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  #1  
Old 08-30-2013, 08:25 PM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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Roll bar with integrated stacks on Raptor??

I will be buying a '13/'14 F150 Raptor within a year and I have an idea but lack the technical know-how & hands-on experience. I will be using the truck for WORK - towing trailers, getting into hard to reach locations in all seasons, vehicle recovery, etc... At times I'll be operating in some sketchy areas and I want to install a roll-bar just in case "stuff" happens. I've also entertained the idea of converting the stock exhaust to stacks - this way I need not worry about ripping off the tailpipe over a ditch or snow bank.
...I have an idea of installing a roll bar that doubles as exhaust stacks - I guess you could call it "stealth stacks" if you wish. My idea is to have the roll bar installed in such a way that the exhaust system could be ran up thru the front part of the bed & into the bottom of the vertical section of the 4" roll bar. After some thought, I have decided on having MANY 3/4" holes drilled into the underside of the horizontal part of the roll bar (where lights are often mounted) in an "honeycomb" formation. Reason for these holes being on the UNDERside of the bar is to keep rain from pouring in and causing trouble (rust). The 40 to 60 (not sure how many) holes would be drilled in 3 staggered rows (I called it honeycomb) extending nearly the entire width of the horizontal bar. If it doesn't get too expensive, I'd like to include the installation of long tube headers and Flowmaster mufflers but I'm not sure how all of this will work considering the location of the catalytic converters - like I said 1st off, I'm no exhaust technician & that's why I'm asking this question here. Speaking of things getting expensive, I have thought of having the roll bar & braces made from heavy-wall, 4" stainless steel - I know, I know. MONEY. (I do have a way of getting material like this at much less cost)
I guess I don't have any particular questions.... I would just like some honest, unbiased opinions of this idea. Do you see any potential problems? Do you think it will sound goofy? Will it be too restrictive?
If there are any experienced auto mechanics or exhaust professionals in the house, throw in your 2 cents (or $2). Thanx!

Last edited by DanTheMan221; 08-30-2013 at 08:27 PM. Reason: typo
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  #2  
Old 08-31-2013, 12:58 AM
85e150six4mtod 85e150six4mtod is offline
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Exhaust and a roll bar do not mix.

A "roll bar" isn't going to do much for you in a real crash. In a low speed roll over, you will still have cosmetic damage.
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Old 08-31-2013, 11:21 AM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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"Exhaust and a roll bar do not mix"... Why? This tells me nothing. Why bother typing?
This roll bar's purpose is NOT to save me in a 95 MPH, tumbling & flipping, TRAINWRECK crash -- it would be for in case things go wrong when I'm tugging the backhoe up an embankment, get a rear wheel in the ditch & "over she goes"... (VERY slow speed tumbles)
Like I said before, I do some vehicle recovery and I imagine the roll bar will occasionally serve as a good hook point and maybe save a black eye sometime...
Now would you mind reiterating your idea of "Exhaust and a roll bar do not mix" so this thread is worth reading?
Good day.
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Old 08-31-2013, 08:16 PM
85e150six4mtod 85e150six4mtod is offline
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Corrosion and heat/cool cycles, plus the weakness introduced with all the holes you want to drill.

How will you weld stainless to the frame? Where will the support braces attach? You going to carve up the bed of a new truck for this? Not to mention the other stuff....

A roll bar as an attachment point for vehicle recovery? A little high up methinks.

