11-18-2014, 11:39 AM
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Embarrassing discovery about rear sway bar
#16
05-11-2012, 07:19 PM
I added the hellwig and it's made a great improvement in 98% of the driving. The ONLY downside appears to be when leaving driveways
at an angle I about get thrown out of the seat as the X sways from
LEft to right to left as the front wheels go up/down at different times.
I 'THINK' this is caused as 1 side of the front hits the bump stop
and forces the Ex to roll - and the massive rear sway bar fights to keep
the back-end level. This would also explain why so many report
the body mounts moan after the hellwig install.
I think with more lift on the 2wd this would get better?
Just my 0.015 (my 0.02 after taxes)
at an angle I about get thrown out of the seat as the X sways from
LEft to right to left as the front wheels go up/down at different times.
I 'THINK' this is caused as 1 side of the front hits the bump stop
and forces the Ex to roll - and the massive rear sway bar fights to keep
the back-end level. This would also explain why so many report
the body mounts moan after the hellwig install.
I think with more lift on the 2wd this would get better?
Just my 0.015 (my 0.02 after taxes)
#17
05-11-2012, 10:56 PM
Lead Driver
#18
05-12-2012, 07:00 AM
Cargo Master
Join Date: Oct 2006
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You will notice a huge improvement in non-towing! I was ready trade my X after 2 nonths of owning it. non towing was scarry and towing was downright dangerous. I installed a Helwig and X ownership has been great ever since!
I thought an X trailer tow group included the tow mirrors and rear sway bar. my X only had the tow mirrors. it`s an early 02. so "I don`t know".
I thought an X trailer tow group included the tow mirrors and rear sway bar. my X only had the tow mirrors. it`s an early 02. so "I don`t know".
#19
05-12-2012, 08:45 AM
Hotshot
#20
05-12-2012, 09:31 AM
Ford thought the body roll would keep soccer moms from cornering too
fast? With the hellwig, it's a sports car around turns now.
#21
05-12-2012, 10:10 AM
Guys - in my quest to "cure the wander" I think I got it pretty well beat down, (springs/shocks/rotors/new front sway-bar connecting links/positive camber/red-top steering). Been thinking of upgrading the rear anti-sway bar for towing our TT this summer and was doing some research. Crawled up under the rig and started looking around and - here's the embarrassing part - there is NO rear anti-sway bar. Like an idiot, I assumed as it was a 2004 it had one so I never really thought about it as I was doing other projects under the beast. Never jumped into my mind 'cause it didn't exist. Was going to measure the diamter of the current bar and it simply wasn't there!!
I have a 2004, Limited V-10. What year did they start putting sway bars in the rear?? As this doesn't have one, need I drill anything to put one in??
I have a 2004, Limited V-10. What year did they start putting sway bars in the rear?? As this doesn't have one, need I drill anything to put one in??
The swaybar design endlinks bolt to the bottom of the shock mounting plates, the bar runs outside of the frame on top of the frame, below the bed....not even visable from the road....the bushing mounting locations provides increased leverage in favor of the bar allowing a 50% reduction of size compared to hellwig (if I had the tooling, I would have gone with 3/4" hollow) and in terms of fit, it is protected from the tank in the event of an accident, you can run any exhaust layout you want, you do not have to touch the vent tube/brake lines, etc and in terms of performance, I have outrun a Porsche Cayanne (non turbo SUV) by 1 mph in the salom with my 4x2 Mark LT....
#22
05-12-2012, 11:40 AM
Lead Driver
My 4x4 will never handle like a sports car, but with the relative lack of interior bracing surfaces and the slippery leather seats, and living in a state with some of the curviest roads in the country, I think my factory sway bar probably keeps me and my passengers from feeling like they are in a boat... I had a chevy astro van years ago that did not have a sway bar and that thing would roll so much it felt dangerous at even moderately fast corner speeds.
As for why they didn't include a sway bar, I'm not sure. My guess is that their research suggested for the way 90% of the anticipated buyers would use their excursions, it wouldn't be missed, and it saved money and weight by deleting it. I believe a sway bar, on a truck like the excursion, can help prevent a roll over by limited body roll that can result in adequate momentum to take the chassis with it. however, I also know from my autocross days that excessive rear roll stiffness (and a sway bar adds roll stiffness) can lift rear tires on tight corners. So there is a balance in there somewhere.
As for why they didn't include a sway bar, I'm not sure. My guess is that their research suggested for the way 90% of the anticipated buyers would use their excursions, it wouldn't be missed, and it saved money and weight by deleting it. I believe a sway bar, on a truck like the excursion, can help prevent a roll over by limited body roll that can result in adequate momentum to take the chassis with it. however, I also know from my autocross days that excessive rear roll stiffness (and a sway bar adds roll stiffness) can lift rear tires on tight corners. So there is a balance in there somewhere.
#23
05-12-2012, 12:00 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2010
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After looking at all the aftermarket rear sway bars, I was dissapointed with several design issues.....relocation of the vent tube, hanging below the axle (like a F16 tailhook), closness of routing to the exhaust pipe, limited suspension travel matching range (the driveway moaning issue) and excessive weight due to the overly large diameter, required by the inefficient, effectively poor design. So I built my own.....the original design was submitted to addco who said they would build it for free if they could have the drawing , I said great!...Their engineers looked at it and said it would not work.....so I went down to the steel whoesaler, bought 3/4" solid chrome moly stcok and 8 hours later I made a rear sway bar, end links & mounting brackets...total install was bolt in plus drilling 2 holes in the frame- actual install time in the driveway...1 hour.
The swaybar design endlinks bolt to the bottom of the shock mounting plates, the bar runs outside of the frame on top of the frame, below the bed....not even visable from the road....the bushing mounting locations provides increased leverage in favor of the bar allowing a 50% reduction of size compared to hellwig (if I had the tooling, I would have gone with 3/4" hollow) and in terms of fit, it is protected from the tank in the event of an accident, you can run any exhaust layout you want, you do not have to touch the vent tube/brake lines, etc and in terms of performance, I have outrun a Porsche Cayanne (non turbo SUV) by 1 mph in the salom with my 4x2 Mark LT....
The swaybar design endlinks bolt to the bottom of the shock mounting plates, the bar runs outside of the frame on top of the frame, below the bed....not even visable from the road....the bushing mounting locations provides increased leverage in favor of the bar allowing a 50% reduction of size compared to hellwig (if I had the tooling, I would have gone with 3/4" hollow) and in terms of fit, it is protected from the tank in the event of an accident, you can run any exhaust layout you want, you do not have to touch the vent tube/brake lines, etc and in terms of performance, I have outrun a Porsche Cayanne (non turbo SUV) by 1 mph in the salom with my 4x2 Mark LT....
#24
05-17-2012, 03:12 AM
Yeah, I want a copy of that drawing!
After looking at all the aftermarket rear sway bars, I was dissapointed with several design issues.....relocation of the vent tube, hanging below the axle (like a F16 tailhook), closness of routing to the exhaust pipe, limited suspension travel matching range (the driveway moaning issue) and excessive weight due to the overly large diameter, required by the inefficient, effectively poor design. So I built my own.....the original design was submitted to addco who said they would build it for free if they could have the drawing , I said great!...Their engineers looked at it and said it would not work.....so I went down to the steel whoesaler, bought 3/4" solid chrome moly stcok and 8 hours later I made a rear sway bar, end links & mounting brackets...total install was bolt in plus drilling 2 holes in the frame- actual install time in the driveway...1 hour.
The swaybar design endlinks bolt to the bottom of the shock mounting plates, the bar runs outside of the frame on top of the frame, below the bed....not even visable from the road....the bushing mounting locations provides increased leverage in favor of the bar allowing a 50% reduction of size compared to hellwig (if I had the tooling, I would have gone with 3/4" hollow) and in terms of fit, it is protected from the tank in the event of an accident, you can run any exhaust layout you want, you do not have to touch the vent tube/brake lines, etc and in terms of performance, I have outrun a Porsche Cayanne (non turbo SUV) by 1 mph in the salom with my 4x2 Mark LT....
The swaybar design endlinks bolt to the bottom of the shock mounting plates, the bar runs outside of the frame on top of the frame, below the bed....not even visable from the road....the bushing mounting locations provides increased leverage in favor of the bar allowing a 50% reduction of size compared to hellwig (if I had the tooling, I would have gone with 3/4" hollow) and in terms of fit, it is protected from the tank in the event of an accident, you can run any exhaust layout you want, you do not have to touch the vent tube/brake lines, etc and in terms of performance, I have outrun a Porsche Cayanne (non turbo SUV) by 1 mph in the salom with my 4x2 Mark LT....
#25
05-17-2012, 04:48 PM
Just installed the Hellwig on my 2000 2WD last night. Great enhancement to this beast! Instructions are horrible. Lay everything out on a table and preplan where all the nuts & washers go, cause the instructions don't tell you squat as far as washers go. I'll post some pics when I acquire the ability to post pics on here.
#29
04-10-2013, 08:52 PM
Hey Jim I know this is an old thread but I did the exact same thing. I have a 30mm F350 swaybar sitting in my garage with nothing to bolt it too. In the pic below are the parts needed to put it in. I'm having a problem finding exactly what the parts #'s are so if anyone knows it would be greatly appreciated.
#30
04-11-2013, 09:04 AM
Laughing Gas