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  #31  
Old 01-31-2012, 08:01 AM
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Its a fun project thats for sure. 4 years ago I never pictured myself doing this but that damn PMS has got me bad.......
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02 F-350 XLT CC LB 4x4 7.3L GTP38R,FFD stage 1's, T500,IH Bellows, EBV & AIH Delete, 5" MKO Straight Pipe 37x13.5x17 Toyo MT, 6.5" Pro Comp Lift,
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  #32  
Old 01-31-2012, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 88f1504x4 View Post
I recently purchashed a comple 7.3 out of an 02 with 160,000. I spent the last week stripping it down to the bare block and the block and crank are going to the machine shop tomorrow. My plans are forged cyro treated rods, the ford overhaul kit, head studs, hybrid injectors, not really sure what size yet I have some more learning to do, gt38r, comp cams valve springs and some upgraded push rods. I'm on the fence wether I am going to use my stock cam or go with a performance one. My goal is 2 months hopefully the funds allow. Rocker arms? Does anyone make an upgrade? I had one fail on me at around 280k and looking at them they don't seem very rugged yet I've never really seen any different replacements. I am also not sure what colors I want to use, I have Clay's intercooler boots and 6637 in blue already and I am leaning towards doing the motor in IH red and black just not sure how the blue ties in there. Does anyone have any pics of some painted engines? or suggestions?
I've always liked the black and red on the black mamba motors

BLACK MAMBA 7.3L POWERSTROKE CRATE MOTOR FROM THE HORSEPOWER SHOP - YouTube
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  #33  
Old 01-31-2012, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by 88f1504x4 View Post
I see 2 different injector sizes with the same outcome. Are they going to have the same characteristics, or are they going to perform completely different?
The turbo is your limiting factor. That's why I say 238/30's are too big, but they are capable of more HP with a properly sized turbo.
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  #34  
Old 01-31-2012, 11:53 AM
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Black and red def go good together! Thats what this one will end up being.

I understand the turbo limits it. In my head I am telling myself this is it. Once I am done I won't be going any bigger. I see a lot of people end up wanting more when they are done. If it comes to that I may go to a bigger turbo down the road but not anytime soon. I have other projects I need to get started on.
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02 F-350 XLT CC LB 4x4 7.3L GTP38R,FFD stage 1's, T500,IH Bellows, EBV & AIH Delete, 5" MKO Straight Pipe 37x13.5x17 Toyo MT, 6.5" Pro Comp Lift,
F6 DP Tuner, 6637, HPX, FPX, CCV mod, Complete 7.3 build FINISHED!
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  #35  
Old 01-31-2012, 12:48 PM
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I'm sure the 250/200 are tuned down. You need to PM Robin. He had his on the dyno last year at RRE and that is the numbers. To me good set up and thats as high as I would want to go. Anywhere around 400+ for me would be great. I also want to tow so 38R is as big as it can get here in California, smog, has to look stock.

