Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > 1994.5 - 1997 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


1994.5 - 1997 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel SPONSORED BY:

Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 07-15-2014, 05:14 PM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
Possible blown HG, need help to diagnose.

This is going to be long winded, and i apologize in advance.
I just bought my first diesel recently, '97 standard cab powerstroke w/ZF5. 170,000 miles and had been all stock until the PO, within a year, put a 4" exhaust and a TS 6 position chip on it. I got the truck for an extremely good deal and couldn't pass. He was selling cheap because it had "blown head gaskets". Along with that, it had another issue. It was mixing oil into the coolant, from which he told me the oil cooler had gone bad. He replaced the oil cooler but told me he didn't know if he got it together well enough because he didn't press it back together. His reasoning for determining a blown head gasket was water in the oil. So, knowing i was buying a project, i took it.

I have a buddy who is a diesel mechanic and we did some tests. Come to find out, it did indeed have a cracked injector cup. I went ahead and replaced those and drove it for a weekend. Went to the lake and noticed a decent oil leak coming from the oil cooler. Figured i could make it 2 miles to my home. Got 1/4 mile down the road and she ran out of oil (enough to shut down the injectors) and i immediately shut it down and towed it home. once home, pulled the oil cooler and sure enough it had a broken o-ring. replaced that and now the truck has a slight knock. It runs rough and is hard to start, but i'm kind of assuming its because the injectors still haven't bled all the air from the system after running them out of oil? and through this, i noticed i still am getting water into my oil. I check the dipstick, and there doesn't appear to be any water in the crankcase, but if i pull the valve covers off, there is still the milky sludge everywhere on top of the head and in the valve covers, and the end of my tailpipe has a liquid residue in the bottom of it.

My main questions being, could i still be looking at a blown HG? Even though we had found a bad injector cup and wrote that off at the coolant in oil?
And what might be the source of this newly found knock?

Sorry so long, I'm very new to this diesel stuff and looking for help. Not new to these 90's trucks in general though. Any help is greatly appreciated.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-15-2014, 06:38 PM
427 fordman's Avatar
427 fordman 427 fordman is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Plankinton, SD
Posts: 8,935
427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.
After the truck sits overnight, pull the drain plug carefully and see if water comes out before oil. How fast does your water level drop?

The knock could be an injector, but if it has had a lot of water in it you could have also wiped a bearing or more out. Headgasket failure on a stock truck is not very common, but anything can happen.
__________________
Darin 99 ranger 76F250 66 fairlane
"TheBeast"1997F2504x4dually4.10's,160k,140VIDM,HPX ,4-5"dp, S366 turbo, 6637, elec. fuel,rosewood stage ones,php,arp studs, comp springs, smith brothers push rods, T500 HPOP,melling lpop,180 tstat,6.0 fan and IC,trucool,coolant filter,scan gauge,lots of other gauges,racer x valve body and billet converter, upgraded trans, F550 leaf springs,SD dual tensioner upgrade, cold ac mod
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-15-2014, 06:42 PM
MOOSE_MACHINE's Avatar
MOOSE_MACHINE MOOSE_MACHINE is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 868
MOOSE_MACHINE is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 427 fordman View Post
After the truck sits overnight, pull the drain plug carefully and see if water comes out before oil. How fast does your water level drop? The knock could be an injector, but if it has had a lot of water in it you could have also wiped a bearing or more out. Headgasket failure on a stock truck is not very common, but anything can happen.
If have to wonder if the stress from water and running the truck out of oil could have spun a bearing. How long will a truck run off the hpop reservoir oil
__________________
It's hard to soar like an eagle when your flying with a bunch of turkey's
1997 F-350 xlt cclb PSD 4x4 zf5
1989 F-350 4x4 7.3 c6 auto retired
2000 F-150 XLT 4x4 4.6 e4od
Nick
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-15-2014, 06:53 PM
427 fordman's Avatar
427 fordman 427 fordman is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Plankinton, SD
Posts: 8,935
427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.427 fordman has a great reputation on FTE.
He won't hurt the bottom end it will die like it did first. The injectors get starved from the top end running short and it dies.

