why does everyone compare Dodge's extended cab to Ford and Chevies crew cabs? Dodge doesn't have a crew cab-yet-its extended cab is meant to compete with the extended cabs, leave it at that. Do you know if its an auto or manual? And do the Fords and Chevies diesels top out at 80mph with 4.10's considering they all have similar RPM redlines?

 

I was disappointed when Dodge dropped the 3.55 rear end.
The 3.55 axle ratio suited the Cummins power delivery so much better

 

Musclecar_Fan, why don't you do a search on owner loyalty. This link that I am posting proves that most people who buy Dodges don't get another one, at least the vast majority of those people.
http://www.polk.com/news/releases/2001_0107.asp
This is the Polk awards for owner loyalty. This states that the F-series has the highest owner loyalty rate of any full size truck with 36% of the market. You still with me? This means that 36% of people who buy a new Ford truck buy another new one. This is the industry's leader in this area, meaning that more people who buy a new Ford truck are goingto buy a new one. Now it might get hard for you, this is math and logic, so follow close. 36% is less than 50%, and since Ford leads the industry with 36%, then it's perfectly safe to say that Dodge, in the same industry and following Ford (the leader) in this area, has a return rate of less than 36%, which is less than half, which means that the majority of people who buy a new Dodge won't get another one. Understand now? I can't really make it any more plain than that, customers are more happy with new Fords than they are with new Dodges, regardless of what they say, we see where they go when it's time to buy a new truck, and more people go back to Ford than Dodge, simple as that. No use in disputing documented facts, and there they are, documented by Polk. Musclecar_Fan and Budly, there's my proof.

 

I don't see anywhere on that page that shows Dodge's owner loyalty. I see that the F150 is 36%, it seems that most people aren't very loyal to any given vehicle. I see nothing on that page that says the loyalty for a Ram is significantly lower than for an F150, heck for all we know it could be 35.9%. If 36% loyalty is the best for fullsize trucks, it says that most people don't repurchase a Ram, Silverado, Titan, Tundra or F150. Heck, from reading the posts on this Polk study, I was expecting to see 90% loyalty for the F150 and 20% for the Ram. Obviously that is not the case. This also does not show that customers are more happy with new Fords than they are with new Dodges.

 

It's more like 16% for Dodge, I don't have time to search right now, but bottom line, it's higher for Ford, and that's all I said in the first place. If you'd like more in depth numbers, please feel free to search for it.

 

FordLariat Those are not stats that show me that Dodge has low owner loyalty. We have many return costomers that have bought Rams time and time again. I know people that have owned Rams or Dakotas their for years and went back and bougt others. Like wnorman said in his post, Dodge could be right behind Ford for all we know. You fail to recognize that there are other automotive manufacturers out there that can compete with Ford products. What the hell would I know about the automotive market anyways, we only have 3 dealerships in the family. Dodge was not known for their trucks for many years, they have come a long way and are now right up their with GM and Ford. We shouldn't even be basing the quality of a truck or an engine on the number of sales. We can not boil the automotive indusrty down to numbers. Ford sells a crap load of trucks thats true. But if you research it further you will find that alot of their sale are thruogh fleet, not average joe going and buying F serries trucks.

 

One thing that you have to remember is that Ford is very big into fleet sales. Fleet sales in an unprofitable thing and many manufacturers are trying to get out of the practice of selling so many fleet vehicles. The one benefit fleet sales has is it inflates sales numbers, and they usually buy from one or two manufacturers, but it does so at a cost to manufacturers, and can really hurt the bottom line. Dodge or import manufacturers have never pushed fleet sales for this reason, and probably never will. Yes, this may mean they will probably never have the sales that Ford does, or they may not quite get 36% in the polk surveys, but they will make a profit at the end of the year. There was a very interesting article in the Detroit news a few months ago reguarding Ford/GM and fleet sales. Ford and GM said they were trying to wean themselves off of fleet, even if it meant much lower total sales.

