Ok, it isn't starting.
Does it crank when you put the key in the ignition and turn?
Does the battery have good voltage?
What is the voltage exactly?


Battery Voltage 101 | OPTIMABATTERIES

 

I'll check the voltage on my battery, we jumped it over the weekend because the battery was on the low side (which is why I want to run a two battery system later on) I need to go buy my own charger instead of stealing my friends for a couple days at a time...

 

What size wiring would you recommend for doing that? I don't want to run to light of a wire and burn it up.

 

check also when the car is running when running the battery should be around 13.5 to 14.5 volts or so depending on what lights/fans are running. if it is less than 13.5 i say your alternator is in trouble and isn't charging correctly.

 

2 battery systems? Rewiring entire trucks? ECU's in 82 F150's? You are in seriously over your head!

Please start by clearly defining what your symptoms are. It sounds like you are experiencing a condition where your starter continues to crank the engine even after the key is released. Is this condition intermittant? Piecing together what you have said, you may have a faulty starter motor which is drawing enough current to weld your solenoid contacts together. You may also be the victim of inferior Chinese replacement parts, although the hot cables would indicate the former.

Wires individually are quite simple and reliable. Problems are connectors, corrosion and tampering. Poorly done repairs are typically the cause of chronic problems. Get some good knowledgeable hands on help if you tackle rewiring yourself.

 

A friend is letting me use some of electrical testers for the weekend. I plan on just slowly checking one by one all the wires and connections. Like I stated earlier I want to fix the problems I already have not create new ones. I apologize if the symptoms I'm describing are confusing I'm not a professional mechanic and will never claim to be. Just a guy with a love for these trucks wanting to learn how to fix them

 

All the fuse links (which are fuses in a way) just a thinner version of the wire it's meant to protect. like a 10ga wire may have a 14ga fuse link about 4 inches long, and they have a rubber covering not plastic, that way when something shorts the thinner wire will melt and break the connection. you should have a bunch of them on that truck, you can test by feeling the wire, if it's hard and burnt its bad, if you tug on it and it stays together its ok. you can test them with a test light too. when the engine continues to crank take off the small single wire on the solenoid and see if it stops. these solenoids are like spark plugs you drop them you throw them away, if the housing is dented they will stick. Let me know

 

Well, sorry but I found it alarming where your intentions seemed to be steering you into an action that could seriously disable your truck. You are thinking correctly in taking it one step at a time, but all the electrical testers in the world are not going to solve your problem without some knowledge of the circuit you are trying to repair.

So, we are here to help. I will start with your engine crank problem, but I suspect you may have other undisclosed problems. We will get there.

The cranking circuit on your 82 is fairly simple. The solenoid mounted on the fender switches the starter motor on. It is necessary because the starter motor draws a large amount of current, requiring the heavy guage wires between the battery, solenoid, and starter motor. There are no fuses or fusible links in this path. The solenoid is controlled by the ignition switch. Battery power is applied to the small terminal of the solenoid when the key is turned to crank the engine. Power is removed when the key is in any other position than cranking. The power from the ignition switch runs through a safety switch that only completes the circuit when the transmission is in park or neutral. (A\T). Manual transmissions have the connections for this switch jumpered together, or running through a clutch safety switch that only completes the circuit when the clutch is depressed. Power for the ignition switch comes from the battery. This connection is made at the battery side of the solenoid through a fusible link.

So, what can go wrong? If your starter motor is turning, your solenoid must be engaged. Solenoids are electromechanical devices, i.e. they have moving parts. A conductive bar is placed across the battery and starter motor posts when power is applied to the small post. This happens when the electromagnet coil inside the solenoid physically pulls the bar across the contacts. When the power to the electromagnet coil is removed, a spring pushes the bar off the contacts, breaking the circuit to the starter motor which stops the starter from continuing to run. Two conditions will stop the solenoid from releasing. If power remains on the small wire from the ignition switch, the electromagnet will not release and the starter will continue to run. The bar and contacts handle very high currents. If they arc and weld together, the spring cannot force them apart and the starter motor will continue to run even with the key off. This would continue even will the small control wire disconnected. Sometimes striking the solenoid will get the contacts to release, but once they have arced, they are likely to stick when used again. Mechanical damage also may prevent the solenoid from releasing.