Chet
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  #36  
Old 01-31-2012, 02:36 PM
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Can someone tell me Robin's user name?
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  #37  
Old 01-31-2012, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 88f1504x4 View Post
Can someone tell me Robin's user name?
PaysonPSD.........
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  #38  
Old 01-31-2012, 09:04 PM
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sweet Thank you
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02 F-350 XLT CC LB 4x4 7.3L GTP38R,FFD stage 1's, T500,IH Bellows, EBV & AIH Delete, 5" MKO Straight Pipe 37x13.5x17 Toyo MT, 6.5" Pro Comp Lift,
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  #39  
Old 01-31-2012, 11:19 PM
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Roland Mueck
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonanza35 View Post
How much HP do you want? Robin on here has 38r, 200/80 and got 480 hp. Thats rwhp.
Chet
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDoodie View Post
I had 250/100's with my GTP38R and did 481 hp..
I'll add a third one to the mix. I laid down ~480 rwhp/950 tq with 180cc/100's & 38r and ran a best of 8.97 sec in the 1/8 mile. With the right supporting mods and tuning, it can be done.
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  #40  
Old 02-01-2012, 03:36 AM
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ya right Roland, its a combination of factors not just sticks and blower. Any of the mentioned sticks will get the OP he's HP goals , just get what you can afford. But I would go for at least 80% nozzles
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  #41  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:05 AM
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haha even more scenarios.... So with your experience of the injetors Roland, do you like them? Do you wish you would have gone to a different size at all?
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F6 DP Tuner, 6637, HPX, FPX, CCV mod, Complete 7.3 build FINISHED!
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  #42  
Old 02-01-2012, 09:11 AM
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Roland Mueck
Kind of a funny story: I originally thought I had bought 160/100 stage 2's (hoping for 400hp) from Clay and live tuned shortly after at RRE. After making some other mods and another round of live tuning, I started to question the size of my injectors. I had dynoed at 448 hp at RRE '10 and wondered if maybe I did have larger injectors than 160cc. I contacted Clay and Ryan Casserly to find out. Ryan didn't have the flow sheets for my set, but told me that they were 180's. I still don't know 100% what I have. I upgraded my fuel system and valve springs in 2011 and added a couple more tunes. These changes netted me the 485 rwhp.
All in all, they are doing well for me. I average near 16 mpg (daily driving) and have towed a ~11k fifth wheel camper with this combo with no EGT problems (note: I have supporting mods for this). The injectors have good street manners, but are a little smoky under 55 mph with the 38r/1.15 a/r combo.
I had no intentions of going with other injectors, but am pleased with the outcome of these. When I build another motor (at a much later date..lol), I will revisit that idea.
Robin and I did have a discussion about our injectors once. We came to the conclusion that the 200/80 and 180/100 flow about the same amount in volume. This is why we had similar results in power.
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  #43  
Old 02-01-2012, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChunderDownUnder View Post
250/100's for me. Your tunes can be tamed for the 38R. If you decide to go a bigger turbo you will have the sticks to do it.
I 2nd this opinion. The trend is such that soon 'stock nozzles' may not be very common. Good tunes should be able to make 238/100's or even 250/200's work fine with a 38R - albeit 'detuned' for that charger. Too bad ya didn't spring for a T4 mount and standard-rotation turbo... Its not much more than 38R and bellowed uppies and soooooo many more options for upgrades!

Bigger nozzles mean more fuel in less time. This gives more time to add fuel BTDC without excessive timing advance. Getting the fuel in there 'early' means lower EGT's and better MPG's. I've spent some time behind the wheel of a truck with 250/200's and a GTX 4294. It drives like a stock truck (even in 'race' tune) and often gets 18+mpg - 4x4 Crew Cab. In 'stock tune' and 'daily driver' (400/450HP?) you really can't make it smoke, but trying to get some black smoke reduces the amount of tread on the tires! Even in the hottest tune, the smoke is gone in 60ft (GTX 4294 )... The owner has also towed 17k lb trailer and reports lower-than-stock EGT's.

I didn't see a tuner mentioned, but I would recommend visiting with a couple of tuners and getting their opinions about injectors. Swamps, Tyrant and Gearhead all have good tunes for big nozzles.

Digging the red/black too! Reps sent! I did black/blue on the dually, but thinking the engine I'm building for the X might look like yours...
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  #44  
Old 02-01-2012, 10:36 AM
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never understood tuning down bigger sticks for a sub par turbo.....if you get the big sticks then go with a proportionate turbo.....if you are not gonna get a bigger turbo then you might as well get the smaller sticks.....jmo....
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
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never understood tuning down bigger sticks for a sub par turbo.....if you get the big sticks then go with a proportionate turbo.....if you are not gonna get a bigger turbo then you might as well get the smaller sticks.....jmo....
There may be advantages to the bigger sticks - even de-tuned. Even factory split-shots/GTP38 can make 100HP more than stock with no EGT penalty (with good tunes ). Of course, some people still write '140HP' tunes for them...

Just because you never empty the barrels doesn't mean you've 'wasted' anything. All Stage III injectors cost the same and are only $200 more than Stage II's.

I think there is a lot of misconception about big nozzles based on old-school tuning. From what I can tell, (some of) the tuners have made huge improvements in how they can make these bigger injectors perform. The days of excessive black smoke and 'hazing' at idle are gone. Lower EGT's while towing and better-than-ever MPG's are just a bonus!
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:48 AM
 
 
 
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