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  #1  
Old 08-19-2004, 10:06 AM
jimandmandy jimandmandy is offline
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Dodge Sprinter vs Econoline

DCX is replacing the Ram van and wagon with a Mercedes-built model called the Sprinter. FedEx is the biggest fleet operator so far. Ford and GM had better get on the ball and sell smaller turbodiesels here. 30mpg real world from a full-sized van with an 8550 GVWR.

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Old 08-19-2004, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimandmandy
DCX is replacing the Ram van and wagon with a Mercedes-built model called the Sprinter. FedEx is the biggest fleet operator so far. Ford and GM had better get on the ball and sell smaller turbodiesels here. 30mpg real world from a full-sized van with an 8550 GVWR....
...and no power. I was just at the Dodge website the other day checking out the Sprinter. 2.7L 4-cyl. Mercedes diesel puts out 150ish HP and 250ish ft-lbs. of torque. I bet it's a dog to drive (not that vans SHOULD roast tires...), but they could have come up with something between that and the 300-350HP/550-600ft-lb. overkill diesels put out today (overkill for many, that is, not all). I'd love to see a diesel for 1/2-ton trucks and vans that is around 3.5-4L, 200-250hp, 350-400ft-lbs. Something like that could still tow respectably, while still getting 20-25 mpg unloaded. I bet dealers wouldn't be able to keep them on the lot.

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Old 08-19-2004, 11:07 AM
jimandmandy jimandmandy is offline
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I do not tow and, while rated for 5000 lb, it is not marketed for towing. It feels much stronger than my 185hp, 12mpg gas 302. This is a valid comparison because the unladen (curb) weight of the Sprinter and my F-150 are almost identical.

I agree with you. What I really want is a 200hp/350ft-lb diesel. My question is, when will Ford make one?

Jim
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Old 08-19-2004, 04:30 PM
dspencer dspencer is offline
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The sprinter van is a fairly large vehicle. The ones I have seen are being used for delivery or service vehicles. Wow, I am suprised that they get that kind of mileage. They would probably make a good weekender......if you have half a weekend to get there.
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Old 08-19-2004, 05:17 PM
BigF350 BigF350 is offline
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adrian.erks.harris adrianerksharris
Just wondering do you guys get the Ford Transit over in the States?
they have a similar sized diesel in it, and while I haven't driven one fully loaded, it was quite impressive empty.
And BTW I assume most of these kind of vehicles are used by fleet operators (they are here in Oz). What fleet manager is going to care if the van is a little gutless, if it has half the running costs, and a vehicle that is going to last longer?
Imagine the savings they make. Here diesel vans are about 90% of the van market, and those that are petrol, are converted to run on LPG (costs about a 1/3 of the price of petrol here).
The sprinters have quite a good reputation in Oz.
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Old 08-19-2004, 06:47 PM
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The Sprinters are definitely being marketed to the fleet ops. As a matter of fact, one of the options I ran across was a 74mph speed limiter, ostensibly for fleet ops who don't want their drivers screwing around. Although, with that tiny engine, I would bet that only drops the top speed 2mph or so...

I've driven an E150 with the 4.2L V6, which I think was rated at about 180-190hp, and that thing was a DOG. I've never white-knuckled it for so long on such a flat freeway...

No Ford Transit in this corner of the world. The U.S. market is still stuck on ever greater HP and torque numbers, not what we sensibly need, so that's what the manufacturers are making. I'm beginning to think that gas will have to hit $5/gallon before we wake up and start driving point-A to point-B vehicles instead of tanks that can go as fast as most race cars. (I would still need a truck, of course, because I'm in construction...)

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Old 08-19-2004, 08:22 PM
BigF350 BigF350 is offline
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adrian.erks.harris adrianerksharris
Quote:
Originally Posted by jroehl
I've driven an E150 with the 4.2L V6, which I think was rated at about 180-190hp, and that thing was a DOG. I've never white-knuckled it for so long on such a flat freeway...
Yeah, but small turbo diesels are generally a lot better at handling loads than small petrols. They may have similar power, but the torque difference is huge...

You make some good points about diesel vehicles in the US (seems to be a common issue on here), but if you guys keep buying gas, it will keep my diesel prices down (the old demand vs. supply thing)
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Old 08-20-2004, 11:23 AM
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is this similiar to the ford cube truck that has the baby stroker in it? any links to this lil van/truck thing? and how bout the some from down under? this is interesting stuff...
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Old 08-21-2004, 03:19 AM
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adrian.erks.harris adrianerksharris
Heres is a link...
http://www.ford.com.au/showroom/ligh...asp?position=0
It has (an option) a Turbo diesel with 135hp and about 280lb/ft of torque, and is pretty impressive. This engine is a larger capacity version of the one shown in the Bronco concept.
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Old 09-13-2004, 04:08 PM
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Re

The Mercedes Sprinter is well known in Europe. The diesel is torquey enough for most conditions. Why should a Fedex van be a sports car? Besides, the Mercedes Sprinter does 156 km/h, my dad`s Ford Econoline 5.4 V8 is limited at 160 km/h.
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Old 09-13-2004, 05:25 PM
Logical Heritic Logical Heritic is offline
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I took a peak at the sprinter while I was test driving the new 600. It was a 5 cylinder mercedes diesel. Is there a 5 or 4 cylinder model? I just figured all were 5 cylinders.
You realise they used a little 4 banger in box delivery vans for years. We the people are a little hp crazy. 200 will move the loads we intend to move.

Last edited by Logical Heritic; 09-13-2004 at 05:28 PM.
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Old 09-13-2004, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Logical Heritic
I took a peak at the sprinter while I was test driving the new 600. It was a 5 cylinder mercedes diesel. Is there a 5 or 4 cylinder model? I just figured all were 5 cylinders.
You realise they used a little 4 banger in box delivery vans for years. We the people are a little hp crazy. 200 will move the loads we intend to move.
I see my mistake. I put in 4-cyl. when it should have been 5. I only see 5-cylinder models available on the website. If there is a Mercedes Sprinter in Europe, I would guess that the Dodge is just rebadged so that they could drop the Ram Van line and save some dough. They sure can't sell TOO many vans if they only sell about 350k trucks per year. Maybe 50k vans per year in the U.S.? They must be able to absord that at whatever plant produces the Euro version.

Jason
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Old 09-14-2004, 08:46 AM
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You guys who are impressed by peak hp numbers in gas engines have never driven a modern turbodiesel. It is torque you feel in a heavy vehicle, not hp. I have rented Isuzu diesel trucks and was amazed at what a four cylinder can do. And these were older generation diesels, not the latest computerized common-rail types.

Jim
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Old 09-14-2004, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimandmandy
I agree with you. What I really want is a 200hp/350ft-lb diesel. My question is, when will Ford make one?

Jim
2007

when low sulfur diesel comes to the U.S.
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Old 09-14-2004, 03:11 PM
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The Ford Commercial Division's page for the new LCF is here. I think it will compete well with similar Isuzu, MitFuso, and Hino cab-forward trucks. UD will discontinue tilt cabs soon.
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Old 09-14-2004, 03:11 PM
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