The MEC adaptor is designed specifically for the "Late Model" Transmissions ie the Ford 3.03, Ford Toploader (64 - 70? Mustang Torino etc, The T-170/71/76 &T150 - These are either the Ford"Tall/Narrow or the Ford Butterfly (Some early Trans were duel pattern)
Besides Ford this pattern was used in Jeep and AMC vehiles.
The MEC adaptor is slightly deeper from the trans mounting surface to the Front surface to work with the longer spline on the above trannys.
Any trannys that match the above will work
NOTE: Some trans were made with other brands bolt patterns so be careful when selecting.

The below shows the Ford Design Patterns - Left is duel pattern outer holes are ButterFly - Inner holes Tall/Narrow - Right is the Tall Narrow pattern

 

I finally found that s197 T5 pic I wanted to include in the discussion earlier:
Modern Driveline - T5 History in Ford Mustangs with specifications for World class and non-World class T5's


If the mustang T5 has a Ford butterfly pattern, and the MEC adapter gets you to a Ford butterfly pattern.... man I wish the weather was better so I could go look at the yard.

I'm not talking myself out of the T19 or into the T5 or anything for that matter, it is just 21 degrees with 7+ inches of fresh snow - not heading to a junkyard anytime soon.

On a brighter note - I found one of the mysterious banging - rear U-joint... when I did the differential swap I must not have gotten it tight, needle bearings took a beating and I now have a new u joint in there, greased every zerk I could find as long as I had the grease gun out. Did anyone else have to be he-man to get the front shackle pins greased... I got a mule's grip (PT after cutting a finger off), but my hands are tired and sore now.

Ross, a little elaboration on why I don't like the S10 T5... same reason I saw you post about - that option is 20+ years old, and I would like a donor that is 5-8 years old instead of a rusting hulk that hasn't moved since the 90's.

 

I'll see yours and raise you one

 

Great info... but now I have conflicting info... From your chart (and that last pic just above) I would take the 2nd line as the probable. Research from a multitude of sites says the s197 6 cylinder 4.0 is 6 1/2" stickout, 1 1/16" dia 10 spline T5 (ok all matching or 1/16" close to line #2), but "Ford symmetric butterfly" which looks to me like picture B not A. Other sites might be wrong, just frustrating when you get a data point like this that just begs "quit the keyboard and go look at one yerself" know what I mean

 

I also noticed the measurements aren't what I keep coming across as the description:

"The front bolt pattern is the symmetrical Ford "butterfly" pattern; 8-1/2" wide by 6-5/16" tall."

That dimension spec comes up over and over again in my search.

 

This is, without a doubt, the most mind-numbingly confusing thread I've ever found on FTE. I feel like the kid in the corner eating crayons and drooling on myself, 'cause this is WAY over my head!

Please let me know when you figure this out so I can copy you without all the work.

 

BPD, did you read the "first half" of this trans info gathering saga....

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...sion-swap.html

Not saying that will help you understand a ton more, but it is the info gathering phase 1.

Havi in post #2 is spot on correct - there isn't any options for the F1 with the small crossmember except the bone stock 60 yr old transmissions if you are unwilling to cut up or remove your crossmember.

Don't worry about how many twists and turns this takes and how confusing it gets, I plan on making a "big close" at the end with a "what all I have proven to work, know works, has been made to work by someone else and such".
If you think it is confusing now, understand there are almost no AMC transmissions (there's a slew T14, T15) and almost no "Chevy" transmissions (there's a boat load of those NV1500, NV3500) in my list... I even looked at the brand new stuff being put in 2012 vehicles - the Aisin stuff. If you are only lookin at what is in this thread you aint seen nothin yet.

I'm a techie computer type - "everything is on the internet"... If you want to know the diameter of a warlock's pinkie toe you can find it with enough googling... I figured in 70+ years of vehicles there had to be lots of options, well there are - how much fab do you want to do yourself though... You could put a brand new 2012 aisin tranny in, but you are gonna break out the big machining toys and open up the wallet with all the adapting and re-engineering.

Post #5 of this thread is the meat and taters - as I figure out and get confirmation I keep updating it and making the charts more accurate.

 

On the other hand, I found one that looks brand new. Just have to be patient.

