Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Older, Classic & Antique Trucks > 1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks > '80-'86 HOWTO's
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 10-09-2009, 02:52 PM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
HOWTO - Stop Me - Hydroboost Write Up

Okay, I have been having problems with my brakes, which has been slowly getting worse. I would turn off my truck, come back 1/2 to 1 hour later and my brake pedal would be hard. As of the last few weeks, this has increased to 15 minutes for it to lose vacuum.

I wanted to upgrade to hydroboost eventually, and figured I could just do it now instead of replacing the vacuum booster and then upgrading down the road.

A hydroboost system uses pressure from the power steering pump to provide assist for the brakes. It provides a lot more pressure for the brakes. There are also negatives, with the biggest one being if you lose your power steering pump, you lose brake assist (after the reserve in the booster is lost). BUT if you lose the power steering pump, you lose the steering anyway and are not going anywhere. Also, once the reserves are gone in the booster, you still have better braking than you would with a vacuum booster once its reserves were gone (at least it feels that way to me).

Enough for the background, here we go!

Click the image to open in full size.

You will need five distinct parts: The pressure hose going from the power steering pump to the hydroboost unit, the pressure hose going from the hydroboost unit to the steering box, The return hose from the hydroboost unit, the hydroboost specific reservoir, and the hydroboost unit itself. I got my parts off a late 80's, early 90's Super Duty. Now would also be a good time to get an o-ring seal kit for the power steering pump.

Click the image to open in full size.

Here is what we started with. It is as simple as first taking off the master cylinder from the booster. 2 nuts hold the master cylinder to the booster, and one nut holds a bracket to the same studs. Slide the master cylinder forward. you do not need to disconnect the brake lines, but MAKE SURE the master cylinder is supported. Disconnect and block off the vacuum supply hose for the vacuum booster.

Click the image to open in full size.

Now we move to the inside. Take off the cotter pin that retains the booster shaft to the pedat. Slide off the brake light switch and the bushings. Now you undo the 4 bolts that hold the booster to the firewall. Pull out the booster, and the old one is out!

Now we can do our install.

Click the image to open in full size.

The new one bolts right in place of the old booster. The four bolts line up. Tighten those down from inside the truck. Next, mount the master cylinder to the booster unit, and tighten the nuts.

Click the image to open in full size.

Now, lets move to the inside. I ran into a MINOR problem. The brake light switch did not line up. I put on the hydroboost shaft onto the pedal, but could not get the switch on. My solution - turn the switch 180 degrees. Now the U shaped part of the switch is on the outside instead of the inside. Put the bushings in, and the cotter pin and you are done with that part. You might need to adjust the cruise control switch, but that might vary.

Click the image to open in full size.

Now, onto the last part - the power steering pump and reservoir.

Click the image to open in full size.

Start by draining the old reservoir. There is no clean or pretty way to do this. Next, disconnect the original return line from the bottom. Disconnect the pressure line from the side. Remove the fitting from the side of the reservoir. Now, wiggle off the old reservoir. There is a large o-ring on the pump that seals to the reservoir. Now would be a good time to replace it. Of course, I did not. Lube up the o-ring and the inside of the reservoir with power steering fluid, and slide the reservoir onto the pump. Put the fitting you had taken off of the pump back on. It uses o-rings too. Now would be a good time to replace them. I did not, and had a little leakage.

Next, connect the lower return line to the reservoir. Connect the upper return line from the hydroboost unit to the reservoir. Now connect the pressure line from the power steering pump to the hydroboost unit. Last, remove the pressure line from the steering box. Connect the new pressure line from the hydroboost unit to the steering box. A lot of these lines use an o-ring on one end. make sure it is in good shape and lube it up before putting it in.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Now, fill the pump and bleed it.

You are now ready to go!

How does it work? Well, I almost sent my butt through my ears the first couple of times I hit the brakes! This is awesome. It is one of the best things I could have done for my brakes. On a side note, the truck also runs better since I no longer have the vacuum leak from the booster.

Hope this helps.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-09-2009, 09:42 PM
jeramy's Avatar
jeramy jeramy is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Arkoma,Oklahoma
Posts: 191
jeramy is starting off with a positive reputation.
will work on a 150 as well correct?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-09-2009, 11:02 PM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Yes, it will.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-09-2009, 11:18 PM
bill11012's Avatar
bill11012 bill11012 is offline
Modular motor junkie
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,190
bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.
great job man!

rep sent.
__________________
My V10 will out pull your PSD any day of the week,
If its close to stock and of the same age as my V10.

My IDI can't out pull anything.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-10-2009, 12:31 AM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Thanks, I appreciate it a lot! I hope this helps you with the conversion.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-10-2009, 12:49 AM
bill11012's Avatar
bill11012 bill11012 is offline
Modular motor junkie
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,190
bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.bill11012 has a great reputation on FTE.
If I could find a donor i would do it now.
I cant find any F super duty's in the yards.
__________________
My V10 will out pull your PSD any day of the week,
If its close to stock and of the same age as my V10.

My IDI can't out pull anything.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-10-2009, 12:53 AM
LCAM-01XA LCAM-01XA is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,802
LCAM-01XA has a very good reputation on FTE.LCAM-01XA has a very good reputation on FTE.LCAM-01XA has a very good reputation on FTE.
Good write-up! I have two things to add tho:

1) if your truck has an aluminum master cylinder with a plastic reservoir, its bolt holeswill not line up with the studs on the hydroboost - you will need to take a small die-grinder to them and elongate them a bit towards the outside, we're talking about 1/16" each so nothing gets weakened by this procedure.

2) on certain trucks (IIRC the '92-'96) the hydrobost will bolt up to the firewall, but the linkage rod that connects it to the pedal will sit a very steep angle, which may actually bind the linkage. Solution to this would be grab the hydroboost-specific brake pedal, or simply grind the pin off your factory pedal and weld it a bit higher on the pedal.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-10-2009, 11:00 AM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Thanks for the info, I am still learning about these trucks, and was unaware of the little things that could cause not so little problems. I picked a late 80's truck figuring it would be as close as possible from the factory.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-10-2009, 03:02 PM
oddshot oddshot is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NoGa.
Posts: 301
oddshot is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bghnkinf250 View Post
A hydroboost system uses pressure from the power steering pump to provide assist for the brakes. It provides a lot more pressure for the brakes.
I have to admit that this statement puzzled me. I'm not familiar with these systems ... so I went on the 'net looking for conformation and an explanation.

I found conformation ... there are other folks out there saying the same thing.

Interestingly, they also state that this system leads to shorter stopping distances ... AND dramatic reduction of brake fade caused by multiple brake applications ... all because of the greater system pressure.

Some folks say that the increase can be as much as 400 PSI ... from about 800 to about 1200.

Wow.

But all this still leaves me with some questions:

Brake system pressure is a function of pistons pushing on a fluid ... and that fluid pressing on another piston.

The amount of pressure in the system ... is a result of the combination of pressure put on the first piston, the SIZE and sealing efficiency of the first piston ... and the SIZE and sealing efficiency of the second piston.

With the addition of this "pedal assist" ... you have not increased the the size or sealing efficiency of either piston ... you've increased the amount of force pushing on them. Which would increase system pressure.

a) Since you have more potential pressure in this system ... haven't you increased the risk of wheel lock up? I imagine this type of booster would work GREAT with an anti-lock brake system ... but without anti lock ... I wonder if this system is gonna be a handful in the rain. How hard is it to modulate the pedal to prevent wheel lockup? Especially with a light rear-ended Pick Up Truck!

b) Sealing efficiency. I can see disc brakes calipers standing up to the increased system pressures ... but rear wheel cylinders? Do they stand up to the pressure with out leaking?

This could be pretty cool ... I will be very interested to see your 60 - 180 day reports.
__________________
oddshot
82 Ford F100 302, 4X4, 4Spd
72 MGB-GT 1.8 4 Cyl, Nissan 5 spd, TBI.
72 MGB Roadster 2.8 GM V6
99 Blazer Grocery Getter
99 Mercedes Benz 500 SL Roadster (the wife's car)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-10-2009, 03:12 PM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
My other truck is 4 wheel disc with no proportioning valve. It is interesting in the rain. The F-250 locks up real quick. It is not much different, as I left the proportioning valve on, so the fronts still lock up first. There is a very brief period where you step on the brakes too hard at first, which almost sends you through the windshield. After that, you gauge how much pressure is is going to take on the pedal. As for changing piston size and such, I am contemplating throwing on the Super duty master, which has a 1 5/16" bore. I should have picked that up while I was there, but did not want to have to adapt brake lines and such (but my master is almost due for replacement, so that might be an upgrade that is coming up.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-10-2009, 03:57 PM
first today's Avatar
first today first today is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Prairieville, La
Posts: 3,273
first today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant futurefirst today has a brilliant future
I saw this in a 77 or 78 lincoln in the junkyard the other day. It used the saginaw steering pump. Do you think it would work on the trucks?
__________________
Call me Kyle






Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-10-2009, 06:39 PM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
I am not sure, I think the only problem would be making sure the brackets fit the engine and the fitting ends matching up to the box. I would love to upgrade mine to a saginaw pump, but I can not find a hydroboost saginaw pump for a Ford. The Lincoln one might be worth picking up and trying.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-10-2009, 07:04 PM
bashby's Avatar
bashby bashby is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Charles Town, W bygod Va
Posts: 5,873
bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.
I thought I saw a thread about this a while back and the general consencus was that the hydroboost wasnt really an upgrade unless you had enough cam to lose vaccum at lower rpms. As long as you can push the pedal hard enough to lock the wheels what more do you need? with the hydroboost if your engine stalls you lose power assist unlike vaccum assist where you get a few more brake applications.
__________________
92 F250 4x4 7.3idi zf5 3.55's Meyer plow
86 F350 2wd C&C Dump 351w C6 4.10s Meyer plow
The rest of my signature changed as to not offend some liberal crybaby.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-10-2009, 07:06 PM
bashby's Avatar
bashby bashby is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Charles Town, W bygod Va
Posts: 5,873
bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.bashby has a great reputation on FTE.
From your first post it sounds like you have a small vaccum leak, it could have been just a check valve
__________________
92 F250 4x4 7.3idi zf5 3.55's Meyer plow
86 F350 2wd C&C Dump 351w C6 4.10s Meyer plow
The rest of my signature changed as to not offend some liberal crybaby.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-10-2009, 07:27 PM
bghnkinf250 bghnkinf250 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, Unfortunately
Posts: 1,459
bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.bghnkinf250 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
I had already replaced the vacuum check valve and still had problems.

Actually, contrary to your last post, hydroboost also gives you reserves as with the vacuum assist in case you lose engine power. Once you run out of reserves, there is still a better pedal feel and you do not need as much effort to stop the truck as you would with a vacuum booster and pedal that is extremely hard. You also do not need to stand on the brakes to lock them up, as you do with vacuum brakes

It might not be for everybody, but I sure like it A LOT better than my vacuum set up. I feel the brakes are the most important system on a vehicle, and it does not hurt to go overkill on them.
__________________
"A man does what he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality."
Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2009, 07:27 PM
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Older, Classic & Antique Trucks > 1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks > '80-'86 HOWTO's

Tags
1986, 2006, boost, brakes, distance, f250, ford, hydro, hydroboost, line, power, pressure, steering, stopping, time, truck

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How To: Power Steering Pump Replacement nstueve 1987 - 1996 F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks 57 08-25-2014 08:15 AM
3G Alternator Install With Pictures bghnkinf250 1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks 72 06-01-2014 01:27 PM
Stop Me - Hydroboost Write Up bghnkinf250 1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks 52 09-09-2013 04:07 PM
75 f250 supercab 12v cummins finally outta the garage pruitt 1973 - 1979 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 34 04-26-2013 07:08 PM
1973 F-250 Custom - Project Thread SeventyThree_F250 1973 - 1979 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 2 03-04-2013 08:20 PM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup