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  #1  
Old 03-08-2011, 07:41 PM
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E85 fuel in the 2011 6.2L

Has anyone used the E85 gas in there truck? If so what kind of results to you get? Any side effects, worse MPG, any knocking?
Just seeing if it would be worth trying it for the cost difference, it is only about 50 cents cheaper per gallon.
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  #2  
Old 03-08-2011, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmonty2 View Post
Has anyone used the E85 gas in there truck? If so what kind of results to you get? Any side effects, worse MPG, any knocking?
Just seeing if it would be worth trying it for the cost difference, it is only about 50 cents cheaper per gallon.
What I have hear was that it gives you 10% less mpg.
So .50 cents makes it a little more tha 10% cost savings if the gas was $3.799 per gallon as it is now locally here in Arizona. Not much of a difference.

Also read your owners manual as it says if you use E85 you must run a tank of regualr gas before any oil change. Not sure why but it is in the book.

It also says harder starting in cold temps.


What is the gas price in your area?
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  #3  
Old 03-09-2011, 03:52 AM
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lots of water in that e85
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:24 AM
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I'm trying E85 right now:

Click the image to open in full size.

I had about an 1/8th of a tank of regular 87 when I filled up with E85 last week... E85 was just over 14% cheaper. The number I have heard was the with E85 you get 20% less MPG... I figure few more days and I'll have a better feel for what my MPG with the mostly E85 is...
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Old 03-09-2011, 08:03 AM
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I am also on my first tank of E85. I have lost about .5 mpg over the first half and still trending down. I run the same route to work everyday and it appears to be getting about 2 mpg less when traveling at freeway speeds.
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Old 03-09-2011, 10:34 AM
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I have ran E85 about 80% of the time. I do like the way it makes my truck run. There is a 70 cent difference here in Iowa. I get 9.8 to 10.5 with E85 and 13 to 13.5 on reg gas.
I have around 13000 miles on my truck now. It is the only fuel I would run. I drive alot of 5 mile trips and shorter trips.
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:11 PM
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From what I've read, E85 would have to be more than $1 cheaper than gasoline to come close to making a difference economically.

The problem with a flex fuel engine is you are trying to get the best of both worlds, when in fact you are only getting the best out of the gasoline side. E85 is inefficient due to the higher octane being burned at a lower compression ratio. For it to be burned properly, the compression needs to be higher.

Here's an excerpt I found online which pretty much sums up the reason for poor mileage and performance...

A flex-fuel engine has to have a lower compression ratio to prevent detonation when it's fueled with regular pump gas. Thus, it can't take advantage of alcohol's efficient high pressure, high octane power when it's fueled with ethanol. In essence, ethanol's superior octane rating is "wasted" in a flex-fuel engine.


While the lower price of E85 may look attractive, it's just not feasible in the end when the numbers are crunched. There are several comparisons online which show E85 to be more than 20% less efficient then gasoline, both cost and mileage wise.

The only way I'd use it is if there was no gasoline available.
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fz1dave View Post
From what I've read, E85 would have to be more than $1 cheaper than gasoline to come close to making a difference economically.

The problem with a flex fuel engine is you are trying to get the best of both worlds, when in fact you are only getting the best out of the gasoline side. E85 is inefficient due to the higher octane being burned at a lower compression ratio. For it to be burned properly, the compression needs to be higher.

Here's an excerpt I found online which pretty much sums up the reason for poor mileage and performance...

A flex-fuel engine has to have a lower compression ratio to prevent detonation when it's fueled with regular pump gas. Thus, it can't take advantage of alcohol's efficient high pressure, high octane power when it's fueled with ethanol. In essence, ethanol's superior octane rating is "wasted" in a flex-fuel engine.


While the lower price of E85 may look attractive, it's just not feasible in the end when the numbers are crunched. There are several comparisons online which show E85 to be more than 20% less efficient then gasoline, both cost and mileage wise.

The only way I'd use it is if there was no gasoline available.
So then, how high does the compression need to be?
Also, Flex fuel engine are designed with the compression just low enough to burn 87 yet high enough to burn E85?

Would you get better mpg's if you had a E85 only engine?

Would you get better mpg's if it was not a Flex fuel engine?
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  #9  
Old 03-09-2011, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fz1dave View Post
From what I've read, E85 would have to be more than $1 cheaper than gasoline to come close to making a difference economically.

The problem with a flex fuel engine is you are trying to get the best of both worlds, when in fact you are only getting the best out of the gasoline side. E85 is inefficient due to the higher octane being burned at a lower compression ratio. For it to be burned properly, the compression needs to be higher.

Here's an excerpt I found online which pretty much sums up the reason for poor mileage and performance...

