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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 07-26-2012, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v8power
Now back to the original reason why I wanted to go to an AOD…4th gear. If I shouldn’t tow or haul in 4th gear, then what’s the point? I do 1:1 now with my C6. I’m not talking about uphill, I manually down shift now for that. I mean long hauls on flat roads. If I shouldn’t use 4th gear for that, then I’m better off with rebuilding my current C6.
What's the point you say? The OVERDRIVE gear, you Lunkhead. Did you not read my posts? If you get an AOD, you tow in 3rd gear, which is a 1:1 ratio, just like the C6. THEN, when you DON'T tow anything and are just driving down the highway, you have the added luxury of the 4th Overdrive gear with the 0.67:1 ratio for much better fuel economy, something the C6 doesn't have. You will get the best of both worlds. Capiche?

And that proves my point on why the AOD was often abused. Too many people thought just as you do and just couldn't understand that the Overdrive gear is not supposed to be used for towing. And that is probably why only the 300 and 302 engines got the AOD.

If you are going to be doing heavy towing most of the time and don't use your truck for long trips without a load very often, stick with what you already have. If you drive your truck on the highway often and would like better fuel mileage than what you have now, the AOD would be an upgrade over the C6.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 07-26-2012, 01:48 PM
FlatBlak FlatBlak is offline
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heres a thought, try a different gear setup if your going for fuel economy? 1:1 vs 1:0.67 would mean you could step down .33 in your gear ratio or tire size and get the same benifit. on the highway.

aode 4r70w? seen those come and go on a weekly basis too.

e40d? you guys think that .03 gear reduction makes a difference?

economy is a funny thing, its like power, there comes a time when you can compromise everything just to save that extra dollar or gain that extra few horsepower. no one will be happy, as we get to vehicles that get 100 mpg buying gas will become more expensive than heroin. but... that being said sometimes you can get both, and there are better and cheaper ways of saving on fuel, one of the biggest is maintenance, the other is making the engine work easier. ive built 5.0's that get up to 28-30 mpg. havent come to that point yet but im planning on building a nice 300 with a little extra power but no affect the fuel mileage, if anything make it better. another way: power to weight, the lighter the vehicle, the easier it is on the engine, and every other component.

as for sticking with the c6, find a good shop, there are plenty around my area, im assuming there would be in your area too, that offer plain rebuilds or what most call a heavy duty upgrade that usually has some type of shift kit in it, heavier internals, ect. if you plan on building it yourself to save a few extra bucks, lots of stuff online you can order, lots of write ups on magazine websites and forums on how to toughen it up.
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Old 07-27-2012, 12:57 PM
v8power v8power is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LARIAT 85 View Post
What's the point you say? The OVERDRIVE gear, you Lunkhead. Did you not read my posts? If you get an AOD, you tow in 3rd gear, which is a 1:1 ratio, just like the C6. THEN, when you DON'T tow anything and are just driving down the highway, you have the added luxury of the 4th Overdrive gear with the 0.67:1 ratio for much better fuel economy, something the C6 doesn't have. You will get the best of both worlds. Capiche?
I guess I didn't make myself clear...I want to tow/haul on the highway in 4th gear. If I can't, or I shouldn't with an AOD...then what is the point? I use the truck for truck stuff like hauling/towing. I have a car for my daily driver. If I never use the 4th gear for hauling/towing, then it's a waste to swap from a C6 to an AOD.

So now it's a matter of rebuilding this C6 stronger for towing/hauling or one ready built.

Other than bad reviews with Monster Transmissions, who builds a good towing transmission?

Going through the forums, it sounds like rebuilding this one isn't so bad, I just have to get a few heavy duty replacement parts like the 5 clutch drum and #9 thrust washer.

Ideas? Comments?
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 09-02-2012, 06:34 AM
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Have you looked into the stand-alone O/D units?

Gear Vendors Under/Overdrive Ford 2-Wheel Drive 3-Speed Automatic.

The way I see it, if you want to tow in overdrive, the C6/Gear Vendors or do like I did and go manual.

