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  #1  
Old 11-19-2012, 04:54 AM
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w/e away in the truck

I took another load of material down to the coast over the w/e. The truck, with FRx, pre-pump and fuel filters ran like a charm.

Saw 2 other F250's down there, both with their exhausts still bunged up with the FA stock 'DP'. It's like they're still watching black & white on their colour TV for the sake of buying a 'proper' aerial! Each to their own.

There was golf ball sized hail on Sunday afternoon. Luckily the truck was parked up under a car-port.

It was hard work coming back, lots of slowish traffic. Running light, not towing, going up Clyde Mountain the trans temp was sitting on 80c or 176F. I've never seen it that high before. A quick search through the US forum releaved my cooked trans concerns - basically anything below 180F is considered normal.

At the passing lane at the top I was able to pass quite a few slower vehicles and flashed by a gold coloured newish F350 or F450 parked on the side of the road with the bonnet up. Wonder if he cooked his transmission?

I wouldn't know anything about the Torque-shift trans and couldn't have helped in any case.

Boost on my stock turbo topped out at 1.7bar or 27.5 psi - I was happy with that!
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NOT done: big oil, big brakes, big turbo. Next Mods? None - I'm done!
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:10 PM
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Simon,

My trucks gearbox runs hotter than 176F. It more runs at 240F, sometimes a little hotter, especially in the queensland summer days. It has always run that hot, ever since I have had it. 240F is still just in the green on the trans temp gauge. I have had the box serviced twice now in 5000k, once cause the mechanic didn't listen to ne when I told him that it was just done 2000k ago, so he did it again. That was for free obviously due to his poor listening skills. Neither of the guys, especially the first service said that the oil was burnt or cooked. I will be putting a larger trans pan on and a JWVB early next year. Hopes that makes a difference. Got me a bit worried now. Last thing I want to be doing is forking out 6K for a replacement box this close to chrissy. Have to keep an eye on that from now on.
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:58 AM
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Thanks for that Wallsy!
The JWVB will probably save some slip and thereby reduce your trans temp.

I saw on the US forum that the larger pan will not improve the cooling. You might want to go for the transmission cooler upgrade - a lot either add the trans cooler from the 6.0 so they run 2 coolers, or replace the stock 7.3 trans cooler with the taller 6.0 cooler.
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NOT done: big oil, big brakes, big turbo. Next Mods? None - I'm done!
Australia: where Mechanics use spanners & Plumbers use wrenches
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:19 AM
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Simon,
Have you up graded your trans cooler mate, or is it stock!!! Getting a trans cooler from a 6.0L would be a fair amount of work I reckon, not really having easy access to any spares in australia hey. Maybe an after market one will be the go possibly. I need to do something. The gearbox has never been flash in it. Sometimes it takes up to 2 sec to change gears and other times it tries to break your neck, by snaping into gear. I will put it on the to do list which is growing by the day at present.
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:54 AM
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Personally I have not done it. I've had a close look at the trans cooler on my truck and it looks like the PO has had a bigger unit put on.
Any parts like this I tend to order from the US - I don't waste my time looking around for Australian suppliers. If the parts are heavy I get the supplier to ground freight to my Viaddress.com suite and get them to forward it onto me. That saved me $100 in fright getting my 'in tank' mods from Strictly Diesel.

The delayed change, esp if it's going into reverse, is a sign that the 'tranny is on the way out' according to our US bros. Hopefully the JWVB will fix that up - I found that it definitely firmed up my shifts. I haven't seen anything that talks about shifts being too firm though. I did see it posted that there are a couple of bolts in the trans behind the valve body, and these bolts tend to back out. If these bolts are loose and are tighted up this can fix the delayed shift problem.

Let us know how you go!

