Due to recently having to remove some water from my gas tank I
thought I would do a little experiment. I live close to a gas distribution
facility where they get gas straight from the refinery and then load
tanker trucks and mix in the ethanol and deliver to gas stations around
town. Consequently you can purchase gas before they have added ethanol
if needed for two stroke engines or older vehicles etc.

I bought a few gallons of pure gas and in several separate glass jars as
separate experiments I added five parts pure gas and one part of:

A - 90 percent isopropol - 10 percent water
B - 100 percent methanol
C - 95 percent ethanol 5 percent methanol ( denatured alcohol )

I stirred or shook all vigorously in attempt to mix the fluids.

In all three cases no more than 4 or 5 percent of the alcohol mixture would mix with the gas.
I'm guessing here as the difference was measured as the width of the sharpie pen on the glass jar.

MY QUESTION--- How the heck do they get 15 percent ethanol in
the gas at gas stations all around? What about the 85 percent ethanol
gas mixture they talk about. I cannot get gas and alchohol to mix ?

Let the shaken mixtures sit for a few minutes and the different mixtures
separate out like exactly like oil and water ? ? ?

The reason for all this is I was thinking of adding alcohol to gas to help
remove the water in the gas thinking the alcohol would mix with the
water and then mix with the gas as fuel is burned but it WONT WORK.

I am surprised at my lab results. BTW. the pure methanol I used came from
a bottle called Gas-Line-Antifreeze and contents label on back lists 100 percent methanol.

Any thoughts here ?

 

Very first thing you are not awhere of is Ethanol is not the same as the alcohol you used for the experiment. The two don't come from the same sources.
Methanol is a poison, Ethanol could be used as a drink.
To mix any of these chemicals, a binder is used so they will combine with gasoline formulation.
The gas formulations are made up of many different chemicals not just straight gas.
Methanol will not mix with gas either in straight form.
Meth will absorb water 10 times or more it's own volume.
As it does it's ability to combust gets so low it won't burn.
Gas formulations today begin to go bad in as little as 6 weeks due to the chemicals in the formulation and are even photo sensitive.
You trying to play chemist without knowledge.
Good luck.

 

Maybe I was not clear or maybe you did not read but in my jar "C"
I used 95 percent ethanol and 5 percent methanol mixture as contents
listed on back of paint store denatured alcohol gallon.

Nevertheless I am perplexed at why the alcohol did not mix better
with the pure gas I was using. Maybe at the distribution center where
they add in the ethanol, the use some kind of detergent or surfactant
to get the ethanol to "dissolve" into the gas.

In my experiment, I also showed where ethanol and methanol will
mix with water readily but neither of those mixtures will blend in with
gas more than 1 or 2 percent if that much. (My lab equipment is not
that precise.)

 

I believe he addressed that when he said a binding agent is used.

 

Scott, im not a chemist either. I can tell you in Illinois you can not buy straight gas at too many stations. I bought a new F250 in 1989 and they had 10% ethanol added at that time.. I though I would have problems.. Almost 30 years , 4-5 different trucks and 600,000 miles later I have NEVER had an injector problem or water problem. My opinion is the stuff must work, and if you have water in the tank ( humidity or accident) the ethanol will take care of a NORMAL amount.

I have never added a fuel addative, dryer, or anything.

 

The ethanol fuels are supposed to burn cleaner. However many people claim their vehicles don't run as well. I know for me, both my Ford's run better on non-ethanol fuel as well as get better mileage. There have been tests done showing inherent problems with motorcycles running ethanol fuels, from corrosion of carburetor parts to rotted fuel hoses. Anything with alcohol, wether it be brake fluid or ethanol fuels will attract moisture. This can cause other problems, but in a properly sealed fuel system in a vehicle that gets regular use I cannot see it as a problem. Some of us may remember "winter" blend fuel and everybody complained about it. This is the same stuff. Now, having said all this, my 2014 Fusion and 2015 Malibu don't run any different with the different fuels.

 

I told you that Eth and Meth will mix with water but not Gasoline.
Even though they are derived from different base materials, they have the same affinity to absorb water in huge volumes that dilute them to the point they have little BTU content left for combustion.
Neither one will mix with Gasoline because Gas is a Hydro Carbon.
The Molecule structure is not compatible with alcohol based fluids.
Therefore a chemical intermediate must be used that has characteristics of both so they will share the Hydro Carbon Molecule electron orbit spaces together.
There is a lot more to all this.
You cannot brew your own mix with any degree of reliability without knowing the chemistry and the engine it will be used in.
Commercial gas is formulated to answer most all common issues for combustion and emissions to be a "legal" fuel for sale to the public and used in every gas engine unless the Mfger. specifies some specific legal fuel.
Gas production is to known standards that most all Mfgers design there engines to use. IE 87, 93 etc.
There are some areas of the country that insist on forcing different standards mostly for political reasons.
This leads to fuel shortage at times, poor performance, higher costs etc.
Ca. is one of those areas.
This is why there often are Ca only marketed vehicles.

.
Some of the other issues related to fuel formulation is the Octane rating, fuel system ability to handle it over the long term, engine spark advance rate etc.
Good luck.