When things go wrong, they rarely go wrong at low speed.

http://machinedesign.com/materials/c...d-other-metals

This is 304, not the strongest available, but the only thing I could find a price on easily:

http://www.speedymetals.com/pc-4517-...-annealed.aspx

"Tube" not "pipe".
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  #5  
Old 08-31-2013, 09:54 PM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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Thanks for the price - I was expecting about 2 or 3 grand to do it. That stuff you had me look at is only 1/4" thick - I was imagining something slightly beefier than that. Maybe that is plenty big - this would be a 1-off project and I'd probably have to look at it in person to decide. I never thought of welding the bar or braces to the frame - I guess I was assuming to bolt the hell out of them from plates or something. I know welding stainless is tricky in itself, let alone welding stainless to the regular frame steel (might not even be possible).
-I just was wandering around that website... I think this would be more adequate:
Speedy Metals 5" OD x 4.000" ID x .500" 304 Stainless Steel Round Tube
It's expensive as all hell, but understand this is still just an idea/dream. If I would use this stuff, the roll bar would be more of a luxury item than utilitarian. Can you imagine somebody walking thru Home Depot, looking up & seeing THAT?
When I mentioned about using the roll bar as a hook point, I didn't mean for regular procedure... When drunks roll down a bank in December, you'd be surprised by the unorthodox techniques needed to get them out.
You 1st mentioned about the heat/cool cycles... Considering that ridiculous 5" stuff I showed you, do you think bulky stainless like that would really be affected? I mean, some of those $1000 grills you see around have stainless grates in them...
-& concerning the holes for the exhaust making the bar weak... In a "honeycomb" formation with no less than 3/4" between them, I really don't think the steel's integrity would be compromised much.
Again, thanks for pointing me to that website. It helped.
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Old 08-31-2013, 10:52 PM
85e150six4mtod 85e150six4mtod is offline
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I would be concerned the heat/cool cycle would affect the welds.

A metalurgist might come along any time here and bless/condemn the idea, who knows......
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Old 09-01-2013, 12:26 AM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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Yeah - that makes sense. I will need to have the back braces welded to the roll bar. That would involve cutting the tubes for the back braces at a pretty steep angle AND concave to fit the vertical bar like a glove.... If this work is being done with material that costs $260+ a FOOT, I'd make sure to really do my homework & search far & wide for a MASTER welder/machine shop guy - I'll drive across a few states to pay some 80 year old dude who KNOWS HIS **** to do the work. Someone who is as qualified as I'd be looking for will know about thermal fatigue & what not.
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Old 09-01-2013, 06:15 PM
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Recovering a backhoe? Stacks? A Raptor!?

You need a 6.7 superduty!

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Old 09-01-2013, 06:53 PM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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Naa. Super Dutys are great for pulling stuff down the road. I spend more time in fields than on roads.
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Old 09-01-2013, 08:17 PM
bigblueworktruck bigblueworktruck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanTheMan221 View Post
Naa. Super Dutys are great for pulling stuff down the road. I spend more time in fields than on roads.
Raptors are great for off-road, no doubt, but the tow ratings are less than even a standard F150 due to the soft suspension, mostly.

