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  #1  
Old 07-09-2011, 10:46 AM
Amphenol Amphenol is offline
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Duraspark to the GM HEI

Im working on a 1983 f100 with the 300 I6. Everything stock except, Offy C, Holley 390, EFI manifolds, and True duals.

I thought I would try swapping out the duraspark ignition box with the 4-pin HEI module.

I had a spare duraspark ignition box. I cut it up for a pig tail. Just like the image below.

Click the image to open in full size.

Next, I attached the module to a heatsink w/heatsink compond, and attached the pigtail to the module.

I used this diagram.

Click the image to open in full size.
I DID NOT use the condenser or diode. The white wire doesnt go anywhere. (This may be why truck doesnt run right)

I grounded the unit to the fender of the truck, unplugged the duraspark, and plugged in the new HEI module.

It started right up with a little throttle but, it will not idle below 1200 rpms.
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Old 07-09-2011, 12:22 PM
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I would ck over at gofastforless dot com. If you can't get an answer here or there, then I'd do a bit of research googling an answer, and try fordsix forum.

Good luck.

I found this: inhand.jpg (6492 bytes)However you can use a GM 4-pin HEI module. The HEI and TFI are basically the same thing but the HEI has the proper input for a magnetic pickup distributor. You can buy a 4-pin HEI module at any auto parts store. If your parts guy doesn't know what that is then tell him you need an ignition module for a '78 Camaro with a 350. The one pictured is a Car Quest #21040 and cost me $17.77. As you can see it has 4 pins labeled W, G, B, and C. G is a 3/16" male quick disconnect the rest are 1/4". The mounting surface must act as a heat sink to prevent the module from burning up. The cooler you keep the module the longer it will last. Securely mount it to a flat metal surface or bolt it to a big heat sink. There are two pins on the back of the module that you need to break off so it will sit flat. The module comes with some heat sink hei2.gif (2837 bytes)compound, smear it evenly over the back before bolting it down. Pins W and G go to the magnetic pickup. On a Duraspark distributor the purple wire runs to pin G and the orange wire goes to pin W. Run the black wire to one of the mounting screws on the module, this gives the module a good ground connection. The module must be grounded to work properly. You can plug into the Duraspark distributor connector with standard 3/16" female quick disconnects. Pin B on the module is run to the positive coil lead (which gets power when the ignition switch is on) and pin C goes to the negative coil lead.
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Old 07-10-2011, 06:19 PM
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The white wire input is not needed as the RED wire will have power in both RUN and START
Try swapping the Dist pickup wires to see if it will run at idle, W and G on the 4 pin module.
I think this will fix it.
Jim
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Old 07-10-2011, 08:40 PM
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the black wire needs to be a good ground through the modual, into the heat sink, and then to the block. If not grounded, it will pick up ground through your dissy, and burn a hole in your rotor, plus, it won't idle
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Rob would probably hurt himself just being in the same room with tools.....LOL
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Old 07-10-2011, 09:24 PM
Amphenol Amphenol is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimsRebel View Post
The white wire input is not needed as the RED wire will have power in both RUN and START
Try swapping the Dist pickup wires to see if it will run at idle, W and G on the 4 pin module.
I think this will fix it.
Jim
I will give that a try. I have a few things to check.

Im looking for a new HEI module right now. The module I have was made in Hong Kong.

Also, The motor kind of wants to keep running? Do I need the diode? or tfi coil?


Quote:
Originally Posted by dustybumpers
the black wire needs to be a good ground through the modual, into the heat sink, and then to the block. If not grounded, it will pick up ground through your dissy, and burn a hole in your rotor, plus, it won't idle
I will also try running the ground from the block. Im not sure the fender was the best place to pick up my ground.

Thanks Guys!
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Old 07-10-2011, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Amphenol View Post

Also, The motor kind of wants to keep running?




I will also try running the ground from the block. Im not sure the fender was the best place to pick up my ground.

Thanks Guys!
Bad ground.
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Rob would probably hurt himself just being in the same room with tools.....LOL
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Old 07-10-2011, 10:00 PM
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Poor ground, or reversed polarity between the module and pickup coil can both make one run rather poorly. I encounted both on one car. Making matter even worse, it's a rotary, and uses 3 GM HEI's...... Little known fact: a rotary will run with the timing 90* off. Not well, but they will run. I "heat treated" my header doing so. Timing was 90* off, due to the reversed polarity...... The header, being made from 1/8" (.125 wall) pipe and ceramic coated, now has a nice blue tint to it, rather than the original silver......

Being a bit of a computer geek, I almost always have Artic Silver CPU thermal paste laying around, and as such, I use that between the HEI and the mounting surface. On that rotary, I used a 3/16" Stainless plate to mount all 3. Thinking of adding a 120mm fan, as they tend to get that plate a bit warm when the car isn't moving, and the electric fan isn't running..... Computer fans are 12V, how convenient.
Why AS thermal paste? Well, it is keeping my 3.2Ghz quad-core CPU at 72F, in a room that is 75F...... I'd say that's a decent heat transfer.
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Old 07-10-2011, 10:34 PM
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Grounds will drive you crazy.

