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Old 03-30-2014, 03:18 PM
bflora bflora is offline
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Injector Noise

Alright folks, again I'm pretty new here, and been reading a ton of post regarding anything 7.3 and Excursion related. Anyhow, I'm uncertain if my "injector noise" is normal since this is my first diesel - assuming it's indeed injector noise. Maybe I'm overly paranoid, hearing things, or actually have reason to be concerned. I'll explain the best I can, and also will provide a video for the truck doing 0-30 MPH at 1500-2000 RPMs (most noticeable). I know I've written a short story below, but want to ensure I give as much info as possible.

I have no gauges, etc, I can't tell you much else other than the repairs listed in my public record doc above - here's 3 cell phone videos, if they don't suffice, I could break out the GoPro:
1) Idle Driver's side front wheel well: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B73...it?usp=sharing
2) Idle w/ low RPM using accelerator - passenger side back wheel well (turbo / exhaust): https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B73...it?usp=sharing
3) Placed under the hood 0-30MPH 1500-2000 RPMs: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B73i...lUeFR2WTg/edit

Notes:
- 2002 Ford Excursion w/ the legendary 7.3 Powerstroke / ~236k miles (35" tires and speedo was never calibrated, so guessing it has maybe close to 250K on these injectors) - all other information can be seen via my public record doc here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...0E&pli=1#gid=0

- I bought the truck in Oct 2013 with ~226k from the original owner, who's not very helpful unfortunately :-/

- MPG are ranging from 14-18 MPG based on conditions, etc. This seems normal since I have 35" tires and a 4" lift. Truck is all stock but the Hutch mod.

- To start, I've always heard a very light high-pitched tick at idle, and assumed it was the infamous #8. I came to this conclusion from reading random posts stating this injector tends to be noisy but I'm confused on what's an okay noise vs what's bad

- For the first time, I can here the knock/ticking noise from inside the cab, specifically from 0-30MPH with low RPM (1500-2000). Mostly, it's the loudest when starting in the morning (sitting over night) or when I head home from work (again, truck sitting, getting "cold"), until the truck warms up, it seem to be much less noticeable. If I'm in a hurry and only let the truck run for a few mins, then it's the loudest, and it appears plugging in the block heater helps, but it's currently been 50-80 degrees, so I shouldn't have to plug it in!

- Could be my imagination, but I believe it began being louder (heard from the cab) after my OEM fuel pump died, and I let the truck quit running on it's own (basically running out of fuel), rather than turning it off immediately - I was on the highway during rush hour, and was trying to get to my safety - almost got rear-end!

- When driving, if you let off the accelerator, the tick/knock goes away, at least being able to hear within the cab

- I originally thought the BF1212 fuel filter from the Hutch mod was lowering fuel pressure, hence causing louder injector noise - changing the filter didn't make any noticeable difference via my "ear test", and changing my oil (Mobile 1 5w40) at the 4500 mark to Mobile Delvac Super 1300 (15w40) allowed for improved acceleration, but made no difference with this "noise".

- Fuel Additives: SeaFoam in the fuel bowl trick seems to make a huge difference, but I can still here a light, high-pitched tick at idle, just not from the cab. SuperTech 2-cycle oil doesn't seem to really make a bit of difference as it relates to the tick - not 100% sure yet, just add about a 100 mile ago. I've also been running Stanadyne's lubricity formula, which also doesn't seem to make a difference with the light tick. To clarify, all seem to help quite the engine, but not resolve this tick/knocking.

- Oil Additives: To scared to try this route, and there just doesn't seem to be many 7.3 folks proclaiming a must do

Most importantly, I want to determine if I can continue to drive the truck since it's my daily or do I need to park until I can afford the repair. Yes, I can take it to the shop, and ask them, but hey, I like the idea of asking my "peers" first!

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Old 03-31-2014, 04:27 AM
jr2000sd jr2000sd is offline
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Im in the same boat as you with the kmock and i too am hopping its the #8 injector, ive tried everything besides a regulated return. I have a 2000 f350 so i have all AD injectors i dont have the AE in #8 hole so i hope its just the normal knock but it drives me nuts. In a month or so ill have a set of 175cc/30% single shot injectors so well see if it makes a difference. I did replace the fuel line from the tank to my spin on filter with a rubber hose and seemed to help a bit but not completely so i must have been sucking air in from that quick disconnect
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Old 03-31-2014, 05:02 AM
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If your injectors were bad you would have other signs other than noise. Poor file economy, smoke, low power, oil in coolant.... All things I would expect from a 7.3. Fact is they are noisy.

It could very be that they are tired and/or nearing the end of their life. But there's nothing you can do about it. There is absolutely no reason to drive it. That would be like buying a new car and being afraid to drive it because it might get scratched! You could potentially try RevX or Archoil in the oil to see if the chatter improves. I wouldn't try any off the shelf auto zone oil additives.