Manual swap isn't bad. No matter what way you go if you change trans plan on drive shaft mods as well.

So seems like it's been long enough where the C6 is freshened up. Just a thought.
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Old 09-02-2012, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v8power View Post
I guess I didn't make myself clear...I want to tow/haul on the highway in 4th gear. If I can't, or I shouldn't with an AOD...then what is the point?
Ok here's a first person counterpoint for you, my truck has an AOD and it's spent most of the last 13ys behind a beefed up 5.8 that was producing close to 400 ft/lbs of torque and it's still banging off shifts to this day.. and I rarely select any lever position except OD.. towing or not. As already mentioned the key to a long live for the AOD and any other auto trans for that matter is to minimize gear hunting and heat buildup, so more than anything when it comes to trucks and heavy loads the axle gearing has to be appropriate for what it's being used for and unless you live in the north an aux cooler is manditory. My AOD is nothing special it's just a rebuild with the latest stock updates from Ford(that's who built it) and a shift kit so I know it's possible to get a lot of good use out of one of these. My truck is heavy at 5k dry but so far I have resisted the urge to mount big tires because I know it also needs more axle gearing, even with 30" tires the truck feels like it would benefit from 3.73 or 4.10 gears, but considering the deep OD ratio I don't think that would hurt fuel milage much if any. Overall I don't see you being disappointed with an AOD unless you just pulled some old carcass out of the junkyard and stuffed it right in a truck with 35" tires and 3.08 gearing.. that is the perfect recipe for turning an AOD into a DOA in a very short period of time. But setup the trans and truck correctly and you should have many years of good performance and the potential for high teens to low 20s fuel milage when unloaded.
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1990 5.0HO AOD XLT X-Cab F150 3.55LS, 1994 3.0L 5-sp x-cab Ranger 3.45, 2004 3.0L 5-sp X-cab Ranger Edge 4.10, 2004 2.5L 5-spd Subaru Legacy
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-02-2012, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conanski View Post
my truck has an AOD and it's spent most of the last 13ys behind a beefed up 5.8 that was producing close to 400 ft/lbs of torque and it's still banging off shifts to this day..

You're talking about apples and oranges here. His stock 300 with over 300k on it will never see 400 ft/lbs of torque. The higher torque/hp of your built 351w makes the transmission hunt less because the engine doesn't have to work as hard to go down the road. After all the main reason the transmission will hunt is throttle pressure. The more gas you give it the more RPMS the engine turns, the kickdown/TV cable moves and BANG! you downshift and the rpms come up to increase the hp/tq. With a built up engine it takes LESS THROTTLE PRESSURE and less RPM to do the same work.