Are you talking about towing a backhoe on a trailer, or using your truck to try and pull out equipment that's stuck somewhere? Just curious, but usually if you get a good sized piece of equipment stuck, you need something bigger and heavier to get it out. Thinking wrecker with winch.
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  #11  
Old 09-02-2013, 12:15 AM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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I was just using that as an example of the kind of things it'll be used for. The Raptors come with the heaviest tow hooks on any pickup for a reason - not for when IT gets stuck (if you can manage that, either you deserve a medal or you rode the short bus) - they're for hooking chains to for tugging on OTHER stuff. We do a little bit of everything around here and that includes some farm duties - I've helped a tractor out of a hole more than once with Pop's '79 Ford straight 6.
Like you said, the truck is "rated" to tow 8K because of the soft suspension - putting too much weight on the ball will squash the rear and screw things up. However, if you're hooked to a heavy tandem axel trailer (we have 2 with electric brakes) that supports the weight itself & not on the tongue, the Raptor can drag WAAAY more than 8000 - I'm talking private property work and whatnot. Heck, the little 3.5 EB is rated for over 11,000...
I'm really looking forward to getting this truck home, getting the overkill roll bar/stack combo on it & getting out there to get stuff done. We have a Kubota RTV dumper & a JD 790 that might be collecting dust or be on Craigslist once the Big Dog comes home.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:09 AM
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I think i can save you some money. You can forget the roll bar, there have been quite a few Raptors rolled out in the desert at high speed. The guys have walked away uninjured. Most roll bars that are put on are more for holding lights than saving the vehicle. These cabs are very strong, and hold up very well in a roll over condition. As for ripping off the exhaust, that would be a tuff one, it is tucked up pretty good under the truck. Add a properly mounted and sized winch to the truck and pull your equipment out at a slow and controlled pace.
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:59 PM
DanTheMan221 DanTheMan221 is offline
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Nope - I'm not gonna forget the roll bar - oh, it's gonna happen. Like I said earlier in this thread, I'm not worried about flipping the truck at 85MPH - it will be in place for the unfortunate event of tumbling down an embankment or something of the sort. Building it from the material I'm thinking of, it can be utilized for things other than just protecting my skull. I've been playing with the idea of having it installed in such a way that it actually stiffens up the truck as a whole. A pickup's weakness has always been where the bed attaches to the cab... Once I have the truck in the garage and can carefully investigate the way it's put together, we might be able to devise a way of actually strengthening the trucks chassis during installation. Other than functioning as a ROLL BAR (NOT just a POS K-mart light mount ), I just like the way roll bars look - they just look good. AND, like I mentioned before, I want to run the exhaust thru them like "stealth stacks" to get the pipes away from the rear wheel - yes, I COULD rip the tailpipe off - I can break anything - it's a gift/curse.
In case you didn't read it from earlier in the thread, THIS is what I'm planning on using....
Speedy Metals 5" OD x 4.000" ID x .500" 304 Stainless Steel Round Tube
I know it's OVERKILL and terribly expensive, but like I've said a dozen times by now, it's going to be a real, FUNCTIONING roll bar and possibly a reinforcing part of the chassis as well. This whole apparatus will weigh approximately 600 pounds so it will also help balance out the front/rear weight distribution and make for a better ride and slightly better traction. Yeah, I know - as if the MPGs aren't crappy enough already, adding another 600 pounds isn't going to help matters, but it might end up being pretty negligible at the gas station.
You mentioned a winch - I agree 100%. I really want to install one on the front of the truck - it's almost a given - hopefully it doesn't interfere with the front-facing camera. I've been talking about utilizing this 600 pound roll bar for "other things"... I'm playing with the idea of installing another winch on IT - just a thought. I'll have to determine if the heat from the "stacks" will pose a problem though - I'm sure there'll be ways around that.
You said about the "cabs being very strong"... The origin of this roll bar idea is the fact that the Raptors AREN'T the greatest in rollovers. I read that a year or two ago. Here is some recent data on the '13s....
2013 Ford F-150 4WD SuperCab 133" SVT Raptor Safety Ratings & Features
I don't PLAN on laying it over, but there's a significant chance of it happening someday.
-I assume some of you guys aren't taking me seriously. In about a year there will be some very interesting posts showing up here...
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  #14  
Old 09-02-2013, 05:56 PM
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600lb!?

That's a good chunk of your payload capacity.
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Old 09-02-2013, 06:12 PM
85e150six4mtod 85e150six4mtod is offline
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NHTSA rollover ratings are based on how easily the vehicle rolls, not how it does when it rolls.

"NHTSA's current consumer program rates rollover risk based on a vehicle's "static stability factor," which is an engineering calculation based on the track width (the distance between two wheels on the same axle) and the height of the center of gravity above the road. Starting with the 2004 model year, the rollover risk predictions will be based both on the vehicle's static stability factor and its performance in the dynamic test."

The above is from this site:

NHTSA Announces New Rollover Test | National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA)

In about a year, huh? Well, I suggest you buy the truck first and then consider if you are going to carve it up and weld a 600lb wart to it's *** after you part with $40000 or more......
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