I have a 04 Excursion with the 6.0, prior to purchase I read and talked to everyone I could about the 6.0 before buying to know what I was getting into. When its running well, the 6.0 does everything I want power wise and I love the EX, a big SUV fits what I want to do. It has 267,000 and at a minimum I need to put $2500 into it to fix the current driveability issues. That doesn't take into account the aging transmission, shocks, brakes, and body issues from the wisconsin salt roads..

SO I'm considering a newer truck and there are 2 F250's with 6.4's in them.

2010 with 115000 on it (Pearl white, list says problematic emissions removed to save engine and help mileage)
2010 with 140000 on it (sexy as hell resale red)
2011 with a 6.7 in it, unknown mileage


What am I looking at for common issues with the 6.4? And if you know the 6.7.

Thanks

Mike

 

wow...just google 6.4 problems and yes, its all true.

the miles your looking at is the problem zone with these engines.....if you really want to go down this path...start with a OASIS report so you can see what was replaced on it so that way you can tell whats ahead of you.

its not true the the high pressure fuel pump failures are due to operator lack of maint on things like fuel filters, water in fuel, etc.......these pumps have aluminum impelors and rely on the lube value of #2 diesel fuel....problem is since 2007, the sulfur content in #2 has been dropping...bottom line...these fuel pumps are running with poor lube factors and when they wear...metal goes in the fuel system and injectors......typical fix is in the 12K range.

rockers are a problem due to poor oil lube flow..tips wear.....once the engine starts ticking and woofing....its a matter of time before you get cylinder misfire and contribution errors and wrench lights. probally an 8K jog at a dealer since all the fuel rails have to come out and the fuel lines are 1 time use.

lifters fail and can't be replaced with out pulling the engine.

there's a thing call cavitation in which areas of the water pump erode creating creaters and the end result the coolent leaks into the oil system and crap the engine out due to oil starvation.

on that subject...fuel line which are under the valvel covers leak and the fuel goes into the engine crank case causing oil starvation.

when the injectors get stuck open pistons get toruched and melt.

if you break an exhaust rocker...as fuel gets pumped into the engine and no exit provided (exhaust lifter not opening the exhaust valve), you will hear a big snap and sound like you dropped a tool box. the snap is you piston rod for that cylinder and the tool box sound is the free rod whipping inside you piston walls cracking and chipping the wall skirts....this is non repairable.

I could go on and on.....do your self a favor and keep googling the 6.4 problems and for every person that says proper maint will prevent all these issues......just remember that when you buy a used truck...you dont know what maint was done....when the oil was changed, etc.

 

Speak is right about the problems, the issues DO however come from improper maintenance. The real problem comes with buying a used 6.4... Some of these trucks are and have always been problem children and it seems nothing you do will straighten them out.

I am still going to tell you to skip the 6.4 for a 6.7... In stock form a 2012+ 6.7 is going to prove as reliable as a 7.3.........

If you like the 6.4s you are looking at bring them to an independent diesel shop and have it gone over. 90% of the time if a 6.4 is starting to have an issue you will never see the catastrophic failure coming. However, with a scan tool and experience any diesel tech that deals with these trucks will find the problem before the truck goes boom. Remember, these trucks are almost always traded in for a reason. In most cases its because the guy before you got tired of shelling out cash for reoccurring repairs..........

NOW... For the big issues. The biggest problem that eats well maintained trucks happens to be pistons. Even in stock form these trucks like to crack pistons... The design of the piston along with timing that allows the 6.4 to make the power it does make for some of the most unfortunate problems.

If you don't have complete maintenance records (oasis reports are a place to start) including oil change interval, fuel filter change interval, and any engine work that has been done RUN... RUN FAR AWAY. Any truck over 120k do not even think about it unless the seller has proven the rocker arms have been done. Drain the hfcm and check for a steady flow of fuel, no water, and very little sediment. If you see lots of rust, paraffin, water, or the fuel doesn't flow freely then the filters have not been looked after. If the truck does not have motorcraft (or racor) filters (both oil and fuel) walk away... If you don't see oil changes every 3-5k run away... Fuel filters should be every 8-10k.

And unfortunately you are going to see a lot of failures on internet forums... You are going to see it everywhere that these trucks are going to murder your wallet. And unfortunately to keep them from going boom you are going to spend an arm and a leg on maintenance. And they STILL have a tendency to eat motors. But the overwhelming problem in my eye is this. Unlike a 6.0 that you can fully bulletproof for $5500 and get an easy 400k, a 6.4 is going to cost you roughly $12,000-$15,000 to fully bulletproof (providing your motor is rebuild able). AND unlike a 6.0 that likes to blow head gaskets, 6.4s like to eat rings or crack pistons thus requiring at the very least a COMPLETE rebuild... And 6.4s do it right around the same rate that 6.0s blow head gaskets.



Fwiw, I would buy a 6.0 before ANYTHING else right now... I love my 6.4 and fully intend to pull the block and do a complete build. Pistons, cam, single turbo, etc... I currently have over 120k trouble free miles. It is always in the back of my head that I could be one hard acceleration onto the freeway due to a short on ramp away from a very expensive repair. I ONLY run a 70hp tow tune from gearhead. I am a huge proponent of keeping power as close to stock as possible to limit the chance of a cracked piston or lifting the heads. And on deleted trucks that have catastrophic failures MOST of the time you will see they are running a 250hp+ tune and or racing/abusing the truck at one point or another.

One last point I would like to make. Ignore anyone who even makes the fuel systems on a 6.4 seem like an issue. You have a much higher chance of an injector hanging open and costing your a motor if you drive a dodge or gm... 6.4s and 6.7s rarely have injector issues as long as you change filters on time, run fuel from heavily trafficked stations, and use an additive. If the owner before you didn't do all that, then its not the trucks fault.... Its not Ford's fault.... Just saying. Its true that the hfcm doesn't hold enough water, but if you drain it every other week OR get an aftermarket lift pump such as and ADII or FASS system it eliminates the filtration issue. ALSO you would be surprised just how many hpfp failures happen because the hfcm is starting to fail and can't provide enough volume to the hpfp. The same can be said for the hp turbo, they like to fail due to clogged air filters.... That and the stock air filter can't provide enough air flow to keep the hp turbo fed..................

 

What all have said above.

If feasible, skip and go to the 6.7. Try to get in a 6.7 with a build date of 4/11 or newer.

 

looks like I'll be doing the same. gremlins are starting to pop their heads out and right now my truck is parked . I took it to ford to get an estimate...gave them all the codes...it sat there for 2 weeks and they said they did not know when they could get to it. towed it back home. suspect a lifter...but between the fuel lines that are one time use and the level of disassembly needed to get to the lifters (worse on pax side) , might as well do a mass refresh.

 

How many miles Speaker?

 

It has 87K miles. bought it at 84K miles. It has a 5th wheel base in it...which should have sent me running...no telling what its been pulling and for how long.

I went thru and changed all the fluids and filters when I bought it...and checked the water seperator every week...but who knows what the maint history was before i got it.

 

What makes you think you dropped a lifter? Needle bearings in oil, no oil to the bowl while cranking, noise??? I knew you were having issues but never saw a post about what specifically you were facing.

If it is in fact a lifter most of the time until you tear up the oil pump you will only have noise. The 6.4 shares the same problem as the 6.0, the cam lobes cause the lifters to "hop". The reason its more common on a 6.4 to drop a lifter is the rocker arm wear. The extra slop adds to this "hop" (simple explanation). The fuel dilution really doesn't help either.

