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Just bought a 2013 Ecoboost and immediately put a grill in front of the CAC. The amount of gravel roads I travel on would surely make short work out of the cooler. I'm very interested in the condensation story and lack of power. I'll keep you informed if I get anything like that on my 2013. I live in the North and humidity is always low, but we'll see.
I don't have an Ecoboost, much less this problem. For the guys who are talking about drastic measures to eliminate the concern I have two ideas:
1) Install a sealed air filter/box assembly between the CAC and throttle body OR replace the hose between the CAC/throttle with one that can S up and down to let moisture collect in a more controlled manner.
2) Flip the CAC upside-down (including the piping necessary to accommodate the change) so the inlet and outlet of the CAC are at the top instead of the bottom.
The condensation in the CAC makes a lot of sense. Even if it ISN'T messing with the sensors, it may be messing with the fuel spray in the cylinder (since it's direct injected). Under steady light/moderate load (driving on the highway at steady speed for a couple hours), the turbo will continue to spin and warm air between it and the CAC. When the CAC cools the boosted air, condensation will settle at the bottom. Theoretically, you could build up over an inch of water at the bottom of the CAC and still let enough air through to not notice. Then, when you jump on the gas the sudden increase of boost will suddenly flush all that water UP the intake piping.
Either of the options above should reduce the amount of water that can get to the TB at once.
The good news is this: I bet you guys don't have carbon buildup on the valves!
Gents. I traded the Ecoboost several months ago because the wife and I upgraded our RV, and needed a diesel dually to pull it. For no reason other than a huge difference in price, I ended up in a CTD Ram this time, and have been spending time in the Cummins forum. But reading through this thread tonight it occurred to me I've never heard anyone on that forum complaining of condensation issues, and its got me wondering why (considering all the diesels that have had the problem; PS, VW). I'll try to get some pics tomorrow and post them so you guys can see the difference. Maybe there's something there, maybe not.
BTW, sold my 86 F150 today. First day in almost 30 years I haven't owned a Ford truck. It doesn't feel right.
I think the main issue is where the intercooler pipes hit the intercooler on the Ecoboosts which would encourage slow air flow at the top of the intercooler which would seem to provide for more opportunity for condensation. On the RAMS/Dodges and Duramaxes, the intercoolers were cross flow with the pipes coming in at about the middle of the intercooler or at the top of the intercooler. So it would take quite a bit of condensation in order for water to make it to the intake. I do believe the 6.4 power stroke had a north south flow on their intercooler however I don't know which way the air came in (from the bottom or the top). The 6.7 power stroke is a water to air intercooler and the way the air flows through that think, it seems like there's nowhere for slow air flow so it doesn't seem like there would be any opportunity for condensation to gather.
I tried really hard to get some meaningful photos of the Ram, but for a truck so large everything is very tight and compact in and around the front bumper. I did get this pic that shows how the inlet and outlet tubes run to the intercooler. One thing I found different from what I remember of the Ford is there's no top or bottom for the inlet/outlet. They have a flange that runs the full height of the intercooler, causing exactly the cross-flow that Jus2shy described above. Also the Ram intercooler is much shorter and wider than the Ford. Hopefully this will help some.
I just read the whole post, and I've experienced the loss of power, shudder, misfire 3 or 4 times now , I may be wrong but my own opinion is that water pools in the bottom of the cac and under sudden WOT boost climbs and blows all the water into the engine , the last time it happened was doing about 50 MPH punched it downshifted to 4th then I floored it and it downshifted to 2nd rpm's went from 3,500 to about 5,000 then it happened loss of power, shuddering, and misfiring like 3 plug wires had come off, after what seemed like forever actually only about 30 seconds it cleared up, no CEL, no codes, dealer says until there are codes they can do nothing. I've had a brain storm idea of putting a drain on the bottom going to catch can with a float operated drain in it, does it sound like a good idea or just wait until my engine disintegrates from a massive ingestion of water. I forgot to add it's a 2011 3.5 Eco screw 4X4 with 3.3 rear.
Last edited by duckman903; 07-08-2014 at 12:07 PM.