v8power stick to the C6, replace your vacuum modulator as that sounds like the issue to me. It's ~$12 bucks. If it still acts up then rebuild the trans and engine at the same time. Throw a little bit bigger cam and better ratio rockers on it for a little boost of power. You'll get better mileage towing.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 09-02-2012, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pfogle View Post
You're talking about apples and oranges here. His stock 300 with over 300k on it will never see 400 ft/lbs of torque. The higher torque/hp of your built 351w makes the transmission hunt less because the engine doesn't have to work as hard to go down the road. After all the main reason the transmission will hunt is throttle pressure. The more gas you give it the more RPMS the engine turns, the kickdown/TV cable moves and BANG! you downshift and the rpms come up to increase the hp/tq. With a built up engine it takes LESS THROTTLE PRESSURE and less RPM to do the same work.
The AODs work a little differently in that regard, they upshift fairly early depending how much preload is on the TV cable and it takes a lot of throttle input(you pretty much have to floor it) to provoke downshifts. I won't disagree with the idea that a higher output motor produces less shifting, that's part of the reason I got 17-18mpg out of this thing with the 5.8 on the highway... once it got into OD it rarely droped out and was pretty impressive at climbing hills in OD too. The comment about the TQ output of my 5.8 was aimed more towards those that say the AOD is too weak, I don't see a healthy copy having any problem with a stock or lightly modified 4.9 or 5.0 in typical truck applications, because short of putting a blower on it those engines will never make that kind of TQ.
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1990 5.0HO AOD XLT X-Cab F150 3.55LS, 1994 3.0L 5-sp x-cab Ranger 3.45, 2004 3.0L 5-sp X-cab Ranger Edge 4.10, 2004 2.5L 5-spd Subaru Legacy
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-02-2012, 07:43 PM
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I agree with what Conanski is saying here. We had a farm truck with a 5.0 and an AOD. We rebuilt the motor at 200k, and the tranny remained stock. We upgraded stroked the motor to a 347 and it sat comfortably at 385 horse abd I'm guessing about 400ft/lbs of torque. We used that truck to haul a cattle trailer and hay wagons. Sold it last year with 310k on the odometer and it ran like the day it was built. We never took it out of OD because it never needed it when it was rebuilt.
but here's an idea. There was a suggestion that his motor gets rebuilt with the trans? Why not get an AOD and make the motor more powerful when its rebuilt so it doesn't hunt?
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 09-10-2012, 04:48 PM
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Are car (Mustang, T-Bird, Crown Vic) AODs the same as those used in the 4x2 F150s?
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 09-10-2012, 04:53 PM
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My TBird has a 4R70W, which is a completely computer controlled version of the AOD.
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Old 09-10-2012, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
Are car (Mustang, T-Bird, Crown Vic) AODs the same as those used in the 4x2 F150s?
Yes they are.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 09-10-2012, 06:04 PM
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AOD should be from a truck or from behind a V8, and from model years '88-'93. Early units have issues.
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Old 09-10-2012, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
Are car (Mustang, T-Bird, Crown Vic) AODs the same as those used in the 4x2 F150s?
Yes and no, the only car version with remotely similar internal components would be one from behind a 5.0HO, and as already mentioned it's well worth searching for a later model(90+) because these things were continuously updated over the years and the later the model the stronger it is.
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1990 5.0HO AOD XLT X-Cab F150 3.55LS, 1994 3.0L 5-sp x-cab Ranger 3.45, 2004 3.0L 5-sp X-cab Ranger Edge 4.10, 2004 2.5L 5-spd Subaru Legacy
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:58 PM
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Unhappy E4 OD braking problem

Newby here, don't know how to start a new thread but here goes.

I've acquired a 1990ish F53 based motorhome. The motorhome modelyear is 90 but I suspect the chassis may be 89 or so with a 7.5l gas and an E4OD tranni. History is that it ran 90,000mi then tranni was rebuilt due to pumping fluid over the side (said a clip had come loose in the OD unit). Ran a scant further 13,000 miles and the OD failed (couldn't be pressed apart) so hard parts were replaced and overhauled by AMMCO. Previous owner (old timer) didn't recognize a fault but when asked, he said "yes, it has been that way since AMMCO redbuilt the tranni".

Problem: While in OD or in any other gear, when descending, engine braking is only available for a few seconds (as if the convertor is unlocking and the tranni is dropping to low pressure/idle mode). If I apply a slight bit of throttle, things lock up and engine braking returnes, as long as I hold a bit of throttle only!

Suspect: ??????

Can someone provide me with the "pinout" of the E4OD connector and a discription of what signals are to be expected on each wire and wheather they come from the engine side or tranni side of the connector?

ANy ideas where to start trouble shooting this problem? I'm referbing the coach and hope to take it out west this spring so will need this feature when descending out of the rockies!!!!


Larry

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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlatBlak View Post
Keep c6, bullet proof, had 5 aod's none of them stood up to what i threw at them (2 stock ones, 3 built ones) if you want that extra gear id go standard. but i would never trust an aod again, if budget permits you could run an e40d, they are pretty solid as well (c6 internals)
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:28 AM
Eddiec1564 Eddiec1564 is offline
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The E4OD tranny will not engine brake in OD, it has a coasting clutch to alow the vehicle to coast(get better MPG). You will need to turn off the OD to get engine braking.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:28 AM
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