I've taken Chunder's advice and started saving for a JW trans - Chunder found it cheaper to buy one in the states and AIR freight it over that to purchase a reman unit here! It was still $6K though!
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MODS: Hutch,ICboots,plenum inserts,IH uppies,G2WW,HPx,AIH delete,EBPV delete,hi flow outlet,CCV mod,OCR,Zoodad,6637,4" TB exhaust,JW VB,coolant filter,FRx,'05 HD lights with switch bypass relays,B20 ready fuel system(3 filters).Stratos truck seats,rear head rests,LED running lights, 285-75-16s. Gauges:EGTx2,Boost,Trans temp,Fuel pressure,Eng oil temp, Coolant temp, Edge CS, PHP tuner
NOT done: big oil, big brakes, big turbo. Next Mods? None - I'm done!
Australia: where Mechanics use spanners & Plumbers use wrenches
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:23 PM
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yep, 240F is up there especially if you aint towing. Like Simon said the VB will firm up ya shifts a reduce heat a little but I would seriously look at ya cooler. Do your trans service your self. There are plenty of write ups and its simple. Get the filter from Clay. You might want to check your cooler lines to see if they are blocked some what. I flush my cooler and lines when I service the trans just to check flow. Both my stock and new box never go over 195F and I spend almost every Xmass up in QLD towing my tralier and sitting in 40C day in traffic on the Pacifi
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:24 PM
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yep, 240F is up there especially if you aint towing. Like Simon said the VB will firm up ya shifts a reduce heat a little but I would seriously look at ya cooler. Do your trans service your self. There are plenty of write ups and its simple. Get the filter from Clay. You might want to check your cooler lines to see if they are blocked some what. I flush my cooler and lines when I service the trans just to check flow. Both my stock and new box never go over 195F and I spend almost every Xmass up in QLD towing my tralier and sitting in 40C day in traffic on the Pacific Hwy
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Old 12-01-2012, 07:20 PM
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Brian,
I had the gearbox serviced twice, as I previously mentioned. The first time was because it was leaking from the dipstick. The second time was 2 weeks later at the mechanics, as I mentioned to him that I just had it done. He misherd me and redid it thinking I wanted it done. The mechanic said that the first guy did a half assed job, as there was a chunk of rockmaterial still stuck in the filter. At least it has had all the oil out of it, even the TC. Never thought of servicing the box myself, due to knowing nothing abouit them, and quiet frankly they scare me. Especially reading up on the forum and all the issue owners have with them. I will look at getting the lines and cooler flushed early this week as I will be up in Gladstone working for the last part of it. Hope that is the issue. I took it for a pretty long drive out to the western suburbs last week to get a wheel alignment, and on the motorway home it crept into the start of the yellow on the gauge. Definately an issue there.

Will you be coming up to the Sunny State this Xmas? Call in if you are. I could do with some expert hands on this truck I reckon mate, if you want to of course. You may also be over them after doing your engine build.
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:44 PM
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Diesel Submariner Diesel Submariner is offline
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V10 COOLER

G'day Wallsy,

I also had tranny cooling issues until I did the following:

1. Dropped pan and changed it to a deep capacity pan with extra cooling fins.
However I'm not sure of that mod. After 30K + Km I now feel that this is not that effective in lowering TFT. In fact common belief now is that it may (r) may actually prolong the cooling down once temps rise due to the increased volume of TF circulating . At my next TF/filter change I'm considering putting the OEM pan back on to see how it effects the cooling down time . One thing it does do is increase the outflow of dollars from ones wallet at TF change time .

2. Got a JWVB from Clay and fitted that.

3. Got the Tranny Cooler for the V10 F'trucks. This cooler is the same as a Tru-Cool Max but has the mounting brackets exactly the same as the skinny little OEM 7.3Ltr. I believe the mob that made the Tru-Cooler's made this one as the OEM cooler for the Ford V10 trucks.
So it is very simple to change out as opposed to the mods needed for a 6.0Ltr cooler.
The piddling little OEM 7.3 cooler is a 28K lb Gross Mass rated cooler and the V10/Tru-Cool Max is a 40K lb Gross Mass rated cooler.
I ran the fluid line into the new bigger V10 and out of it to the original OEM cooler mounted between the inside of the ARB Bull Bar and the Air Con condenser, out of it to the fluid return line to the tranny.
The combination of the V10 and the 7.3ltr OEM coolers has the same heat exchange efficiency as the big 6.0Ltr cooler.
On the 7.3Ltr OEM cooler I later mounted 3 x 4" Spal 12V Fans side by side to draw cool air through that cooler. I just turn these on when I see 165*F on the TFT Guage. I have an LED indicated switch on the dash to a relay to start all three fans. The switch is tapped off and ignition live only source so as I don't accidently leave those three fans running after shut down .
It works a treat. These are the same fans fitted to Water cooled Motor Bike radiators. They're water proof and I've had them on for a couple of years with great success .

4. Changed the Ford Dexron111 Red TF for the fully Synthetic Castrol Transmax 'Z'. It is Green in colour so it is easily pushed through the system until no Red is coming out and only clean Green coloured fluid is showing.

I've been running like this for a couple of years now and have had no more overheating issues .