 

Now THAT'S a statement with no facts. You asked for proof, I proved it, Ford has a higher owner loyalty rate, and less than half, or the majority of people who get a new Dodge don't get another one. Period.
Also, why don't you get us sales numbers of how many are fleet trucks? I'd like someone to prove how many are actually sold to businesses and fleets.

 

It looks like well less than half, or the majority of people who buy any truck don't get another one. My statement was full of facts. An excerpt from consumerguide:
"In addition, sales numbers at Ford are bolstered only because most of its cars sell to commercial and rental fleets. According to George Pipas, Sales Analysis Manager at Ford, Mustang volume is 10% fleet, Taurus 50%, and Crown Victoria an unbelievable 70%"
link
http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/e.../act/opinion20

It is a known fact that fleet sales are not profitable and it is also a fact that Ford is losing money. I hope they get things turned around, which it seems they are slowly doing, because I really do like Ford and want to see them prosper. You are reading way too much into that Polk survey. It does NOT say that the majority of F150 owners purchase another F150. It also does not say that most people who buy a dodge are unhappy with their purchase. I looked everywhere for numbers on fleet sales of the F150 and couldn't find any. I have no reason to believe the numbers are significantly different from any of their other products. Ford seems to keep that information private for some reason. I bet it is a substantial number though.

 

I was coming off of two very satisfying dodge ownership experiences and still bought a ford. I am a repeat dodge owner and a repeat ford owner. Just because I didnt buy a third dodge in a row doesnt mean Im not going back. The quality of their trucks really amazed me. It was the little stuff that ford overlooks. I took the dodges cab apart in an intensive stereo installation. Never seen anything like it before. It was like a lexus underneath. I was truly amazed at the lengths they went to. To prevent road noise and vibrations.

If just over 1/3 do it over in the pickup segment. Does that means 64% were unhappy? Id say this reflects very poorly of all three manufacturers. At 18% subura won its compact suv segment. Does that mean that more than 82% of all compact suv buyers were dissatisfied with their experience? Doubt it. Ive owned subarus and will do so again. And toyotas. And dodges. And fords. See how that works. I might not do it all in a row so polk will give them a bad mark because I have different needs from year to year.

 

Very well stated, Logical Heritic. Studies such as these are often taken way out of context. I found the same study from 2001, and the Ram was ranked number 2 (it had the top three in each category). That was even with the old style Ram which was nearing the end of it's product cycle and much more outdated than the competition. From reading the above posts, you would think that the Ram wouldn't even be on the list since "people who buy a dodge never buy another one", when in fact almost as many people buy another Ram as buy another F150. In fact the number 1 position in 5 of the 10 categories was a Dodge. Very interesting.

http://www.polk.com/news/releases/2001_0115.asp

 

Something else to stew on.
http://www.jdpa.com/businessservices...04_dieselp.htm

Ford diesels as of 01 reported 430% more problems than their gasser counterparts. Yet they have a very strong level of percieved quality and brand loyaltly. Interesting. So If I read this right. Fords powerstroke was dead last in quality and durability but seemingly at the same time. Have the highest repeat buyer. Thats advertising at work. This was even before the 6.0 debacle.

P.S. Before anyone starts thinking well there are twice as many fords. This is a per hundred unit average. It doesnt matter if there are 100 or 100 million. The 100 unit average is going to be the same.

 

Ford is actually on the positive side off the ledger this year. Ford finances are much better then 3 yrs ago. With several Ford cars and the new superduty Ford looks to be in fine shape. GM on the other hand with the steep rebates of late is losing more monetythis year then in several years. They have had to cut production at on one of there truck plants do to poor sales. There SUVs are selling slowly. GM might have shot themselves in the foot with thispiston slap issue. This has been a teriible thing for them. It has hurt there reputation badly and they still dont have it remedied. Fords having one off there best truck sales year ever in the history off the company. !0,000 units ahead of GM. Fleet sales arnt the only reason. The general public are buying Ford trucks. After this year Ford will be way on top as for loyalty goes. Dodge truck sales are downthis year.