The T5 has a lot going for it. There aren't many transmissions out there with aftermarket support like it has. I think you may be trying to re-invent the wheel. If you aren't in a hurry, more power to you in your quest, but there honestly aren't that many really modern trannies that are candidates. Manual transmissions just aren't popular any more.

 

I'll nibble Ross, I thought I saw in one of the hundreds of threads I read in my research but I forget... You got a WC out of a Mustang, right? - what's your plans, transplant a S10 tailhousing and re-engineer the speedo, use an adapter like maccspeed's toploader / ford T5... or is my frozen brain all mushy and I misread or mis-remembered what you have?

MAC'S SPEED EQUIPMENT - Gearbox Adapters

 

I'm not going to close this thread out (the point is to gather info on options so to provide a guide), but I did purchase a transmission. I went to the junkyard and discovered the "common" T19 is a unicorn.
Ford claims they used it and it was common, but what they did in reality in the 80's and 90's trucks is use the NP435 in the 4x4 and an automatic in 4x2. Every single 4x2 I found was an automatic.

The point of the T19 for me was this line of thought T98->T98A->T18->T19..... if you are following the progression here, that is one family of transmissions designated as successive redesign enhancements. They are almost identical, Ford used the 6 bolt pattern (match the hogs head) on the front of the big T98 in the 48 year (on the big truck), and other than changing to the modern Ford small block pattern it is kept nearly identical, just more modern with synchros up till the T19 is fully synchro and the smaller spline everyone did to save manufacture cost.

I was hoping to get a T19, a F2+ crossmember from someone cutting up a scrapper, and keep it as stock as possible. Finding out that a T19 would be a hard find and seeing a S10 with a T5 in great looking shape and a reasonable odometer reading (110k), I jumped on it rather than let it pass and kicking myself next week.

So now I am embarking on a S10 T5 swap - I'd like to keep any T5 discussion to a new thread (I'll make one as soon as I get stuck, I'm sure it will happen). But feel free to go back and fill me in on any missing spots in the chart (and I am adding a column and some adapter notes)... stay tuned.

 

I did read that, but you are speaking on a level way over my head. Normally I can track with this kind of info (I even have a couple of college degrees). I think MENSA should be knocking on your door soon.

I'm still in the kiddie pool of ignorance with a float ring while you are in the Olympic size pool of knowledge doing the back stroke.

 

Maybe. I can tell you that biliary stasis leads to the formation of choleliths which in turn obstruct the cystic duct and cause secondary cholecystitis which may in turn lead to intrahepatic, pancreatic, or mesenteric infections which could be detrimental to ones overall morbidity or mortality. OR I can just say you've got a bad gallbladder that needs to be removed before you get really sick.

It's just a matter of how simple or complex you want to make it sound. This thread is way too complicated.

 

I chanced upon a '93 S-10 T5 which is one of the very few S-10 T5's that is a WC trans, but has the S-10 shifter location. It has an electronic speedo but I can fix that. I'll ultimately be hacking the crossmember just like everyone else, although I also have an F-2 or F-3 "hoop" crossmember if I felt like pulling the cab to install it..

 

Mine came out of a '91 and looked original, but the tag came back as a '89 (none of the databases I look in have 91 or newer, so I think the databases are just out of date). NWC, but I am staying all stock no performance parts so not much to worry about there.

As far as this thread goes, I have a super updated lots of blanks filled in chart at work - have to wait for tomorrow to post that. I also found multiple sites claiming the "ford small block" on a T18 is the same as the "ford symmetrical butterfly" also listed for the T18's. So.... if I can put that in the chart I think I can move all the T98 family, the T170 family, and any other Ford butterfly to "it should work with crossmember modifications" status.

Ross, if you need a speedo S10 tailhousing or parts off an astro (clutch disc), maybe we can work some horse trading for that 3.50 center section, the local junkyard here has both and is purdy reasonable compared to back east.

 

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <woNotOptimizeForBrowser/> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--> I am very appreciative of the info I have found in this thread. I have been researching this lately. I would like to modernize the transmission on a 51 226 I6 . I found something that may be of interest to some. It opens up more possibilities than the S10 T-5. I know it is designed to move the shifter location back, but it could be used to move forward, also. It seems fairly easy to fabricate.



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