Reason: more info
I just read the whole post, and I've experienced the loss of power, shudder, misfire 3 or 4 times now , I may be wrong but my own opinion is that water pools in the bottom of the cac and under sudden WOT boost climbs and blows all the water into the engine , the last time it happened was doing about 50 MPH punched it downshifted to 4th then I floored it and it downshifted to 2nd rpm's went from 3,500 to about 5,000 then it happened loss of power, shuddering, and misfiring like 3 plug wires had come off, after what seemed like forever actually only about 30 seconds it cleared up, no CEL, no codes, dealer says until there are codes they can do nothing. I've had a brain storm idea of putting a drain on the bottom going to catch can with a float operated drain in it, does it sound like a good idea or just wait until my engine disintegrates from a massive ingestion of water. I forgot to add it's a 2011 3.5 Eco screw 4X4 with 3.3 rear.
Some guys on another forum drilled a 1/16" hole in the bottom of the intercooler and haven't had the problem since. Under boost it blows the water/oil mix out of the hole so the engine doesn't get a big gulp. I'm not telling you to do this mod, I'm not telling you not to do it either. But I would suggest changing your spark plugs, Motorcraft SP-534's gapped to .030
I just read the whole post, and I've experienced the loss of power, shudder, misfire 3 or 4 times now , I may be wrong but my own opinion is that water pools in the bottom of the cac and under sudden WOT boost climbs and blows all the water into the engine , the last time it happened was doing about 50 MPH punched it downshifted to 4th then I floored it and it downshifted to 2nd rpm's went from 3,500 to about 5,000 then it happened loss of power, shuddering, and misfiring like 3 plug wires had come off, after what seemed like forever actually only about 30 seconds it cleared up, no CEL, no codes, dealer says until there are codes they can do nothing. I've had a brain storm idea of putting a drain on the bottom going to catch can with a float operated drain in it, does it sound like a good idea or just wait until my engine disintegrates from a massive ingestion of water. I forgot to add it's a 2011 3.5 Eco screw 4X4 with 3.3 rear.
Huh. My dealer did the CAC TSB without me even complaining about it. Maybe try a different dealer.
XDotNet said: "I think Fords "fix" is BS...all they are doing is shrinking the intercooler or blocking it's flow in an attempt to heat up the surface enough to burn off the condensation.
I'd love to have an ecoboost with the air to air intercooler but it needs a drain. It's just an engineering change that they seem unwilling to invest in."
This post is over a year old now, but in case some are reading it since this discussion was brought back to the top....
I have a new truck built in April 2014. It has the newer CAC (per the code on the side of the CAC) and it does not have the add-on deflectors that previous TSBs had the shops installing. I noticed in the video below, the TSB says that's relevant for trucks built before Dec 16, 2013. I assume the CAC was tweaked over time and the tune updated. But in the video below, it sounds like even people with an older coded CAC (?) should have the deflectors removed, the PCM flashed to the latest update/tune...but not replace the CAC. Sounds like it.
Anyway, I haven't been in the exact type of driving conditions that people say can trigger this problem, but maybe the next time it's raining good on the highway, I'll floor it and see how it goes. Hopefully the very latest built models have all the updates/fixes built in and I'll never experience this problem. It's pretty rare that I do wide open throttle anyway, so I'm less likely than some to experience this in the first place. But sure, there are times when i do for passing or pulling out onto a busy road.
As I stated in an earlier post about loss of power, shuddering, I thought it was water in the IC but it's happened in the dry a couple of times, driving up grade in 6th then enough throttle to down shift to 4th, then stomp on it, drops into 2nd and around 4,500 rpm it starts it's s**t, well I cured the problem, went to the dealer and said the magic words "LEMON LAW" so my problem got solved and it's sitting in my yard now 2014 4X4 screw EB with more options than I'd ever order, and I'm saving MONEY.
My fix is add the large Catch Can to the fresh air side and mount it with 4 feet of 5/8" hose next to the horns.
One thing I have noticed is about 1/5 of the stuff the can catches floats on the oil like substance so it looks like water but does not evaporate away no mater how long you let it set in an open glass.
Water and combustion compounds in the lower 9/10 th of glass are from strictly the fresh air side and would have gone thru the driver side turbo and condense/collect in the CAC. Caught in the Can over a 270 mile run in the rain, temps in the low 50's.
I never experienced this problem. I wonder if it's because I always seem to be driving in traffic so I can never drive a constant speed? On long trips we are generally towing something so I'm working the truck harder and as a result burning more gas & moving more air. Would this make the problem less likely to occur?
11-10-2013, 04:43 PM
But I would suggest changing your spark plugs, Motorcraft SP-534's gapped to .030
