Ask Toreador Diesel what he thinks about K&N filters. He reported last week that his turbo had MAJOR damage.
Ok, wait a second. Major damage from what made it through a properly installed a cared for K&N filter? Come on, give me a break. What made it through the filter, a pebble? Or maybe he was driving through a sand storm? Come on, think about it. I'm not going to sit here and argue weather the K&K filters better than the stock one or not. In fact, I would be willing to say it doesn't. But there is NO WAY anything large enough to damage a turbo is going to be able to make it through a K&N. I have had a side business for four years that builds 600, 700 & 800 rear wheel HP turbo imports, and virtually all of these cars run K&N cone filters. Not one that we have built, or any others that we know of for that matter, have ever had a turbo failure because of the filters. Hell I run TWO (one per turbo) of them on my 630+ RWHP 300 ZX twin turbo, and have for years and they are just fine. And I'm talking about a $6000 set of turbos, so yeah, I guess you could say I trust them. For a truck that sees the off road, or is used on dusty job sites and the like, then no, I probably would not want to use a K&N. But for the truck that is used under "normal" conditions, on the street and highways it would be just fine.
You are correct in your assumptions. I too have run them on race cars and tow vehicles since 1984. Here is the data link to independent lab tests: http://www.knfilters.com/facts.htm#WORD
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
OK, so a lot of you 6.0 PSD guys will learn the hard way. Yes, even properly cared for K&N's let too much dust through. Cummins actually warns specifically against the K&N becaust of the damage it can cause. If you take a poll of all the diesel owners over at the diesel stop almost all would recommend against the K&N.
Anyway, I'm done posting on this thread. It's obvious that some people can't be convinced that just because a K&N is good in a gasser that doesn't mean it's OK in a turbo diesel. I'm just trying to provide information from experience and a large cross section of diesel owners to those of you who might own your first diesel.
To each their own. At least we can agree on Ford.
A hit and run flamer huh?
By the way, it is illegal for Cummins to void warranties based upon K&N filters.
check out this letter http://www.knfilters.com/warrantyletter.htm also there is plenty of independent lab test data if you are really interested in the truth.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
Well, I think K&N realizes there is a problem with the dirt that their filter passes, because they have now come out with a "precharger" filter that you use with your regular
filter to "filter small dirt particles"!!!!!!! I think what they
are trying to say is the regular filter doesn't filter well, and you need this "precharger" filter is dusty conditions!!!
Fm Chocktaw Bob
By the way, it is illegal for Cummins to void warranties based upon K&N filters...
The same applies to Ford dealerships effort to "void" warranties, but they will try, and unfortunately, too many truck owners accept the dealership's claim.
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Just A Thought...............on...............My Perceptions................
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OT - Hey FredsF250TD, since you tune cars here in Houston, I'd like to yalk to you. I've got a turbo porsche I'll need to do some dyno tuning in about a month or so. Do you have a dyno?
A hit and run flamer huh?
By the way, it is illegal for Cummins to void warranties based upon K&N filters.
check out this letter http://www.knfilters.com/warrantyletter.htm also there is plenty of independent lab test data if you are really interested in the truth.
OK, I wasn't going to respond but this was uncalled for. I'm certainly not a hit and run flamer. It's NOT illegal for Ford and Cummins to void your warranty if a K&N damages your engine because you have installed a product that doesn't meet the manufacturers specification. Magnuson-Moss only protects you from having to buy replacement parts from Ford, but they have the right to set the standard. Any damage caused by modifications is not covered. Here's a link to understanding what Magnuson-Moss actually says:
As for the "independant test results," they aren't independant if K&N pays someone to do it. They are independant if they do them without pay and are not connected to K&N in any way. This is the same trick that Amsoil uses.
Let's stop the name calling and play nice!
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1997 F250 HD PSD SuperCab 4X4 ZF5 4.10
173K miles CMP Info1 CMP Info2
Last edited by johnsdiesel : 04-14-2004 at 11:46 AM.
OK, so a lot of you 6.0 PSD guys will learn the hard way. Yes, even properly cared for K&N's let too much dust through. Cummins actually warns specifically against the K&N becaust of the damage it can cause. If you take a poll of all the diesel owners over at the diesel stop almost all would recommend against the K&N.
Anyway, I'm done posting on this thread. It's obvious that some people can't be convinced that just because a K&N is good in a gasser that doesn't mean it's OK in a turbo diesel. I'm just trying to provide information from experience and a large cross section of diesel owners to those of you who might own your first diesel.
To each their own. At least we can agree on Ford.
