We have worn out and extracted all the technical benefit from this post.
....all can make their own choice.
__________________
Administrator
tim.lamkin@internetbrands dot com
Life is not only time……paradoxically, it is the denial of time!
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
I think Tim is saying that you are too late to jump into the middle of this argument which he (Tim) wants to be over. He is tired of moderating the bickering.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
I appreciate fine machinery, and I take the best of care of all my vehicles!! I just hate to see a vehicle abused in any
way, and this is the reason I have taken a stand against
K&N air filters!!![/quote]
That is where the dispute is Bob. All the actual data posted on this thread indicates that the K&N filters are equal to or superior every filter in filtration except the stock one which is only a couple of percentage points better. Facts are still facts and more reliable than opinion.
__________________
03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
I appreciate fine machinery, and I take the best of care of all my vehicles!! I just hate to see a vehicle abused in any
way, and this is the reason I have taken a stand against
K&N air filters!!!
That is where the dispute is Bob. All the actual data posted on this thread indicates that the K&N filters are equal to or superior every filter in filtration except the stock one which is only a couple of percentage points better. Facts are still facts and more reliable than opinion.[/quote]
Bob, for the last time, I'll summarize the FACTS for you:
1) Cummins has stated that the dirt that the K&N air filter passes CAN do damage to an engine.
2) Many people have posted (ON THIS FORUM) that using a K&N air filter causes their oil to turn black earlier.
3) Using a K&N air filter shows high silicon levels in UOA.
4) K&N has come out with an additional filter (precharger)
to catch "small dirt particles" in dusty conditions.
That is where the dispute is Bob. All the actual data posted on this thread indicates that the K&N filters are equal to or superior every filter in filtration except the stock one which is only a couple of percentage points better. Facts are still facts and more reliable than opinion.
Bob, for the last time, I'll summarize the FACTS for you:
1) Cummins has stated that the dirt that the K&N air filter passes CAN do damage to an engine.
2) Many people have posted (ON THIS FORUM) that using a K&N air filter causes their oil to turn black earlier.
3) Using a K&N air filter shows high silicon levels in UOA.
4) K&N has come out with an additional filter (precharger)
to catch "small dirt particles" in dusty conditions.
What other FACTS do you need????????????[/quote]
The problem is that NONE of the things you are listing are FACTS. They are OPINION and CONJECTURE from an extremely biased individual. The TEST data indicates otherwise.
__________________
03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
Bob, for the last time, I'll summarize the FACTS for you:
1) Cummins has stated that the dirt that the K&N air filter passes CAN do damage to an engine.
2) Many people have posted (ON THIS FORUM) that using a K&N air filter causes their oil to turn black earlier.
3) Using a K&N air filter shows high silicon levels in UOA.
4) K&N has come out with an additional filter (precharger)
to catch "small dirt particles" in dusty conditions.
What other FACTS do you need????????????
The problem is that NONE of the things you are listing are FACTS. They are OPINION and CONJECTURE from an extremely biased individual. The TEST data indicates otherwise.[/quote]
Bob, I hate to tell you, but ALL 4 items I listed are total
FACTS, nothing to do with OPINION and/or CONJECTURE!!
#1 is from Cummins website
#2, and #3 are from FTE forums
#4 is from K&N's website
Last edited by Bob Ayers : 04-16-2004 at 02:26 PM.
The problem is that NONE of the things you are listing are FACTS. They are OPINION and CONJECTURE from an extremely biased individual. The TEST data indicates otherwise.
Bob, I hate to tell you, but ALL 4 items I listed are total
FACTS, nothing to do with OPINION and/or CONJECTURE!!
#1 is from Cummins website
#2, and #3 are from FTE forums
#4 is from K&N's website[/quote]
Let me see if I can lead you through the logic.
1. The Cummins website is not test data. It is the opinion of someone who wants to sell stock air filters. I don't own a Cummins and it is unimportant to me and most PSD owners what they think. If you want to believe it, O.K. I just don't accept it as fact. O.K?
2. The FTE forums are great because we can exchange information. Don't you think we have a responsibility to publish only information that is factual. Most intelligent people will search to find the facts. Opinion is unimportant. People at one time had the idea that the world is flat. People used to buy and drive Yugos. I don't value your opinion. If you based your posts on facts without prejudice I would have formed a different opinion of your posts. If Ken or Tim published the kind if opinion and conjecture that you do, they would be in legal trouble. Because you can hide in the internet, the K&N lawyers can't find you easily. But believe me they are looking for you. Go to the diesel stop and look at the letter sent from the President of K&N. Companies today will not tolerate slander.
4. Because K&N came out with a new product is no reason to speculate that they did it because their air cleaners are defective. There is actual test data published on this very thread that indicates that K&N Filters are better than most and close to the filtering capabilties of stock filters. When the new covers are added, the K&N becomes superior to every filter system tested by a wide margin while still outflowing the stock filter.
I don't want to convince you of anything. I could care less if you think the world is flat. My friends on this forum should have all the information necessary to make an informed, logical choice. I have no investment in K&N. If something better becomes available, I will buy it. How much aftermarket product have you actually bought? Air cleaner? programmer? Gages? Exhaust? When you spend your money I would hope that you will investigate the facts.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
Wow, I guess I should be sorry I asked. But after looking at the reply,s and visiting the web sites listed, I think I will just leave it to the Ford filter for the time being anyway. I guess if it aint broke, don't fix it.
But thanks to you all for the info.
Bob you are twisting the K&N page. This is what it says.
"The K&N PreCharger is a specially designed filter wrap made to extend the service interval of your K&N Filtercharger when used in very dusty conditions"
This is a great new product makes the K&N filter the best in filtration by a wide margin. The guy I talked to at K&N said they came up with this so they could protect vehicles in dust storms in Iraq. When they became clogged, they take them off, and shake them out, and put them back on and continue to drive instead ov being disabled.
The test was not an independent lab and was not even the same filters that we were discussing. They appeared to be a flat stock type airbox filter. There is no relationship here. There is no way to correlate this information. Again you are twisting to suit your purpose.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
Bob you are twisting the K&N page. This is what it says.
"The K&N PreCharger is a specially designed filter wrap made to extend the service interval of your K&N Filtercharger when used in very dusty conditions"
This is a great new product makes the K&N filter the best in filtration by a wide margin. The guy I talked to at K&N said they came up with this so they could protect vehicles in dust storms in Iraq. When they became clogged, they take them off, and shake them out, and put them back on and continue to drive instead ov being disabled.
The test was not an independent lab and was not even the same filters that we were discussing. They appeared to be a flat stock type airbox filter. There is no relationship here. There is no way to correlate this information. Again you are twisting to suit your purpose.
Yes, it was an independent test!!! The filter profile isn't important, what is important is the comparison of the different types of filter media!! This would apply to different filter profiles!!!
No, the test was not done in a laboratory under controlled conditions. Even if it had, the test is not valid because the engines, airflow, housing, element shape, humidity and all the other variables must be correct. Also, you can not reach a valid conclusion by extrapolating this "test".
You can't prove your assertions by using circular arguments and additional opinions.
No matter how deep you stack the nonsense, it never ceases to be nonsense.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
ENOUGH take a breath....................NOW!!!!!!!
__________________
Administrator
tim.lamkin@internetbrands dot com
Life is not only time……paradoxically, it is the denial of time!
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