Your story is exactly why I am so hesitant to recommend 6.4s but why I am so dead set on telling people to have them inspected by a mechanic that works on them every day. Unlike a 6.0, a 6.4 will hide problems till it has a heart attack. I have seen 6.4s with cracked pistons that show no signs of an issue besides a very very slight miss and a lot of blow by. People buy these trucks all the time with cracked pistons and have no idea until the pcm finally throws a cyl contribution code. They are amazing trucks if cared for properly, even more so once the expensive work has been done properly. If deleted with a mild tow tune and maintained there is no reason a 6.4 won't go 200k+ miles without any major repairs. Rocker arms are about the worst thing that will happen... We all know how brittle they are and have all seen how much they like to break.


The one saving grace of the 6.4 is the bottom end... Nothing out there comes close to the strength of the 6.4/6.0 bottom end. Well, except for pistons lol. Its just the valve train on a 6.4 that really lets it down. If ford had put realistic maintenance schedules in the manual I have no doubt that we would se a lot less massive failures in these trucks. 5-8k mile oil change intervals and 15-20k for fuel filters is just asking for major repairs, especially in stock form.

 

my mistake....meant to say rocker arm. no metal at all in the oil, plug magnet, filter magnet.

 

How much experience do you have with a wrench????

You can have the valve covers off and new rocker arm assemblies in with the cab on within a weekend... Its not a fun job, but by no means impossible. Yes its easier with cab off, but its completely doable without pulling the cab. Are you at a dealer with the truck or an independent shop???? With a 6.4 you are almost always better off with a 3rd party diesel shop that specializes in 6.0s and 6.4s. It will save you money and you are going to generally get more for your money... There are VERY few dealers that I would even let touch a diesel much less a 6.4.

 

I vote late build 2011 6.7 if you can... I'd still check out a 6.7 the way it was described by Matthew to check out a 6.4 though. 6.7 may be better, but we still hear about some of them grenading or at least causing $10k repair bills as well from lack of maintenance.

I'll put it to you this way, I've owned several diesel trucks from Ford and GM. The *only* time I ever bought my replacement from the same Manufacturer has been the 6.7... I'm on my 4th, 6.7....

 

If money is tight and you can't quite swing a 6.7, get a 6.0 with blown head gaskets for cheap and bulletproof it. You will end up with a great truck as long as the work was done by someone who knows what they are doing. The 6.4 is fun and they really are great trucks, however they are the sports cars of the diesel world. They are a lot of fun until you find out the true cost of ownership. Right now if you have the funds for a 6.7 psd it really is the way to go. Avoid the 2011s, they have a lot of turbo issues and the early 11s had valve issues. Pretty much any mid 12+ 6.7 will end up being a solid truck. And yes, no matter what you buy... Have it inspected.

 

While you can make big power with a 6.4 I will say this.
Skip the 6.4.
If you want an older truck get a low mile 06-07 and spend some money making it bullet proof.
If you want a newer truck get a 2012 or newer 6.7.
Having had a 6.0 that was a bad example I skipped the 6.4 and went to a 6.8 gasser then to the 6.7. But I still look for a late model 6.0 for some reason.

 

I think I could pull it off if I read up on proceedures, torques, special gotchas (like not reusing fuel lines). I have a few 3ft wide by 5ft high tool boxes full of anything I could need. I've rebuilt a few gas engines, worked on turbine jet engines, etc.

I took a look in the engine bay and the drivers side looks doable, but there's a lot of piping in the way on the pax side...so yes...I would agree with you that removing the cab or even lifting the cab 3-6 inches might will make things easier.

and yes, if there was a local desiel shop that knew how to do the work and was available to do it...I would let them handle it...Im off two days a week and there never seems to be enough time to do everything as it is.

I just feel once I start into this..I am going to see something I dont like and wind up yanking the engine and taking ti down. I think even if I went in to do both rocker banks, I would want to scope the combustion chambers to see if any of the pistons have issue.

anyway, I have a deck to finish first so the deck can be used this summner, then I'll start on the truck.

pic's and my adventures to follow in another thread.

 

I will see if I can dig up the walkthrough one of our members on powerstroke.org wrote up. It was complete with pictures, torque specs, and tips. If I find it I will shoot you a pm.