I used the large aluminum heat sink out of the back of a rear projection tv with the fins on the back. I bolted it to the coil bracket off an I6 efi coil, and onto the motor where it normally rides.

the 2 tabs on the back... I didnt cut them off, I drilled 2 holes in the heat sink for them to sit in. looks kinda cool with the aluminum fins.
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Yes I do... I've been told on several occasions I should be on happy pills to make it possible for someone to live with me.
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Rob would probably hurt himself just being in the same room with tools.....LOL
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Old 07-10-2011, 11:15 PM
Amphenol Amphenol is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue_Wulff View Post
Poor ground, or reversed polarity between the module and pickup coil can both make one run rather poorly. I encounted both on one car. Making matter even worse, it's a rotary, and uses 3 GM HEI's...... Little known fact: a rotary will run with the timing 90* off. Not well, but they will run. I "heat treated" my header doing so. Timing was 90* off, due to the reversed polarity...... The header, being made from 1/8" (.125 wall) pipe and ceramic coated, now has a nice blue tint to it, rather than the original silver......

Being a bit of a computer geek, I almost always have Artic Silver CPU thermal paste laying around, and as such, I use that between the HEI and the mounting surface. On that rotary, I used a 3/16" Stainless plate to mount all 3. Thinking of adding a 120mm fan, as they tend to get that plate a bit warm when the car isn't moving, and the electric fan isn't running..... Computer fans are 12V, how convenient.
Why AS thermal paste? Well, it is keeping my 3.2Ghz quad-core CPU at 72F, in a room that is 75F...... I'd say that's a decent heat transfer.
That explains why I was able to advance the timing so much!

I was thinking what the hell is going on here!! Shut it off pretty quick, and plugged the duraspark back in. I set the timing back. I used a light and vacuum gauge to get it to about 13 to 14 degrees advanced.

I’m also going to put my fan back on the heat sink! I have plenty of scrap computers lying around too!
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Old 07-11-2011, 01:15 AM
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We're glad you got it working. Welcome to the forum.
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Old 07-11-2011, 10:13 PM
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We're glad you got it working. Welcome to the forum.

Thanks F250!

Unfortunately, I'm still running the duraspark 2 Module.

I did get some work done today. I picked up a wells HEI module and ran a ground wire directly to my battery.

After everything was wired back up, it started right up and idled for about 30 seconds. Then it would not idle. It also spits and sputters after I shut it off.

I tried switching the violet and orange wires on G and W. It acted like it didn't even wanna turn over?

I'm going to look over my pig tail tonight. I'm also wondering if I need a different coil. I read the HEI likes a certain coil??


C&P from • View topic - Duraspark ignition system - What is the weak point?

"turns out the duraspark coil wants 8 volts not 13.4 so it gets hot and stalls out. it has too much resistance for the GM HEI so you have to run a low primary resistance coil, Less than 1 ohm. MSD Blaster II fits in with 0.7 ohms. vrs the 1.5 ohm duraspark coil."

Could this be my problem?
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Old 07-11-2011, 10:20 PM
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Could be. I forgot to mention, that RX7 has 3 MSD blaster coils too.....
3 modules, 3 coils, and only 4 spark plugs.......
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Old 07-12-2011, 11:24 AM
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Thanks F250!


C&P from • View topic - Duraspark ignition system - What is the weak point?

"turns out the duraspark coil wants 8 volts not 13.4 so it gets hot and stalls out. it has too much resistance for the GM HEI so you have to run a low primary resistance coil, Less than 1 ohm. MSD Blaster II fits in with 0.7 ohms. vrs the 1.5 ohm duraspark coil."

Could this be my problem?
The way you have it wired the coil is still down stream of the resistor wire, with either the GM 4 pin or the DS2 module, so the coil supply voltage will be the same.

I am running a square TFI coil which has a lower primary coil resistance than the older round coils with my 4 pin GM module.


You could run a jumper wire from the battery positive to the coil positive when it starts to run bad to test to see if it makes any difference.

In order to really gain anything with the GM 4 pin module you should use a better coil and full voltage to the coil positive. The coil is just a step up transformer, the more input the higher the secondary output.
Jim
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Old 07-12-2011, 01:11 PM
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IIRC, when you use the HEI module, you do NOT want a resistor in series with the coil. I was thinking about doing this conversion. I emailed the guy as gofastforless.com and he told me that the current limiting is build into the HEI module, and he said to run 12V straight to the coil and let the HEI module regulate the current.

I have not actually done the conversion yet, so I cannot say how it works with straight 12V.
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Old 07-12-2011, 02:46 PM
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That is how we did the hei conversions in the late 70's in gm engines. We would pull the points distributor, and put in the hei. Then we would do away with the resistor wire, and run a wire straight from the ignition switch to the hei distributor12 volts.

I also use the newer efi coil
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Rob would probably hurt himself just being in the same room with tools.....LOL
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Old 07-12-2011, 02:46 PM
 
 
 
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