Cheers,
Reg
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:25 PM
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Reg,

Thanks for the tips mate. Im sure if I copy you, which I probably will do, that it will sort the problem, but not really! The gearbox should not be getting that hot running as a stock standard set up. I intend on getting to the source of the problem. I will also do the mods you have suggested as it can only be benifical to the gearbox long term.

I checked my transcooler and its dimensions are 350mm x 350mm, situated directly behind the grill. Not sure if this is standard, or if the standard one is mounted there. The ones on ebay for the F250 seem to be long and skinny. I have room directly below it to fit a long thin one, but not too tall, just behing the number plate. There is 70mm of clearance to fit a cooling fan to the other transcooler behind the grill.
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:28 AM
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Diesel Submariner Diesel Submariner is offline
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TRANNY COOLERS

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallsy View Post
Reg,

Thanks for the tips mate. Im sure if I copy you, which I probably will do, that it will sort the problem, but not really! The gearbox should not be getting that hot running as a stock standard set up. I intend on getting to the source of the problem. I will also do the mods you have suggested as it can only be benifical to the gearbox long term.

I checked my transcooler and its dimensions are 350mm x 350mm, situated directly behind the grill. Not sure if this is standard, or if the standard one is mounted there. The ones on ebay for the F250 seem to be long and skinny. I have room directly below it to fit a long thin one, but not too tall, just behing the number plate. There is 70mm of clearance to fit a cooling fan to the other transcooler behind the grill.

G'day Wallsey,

Hummm .. agree, getting those temps stock is concern enough , however it is of more concern as the measurements of the tranny cooler you have in there is not the 7.3ltr OEM cooler , but your set seems to already have 2 x Coolers and therefore bigger in its capacity.

If you have a cooler situated directly behind the grill then that is an add on cooler because the OEM is between the Air Con Condensor and the Intercooler.

That 350mm X 350mm I suspect is a Tube and Fin type; i.e: a round tube with cooling fins around the snaked tube ??

If that is the case then there is part of your cooling issue. A 'Tube and Fin' type cooler is no where near as efficient as the 'Stacked Plate and Fin' type. The OEM are these type as are all the F-Truck tranny coolers.
Tube & Fin are cheep to make and are much less efficient and also slow down the flow.
Stacked Plate & Fin do not restrict flow and have an effective full fluid surface contact to the air via the thin flat plates as it flows through the stacked plates. The effective cooling surface area is greatly increased over the very limited tube & fin types.
The Tube & Fin can only disipate the heat via the external fins making it much less efficient in the heat exchange.
Again I'm only guessing that this is what may be fitted??

What may be the issue with your set up is that the fluid is flowing it's normal route through the bottom of the radiator, then through the 7.3ltr OEM cooler then to (I suspect) the add on Tube & Fin cooler.
The flow through the Tube & Fin may well be too slow due to the tube wall and numerous bends friction.
If this is the case then this will add to the cooling inefficiency of the little OEM instead of aiding it.

The 7.3ltr OEM is around 580mm (L) X 140mm (H) X 30mm (D) = 2,436cm3.

The V10 is 580mm X 200mm X 30mm = 3,480cm3.


Here is a pic of the comparison between the Stacked Plate & Fin coolers:

Click the image to open in full size.[/IMG]

Hope this helps mate.

Cheers,
Reg
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:51 AM
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Reg,

And there be the problem. I do not have a transcooler between the intercooler and A/C condensor unit. It basically runs from the gearbox to the bottom tank of the coolant radiator, then out and up to the 350mm x 350mm gearbox intercooler. And yes, you are right, it is a snake type cheap one at that.

Seems I will have to get a proper transcooler fitted. Fitting one in front of the A/C should be ok I guess. Can you see any issues with that, other than the A/C may not be that cold, which it isn't anyway, or should I put it back to where it originally was.

This takes me to the next issue. A mate of mine brought his 04 dual cab F250 around for me to have a look at. He was running 2 coolers. 1 where you said between the intercooler and A/C and a small one, about the size of a house brick just to the left side of his number plate, tucked away down in there.

One other thing I did notice is that the intercoolers have plastic outlets. My intercooler is all aluminium aftermarket. Maybe that is why I have no transcooler in there anymore. Although saying that, the rough dimensions you gave me for the standard trans cooler being 30mm deep, it should fit as I have about 50mm gap in there. Go me stuffed.

At least we all figured out why the gearbox is getting so HOT. I wondered why it had a gearbox temp gauge in it when I bought. The previous owner must have known it was an issue. I am taking it to a gearbox place this week to have a chat to the guy to see what he has that will replace the standard transcooler or a better way of keeping it cool. Maybe just a good quality one in front of the A/C condensor radiator is the go. See what he says.

