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  #1  
Old 02-15-2014, 12:40 PM
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Picking a Wideband O2 for tuning?

I am doing a mass air swap on my '97 460 and have no experience with wideband sensors. I want something that will work in the truck long term with an installed gauge, but also to work with my QH/BE combo for datalogging and realtime emulation.

I've looked at the innovate stuff but not much else.
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Old 02-18-2014, 09:44 AM
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Take a look at the NGK AFX with the NTK sensor. The unit is far less "flaky" and uses are more accurate sensor than the LC1's.
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Old 02-18-2014, 12:49 PM
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I would kind of like a kit with a 2 1/16" gauge. Would I be better off getting the sensor and gauge separately?
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Old 02-28-2014, 10:10 AM
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aem makes a pretty kick *** wide band set up but it is not cheap. They sell for 150 on ebay regularly, I made an offer for 130 and got mine. Moates likes to recommend innovate. They talk to the Binary Edit software that is used for tuning. From my experience using both in the shop, its really a toss up between the two. Like anything, you get what you pay for. Stay away from cheap gauges.
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Old 02-28-2014, 12:38 PM
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Will the aem talk to binary editor? I assume it will, but this is a main concern for me as I will need to datalog the AFR readings
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Old 02-28-2014, 03:03 PM
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CB, I have not had a chance to tune with BE and AEM. Not sure why it wouldnt. I know it works fine with FAST, MOTEC, HONDATA, and AEM ECU's from personal experience. I bet if you called up their tech support they could tell you. They got great people answering the phones
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Old 04-03-2014, 10:09 AM
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Innovate LC-2 or Glowshift wideband?

I ended up buying two different wideband sensor/ AFR gauge combos. I have not installed either yet.

I bought the Innovate LC-2 with Green DB series gauge for $170 on ebay, shipped directly from Innovate. I have talked to an innovate tech rep, who said that it should work for a narrowband stock replacement just fine, and still provide the wideband features.

Has anyone run an Innovate controller like this as a stock replacement?

I also bought an Elite 10 series four gauge set from Glowshift with a pillar pod. The glowshift wideband(bosch 4.9) and gauge that came with it claims to have datalogging outputs, but I am curious if this will actually work with BE and my PCM.

GlowShift | White Elite Wideband Air Fuel Ratio Gauge

Has anyone ever used one of these cheaper wideband setups for a stock EEC? Will it send a narrowband to the PCM?
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Old 04-03-2014, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbakker View Post
I have talked to an innovate tech rep, who said that it should work for a narrowband stock replacement just fine, and still provide the wideband features.

Has anyone run an Innovate controller like this as a stock replacement
Worth reading: Wideband help
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Old 04-03-2014, 01:14 PM
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Thanks for the link. After reading that, I will not attempt to replace the stock sensor. I will add a bung near the factory location, and use the wideband solely for tuning purposes.

I just need to figure out now if the glowshift wideband kit will datalog with Binary editor. If it is capable, I will return the Innovate LC-2.

If not I will keep and use the Innovate, and try to return the glowshift wideband.
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Old 04-04-2014, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbakker View Post
I bought the Innovate LC-2 with Green DB series gauge for $170 on ebay, shipped directly from Innovate. I have talked to an innovate tech rep, who said that it should work for a narrowband stock replacement just fine, and still provide the wideband features.

Has anyone run an Innovate controller like this as a stock replacement?
I have with an LC1.. worked a treat on my '90 f150 with a Ford Motorsports MAF conversion kit(A9P mustang computer). At the time I had it configured for dual O2 sensors with a stock narrowband sensor on one side and the LC1 simulated output connected to the other bank. Fuel trims for both banks tracked in near perfect synchronization and I was also able to make one side run lean by moving the target A/F ratio. That experiment also confirmed for me that there was no real need for a dual sensor setup if all injectors are in good shape so I put it back to a single sensor config and kept the LC1 in the opposite side as a wideband for tuning. I have a Tweecer RT with Binary Editor for tuning.
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Old 04-04-2014, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conanski View Post
I have with an LC1.. worked a treat on my '90 f150 with a Ford Motorsports MAF conversion kit(A9P mustang computer). At the time I had it configured for dual O2 sensors with a stock narrowband sensor on one side and the LC1 simulated output connected to the other bank. Fuel trims for both banks tracked in near perfect synchronization and I was also able to make one side run lean by moving the target A/F ratio. That experiment also confirmed for me that there was no real need for a dual sensor setup if all injectors are in good shape so I put it back to a single sensor config and kept the LC1 in the opposite side as a wideband for tuning. I have a Tweecer RT with Binary Editor for tuning.
Thanks Paul. I will only have one O2 at the y-pipe, and I am somewhat worried about swapping it, but it sounds like yours does just fine. Did you just wire the narrowband output from the sensor to your stock O2 harness? How does the innovate controller hook up to your laptop? I am not real familiar with the tweecer, but are you able to hook up to it in the cab, or does it need to be removed?

Also, how did you fake out the heater circuit?
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Old 04-04-2014, 06:48 PM
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The Innovate wideband has a "controller" built into the cable which stays with it it permanently, connection to the laptop is via serial port. My MAF conversion kit comes with an overly harness and that's where I connected the second O2, but the Mustang PCM has hardware for dual O2 sensors while the truck PCMs do not so you couldn't run dual sensors to the PCM even of you wanted to. You could however have a second bung welded into the drivers side down pipe for example and plug your wideband in there, and then you can have tuning input without interrupting the stock setup. Using the wideband to simulate a narrowband is a neat trick but given the need to recalibrate them occasionally it's not a practical solution.
Tweecer is a module the plugs into the J3 port in the PCM just like a Quarterhorse and it connects to the laptop via USB.
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Old 04-05-2014, 07:58 PM
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Do you recommend just adding a bung for the wideband, and keeping the stock O2 for the PCM?

With my banks headers, would I be better off putting bungs right after the tri-y collection point, or just downstream near the stock location in the y-pipe? I would only run one wideband at a time,but just have both banks to move it around for some double checking.
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Old 04-06-2014, 10:42 AM
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Right in the header collector before the flange is where I have always installed O2 sensors, EFI specific headers will have them in this location but if yours don't it's not a big job to have them added, a decent muffler shop will have them in stock for example. Having a single factory narrowband sensor in the passenger side header only where it only "sees" half the motor is no problem either, I have been running my trucks that way for over a decade and there is no performance or driveability downside since the computer applys the same fuel trims to all injector regardless if you have a bank fired SD or sequential MAF truck computer. If you wanted to put a bung further downstream where all cylinders come together for the wideband thats fine but the narrowband sensor should not go there it's more important for it to be close to the engine than see all cylinder.
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Old 04-06-2014, 10:42 AM
 
 
 
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