Running rough and hard to start is from starving the top end of oil. You got air in the system. The knock could be an injector, but I would like to hear if you find any water in the pan.
__________________
Darin 99 ranger 76F250 66 fairlane
"TheBeast"1997F2504x4dually4.10's,160k,140VIDM,HPX ,4-5"dp, S366 turbo, 6637, elec. fuel,rosewood stage ones,php,arp studs, comp springs, smith brothers push rods, T500 HPOP,melling lpop,180 tstat,6.0 fan and IC,trucool,coolant filter,scan gauge,lots of other gauges,racer x valve body and billet converter, upgraded trans, F550 leaf springs,SD dual tensioner upgrade, cold ac mod
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-15-2014, 07:13 PM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
When it ran out of oil, it started misfiring badly and suddenly my gauge lost pressure. When i got it home i still drained maybe a gallon of oil out, so it didnt run dry. Just enough to quit firing injectors. Ive only put maybe 50 miles on it since the cups, and ive changed oil twice. (Once changing the oil on its own) both times it appears to be no water. If i top off the the degas bottle, and drive for ten miles, the bottle will be empty again. It also pressurizes the degas bottle and pushes coolant out.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-15-2014, 09:40 PM
96ford250 96ford250 is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Northeast Ohio
Posts: 969
96ford250 is starting off with a positive reputation.
is the truck running hot? run engine and look in the degas bottle if its bubbling while the truck is running your getting compression gases into the coolant. this will push coolant out when the engine gets hot. the milky stuff on top could just be condensation from heat cycles not sure where you live but if it gets kinda chilly at night it wouldn't surprise me depending on the amount that's up there.
__________________
1996 F250 HD 4x4 Single Cab Long Bed, 1997 7.3, auto 3.55s, 6637, E-fuel, CCV mod, 2001 IDM, EBPV delete, Diamond Eye turbo back, high pressure crossover, B&M 14,400 btu trans cooler
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-15-2014, 10:15 PM
oldbird1965's Avatar
oldbird1965 oldbird1965 is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: AZ
Posts: 12,703
oldbird1965 is a name known to alloldbird1965 is a name known to alloldbird1965 is a name known to alloldbird1965 is a name known to alloldbird1965 is a name known to alloldbird1965 is a name known to all
The PCM will shut the motor down with low or no oil pressure. The motor should be OK, I did it once losing all my oil until it shut down and all is good. Good luck with the other problems.
__________________
Glenn
The Mule-96 2WD F250 EC/LB auto, Lots of Mods!! Semi retired, still runs great after years of pulling!!
The Mare 97 dually cc, s366 turbo, stage II's, IC, studs, springs, rods, JW auto, 4:10 LS, efuel, FS2500 bypass oil filter, HVHF IDM, IH WP, 6.0 trans cooler & rad fan, MBRP 4", SD tensioner, AFE, 220 amp alt, 38G tank, soundproofed, 3 different TS chips
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-15-2014, 10:53 PM
Chris56ford's Avatar
Chris56ford Chris56ford is offline
lost
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Worland, WY
Posts: 275
Chris56ford is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
If your degas bottle is being pressurized you either have an injector cup leaking, head gasket is blown or holes in the cylinders from cavitation. If you already had 1 injector cup that was cracked there could be more ( did you replace them all?). The only way to pressurize the coolant system like that is to have combustion gasses getting into the coolant system.

One other possible theory for the knock, you could have hydro-locked a cylinder that the coolant leaks into. When the engine is not running the coolant will enter the cylinder and fill it up. When you go to start the motor it will pressure the coolant up too much and can bend a connecting rod. I hope that is not the case but definitely possible.
__________________
Chris
-1997 F-350 XLT 4x4,7.3 PSD,ZF5,227,000 miles,6637 intake,SD 7.3 Intercooler,F5 DP-Tuner chip,3" DP,4" Diamond Eye exhaust,EBPV delete,IH bellowed up-pipes,Beans D66 turbo,Southbend SMF/clutch kit,Autometer gauges,6.0 fan.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-15-2014, 11:21 PM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 96ford250 View Post
is the truck running hot? run engine and look in the degas bottle if its bubbling while the truck is running your getting compression gases into the coolant. this will push coolant out when the engine gets hot. the milky stuff on top could just be condensation from heat cycles not sure where you live but if it gets kinda chilly at night it wouldn't surprise me depending on the amount that's up there.
The motor does get hot if i run it a little hard. And it hasnt gone below 80 degrees here since ive had the truck. But if i take the oil cap off the valve cover while its running, and put my hand over it, my hand gets wet from steam. Its straight steam.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-15-2014, 11:24 PM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris56ford View Post
If your degas bottle is being pressurized you either have an injector cup leaking, head gasket is blown or holes in the cylinders from cavitation. If you already had 1 injector cup that was cracked there could be more ( did you replace them all?). The only way to pressurize the coolant system like that is to have combustion gasses getting into the coolant system.

