Oh... and about towing performance? A used 7.3L and a bunch of mods will get you that performance - for less than half the price of a 6.7L.

 

This is true lol


But quiet as a gas motor, no diesel smell, no smoke, latest technology..... new car smell. Hard to resist.


Come to the dark side, we have cookies.

 

I have all the faith needed in the engine. I hear great things about it - and there is no reason to believe the engine is a fail. When I refer to the 6.7L, I refer to the system. Fat good it does to have a very reliable engine... encased in amber (cab lift). A $10,000 fuel system that needs to be replaced if it gets water - or the occasional accidental DEF fluid? Resale value?

I'm not saying the 6.7L is a piece of anything less than a sturdy towing platform when new. I'm saying that Ford put a thick layer of "Engineered Obsolescence" in this very expensive system.

 

And car payments......

 

Are they Gluten free? That was Stingy (the Prius) asking.

 

Did you post your opinion the 6.7 section comparing your 7.3 to the 6.7? I bet you would be laughed off of that section. There's only one person (pocket) who's signature says he drives a 6.7 (Ford) daily. I believe he is being modest.
Apple's to oranges this thread may have points but most are invalid.
Let's say there's a 7.3 and a 6.7 with the same mileage condition options and same price etc etc. How many would test drive both and say they are going to choose the 7.3? Some...? Yes. Most...? Not a chance.
That's the only way I can thing to make the apples to oranges comparison.

 

And to be completely honest, the 6.4 is king-o'the-hill right now in total performance when modding. At most of the events for modded power, after suring up the heads and DPF delete, that 6.4 can not be beat, and as far as creature comforts, really really nice. This coming from a guy with the "top of the line" in creature comforts '03 7.3 Lariat with heated seats.

 

These are my observations and opinions only.

First, the 6.7 is without a doubt the most powerful power-plant to date. So much so, there are actually "de-tuners" coming to market. Almost 600 HP and 1k Tq. is a bit overboard for a light duty truck. Manufactures want to be the best, fastest, strongest, etc. for competition. But, we, in the end, pay the price. People are considering de-tuning to improve fuel mileage and hopefully increase longevity.

The Cab enclosure is one of the most technical and comfortable ever built. These things run like a Striped Ape and ride like a Lincoln. The Cab is quieter than most Luxury Cars, and just as nice in the King-Ranch or Platinum platform units.

Both the 6.4 and 6.7 are VERY Expensive to keep above 100k (after the factory warranty). For that matter, just routine maintenance, DPF Fluid and so on. You don't want to just stop at any fuel point either. Bad fuel will kill the injection system in both of these and leave you with a $6k bill. Just replacing the exhaust with all its components runs close to $9k!

Major component replacement for either must be new. The catastrophic failure rate of a part is almost always 100%. Meaning, there are no aftermarket or re-buildable parts available. You can bet (almost 50%) you will need heads on the 6.4 before 150k. Worst design ever!

As far as accessing things like fuel injectors as you mention, forget it! The 6.4 is the more expensive of the two. NOTHING is accessible without the Cab Off.

The 6.7 is a bit better (it has undergone a few improvements). in that "most" major parts are accessible with the Cab on. i.e.: EGR, Oil Cooler, Turbo, etc.. .... if one knows the tricks.

In either case, anything more than accessible replicable part on the 6.7 or just about any on the 6.4 the Cab has to come off.

From the information on life expectancy the 6.4 is about 150k - 175k. Only because the replacement cost is astronomical! The vast majority (including my Brother-in-Law's) are repossessed and auctioned. Who can afford a $60 truck with a $750 monthly payment that needs $23k in repairs? All from a Turbo failure at 110k miles.

The 6.7's now out of warranty are hitting the resale market as Owners fear the possible expenses associated. As much as I LOVE and ADORE this Gen of Truck, there is no way in hell I would ever own one.

I didn't work on the 6.4 or 6.7. But, I'll tell you under Warranty, there are as many long blocks delivered to dealers than major parts. That should tell someone something.

The Technicians who worked on these loved them because they almost always knew how much was coming in their next check as most were Engine Swaps they could do in their sleep.

From the 7.3L (which I hope to get 500k out of) I'll move to a late model 6.0 and Stud it, deletes, and so on. All for a fraction of what a years payments on a new truck costs.

That's what I know. Hope it helps.

 

I can say I would and have done...actually when I looked at my current truck I had a few up for consideration, the 2001 F250 V10 Gasser, 1999 F250 Diesel 7.3L, F250 6.7 (I think it was a 2008+ I forget the year the truck was) and one other truck a 6.4L, and I went to the 7.3 mainly because of how well I know the engine capabilities and the fact that I also had one when I served as an EMT/First responder...

 

I'll start thinking about a 2012-2014 F250 sometime around 8-10 years from now. I just can't afford to even entertain the thoughts until then. But heck, by then, I'll probably be more interested in something like a diesel Porsche Cayman and will let my 7.3 sit on the side waiting for the periodic "truck need".

 

I always like the way you think Pete.

 

I will be the devils advocate here...

I love my 7.3, but if I could afford to drive a 6.7 I would in a heartbeat. I'd of course keep the 7.3. However, that will never be an option, and my 7.3 will likely be the last truck I ever own.

Driving the new trucks sure makes you want to buy one. Man its like nothing is back there with the new rigs, and the cab and ride quality is like a darn cadillac. Most average joes buy a new diesel and are done with it for a new one before the 100k mile marker hits. Why, well that 100k warranty is up and the average joe now days waits for road side assistance to come change his tire since he can not find his lug wrench...or spare tire for that matter.

Comparing one with trade in value and a 7.3 with private sale value is apples and oranges.... 200k 7.3 trade in on the lot will be lucky to net 5-6grand here locally...I don't care if your truck makes 700 hp and has had everything replaced. Thats what you get for dealer trade in and the same rules go for the 6.7. They both have a value, and its typically 60-70% of what private sale would be. For those that paid 32 grand for a 200-2003 7.3 12-15 years ago...just an other thing to think about, what do you think 32 grand is worth 12-15 years later??? I know 32 grand went much further back in the day then it does in today's day an age, inflation itself is up 25% since the 7.3 came out. Just a thing to think about....

Regarding a 200k 6.7, not sure why it would be broken. I have numerous friends who tow for a living with 200-400k(not exaggerating) on their 6.7s already. Some have switched to FORD from cummins due to the 6.7 cummins problems. I think Ford built an incredible motor, they kinda screwed up in the turbo department with the sequentials on the 6.7, but that is finally resolved on the 2016 model.

Regarding maintainance.... I personally think its a bit more expensive to have a 6.7 worked on vs a 7.3 at the same shop, but in all honesty they are not much more difficult for the DIYer with the proper tools.

New technology and a motor that comes right out of the box with an output level that is pushing a 7.3 pretty hard, yeah I'd expect it to cost more to work on. One requires to pull the cab for a few items, but you know what, its much quicker to pull a 7.3 than trying to do certain things in the truck(heads for example, what about our awesome oil pan and dipstick adapter) They all have their plusses and minuses. In the long run, if you can do it yourself it will be an affordable truck, if you can't you better have a good pay check. I'm the guy who has to choose the first option.

There could be more out there than I would think, but in all my years , I have not spoke to anyone towing with a 7.3 at a sustained 4-500hp level for 200+ thousand miles. I'm sure others have, but I have not. If you take the cost of what it took to get to that power level reliably, let alone maintainence on it, I think most would be pretty surprised. I bet there are a lot of forum members on here that have over 10k just in parts in their trucks, let alone the labor costs, that they most likely didn't have to pay by doing it themselves. My point is these new rigs are built to work, if used as a highway queen then I think they are a waste of truck, but when you really are working them hard it is darn impressive what they do, it really is.

When I say this to compare, lets take a 2016 6.7 and a 2003 low mile 7.3, Pay a shop to build the 7.3 to equal HP level and driveline reliability and then run them for 200-300k miles at that level... I personally think it would be a throw up in the end. But that is me.