A flex-fuel engine has to have a lower compression ratio to prevent detonation when it's fueled with regular pump gas. Thus, it can't take advantage of alcohol's efficient high pressure, high octane power when it's fueled with ethanol. In essence, ethanol's superior octane rating is "wasted" in a flex-fuel engine.


While the lower price of E85 may look attractive, it's just not feasible in the end when the numbers are crunched. There are several comparisons online which show E85 to be more than 20% less efficient then gasoline, both cost and mileage wise.

The only way I'd use it is if there was no gasoline available.
The main reason for reduced MPG is , E85, gallon for gallon, has less energy than regular gasoline... Even if you had a high compression E85 only motor, you still wouldn't get as good of gas mileage due to the lower energy of E85... you might close the gap, but i believe it would still have to be less..

Now the "wasted" part.... I think this is assuming that the computer can't automatically take advantage of the E85's octane rating, which on some vehicles it can. For example the new 5.0 in the F-150 makes 15 HP more with E85 then it does on regular gas. Basically the way a lot of the modern systems works is they keep advancing the timing until the knock sensors become active and then back the timing off a bit, creep the timing back up a bit until the knock sensor become active, back it off a bit.. repeat..

I seen this first hand in my 2005 Mustang. Basically "over-spark" the motor and depend on the knock sensors to pull the timing back down...

Now that being said, i'm not sure that the 6.2 is setup to take advantage, timing-wise, of E85... looks like my truck is still running the same timing at WOT...
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  #10  
Old 03-09-2011, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by kmonty2 View Post
So then, how high does the compression need to be?
Also, Flex fuel engine are designed with the compression just low enough to burn 87 yet high enough to burn E85?

Would you get better mpg's if you had a E85 only engine?

Would you get better mpg's if it was not a Flex fuel engine?
I think a lot of people over look that fact that a lot of the newer vehicles rely heavily on the car's knock sensors... For example my 2010 V6 Camaro had a compression ratio of 11.3:1 yet was able to run on 87 octane... Yes, 11.3:1 on 87! So while the car was could run fine on 87, i did notice the knock sensors were pretty active a lot of the time... switched to 93 and the knock senors quieted right down and the car was running more time.. Yes, the car appeared to take advantage of higher octane gas without a tune! LOL
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:51 PM
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It's been confirmed that the 6.2 picks up some decent hp with premium fuel:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/92...ml#post8833938
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Old 03-10-2011, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000silverbullet View Post
It's been confirmed that the 6.2 picks up some decent hp with premium fuel:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/92...ml#post8833938

very interesting!
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Old 03-10-2011, 03:52 PM
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So last week when I filled up with E85 I still had about an 1/8th of a tank. Computer show 54% alcohol. Today had just a bit more gas when I filled up. The alcohol content is now up to 73%

Click the image to open in full size.


For the tank with 54% alcohol my avg MPG was 12.5 MPG. So that is a 12% reduction in MPG. Last week E85 was about 14% less than regular 87... so in theory, E85 save me a tiny bit. Today however regular gas went up to $3.65 while E85 stayed at $2.99. So today E85 was 18% cheaper than regular 87.. Question now will be how much more will my MPG go down now that I'm basically running almost straight E85...

Oh and here a random one... If you are in the A/B Trip screen, and you give the OK button a quick poke, you actually PAUSE the things! LOL

Click the image to open in full size.

Not sure why I would do this... LOL
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Old 03-12-2011, 10:49 AM
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Question: So higher alcohol is better MPG's, or the other way around?

So 7/8 tank E85 mixed with 1/8 tank 87 equals 24 cents per mile? 12.5mpg
Where as you were at 26 cents per mile with all 87? 14 mpg

Those number were just with 35 gallons of fuel. I figured you were getting 14 mpg with 87 and 12.5 with the mix? Is that correct.

Also does the Airaid make a difference? I am looking into getting one. I read your blog on it.
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Old 03-12-2011, 11:32 AM
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Question: So higher alcohol is better MPG's, or the other way around?

So 7/8 tank E85 mixed with 1/8 tank 87 equals 24 cents per mile? 12.5mpg
Where as you were at 26 cents per mile with all 87? 14 mpg

Those number were just with 35 gallons of fuel. I figured you were getting 14 mpg with 87 and 12.5 with the mix? Is that correct.

Also does the Airaid make a difference? I am looking into getting one. I read your blog on it.
Other way around... your MPG goes down with the higher ethanol (alcohol)...

Your numbers are pretty close with the cost per mile... I stopped at $75 since I refuse to swap twice... so only 25 gallons... LOL! Question is where will my MPG end up when I running just E85. With the blend and E85 at $2.99 vs 87 at $3.49 it was about break-even... this take was basically almost all E85 which was still $2.99 while 87 jumped to $3.65...

Yes, I do believe the Airaid helped with my MPG and it sure makes the engine bay look a lot better!
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Old 03-12-2011, 11:32 AM
 
 
 
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