One other possible theory for the knock, you could have hydro-locked a cylinder that the coolant leaks into. When the engine is not running the coolant will enter the cylinder and fill it up. When you go to start the motor it will pressure the coolant up too much and can bend a connecting rod. I hope that is not the case but definitely possible.
I replaced all 8 cups. And the motor actually did hydrolock once when it sat for a couple days. I didnt push my luck and just pulled injectors and GPs and cylinder #8 was the culprit. Full of coolant. But it didnt knock til the oil ran dry. Knock actually comes from what sounds like the top of cylinder 3 or 5. Which would confirm the knocking injector like suggested above.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-16-2014, 12:39 AM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
I should add that the knock sounds more like a tick or tap. Not a deep knock. If that makes sense.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-16-2014, 02:56 PM
williameub williameub is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 78
williameub is starting off with a positive reputation.
He's loosing coolant...

I doubt an injector cup... He'd have diesel in the coolant if that was the case.

Since you had coolant in cylinder 8, that defiantly points to a HG, Head or block issue.

Maybe I've missed stuff in the thread, but that's what I get out of the information I've read.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-16-2014, 03:10 PM
Chris56ford's Avatar
Chris56ford Chris56ford is offline
lost
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Worland, WY
Posts: 275
Chris56ford is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by williameub View Post
He's loosing coolant...

I doubt an injector cup... He'd have diesel in the coolant if that was the case.

Since you had coolant in cylinder 8, that defiantly points to a HG, Head or block issue.

Maybe I've missed stuff in the thread, but that's what I get out of the information I've read.
The injector cups seal in two spots with green locktite, one on each side of the water jacket in the head. A crack in the cup in the area of the water jacket will put diesel in the coolant. But if the lower seal is not sealed right it will leak coolant and allow combustion gasses into the coolant system. There will be no raw diesel in the coolant system in this instance.

He said all 8 cups were replaced, so a crack is unlikely but one might not be sealed well.
__________________
Chris
-1997 F-350 XLT 4x4,7.3 PSD,ZF5,227,000 miles,6637 intake,SD 7.3 Intercooler,F5 DP-Tuner chip,3" DP,4" Diamond Eye exhaust,EBPV delete,IH bellowed up-pipes,Beans D66 turbo,Southbend SMF/clutch kit,Autometer gauges,6.0 fan.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-16-2014, 03:30 PM
dev_jhnsn dev_jhnsn is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 46
dev_jhnsn is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris56ford View Post
The injector cups seal in two spots with green locktite, one on each side of the water jacket in the head. A crack in the cup in the area of the water jacket will put diesel in the coolant. But if the lower seal is not sealed right it will leak coolant and allow combustion gasses into the coolant system. There will be no raw diesel in the coolant system in this instance.

He said all 8 cups were replaced, so a crack is unlikely but one might not be sealed well.
I took my sweet time cleaning each bore and putting the cups back in, making sure they were all in right. Doesnt mean they are i guess, but im confident they are okay
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-16-2014, 04:02 PM
Chris56ford's Avatar
Chris56ford Chris56ford is offline
lost
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Worland, WY
Posts: 275
Chris56ford is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dev_jhnsn View Post
I took my sweet time cleaning each bore and putting the cups back in, making sure they were all in right. Doesnt mean they are i guess, but im confident they are okay
They are probably fine, I was just explaining to williamub that there doesn't have to be diesel in the coolant with a cup leaking.

I think your only option at this point for the leak is to pull the head and see if its the head gasket, it most likely is. That sucks man!
__________________
Chris
-1997 F-350 XLT 4x4,7.3 PSD,ZF5,227,000 miles,6637 intake,SD 7.3 Intercooler,F5 DP-Tuner chip,3" DP,4" Diamond Eye exhaust,EBPV delete,IH bellowed up-pipes,Beans D66 turbo,Southbend SMF/clutch kit,Autometer gauges,6.0 fan.
Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2014, 04:02 PM
 
 
 
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > 1994.5 - 1997 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
new oil cooler AGAIN, 24 degree deltas?? Enduroman 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 82 09-22-2013 08:44 AM
Blown head gasket symptoms. brickie 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 16 07-29-2012 07:43 AM
Blown head gasket? yamaguy 1999 - 2003 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel 10 10-05-2011 02:38 PM
HG oil cooler issue. rmj951 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 15 12-28-2010 06:30 PM
Still blowing coolant pipewelder71 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 30 11-13-2008 07:56 PM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7 AC1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup