Low power - exhaust leaks- missing
#1
Low power - exhaust leaks- missing
I posted here a month ago (800 miles to go) and you guys helped me by directing me to the fuel tank and the likelihood of a restriction. It was good advice and I made progress after removing the tank and fixing the problem.
Even though much better I still had low power and finally took it into a shop in Fayettville,NC and they found that the exhaust was being dumped out the tail pipe and i was basically getting no turbo boost.
The clip on the arm that controls the boost to the turbo had disappeared and the arm was poking into the firewall. All they did was hook that back up and tell me about the exhaust leaks. It leaks where the exhaust connects to the manifold and a plug that was put in when the 6' exhaust was put on has come out and was found on the fuel line.
I had to leave for Mass and there were no issues on the computer and it was felt I would be good for the trip so I loaded my TC and headed out. there was a definate improvement but the truck still seemed to struggle on relatively easy inclines.
I had experienced some missing but it did not show up while in the shop. Half way to Mass it was as if the engine passed a kidney stone. All of a sudden the turbo roared back into action and I could put the truck on cruise control and you could feel the difference in the power.
At present I know I have the exhaust leaks to deal with but at start up it runs rough and sometimes misses a bit. Once it is up to temp it runs better and you can now hear the turbo spooling up and down.
Any ideas on what may be going on?
Even though much better I still had low power and finally took it into a shop in Fayettville,NC and they found that the exhaust was being dumped out the tail pipe and i was basically getting no turbo boost.
The clip on the arm that controls the boost to the turbo had disappeared and the arm was poking into the firewall. All they did was hook that back up and tell me about the exhaust leaks. It leaks where the exhaust connects to the manifold and a plug that was put in when the 6' exhaust was put on has come out and was found on the fuel line.
I had to leave for Mass and there were no issues on the computer and it was felt I would be good for the trip so I loaded my TC and headed out. there was a definate improvement but the truck still seemed to struggle on relatively easy inclines.
I had experienced some missing but it did not show up while in the shop. Half way to Mass it was as if the engine passed a kidney stone. All of a sudden the turbo roared back into action and I could put the truck on cruise control and you could feel the difference in the power.
At present I know I have the exhaust leaks to deal with but at start up it runs rough and sometimes misses a bit. Once it is up to temp it runs better and you can now hear the turbo spooling up and down.
Any ideas on what may be going on?
#2
If you're serious about wanting to fix this yourself, I'd suggest you start paying a little closer attention to what people are telling you. That will make things easier to understand, ask advice on, and repair. No offense meant, but your post is a little confusing.
That's what the tail pipe is for. To dump exhaust out of the motor and behind the truck.
Wastegate?
It's very unusual to hear about the up pipes leaking at the exhaust manifold. Are you sure they're not leaking at the back of the turbo instead? If it's leaking at the manifold, which side is leaking?
You put a plug in when you installed a 6 foot exhaust? Are you possibly referring to removing a temperature sensor probe and installing a plug in that hole? Where was the plug installed? Manifold? Up Pipe? Down pipe? Is the plug still missing? That could cause a leak.
If I had to guess, I'd say your up pipes are leaking at the baby's but and a set of bellowed up pipes would be a good fix, but those are kind of pricey and it's purely a guess on my part since I don't fully understand your post.
It's very unusual to hear about the up pipes leaking at the exhaust manifold. Are you sure they're not leaking at the back of the turbo instead? If it's leaking at the manifold, which side is leaking?
If I had to guess, I'd say your up pipes are leaking at the baby's but and a set of bellowed up pipes would be a good fix, but those are kind of pricey and it's purely a guess on my part since I don't fully understand your post.
#3
Sorry , I am not a good mechanic and do not have the tools or the place to do my own work so I am just trying to understand and learn so when I am with a mechanic I have some idea about what the issue is. I am a boat captain by trade and have worked with diesels for many years. If I had a shop manuel I could be more specific as to what I have learned so far give you the names of the parts I am trying to discuss.
I am unemployed and money is so tight as to be almost nonexistent.
When I was trying to get home from a month of moving equipment from the BP spill to Michigan this forum helped me understand that what I was dealing with was probably a restriction in the fuel tank. That was a problem and I have corrected that. Once the fuel tank restriction was corrected there was improvement but I still had very low power. I made a 1600 mile round trip from NC to Mass and back and before I was due to repeat the trip, I experienced a brief intermittent missing. I then took the truck to a reputable shop. Good mechanic and a good guy. Explained my problems and my financial situation. The mechanic found that I was getting no turbo boost. A clip on the arm that controls the exhaust to the turbo was off and the arm was poking the firewall. He basically put that back on and told me that I had exhaust leaks where the exhaust pipes connect to the engine and that when the 6" aftermarket exhaust was installed they removed the device that directed the exhaust back into the engine to help the warm up process and the plug they installed had come out and was laying on the motor.
I did not have time or money to address these issues but he felt I was ok to make my return round trip from NC to Mass and back.
I put my Truck camper back on and left for Mass. There was definately more power but I still struggled on grades. Even at 65MPH if I was on cruise control the truck would lose momentum on relatively modest grades. I crossed the Hudson at NYC and all of a sudden I had power back. ( very bumpy roads)Now on all grades even on cruise control the truck responds well and you can now hear the turbo working.
My concern now is that even in this warm weather when the truck is first started it misses and has low power until it is up to temp.
There were no issues on the computer when the truck was in the shop but the mechanic said the engine did not "miss" when he had it.
I am comfortable I will get home ok but am kinda hanging around New England hoping to see my twin boys one more time before I head back to NC and thought I would see if any of you had any ideas about what may be going on here with my engine.
Thanks
I am unemployed and money is so tight as to be almost nonexistent.
When I was trying to get home from a month of moving equipment from the BP spill to Michigan this forum helped me understand that what I was dealing with was probably a restriction in the fuel tank. That was a problem and I have corrected that. Once the fuel tank restriction was corrected there was improvement but I still had very low power. I made a 1600 mile round trip from NC to Mass and back and before I was due to repeat the trip, I experienced a brief intermittent missing. I then took the truck to a reputable shop. Good mechanic and a good guy. Explained my problems and my financial situation. The mechanic found that I was getting no turbo boost. A clip on the arm that controls the exhaust to the turbo was off and the arm was poking the firewall. He basically put that back on and told me that I had exhaust leaks where the exhaust pipes connect to the engine and that when the 6" aftermarket exhaust was installed they removed the device that directed the exhaust back into the engine to help the warm up process and the plug they installed had come out and was laying on the motor.
I did not have time or money to address these issues but he felt I was ok to make my return round trip from NC to Mass and back.
I put my Truck camper back on and left for Mass. There was definately more power but I still struggled on grades. Even at 65MPH if I was on cruise control the truck would lose momentum on relatively modest grades. I crossed the Hudson at NYC and all of a sudden I had power back. ( very bumpy roads)Now on all grades even on cruise control the truck responds well and you can now hear the turbo working.
My concern now is that even in this warm weather when the truck is first started it misses and has low power until it is up to temp.
There were no issues on the computer when the truck was in the shop but the mechanic said the engine did not "miss" when he had it.
I am comfortable I will get home ok but am kinda hanging around New England hoping to see my twin boys one more time before I head back to NC and thought I would see if any of you had any ideas about what may be going on here with my engine.
Thanks
#4
Now that makes more sense. What you're describing is leaking up pipes. There is an exhaust pipe that comes off the rear of the exhaust manifold and runs up the back of the motor and feeds into a Y collector behind the turbo. These are your up pipes. The actual exhaust pipe comes off the turbo, goes down and then out the back of the truck. When they put on your exhaust, it sounds like they either went with a non-EBPV pedestal, or more than likely they simply removed the flapper valve that used to close to increase back pressure.
Bellowed up pipes are the best fix for leaking up pipes, but expensive. Since money is tight, if you're willing to do the labor you can fix all this for less than $20. Let's start with the up pipes. You'll need to check where the pipes joint the Y collector for any signs of soot marks. Here's a shot from a van where you can remove the cover off the back of the motor to see it. Notice the black stains on the left side? You'll be looking at it from the front of the motor so this view is what you won't see since it's next to the firewall.
Here's what they look like when you take them out
You'll notice 2 different size donut gaskets in the above picture between the pipe and Y collector. If you go to your local parts store and tell them you need (2) Felpro #8194 donut gaskets you will get a set that is thicker than the factory ones. Coat them good with anti-sieze and tighten the bolts back down. The thicker size will help it stay sealed a little longer since the pipes are going to be slightly crushed.
Felpro 8194 on left, old stock donut on right
You'll also need to inspect the outlet that sits between the turbo and the down pipe. That's where the flapper valve for the EBPV (Exhaust back pressure valve) used to be (or maybe still is). Since you mentioned a plug that was loose, inspect to see if they have removed the shaft the flapper valve attaches to and installed small freeze plugs or something else that may be leaking. Again, look for black soot stains.
I don't have a picture of this handy, but it's the part between the turbo and large pipe that comes off the passenger side and elbows down. You can see what it looks like when it's been removed here. High Flow Outlet
The picture on the left shows the stock outlet with the flapper valve and the high flow outlet without the valve. Your valve may have been removed to make it flow better and the plugs used to close the holes for the center shaft may be leaking. There should be a plug on both top and bottom.
Bellowed up pipes are the best fix for leaking up pipes, but expensive. Since money is tight, if you're willing to do the labor you can fix all this for less than $20. Let's start with the up pipes. You'll need to check where the pipes joint the Y collector for any signs of soot marks. Here's a shot from a van where you can remove the cover off the back of the motor to see it. Notice the black stains on the left side? You'll be looking at it from the front of the motor so this view is what you won't see since it's next to the firewall.
Here's what they look like when you take them out
You'll notice 2 different size donut gaskets in the above picture between the pipe and Y collector. If you go to your local parts store and tell them you need (2) Felpro #8194 donut gaskets you will get a set that is thicker than the factory ones. Coat them good with anti-sieze and tighten the bolts back down. The thicker size will help it stay sealed a little longer since the pipes are going to be slightly crushed.
Felpro 8194 on left, old stock donut on right
You'll also need to inspect the outlet that sits between the turbo and the down pipe. That's where the flapper valve for the EBPV (Exhaust back pressure valve) used to be (or maybe still is). Since you mentioned a plug that was loose, inspect to see if they have removed the shaft the flapper valve attaches to and installed small freeze plugs or something else that may be leaking. Again, look for black soot stains.
I don't have a picture of this handy, but it's the part between the turbo and large pipe that comes off the passenger side and elbows down. You can see what it looks like when it's been removed here. High Flow Outlet
The picture on the left shows the stock outlet with the flapper valve and the high flow outlet without the valve. Your valve may have been removed to make it flow better and the plugs used to close the holes for the center shaft may be leaking. There should be a plug on both top and bottom.
#5
slowly learning and making progress
Hopefully I can relay the information I THINK I have learned during this process. I now have close to 13K miles logged with a sick 7.3 and have made progress getting it better.
The original posts pointed me toward fuel restriction and a problem was found and fixed in the fuel tank. The last post concerned exhaust leaks that a shop in NC found but did not fix due to lack of money. They did get the turbo hooked back up which was a major improvement but I am still not there.
I drained the fuel filter housing and found some trash and an old o-ring, cleaned that up and saw another improvement but I'm still not 100%. Far from it.
What I think I have learned! I learned the injectors work off of oil not fuel. I have been running Valvoline 5w-40w synthetic oil. It was suggested by the mechanic in NC that I switch to Rotella 15w 40w oil.
I have not considered injectors because I have not noticed any smoke.( In the marine field you can see the fuel burned behind the boat)
I stopped by a shop in SW Virginia and the diesel mechanic listened to my description and told me my injectors were bad. We discussed oil and I went and bought the Rotella.
I was hoping that when I changed the oil to 15w 40w I would notice a difference in how rough/smooth the truck ran at start up. Now it runs rough at start up and has low power until hot.
When I started the truck after the oil change when the new 15w 40 hit the injectors it stalled the truck. That is the first time that has ever happened.
I am assuming this points again to the injectors and that I am going to have to change the injectors.
If I am on the right track I need to learn about injectors. the Va mechanic can get a set out of FLA for $150 each. I don't have much money but I do not want to put crap injectors in the truck. Ford injectors are over $300
What do you guys think
The original posts pointed me toward fuel restriction and a problem was found and fixed in the fuel tank. The last post concerned exhaust leaks that a shop in NC found but did not fix due to lack of money. They did get the turbo hooked back up which was a major improvement but I am still not there.
I drained the fuel filter housing and found some trash and an old o-ring, cleaned that up and saw another improvement but I'm still not 100%. Far from it.
What I think I have learned! I learned the injectors work off of oil not fuel. I have been running Valvoline 5w-40w synthetic oil. It was suggested by the mechanic in NC that I switch to Rotella 15w 40w oil.
I have not considered injectors because I have not noticed any smoke.( In the marine field you can see the fuel burned behind the boat)
I stopped by a shop in SW Virginia and the diesel mechanic listened to my description and told me my injectors were bad. We discussed oil and I went and bought the Rotella.
I was hoping that when I changed the oil to 15w 40w I would notice a difference in how rough/smooth the truck ran at start up. Now it runs rough at start up and has low power until hot.
When I started the truck after the oil change when the new 15w 40 hit the injectors it stalled the truck. That is the first time that has ever happened.
I am assuming this points again to the injectors and that I am going to have to change the injectors.
If I am on the right track I need to learn about injectors. the Va mechanic can get a set out of FLA for $150 each. I don't have much money but I do not want to put crap injectors in the truck. Ford injectors are over $300
What do you guys think
#6
#7
There's a chance that you have bad injectors. If it's running worse starting up cold, pull the valve covers, start the engine, and watch the oil discharge from each injector. If they're not all spitting, or not all spitting the same when cold, but start to look more uniform when the engine warms up, then it's time for injectors.
DO NOT BUY injectors from Pensacola Diesel if that's where the mechanic can get them cheap. If you save $50 - $100 on injector pricing, but have to pay someone to pull them out, ship them back in, wait on a replacement 3 or 4 times like we've read about with the Pensacola (and many other rebuilt) injectors, are you really saving any money?
DO NOT BUY injectors from Pensacola Diesel if that's where the mechanic can get them cheap. If you save $50 - $100 on injector pricing, but have to pay someone to pull them out, ship them back in, wait on a replacement 3 or 4 times like we've read about with the Pensacola (and many other rebuilt) injectors, are you really saving any money?
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#8
At this point I am believing injectors are needed. I bought the truck with 125k miles and assume the injectors are original. they now have 275K miles and have been running all summer with fuel restrictions and no/low turbo boost.
So, what is the best injectors to use. Ford original? I cannot afford to go cheap and have trouble.
So, what is the best injectors to use. Ford original? I cannot afford to go cheap and have trouble.
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