Gotcha ya... I understand. My comment was tongue-in-cheek and not meant to be taken literally, aka exactly at half-throttle. I guess I just don't understand the "I have to be the first one to the top of the hill" philosophy. I'll gladly back off the throttle, stay in the right lane, lose some speed and time and save a little abuse on the truck. Then again, I'm never in a hurry...just happy to get there!

 

No problem, but going over this pass with a heavy trailer will definitely take a heavy foot.

The F-150 EcoBoost towing it's maximum rated towing capacity, has no trouble meeting the speed limit and even needing to back off the gas to not break the speed limit going up this route.

The 2017 F-450 tested by TFL towing right at its maximum of over 30k, could not maintain the speed limit with a foot to the floor. It certainly did better than the RAM, but its interesting how the F-150 seems to have more engine than it needs for it's load rating while the Super Duty could use a little more engine. One is chassis and suspension limited; the other is engine limited.

 

That is a very interesting observation. Would love to be in the room and hear the discussion when the engineers are determining these things.

 

GM recently made the claim (after the launch of the new L5P Duramax) that less than 1% of the HD truck market need to tow over 25,000lbs...hence justification for their 23k rating. So if this is true, most folks will love the performance of a Ford 350 or 450 dually, while still being *able* to tow the max rating if they desire.

I'm a bit surprised that GM did not try to take the cake with a 33k rating, or at least a 30k rating. Knowing most would never attempt it, and especially knowing the Ford 350 DRW is rated for over 30k. Tow ratings are one of the biggest marketing tools and bragging rights among HD truck owners. It lends credence to the theory that something on that GM truck is not up to the task...and almost certainly that component is either the frame or transmission.

 

I agree with this as well and i think it's the transmission

 

But the more I think about it, GM may not be quite correct in thinking only 1% need to tow more than 25k in the heavy pickup class. If this was true, why does Ford sell so many F-450's?

 

GM is not know for considering there customer base.


Market surveys of what there core customer desires is not considered.


Otherwise they would redesign a lot of the interior and fix the powertrain components to be more competitive.

 

I think its the transmission also, but they would never say that because the Allison is such a marketing tool for them. I see a lot of 450's use as grocery getters.

 

because they're awesome. Who doesn't want an F450?
there are several on this board actually, that have admitted that they bought their F450's just because of their looks and stance, they don't actually own a trailer and never will.
but your point is still valid, the F450's are selling for a very good reason and even the most diehard GM guy has to be scratching their heads at what GM is doing (of not doing) right now.
Their HP numbers look good on paper and in one fake youtube video, but this 2017 super duty is going to dominate GM's products in just about every category. I firmly believe the Ford is going to easily win the Ike Gauntlet tow tests too.

 

I hope they don't repeat the same thing they did a few years ago. They loaded each trucks to their rated max towing capability and charged them up the mountain. The Ford was pulling the most weight and therefore didn't win and used more fuel. They need to load each truck with the lowest truck's max tow rating and let them pull apples to apples.

 

I thought that GM/International were developing a new 450/550 class truck due out in 2019, it was supposed to be Chevrolet selling the nice pickup versions and international selling the vocational version.

 

news to me.
I actually liked the C4500/C5500 trucks that GM came out with 10 years ago. We still have one at work, it was my truck when it was brand new. Crew cab, 10' tool bed, 4x4 with the Allison-Duramax combo. It had some flaws, such as towing capacity, fuel mileage and practicality, but overall I liked it.
we don't use it much anymore, because it's incredibly unreliable, but it's cool to look at back there in the yard.
GM did away with them, but I'm surprised they didn't refine them, or come back with something more F450ish.
They are really missing the boat right now with their towing and hauling numbers.

 

Up north here i've only seen 1 450 pickup a 2008 and he hauls HEAVY other then that there was one at my dealer i tried last year (it ended up going on a dealer trade) and mine. every one up here don't even know they exist very rare. As far a 350drw go there's 3 in town (12,000 people) including my old 2011

 

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Navistar to build medium-duty trucks for GM
Melissa Burden, The Detroit News 9:55 a.m. ET Sept. 30, 2015




(Photo: Navistar)
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General Motors Co. said Wednesday it has entered into a long-term agreement with Navistar International Corp., an Illinois-based producer of trucks, buses and military vehicles, to co-develop and build medium-duty trucks for the automaker.
The Class 4/5 trucks — which are larger versions of a chassis cab pickup with a hood in front — will be built at Navistar’s plant in Springfield, Ohio, and are expected to go into production in 2018. GM said Navistar will add 300 jobs and invest $12 million to upgrade the plant to build the new vehicles.
“Bringing medium-duty conventional cab trucks back into the portfolio strengthens Chevrolet’s commitment to providing commercial customers with more choices and one-stop shopping for a versatile lineup of trucks, vans and crossovers,” said Ed Peper, U.S. vice president of GM Fleet and Commercial Sales, in a statement.
GM shuttered its medium-duty truck business in mid 2009 after it failed to sell the business; it had sought to sell it to both Isuzu and Navistar. The automaker’s medium-duty trucks had been built on a line inside GM’s Flint Truck Assembly Plant; nearly 400 jobs were cut.
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In June, GM announced it had reached a deal with Isuzu Motors to produce low cab forward medium-duty trucks that are slated to go on sale next year in the U.S. Six new Chevrolet models will be available based on the Isuzu N-Series.
GM said the new vehicles would be developed using Navistar’s rolling chassis configurations and would include GM commercial components and engines. Terms of the deal were not disclosed and GM said it would announce product information later.
Navistar, in a statement, said the deal will help it enhance its medium-duty portfolio and use its scale.
Earlier this week, the Ohio Tax Credit Authority approved a 60 percent, six-year jobs creation tax credit for the Springfield work, worth $643,000. Navistar’s 300 new jobs are expected to generate $10.4 million in new payroll a year and retain $38 million in existing payroll.
The plant currently employs about 1,100 workers who build medium-duty trucks such as municipal dump trucks, beverage delivery trucks and moving van trucks.
mburden@detroitnews.com
(313) 222-2319
Twitter.com/MBurden_DN

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I live in Oklahoma which is a lot like Texas in the fact that everyone needs a big dually just to get around town.