I have a new to me 2000 f250 2wd 7.3 PSD srw with a zf6, truck has just over 43,000 miles on it now and its completely stock. The truck HAD a Valeo single mass, single disc factory ford clutch in it which was smooth and working great until the factory clutch fork snapped 2 months ago.

After some forum and local research I went with the Valair stock replacement brass lined clutch(single disc, 400hp), the Ford one I took out was a brass lined disc as well. I updated the clutch fork to the new one, new pivot, new pre-bled slave and master cylinder, all factory Ford parts. The flywheel was resurfaced, it was well within Valeo specs, I called them first to verify. I followed the installation instructions thoroughly, everything was cleaned extensively with 3m brake cleaner, I used red loctite on all fasteners and torqued everything evenly in sequence to Valair spec. Break in was 600 miles, very easy driving, I have a little over 1400 miles on the clutch now.

The problem is the clutch is quite chattery from a stop in first, second and reverse, after that its smooth, other than it chatters on vehicle slowing downshifts some in lower gears.

I spoke to Valair a couple times and first they told me something had to be loose, I went back and checked, everything is still tight. I called back and this time Gary told me these clutches are just more aggressive and some chatter is normal.(far from what they told me when I called them directly to purchase the clutch kit.) His only other explanation was I had hot spots on my resurfaced flywheel and that could be causing problems. I didn't see any heat spots, I even asked my machinist to double check and he said everything looked, and resurfaced fine.

Not real impressed with Valair CS, Gary told me I could buy a less aggressive disc, pay for shipping again, pay for R&R and see if that fixed the problem. One of the reasons I went with Valair was the forums spoke highly of the customer service.

So I either have chatter or I can give the truck a rev to about 1100-1200 rpm and get a lunge instead of chatter.

Finally my question, does this sound normal and is it just something I have to learn to live with or does something seem wrong? After some more extensive reading I found quite a few similar complaints about these clutches.

Honestly at this point I am thinking of pulling it back out and going back with a factory single mass setup, although its $800 on top of what I already spent. I live in a decent size city and In stop and go traffic its driving me insane.

I tow maybe 10 times a year give or take, usually a 12' dump trailer with construction debris, rock, sand, dirt, and other general construction supplies. Trailer is 4k lbs empty plus the fill. Never unreasonably heavy but I thought maybe a little better clutch was a good idea.

 

Welcome to FTE.

Hold that thought. Let me PM someone who has a lot of experience with Valair and we'll get his input on this.

 

I put a Valair clutch in the old truck I had and experienced the chatter, bunny hop as well. Seemed to go away after several months.

 

Something is a miss here. An organic, or organic/brass single disk should be smooth as silk. But there are too many factors involved that I can't look at to tell you which one. I can't verify your machine work on the flywheel, and I can't verify the parts of the pressure plate, or clutch disk. I have driven every clutch that Valair offers, and anything organic has been smooth. Especially the single disks.

Gary can sometimes be very direct and to the point, but he's a very nice guy, and know's his clutches. Good customer service doesn't mean, if for some reason you are not happy, we will send you free clutch parts. On any given day (I know because I've spent alot of time there) they get 10 or 20 calls with guys saying my clutch flew apart, and I was just driving it, or some other story like that. So you have to understand their side of the story.

There are not many other companies that will just sell you a clutch disk if you ask for it. Most will sell you a whole new setup. And I can't imagine a single organic clutch disk would cost much at all. While it's true you would have to pull the tranny and swap it, it's still a reasonable offer. And if you are not doing the work yourself, that makes it a third party that can cause problems so to speak. Nobody is verifying, the verification, of the verifier..... See what I mean?

I hate that you are having problems with the clutch, nobody likes to see this, especially Gary and the guys at Valair. On most things they will work with you if you are reasonable. (not saying you did this) But if you call up there with a poor attitude, customer service is out the door. Again, not saying you did this.

If I was a betting man, I would say if you are really babying the clutch, this may be the issue. The clutch needs heat cycles to break in. If you haven't slipped it at all, it may not even be seated in yet. Even at 1400 miles. My suggestion would be to put some RPMs to it and slip it a little a few times. But that is just my opinion, and while I know a lot about clutches, I am not the expert that Gary or Dan is by a long shot. So I would ask them is there is anything you can do to try and get it to smooth out.

I promise you, they will do anything they can to help you out if you just talk to them about it like a friend. More with sugar than salt my friend. I will pass this thread along to Gary, and hopefully he can chime in.

Cody
Death Row Diesel

 

I believe in what Cody said. Its not a good idea in my opinion to turn the flywheel to begain with, just replace. Also I like to do it all, pressure plate also. This is just me. I know guys have done this and been okay. Its just your opening up a can of worms. Let us know how it goes. Sliping to seat, it mit work.

Chet

 

Don't get me wrong Chet, I'm all for surfacing the flywheel. When we were doing R&D for the OBS double disk, I had a different clutch in the truck every week for a month. And we surfaced the flywheel every time. We didn't have a single issue with it. Heck, never had to use shims either come to think of it.

The pressure plate should be a perfect surface when the customer gets it, no question. And Gary will be the first to tell you, surface the flywheel you are going to use. Don't install a new clutch, that the old clutch has worn into. It's like putting new brake pads on rotors you didn't cut. Will it work? Yes. But it has a higher likelyhood of failing/vibrating/ squeeking. Same with a clutch. All new parts are the way to go, but I have no issues with getting the flywheel surface. But your point is a good one too.

