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1968-2013 Full Size Vans Econolines. E150, E250, E350, E450 and E550

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2013, 08:02 PM
oldcurmudgeon oldcurmudgeon is offline
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Hmmmm, yard near here wants $450 for one with 115K. OUCH!
Center shaft is only $24 at Ford dealer! And I already have a new "infamous lock pin". If I just could get the old one OUT!
Have to admit... sure would be easier fix to drop out whole axle and replace.

Also...plot thickens.....
apparently all 92-95 E150 had rear ABS (according to manual I have) and some 95 had 4WABS. There is, in fact, an electrical connector on the front of the diff housing. Had assumed that was VSS, but on checking manual, it states VSS is located at rear of trans.

If this is indeed RABS, why do I see 'non-ABS' rear ends for E150 in these years listed for sale? Does this just mean 'not 4WABS' or is manual incorrect? If I read correctly, there is no difference in the rear ends ...both RABS and 4W ABS have a single rear axle sensor and sensor ring. The difference is in the anti-lock control module, the hydraulic control unit (only 4W), the ABS relay (only 4W), and the front wheel sensors (only 4W).

Go figure........
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 06-06-2013, 08:41 PM
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Hmmmm, yard near here wants $450 for one with 115K. OUCH!
........
Can't help ya with the VSS stuff, I don't know enough.

But damn maybe I need to put together a load of good old Ford parts and head to NC.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 11:31 AM
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HAPPY,HAPPY,HAPPY!!!!!

I am a persistent sort, and decided to try welding a 1/2" hex bolt to the buggered 5/16 hex. Figured if it did not work, I could always drill the center shaft and go from there.

Took my time in prep. Already had ground a slot in 5/16 hex to try to remove with driver. Ground new bolt end to fit slot. Covered entire area with heavy duty foil .....just exposing the bolt. Used MIG and managed to get new bolt pretty well attached and did not have any mess at all on carrier or elsewhere.
Not an easy feat when you are squeezed under the van (no lift!)

You can imagine my grin when the *@#$& lock bolt turned when I wrenched on the 1/2" !!!!

Came right out and pulled the center shaft and C clips with no problem.
Will pull axles, replace bearings and seals, put in new center shaft and lock pin.

As mentioned before....seemingly no issues with rear end itself prior to all this mess. No noise, etc. Gears inside look good.
Think I can get away with above approach or should I think about rebuilding entire diff with a bearing kit? Probably won't put another 50K on it over the coming years.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 11:42 AM
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awesome!

if it was mine, i would just do the wheel bearing and stuff on the offending wheel, toss a new seal at the other wheel, and call it good enough, assuming you don't find any problems with the bearing/seal surfaces of the shafts
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 12:13 PM
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FANTASTIC!!!

No reason at all the pull the carrier and do bearings unless you have an indicator that something is wrong.



Ok a few tips for getting it together right so you don't have to do this again.

Is it posi? They don't all have the spring sometimes the only way to know for sure is to pull the side gears and look. If so replace the clutches and make sure it's tight. Worn posi clutches cause more C-clip play.

You said your replacing the center shaft, but take a really good look at the axles. Three places wear on the axles; 1) the bearing, the axle is the bearing race 2) the seal surface 3) and most important, the end that impacts the cross pin. In the pic below you will see that the axle is mushroomed.
Click the image to open in full size.


A very cheap and worth while piece of insurance is to put an O-ring in the groove with the C-clip. It will help keep the C-clip tight which helps everything else stay tight and in the worse case it can hold the C-clip in place.

Of course inspect the C-clips to and consider replacement.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 12:53 PM
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1959 thru today:

If the AXLE code stamped on the Warranty Plate (1959/79), printed on the Certification Label (1980 to date) begins with a letter: Limited Slip.

If with a number: No Limited Slip / Posi and Posi-Traction are GM terms.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 02:41 PM
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1959 thru today:

If the AXLE code stamped on the Warranty Plate (1959/79), printed on the Certification Label (1980 to date) begins with a letter: Limited Slip.

If with a number: No Limited Slip / Posi and Posi-Traction are GM terms.
Bill, not sure your point, not all tags are present or can be counted on to be correct. It's so easy to look, just look. And LS/posi, same thing, nobody really cares.

Now what I am curious about that you might have insight on is the O-ring thing. I've seen more O-rings in the C-clip groove then I'd suspect were installed during repairs and more in later vehicles. Is that something Ford ever did from the factory?
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by BruteFord View Post
Bill, not sure your point, not all tags are present or can be counted on to be correct. It's so easy to look, just look. And LS/posi, same thing, nobody really cares.
It's not an axle 'tag' that I was referring to. AXLE code stamped on Warranty Plate riveted to left door face. AXLE code printed Certification Label that is glued on door face or B pillar.

