Darn rights moving 25,700 lbs is gonna take some boost haHA

Consider this though; with the 6.4 running so much EGR, should an EGR disabled tune not need less air into the engine to achieve the same results?


I'm not 100% schooled on the subject, but I thought the 6.4 runs about 30% EGR gasses to the intake, on average.
If that figure were true, the EGR disable tunes should require 30 % less forced induction on AVG.

As I said before, the 6.7 only runs just above 20 PSI to make it's 400 HP.

There is nothing I'm aware of on the 6.7 as far as injection being more effecient, thus I see no reason why these tunes should be running such high PSI boost with EGR disabled tunes.
If I floor the 6.4, with EGR disabled, I would expect to see around 20 PSI, not 30 or 40. Every PSI of manifold pressure = at least a PSI of back pressure, and making that back pressure is robbing power from the engine.
If the turbocharger actuator is positioned by the tuning to create 30 lbs of boost, when 20 lbs is all that is required, does it make sense that even with 10 PSI of un-necessary back pressure, it's wasting all that power?
At 2000 RPM, that would be compressing 6400 liters of air to 10 PSI per minute, as a total waste. I don't know what that would translate to for HP, but it could be the #1 reason why 6.4's get less than desirable MPG in general.

 

I ran the original H&S tunes that had very low boost and mileage was still around 17 hwy. now with new tunes boost is higher but mpg same. Why did they raise boost levels though?

 

I would have to imagine to burn cleaner.
The advantage is that if you apply more throttle, if the induction pressure is already there, the power is more instant.

 

<style> <!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:Cambria; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:0; mso-generic-font-family:auto; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:3 0 0 0 1 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ascii-font-family:Cambria; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:Cambria; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-hansi-font-family:Cambria; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style> I know the Spartan 210 tow tunes have increased line pressure to the trans, in addition the torque converter lock up is much earlier. The shifting is a little harsh at first but will tailor to the driver and improve over time.

The Pcm on the engine tuning has much lower EGT, fuel rail temp and OIL temp safeties limits built into the PCM as higher sustained temps are expected.

I saw someone post about trans reliability. I tow around 26,000 lbs trailer weight at least 3 times a week. I have the original trans in my truck and have been tuned since about 10,000 miles when Spartan tunes where only available thru a custom file on a superchip tuner with about 98,000 on the clock now I have had ZERO trans issues and trust me my truck gets worked hard its no pavement princess...lol these trans are extremely strong and reliable when proper maintenance is preformed on them.

 

Without the AR and mapping of the 6.4 turbo vs the 6.7 turbo there is no far comparison of the two to actualy look at the boost pressure. I haven't had to chance to play with the new tech on the 6.7 turbo but i am assuming its much more efficient then the 6.4 setup

 

I'm no diesel tech but I don't know that your logic would hold up under qualified scrutiny. The 6.0 at my shop doesn't run near the boost of the 6.4 either but I just chalk it up to different methods by the engineers for achieving the required hp/tq. Why it is I don't know, but I don't see it as a problem needing to be fixed, it's just the method they chose for achieving their design goals.

I don't get your idea on EGR either. I could very well be mistaken but as far as I can tell boost is boost and if the 'puter determines it takes 20lbs boost pressure to get the power your foot is asking for it's still going to require 20psi regardless of where that air is coming from.

 

The 6.0 had a different emissions goal, different injectors, etc. So it plain out runs differently. I think you are right, it's all different designs to make things work properly. Heres the catch though; "properly" from ford, is different from what others might think "properly" is. For EG, ford thinks EGR and regens are working "properly", and most would disagree.

Ok, I see where you're going, but 20 PSI of fresh air, and 20 PSI of mixed EGR air are 2 different things. You'll need more induction pressure than an identical engine without EGR to make the same power, because there is less oxygen in the intake.

I think we are talking about the same thing? lol...

We all know it takes boost to make power. Strip off the turbo from a 6.4, and what would it make? 160 HP maybe?
I'm not saying turbochargers are stupid or anything remotely close.
What I am saying, is that all the tunes I have used to far, seem to run the turbochargers like boost is goin out of style.

I can easily load the right tune, and I can have the empty truck at highway speed, running 20-30 lbs of boost, barely picking up any speed. That is crazy, because that 20-30 lbs of boost is robbing power out of the engine, and is doing nothing that couldn't be accomplished with say 10 lbs of boost. Hell, an old IDI engine could pick up speed just as fast running 0 boost.

So, all my ranting, and whining, is because I would like to see the turbocharger system running according to load, not crazy emissions tuning.
Old hills I used to pull with the 7.3 at 10-12 lbs of boost make the 6.4 peg the boost guage to the end on some tunes.
That doesn't make sense, especially since the injection system on the 6.4 should make more power with LESS induction.

 

All i know is my 6.4 tuned by h&s lattest updates pulls like a beast on stock power using S1M tranny tunes. I tried the S2M ones and didnt like them nearly as much. So as far as im concerned BOOST IT BABY.

 

RU on the latest software version, I think it's 48. Changed the names of the tunes and according to their website they didn't change anything except the names. What didn't you like about S2M, the harsh shifts? I was hoping they would smooth out and just be firm when I was towing. I don't drive it much when I';m not towing but it is a hard shifting program.

 

No its not harsh just seems like theres too much slipage from the torque converter to me when using S2M. Tranny temps seem higher now with newer updates. The funny thing is i didnt notice that on the older update. On S1M using tow haul the truck pulls like crazy on mild tunes using stock setting. Keep in mind this is differeent than stock using the high hp tunes. On a down side with S1M When not using tow mode the torque converter keeps going in and out when in city or slower driving. However i have learned to deal with this better by not letting fully off throttle when possible.

 

What speed will the TC lock?