 

And just so I'm clear, I'm not saying blownnova did anything wrong. Not trying to point any fingers at anyone. I'm just saying there is a lot to concider when your having clutch issues. And I have no doubt that Valair will help you out the best they can. You just have to be up front and work with them. No doubt it's a frustrating situation, I feel ya.

 

Thanks for the welcome and replies,

I understand what you are saying Cody, I will try a little harder clutching and see if that helps. I have slipped the clutch a bit and it seems to get really grabby when I do that but I will give it some more attempts. There are tons of unknowns involved here and that makes it tough, but that's also part of being in the type of business and doing business on the internet. It can be bum deal when things don't go well. You are not offending me and I don't feel you are trying to blame anyone.

I am heading to Utah for some fly fishing and to see some family on Wednesday, its a minimum of 1300 miles there and back, should be plenty of time for some seating.

All my calls to Valair have been cordial, I am mainly looking for a solution, not confrontation, as you said its very frustrating. I rent a tranny jack when I do this and its kind of a pain, also somewhat expensive so I would like to get it resolved. I have arranged for a lift and some help the next time. If it has to come out again, all I can do is take it apart and inspect it for damage/problems and take some pictures for other opinions. I can't say that I am blaming Valair, its just hard for me to want to spend more money for another clutch disc when I already have one I am not real happy with. Although you said all yours have been smooth Cody, with a little searching there are quite a few people with my identical issues.

As far as turning the flywheel, its a judgement call, I have turned several in my life, this is the first with any problem. I asked Valeo, they said it was fine, I asked Nick at Valair, he said it should be fine, I asked my machinist, he said it was flat and turned down fine. Perhaps it was a mistake. I was already spending well over $1200 unexpectedly on clutch parts, tools, towing, and rentals, saving the $200 on a flywheel was helpful at the time. There was nothing wrong with the old clutch, it was smooth as can be until the fork went, I thought it would be fine.

I was actually ready to pull the clutch out and put a Ford factory clutch back in before my trip until I went to the dealer today. She told me the clutch and pressure plate I took out that was working smoothly when the fork broke had been superseded 12 times since it was released. Not real confidence inspiring!

I will try what was suggested and see if it helps and wait and see if Valair has anymore insight. Thanks,

David

 

Good luck Fishing, David.

From DISLFVR's post on this identical company i mentioned about, is why i have a "stock" Valair replacement in my garage now. I too, plan on turning the flywheel to save the 300-ish buks for replacement.

Anyhow, hope there's a resolution/solution to ur experience...

 

The -01 (Heavy Duty Organic) can be a little aggressive compared to the OEM Organic due to the HD spring hub we use. When we say a little aggressive we mean that it is going to have a more possitive engagement. Denpending on the situation it could chatter a little but in no way should it be jumpy or undrivable.

We used to send out replacement clutches no questions asked, but due to receiving clutches back that showed signs of being installed wrong, or not receiving them back at all we have to cover all bases before deciding that it is necessary to send out a replacement clutch.

Cody is right, you may have to drive the truck a little more aggressive to get the clutch to seat in.

 

Thanks for the wishes of luck Timmy, I can always use a little more.

Thanks for the reply, it is a more valid explanation of what is necessary to assess the problem when someone calls and is having clutch issues. Its to bad people are taking advantage of your willingness to help with problems.

When I called in I was not given this type of explanation, it was more along the lines of there must be something wrong with the install (both times I called), figure out what you did wrong and get back to us. That still may very well may be the case, perhaps 99+ percent of all clutch problems are from the installer, but I am certain that's not always the issue. I think if I was told that others were taking advantage of the of replacement clutches and more was necessary for you to deduce the problem, I would have more faith in your CS. Being told it's most likely my fault and I can buy another clutch to try is not real confidence inspiring. Again there are many variables and unknowns at play here and it may just be to time consuming to get into conversations like this.

I was not expecting to just be offered a replacement clutch, I was hoping for some insight into what might be going on from someone with more experience in this field.

My truck is certainly still driveable its just extremely annoying and feels wrong, also in my mind it seems like it may lead to some more issues if it continues to chatter and hop very long.

Anyway, for know I am going to take the advice of others here and drive it more and see if it goes away. If it does, excellent, there are a lot of people who are crazy about these clutches, I was hoping to be one of them. It will certainly save some money. If it does not go away I will pull it again, see what issues there are and be in touch.

This is the end of a very very long day, thanks again to those who have taken the time to try and help me, have an enjoyable and safe holiday.

David

 

Ok, I drove it hard, drove it far and its no better, I am gonna start rounding up parts as soon as I have the extra money and pull it back out.

 

When you say chattering is it a noise you hearing or is it something you feeling? I also have a valair in my truck but mine is the ceramic/Kevlar for heavy towing witching do a lot of. After I put my valair in my trans got very noisy when it was in neutral with the clutch pedal out. But other than that my clutch is very aggressive and does shake the truck when releasing the pedal on take off.

 

Feeling, it feels like the truck is hopping in the low gears and reverse. I do have the rotational noise when the clutch is out too but I had it before with the single mass Valeo I had. It's slightly louder with the Valair but I can live with that part, that's only troublesome when I am at a drive through or someone is trying to talk to me when I'm sitting in the truck.

 

Mine does the same thing but mine is a more aggressive clutch. It can get very annoying when backing up and trying to slip the clutch a lil so I'm not backing so fast with a heavy load. I think there is nothing wrong with your set up I think its just the clutch grabbing due to the difference in the pressure plate. My factory clutch was fine it was just not enuff pressure in my pressure plate and it was slipping with the mods I have pulling a load.