You have already addressed the likely suspect twice by replacing the solenoid. So, something is happening to destroy the new part, or the power remains on the small wire. This is easily tested by disconnecting the small wire when the motor is stuck on. If it stops, investigate the ignition switch. If not keeps cranking, problem is in the solenoid. Like I said earlier, cheap parts tend to fail, but excessive current draw can also ruin a solenoid. Starter motors can develop shorted windings which may not stop the starter from operating, but will draw excessive current which can kill a solenoid. The hot wires can be a sign of this. Low battery voltage can cause internal arcing in the solenoid. It may also explain charging problems which you seem to have experienced. Check that battery! If a fusible link blows, multiple circuits in the vehicle will no longer work. If the fusible link to the ignition switch goes, nothing works. A blown link will not cause a stuck starter.

Hope this is a little more helpful and good luck.

 

NET - Well said and well explained. Reps to you for that. The only thing I would add is that several on here have gotten bad solenoids from the parts store. In fact, some have gotten several bad, or marginal, in a row. And, for the most part all of the bad/marginal ones say China on them. So what some are doing is going to the salvage and snapping up used ones that say Motorcraft. Or, going to Ford and buying used ones.

It still could easily be a bad starter pulling too much current, so it should be pulled and taken into the parts store for testing.

 

Let me add to NET's statement that a bad battery cable will also cause higher amperage because the higher resistance in the cable causes the voltage from your battery to drop and that in turn requires more amperage to get the job done (turn the starter). This higher amperage can damage the starter and or starter solenoid as NET said.

Sometimes the battery cable(s) look okay from the outside. (PS. If you have any clamp-on battery cable ends, stop now and get a new cable). An easy way to test the cables and solenoid is with a "voltage drop test". You just need a voltmeter to perform the test.

A drop of .6 volts is the maximum allowable for the entire circuit (from battery to starter). If you have more than .6 volt drop, you move the test lead to the next connection point closer to the battery and continue testing until you find the place were the voltage drop is acceptable. That tells you the last thing you checked is a problem (or it could be a combination of items).
Rather than explain how to do this test step by step, see this link: Voltage Drop Testing

BTW - there are a lot of YouTube videos and websites with good info on doing this test. Just google "voltage drop test".

Good luck.

 

CB - I'd rep you as well but can't. Anyway, well done.

JW - You are getting really good advice. If you work with the guys and follow their instructions you can fix the problem.

 

I didnt see this mention but you can check the voltage of the battery, but you really should load test it to see if the battery is good. Ive seen batteries read 12 volts but when you load test them they just drop to zero.

Now as far as splicing in new wires to fix a problem, that can be done, I did that for my dash lights, but the thing I did though is I completly removed the orignal circuit and ran a whole new circuit. If I ever tear the truck apart and find the problem the wiring is still there for me to rehook it back up OEM.

I personally wouldnt recommend doing something like this unless you have a very good understanding of wiring. The longer the wire you run, the larger gauge wire you have to use. The extra circuit I am adding under the hood via a power/ground distribution block will be a 12ga wire as I am not sure how I will run it from the passengerside solenoid to the driverside mounted distribution block. But with this gauge I used I could run it any way I want and not have to worry about voltage drop.

This is why I personally wouldnt recommend doing custom circuits or making new circuits to replace old unless you know enough about wiring to prevent damage to your vehicle and possibly yourself if your wiring desided to catch fire.

 

I got him and explained that it was from you, Gary.

 

Thanks, David.

 

my 1981 i6 c6 when I got itit would fry the solenoid every once in a while,finally pulled the starter and found it very greasy causing a high starter draw which would fry the solenoid replaced starter problem solved