Shoot I hope my setup lasts that long! If it does I'll be exstatic and eat my words!

That all being said, go over to the 6.7 forum, i paruze over there time to time, the majority say when they get close to that 100k mark, they will be trading in for a new one... you can make your own opinion based upon that.

 

Purchase Year = 2000

Investment = $32,000

Value of Money in 2105 = $50,000 @ 3% Inflation, or $66,000 @ 5% Inflation

Just for trade-in context... my son traded in his 2002 F350 Extended Cab, 4WD Lariat with 325K miles on it last spring, and only got $3,000 for trade-in. It needed a front bumper and perhaps $1500 worth of miscellaneous repairs. No rust. Needed new front seat covers. At the time, no one was buying the 7.3's locally, so he decided to stop waiting and lost serious money by trading in, but that's HIS call and HIS bed to lie in. You can only try to lead 'em to the water.

 

There's a few things to straighten out here.....

There's a difference between "routine maintenance" and "repair".

When it comes to maintenance, I would bet that the 6.7L is the same or less than the 7.3L. Here's why....

DEF is extremely cheap. It's barely a factor in total yearly maintenance costs. Oil changes are the most costly maintenance items for diesel. Oil change intervals for the 7.3L are 3,000 miles based on how most people drive, I would venture that many folks around here typically change their oil every 3,000-5,000 miles. The 6.7L typically goes 8,000-10,000 miles between oil changes. So right there you are saving some money by more than doubling on average the oil change interval. Fuel filters on the 7.3L are typically changed every 10,000-12,000 miles, where the 6.7L goes 20,000+ miles. However the 6.7L has two filters, so that's pretty much a wash. Transmission service intervals on the 7.3L's 4R100 is every 60,000 miles, where the 6.7L's 6R140 is every 105,000 miles for the 11-14, and 150,000 miles for the 15+.

Longer service intervals mean less maintenance costs over the life of the vehicle, which is why I would bet that the 6.7L maintenance costs would be the same or less than a 7.3L.

Coolant systems vary both in the 7.3L and the 6.7L. Remember that the 7.3L didn't get the longer life coolant first introduced until the 2002 model year. Ones with the green coolant must be maintained at regular intervals very similar to the 6.7L.

Actually this is incorrect. I can go into our warehouse and literally look at millions of dollars in inventory of remanufactured heads, turbos, HPFP's, and complete motors.... all with the Motorcraft sticker on the box.

And believe it or not, some similar components (like injectors) are actually cheaper on the newer trucks than the 7.3L.

Also, it took Ford nearly 5 years to start the reman program for the 6.7L. Not because every motor was a catastrophic block failure, but rather complete engine failure was so rare that there was not an adequate supply of cores for many years. That says something to the reliability.

The 6.4L does require the cab to come off for many repairs. However, you can pull the heads off a 6.7L without taking the cab off. There is significantly more room and accessibility of components when Ford designed this motor, and some repairs are actually quicker and easier to complete on the 6.7L than the 7.3L.

Every engine has their quirks, some more than others.

However, you'd be surprised at how many failures are the fault of the owner. Especially when it comes to emissions systems, fuel systems, and turbos.

That said, there's quite a few 6.4L's and 6.7L's out there with well over 200K miles still going strong with little to no issues. And yes, there are others out there that are nearly lemons. This is true of any motor really.

Unfortunately, that is nowhere close to accurate. I watch the parts go out of the local warehouse to dealers, and a motor is far more rare than major parts.

Now I will say this.... very few parts for the 6.7L go out compared to the 6.4L or the 6.0L.

 

Where I land with it is IF I had the income to support it, I would have a 6.7 in a heartbeat. Why not? There are so many improvements. That said, I'd probably trade it in at 100k or less and get another.

Since I don't have that level of income or, more accurately, don't place my financial priorities on a 50-65K truck and have the capability/interest to work on my own stuff, the 7.3 fits the need nicely. I'm partial to no emissions and loud diesel anyway.