Now what I am curious about that you might have insight on is the O-ring thing. I've seen more O-rings in the C-clip groove then I'd suspect were installed during repairs and more in later vehicles. Is that something Ford ever did from the factory?
4A332 is an o-ring, is this the one you're referring to?
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by NumberDummy View Post
It's not an axle 'tag' that I was referring to. AXLE code stamped on Warranty Plate riveted to left door face. AXLE code printed Certification Label that is glued on door face or B pillar.
OK but the point still stands, the warranty plate isn't always present or correct. The point is that for the 30 seconds it takes to look there is no reason not to.

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4A332 is an o-ring, is this the one you're referring to?
Cool good to know, so any 8.8 without the o-ring has lost it at some point? Maybe 10% of them that I've had apart had an o-ring in there when I did
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2013, 06:19 PM
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Cool good to know, so any 8.8 without the o-ring has lost it at some point? Maybe 10% of them that I've had apart had an o-ring in there when I did
If a dealer or shop replaced the axle bearing and seal, would most likely replace the o-ring.

But, what would 'shade tree' Elmer do? He'd whiz down to Ben Dover's auto parts store, buy the seal or bearing or both. But...unless he pulled the axle beforehand, would he be aware of the o-ring?

Probably not, and if it had disintegrated, would not be aware there was one.

If present, would he whiz back down to Ben Dover and buy a new o-ring? Probably not, he'd put it together and pray.

btw: Are you aware that Horizon Ford in Tukwila is an FTE Ford Dealer Parts Dept sponsor? Gives a parts discount off the actual MSRP
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 06-08-2013, 05:46 AM
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btw: Are you aware that Horizon Ford in Tukwila is an FTE Ford Dealer Parts Dept sponsor? Gives a parts discount off the actual MSRP
Many newer contributors don't know OEM parts can be obtained from our sponsors----we who've used Horizon or Tousley Ford need to spread the word more often.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 06-08-2013, 05:56 AM
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Many newer contributors don't know OEM parts can be obtained from our sponsors----we who've used Horizon or Tousley Ford need to spread the word more often.
Tousley Ford (tousleyfordparts.com), in White Bear Lake MN is now known as Auto Nation Ford / horizonpartsguy.com was formerly partsguyed.com

Another FTE sponsor, silverstatefordparts.com ~ Gaudin Ford in Las Vegas NV / This is only one of the three that has a link to their site among the sponsors-top of this page.

If you want the other links, you have to click on MARKETPLACE then SPONSORS. Reading thru the sponsors...you'll find they're not in alphabetical order.

Ed Olson (partsguyed), got most of the business as he was very active on FTE and in FTE's WA chapter. He has a Stupor Duty & 1977 F100.

But Ed suffered a stroke 1/2011, was forced to retire. Recently I sent a member from OR to Horizon, when he called, the idiot that answered the phone had never heard of FTE!

I told the member to call back, speak with Wyatt who now handles the FTE orders. Told him to tell Wyatt to inform the other parts guys inre to FTE.
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2013, 06:41 AM
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Great info guys...Thanks!

I decided to order the center shaft and C clips from Ford. Not expensive and figured 'worth it'. Local parts guy does not beat me up with retail. Did not know about the sponsors but will check in future.

Will pull and inspect axles today...hopefully they will be OK.
Will have to add O rings as well.

After 'assembled'....check play (any tricks?) or just figure existing shims should provide right spacing?

Anything else to inspect prior to buttoning it up?

This has been a 'challenge' (read PITA) but considering the cost of 'just paying to have it done', well worth the trouble. Besides, I know if I do my own wrenching, it might take longer but will be right.
Thanks again .....forum has been GREAT help.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2013, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by oldcurmudgeon View Post
Anything else to inspect prior to buttoning it up?
Just while in there might as well make sure it's not limited slip as mentioned and make a note of the gear ratio. The tooth numbers will be stamped on the ring gear. Something like 39-11 which would be 3.55s
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Old 06-09-2013, 04:52 PM
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tag on diff reads S744G 3.55 8.8. It is NL .

Project has now evolved:

Have to replace both axle shafts after iinspection showed some pitting. Not bad, but will 'make it new'.
After axles and rear end repaired, will also replace rear wheel cylinders, brakes all around, and front bearings/seals.
A fair bit of time , effort, and money......but hey, at 200K it is time to just take care of it! Van has been running well.
Should be set for a few more miles....hopefully!
Definitely cheaper than a new van!!! HAHAHAHA
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Old 06-09-2013, 04:52 PM
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