As for the complete aluminium intercooler? It has very large outlets on it, larger that the pipes going into it. Must have been done with the turbo upgrad I imagine. Really helped have another F250 next to mine to compair as I have not done this before. Learning all the time about this truck.
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Old 12-02-2012, 05:07 AM
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Reg, great photos, thanks for posting those. From that I think my PO put in the trans cooler from a 6.0 - result!

Wallsy, sounds like your PO has fitted a trans cooler with insufficient cooling capacity. All you have to do is get the 6.0 trans cooler fitted and your high trans temps will be a thing of the past! If you're careful you should be able to do this without loosing too much trans fluid, just a top up required!
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MODS: Hutch,ICboots,plenum inserts,IH uppies,G2WW,HPx,AIH delete,EBPV delete,hi flow outlet,CCV mod,OCR,Zoodad,6637,4" TB exhaust,JW VB,coolant filter,FRx,'05 HD lights with switch bypass relays,B20 ready fuel system(3 filters).Stratos truck seats,rear head rests,LED running lights, 285-75-16s. Gauges:EGTx2,Boost,Trans temp,Fuel pressure,Eng oil temp, Coolant temp, Edge CS, PHP tuner
NOT done: big oil, big brakes, big turbo. Next Mods? None - I'm done!
Australia: where Mechanics use spanners & Plumbers use wrenches
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Old 12-02-2012, 07:02 AM
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Diesel Submariner Diesel Submariner is offline
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Tranny coolers

G'day again Wallsey,

Well good to see we've nutted out ya problem .

Seeing you don't even have the little OEM I would advise that you source asap a cooler from a 6.0ltr and mod the brackets on it to fit in the correct position between the Air Con Condenser and the Intercooler (I have a full write up on how to do it with photos and video if you want).
The original lines will still be there coming out of the radiator bottom as they would be currently used to connect that Tube & Fin rubbish that the misguided PO fitted .

If you can't get hold of a 6.0Ltr Cooler at least source the Tru-Cooler for the V10 and fit that. It is a straight bolt in as the brackets are the same as the little OEM. At least that will look after you a hell of a lot better than what you now unfortunately have.
You could then in due time source the original 7.3ltr OEM cooler and fit it as I have.
But the best way would be to get hold of a 6.0ltr and do as I first suggest.

As far as your statement goes 'other than the A/C may not be that cold, which it isn't anyway,' Well that is another issue with these that I can sort for you. There is a fix for that also.
But lets get the Tranny box cooling sorted first.

One thing I would do is when you get a 6.0ltr or V10 "DO NOT" just leave the current fluid in the tranny and top up.

With the temps you have been seeing and not knowing what temps and stress the PO has put on it before you, it would be counter productive to spend good earned hooch on proper cooling and not flush out the old fluid and put nice clean fresh fluid back in. That old stuff is most probably burnt to a degree and has most certainly lost a deal of its designed properties.

Put that full Synthetic Castrol Transmax 'Z' in mate, ya tranny will love ya for it.

Cheers,
Reg
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:11 AM
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Update,
Took the truck to 3 seperate places to get looked at this arvo.

1st place said 2 small transcoolers in front of the A/C condensor radiator is the go. That was priced at a staggering $750. Another $500 if I want the fluid changed. Seems Ned Kelly is still alive and well.

2nd place said they would fit a large transmisson cooler, again in front of the A/C behing the front grill for $400. This cooler is a bit larger that the V10 from what I understand.

3rd place said I want to do a pressure test. If the box is not pumpming 1ltr per 10sec, then there is a large issue. If this is the case, he reckons putting on an additional cooler, with exception to replacing the standard one, with excentuate the problem. He is charging $90 for the test.

Seems the 3rd guy found the missing intercooler I was looking for. It was tucked down at the very bottom of the A/C condersor radiator, sort of hidden in there. Because it is painted black and looks like the bottom of the A/C condensor radiator, it blens right in. It is smaller than I imagined it would be. About 140mm high, pretty long and half hidden by the A/C radiator. So now that it is there, I have real issues. Two coolers and the truck is up at the 240F all the time. All the blokes checked the oil, and said it was in excellent shape. Note, the oil is only roughly 2000km old though. I just hope Brian is right saying the lines are blocked, or at best the cooler is stuffed with collapsed cores. I am just wishing that is the case.

I think I might go with option 3, just to rule that pump issue out, (I hope).

All of the guys aswell recomend by-passing the water radiator? Thoughts!
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