John, ......I'm against K&N air filters in gassers also!!!!!!!
If you check out the posts on K&N air filters, you will see lots of posts where UOA show high levels of silicon, and oil
turning black earlier when using a K&N air filter....This is proof of the dirt a K&N air filter is passing!!!!!
Last edited by Bob Ayers : 04-14-2004 at 12:02 PM.
OT - Hey FredsF250TD, since you tune cars here in Houston, I'd like to yalk to you. I've got a turbo porsche I'll need to do some dyno tuning in about a month or so. Do you have a dyno?
Guideline violation removed.
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04 F250 XLT 6.0 2x4 Auto.
Build Date 11/03
Think Bush lied about WMDs? Trust your Democratic leaders? Check this out: http://rogerhedgecock.com/amnesiacity.html
Wow, I guess I should be sorry I asked. But after looking at the reply,s and visiting the web sites listed, I think I will just leave it to the Ford filter for the time being anyway. I guess if it aint broke, don't fix it.
But thanks to you all for the info.
Wow, I guess I should be sorry I asked. But after looking at the reply,s and visiting the web sites listed, I think I will just leave it to the Ford filter for the time being anyway. I guess if it aint broke, don't fix it.
But thanks to you all for the info.
Well, I think K&N realizes there is a problem with the dirt that their filter passes, because they have now come out with a "precharger" filter that you use with your regular
filter to "filter small dirt particles"!!!!!!! I think what they
are trying to say is the regular filter doesn't filter well, and you need this "precharger" filter is dusty conditions!!!
It is a smart way to sell more product. So far you have produced nothing in the way of evidence to prove your assertions. You do everyone an injustice by making unfounded statements besides making yourself look like an ignoramus. If I was an officer at K&N and heard you say those things I would be pleased to drag you into court where you would be forced to be more responsible. Any bozo with a computer connection can suddenly assume a pose of authority. Until you prove your asserertions with verifiable data similar to what I have provided that is the way you look to all of us.
On this forum they are a lot of people ready to listen but you must provide evidence to have any credibility.
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03 6.0 SC Short bed 2WD Auto
Preditor, Gages, K & N FIPK
Some people just don't want to be confused by the facts. Try http://www.knfilters.com/facts.htm#WORD
on this page are links to independent lab tests. This proves the fact that K&N air filters provide filtration equal to ot superior to the factory air cleaners.
I have struggled with these same people on this forum who have they minds made up based upon what they read on some flamer site or from their buddy. Their buddys truck could have died from any number of reasons (no test data documentation available)but the data supports the idea that it was NOT the K&N filter.
What an absolute joke! Independent tests? Says who? K&N, thats who! Nowhere do they state who or where this lab is, if they did or didn't pay them. Show me an actual INDEPENDENT test, until then Ill believe all the real-world tests that show K&N indeed does flow well but filters only slightly better than NO filter.
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No longer a wanabe, now a have!
2004 X Limited, 4X4 6.0 PSD Pueblo Gold
10/23/03 X Build
10/20/03 Engine Build Pilot Injection?
OK, so if you buy K&N's testing, here's the testing from the other side. I believe the AFE they tested was the older style. From The Diesel Stop:
I have the SAE J726 filtration effeciency ratings for the AFE, K&N, stock, and Donaldson (Baldwin). Although some of the mentioned companies will give you the cumulative results of the test, which look better because a dirty filter will be more efficient at filtration than a clean filter, what you don't get when they are dirty is good air flow. These initial ratings show good air flow since the filter is clean.
AFE**** (conical replacement intake) - 95.4%
K&N*** (in the stock box)- 97.1%
K&N** (conical replacement intake) - 97.3%
Motorcraft (in the stock box) - 98.7%
Donaldson* (barrel replacement intake) - 99.8%
*The Donaldson test reflects a Tymar style intake and may not properly reflect home made versions or intakes that do not supply the minimum radial clearance for the filter as supplied from the manufacturer.
** K&N literature states up to 99%. Cumulative results were 99.05%
** K&N literature states up to 99%. Cumulative results were 99.1%
****AFE literature specifies that it filters particles sized down to 2.5 microns that cause engine wear at a 99.9% efficiency rate while passing the smaller than 2.5 micron size that they claim are harmless. When a specific 2.5 micron test was done at 530 cfm with 0.0025 per cubic foot volume rate and 100 grams, the result was actually only 88%. The same test for the Donaldson resulted in 98%.
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1997 F250 HD PSD SuperCab 4X4 ZF5 4.10
173K miles CMP Info1 CMP Info2
At least we can agree on Ford. 
Wow