Maintenance is key. Keep up and it will live as long as possible. Drive on brother.
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Old 03-31-2014, 06:13 AM
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The 7.3L injector has been around for 20 years - it's old technology. The 7.3L is also the crown jewel of loud diesels in consumer vehicles. I live on a fairly busy road, and the difference in noise between the Cummins and the Ford is the Cummins noise out the back and the Ford noise out the front. Those are the predominant sounds I hear as they drive by.

The ticking... that's a tough one to get rid of, if it's not an exhaust leak. Look for soot anywhere under the hood - soot does not belong under the hood. If no soot, the ticking is likely the solenoids. Knocking can be addressed, but ticking is frequently the activation of the solenoid. The plate comes up and smacks the solenoid coil base - and this makes noise without the truck even running.



Once you add hundreds or thousands of PSI of oil pressure, the ticking can get pretty loud. I listened to your video and the truck sounds normal through your microphone - with the camera placement you had. Injector knocks are heard under the truck, behind a front wheel.


Some injector knocks involve replacing the injector - like the one in the video. There are more subtle knocks that can be addressed with fresh O-rings and a good injector torqueing. I've done all of the above, and other relevant mods are in my signature.

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Old 03-31-2014, 12:01 PM
bflora bflora is offline
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Thanks, and that gives me piece of mind. Also, sounds nothing / as bad as the video Tugly posted '7.3L Injector Noise - YouTube'. Just didn't want to have to break out the Buckszooka already!
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:35 PM
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My injector knocking noise appears to come and go. Sometimes it sounds loud when idling, and other times I can't hear it at all. I also don't hear it while driving down the road.

What makes the knocking sound come and go? Seems like it would happen all the time or none at all.
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Old 04-23-2014, 08:15 AM
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There are so many root causes of injector noise - oil quality, temperature, tuning adjustments based on inputs, load, air in fuel or oil, ICP, mechanical wear in the injectors, a rolled or damaged top O-ring on the injector, loose injector torque, fuel pressure, etc....

Before aiming for sticks, I made certain they had proper care and feeding.

I had one brand new injector bang away, and I swapped it out to quiet the truck down. I can't emphasize enough how twitchy those things can be.
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Old 04-23-2014, 08:46 AM
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I also forgot to mention that I only hear the knocking when the engine is warm, never cold. I really don't want to tear into the vc if this is something I really don't need to worry about. It's just annoying at times.

BTW....I just switched to Mobil 1 synthetic, and have only a few thousands miles since the last oil change. Seems as though I just started to hear this knocking stick after the switch. Coincidence?
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:52 PM
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I have a 2001 with high mileage. I bought it cheap because it had a knock. A very load knock. I traced the knock down to #7 cylinder - the rear one on the passenger side. I replaced the injector, under-valve-cover harness, and glow plugs. Still knocked.

When I isolated the problem to #7 cylinder, I made a test harness that I could switch on and off each individual injector. If I shut off #7 the sound goes away. No other injector makes a change in sound. If I pull my foot off the accelerator above 50 mph and all the injectors quit firing, the noise goes away. Because of this I know it is an injector and not a mechanical noise.

I checked out the entire Exhaust Back Pressure System - nothing wrong.
I tried a known good IDM - no change.
I checked out the wire harnesses and found nothing wrong - no change.
I tried a known good PCM - no change.
I checked the exhaust system for leaks - no leaks.



I picked up a rebuilt engine during the recent Economic Depression with the intent of driving this engine until it quit. I have put 40,000 miles on the truck and it still runs fine, except for the noise. The odometer is pushing 306,000.

I may give up and install the other motor just because I'm tired of listening to the knock! And everyone stares at me when I drive by. And I have to shut down the engine to order at a drive-through. And I have to turn up the radio to hear it. And I can't hear anyone on my hands-free speaker phone. And the people I call can't understand me because of the knocking noise drowning out my voice.

The new engine has forged rods, too. I might add a tuner to that one.
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:12 PM
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I have a permanent knock near #7 and I have been unsuccessful at eliminating it. It's nowhere near as loud as yours, but there it has been... for tens of thousands of miles. I've been told "Sounds like a 7.3 to me", and "Sometimes these things just knock for no particular reason". I was told this by people I regard as knowing what they are talking about. I still can't help but wonder what's banging in there.
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Old 04-23-2014, 06:27 PM
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I had a knock, And 3- 4 years later it is still gone !. I believe that air was getting pushed in by #2. i don't know, Been years since i though of it.

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Old 04-23-2014, 11:01 PM
bflora bflora is offline
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Just wanted to report back that the SuperTech 2-cycle has really helped quiet down the injectors, and the truck seems to really love it - guess these old sticks just needed some lube treatments, so I plan to continue with the SuperTech indefinitely.

Also, I've been switching between the SuperTech and Stanadyne's lubricity formula, and SuperTech just works better as it relates to quieting her down + it's cheaper and easier to find.

Anyhow, I still hear the "tick" at idle, but that just seems to be the norm with these old dawgs.

Onward through the fog!
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Old 04-23-2014, 11:01 PM
 
 
 
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