Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Older, Classic & Antique Trucks > 1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Fat Fendered and Classic Ford Trucks

Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 01-13-2011, 07:24 AM
49truck 49truck is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Easton on the Hill, UK
Posts: 31
49truck is starting off with a positive reputation.
'Widowmaker' Options

Hi

I have a 49 F3 pickup that I am restoring and have got to the Widowmaker issue that I now is well documented on the forum. I don't currently want to change the rear end for say a Dana 60 as I want to keep it relatively original and won't be doing any main highway driving so speed isn't really an issue. I want to keep steels on it.

There doesn't seem to be a definitive list of what will and won't fit over those big rear drums, does anybody have this information???

Has anybody experience of whether 2003-2009 Dodge Truck 3500 rims will clear the drums? These measure in at 17" x 7", 8 Lug, 6.5" Bolt Pattern and are a relatively 'plain' rim which I dont think would look out of keeping and are readily available for a good price. Okay, a little wider than the originals but.........

Any help would be much appreciated

Thanks
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-13-2011, 09:47 AM
kenjh's Avatar
kenjh kenjh is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: victoria
Posts: 2,009
kenjh has a good reputation on FTE.kenjh has a good reputation on FTE.
you have 8 lug wheels?? get one and try it..I have 6 lug and my choice is new custom rims..I have 8 bolt axles from 70's trucks and sever rims to fit..but trying to keep near stock..would have been really nice to have 8 bolt ..so you gonna show us your truck??
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-13-2011, 10:17 AM
truckdog62563's Avatar
truckdog62563 truckdog62563 is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 5,965
truckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to behold
Andrew - If I've not said welcome on your earlier posts, I'll say it now. Welcome, glad to have you hanging around. Especially since you're saving an F-3, and trying to keep it stock. Same as my value system. I see that you are in the UK, so finding the wheels I'll recommend might be a challenge. But at least you'll have the info.

I've researched this for guys several times and think that the "best" option is to use the 19.5" tubeless wheels that were first supplied by Ford on 1956 F-250s. They are 5.25" wide which would ensure that you'd have no wheel well clearance issues. They also have the hub cap nubs like your stock 17" widowmakers which would permit use of the stock hubcaps. The 19.5" size is the exact correct replacement tubeless size to match your 17" tube type widowmakers. The outside diameter of the tires will be near exactly the same. I've never had or seen a real set of these so everything said is based on my references.

As said, the 19.5s were first offered by Ford on F-250s in 1956. They were also offered by Dodge and Studebaker on their 3/4 ton models in 1957. Ford offered them until 1969, Dodge 1968, and Studebaker 1964. They are a Budd Corporation product having Budd #71410. The corresponding Ford part # is B6D 1015-B. The Dodge part # is 1922398 and Studebaker # is 1685912. The National Wheel and Rim Association (NWRA) cross reference number is X-45049.

The next best option is the 17.5" x 5.25" tubeless wheel offered on the 1956 F-250s and corresponding Dodge and Studebaker 3/4 ton models. These were available during the same range of years as above. Same hub cap mounting. I have two of these wheels that are presently mounted on a donor truck's early F-3 rear axle having the 14" drums. They fit perfectly. There were two Budd numbers listed. Budd #70720 cross refers to their later #73240. Mine are one of each and they look identical. The Ford part # is B 8 D 1015-A. The Dodge # is 1922395 and Studebaker # is 1685911. The NWRA cross reference number is X-45048.

Stock F-2/F-250 16" wheels will fit on your front, but not your back axle because of drum clearance. We've had guys say that they've had luck finding modern 16" wheels that fit, but I've seen no list of donors to use as a proper reference.

There is only one other period 17" multi-part wheel, and it will fit only your front axle. It is a Chevy wheel used on the early 1950s 3/4 and one ton models. I have one of these and know it will not fit a rear. It will also not accept a Ford hub cap.

Other options get iffy. I personally was not aware that the newer Dodge models still have the 8 x 6.5" pattern as you said. I've assumed that all manufacturers had, like Ford, switched to the metric sizing. The 7" width of the Dodge wheels would maybe be an issue, but the stock Ford 16s and 17s were 6" wide so the extra inch might not be an issue. You'd have to make sure the offset/backspace would be compatable.

As for finding wheels, you have come to the best source in my eyes. I remember one 49 F-3 owner that connected with another member on a full set of the 17.5s. With all the "dark side" work being done to F-250s, there are no doubt many wheels sitting in shops taking up space. Hopefully a member will speak up. Stu
__________________
Stu McMillan
'52 F-3 Marmon-Herrington 6R32-4 - in progress
'51 R3-4; '51 LD7-4 Ranger; '50 R3-4 - pending projects
'51 F-3; '51 F-3; '52 R32-4, '53 6M254 -parts/donors
'97 F-250 4WD/460/ZF5 - trailer duty
'03 E-450 Fun Mover; '07 E-350 parts hauler; '13 E-350 Lab taxi
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-13-2011, 10:47 AM
49truck 49truck is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Easton on the Hill, UK
Posts: 31
49truck is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckdog62563 View Post
Andrew - If I've not said welcome on your earlier posts, I'll say it now. Welcome, glad to have you hanging around. Especially since you're saving an F-3, and trying to keep it stock. Same as my value system. I see that you are in the UK, so finding the wheels I'll recommend might be a challenge. But at least you'll have the info.

I've researched this for guys several times and think that the "best" option is to use the 19.5" tubeless wheels that were first supplied by Ford on 1956 F-250s. They are 5.25" wide which would ensure that you'd have no wheel well clearance issues. They also have the hub cap nubs like your stock 17" widowmakers which would permit use of the stock hubcaps. The 19.5" size is the exact correct replacement tubeless size to match your 17" tube type widowmakers. The outside diameter of the tires will be near exactly the same. I've never had or seen a real set of these so everything said is based on my references.

As said, the 19.5s were first offered by Ford on F-250s in 1956. They were also offered by Dodge and Studebaker on their 3/4 ton models in 1957. Ford offered them until 1969, Dodge 1968, and Studebaker 1964. They are a Budd Corporation product having Budd #71410. The corresponding Ford part # is B6D 1015-B. The Dodge part # is 1922398 and Studebaker # is 1685912. The National Wheel and Rim Association (NWRA) cross reference number is X-45049.

The next best option is the 17.5" x 5.25" tubeless wheel offered on the 1956 F-250s and corresponding Dodge and Studebaker 3/4 ton models. These were available during the same range of years as above. Same hub cap mounting. I have two of these wheels that are presently mounted on a donor truck's early F-3 rear axle having the 14" drums. They fit perfectly. There were two Budd numbers listed. Budd #70720 cross refers to their later #73240. Mine are one of each and they look identical. The Ford part # is B 8 D 1015-A. The Dodge # is 1922395 and Studebaker # is 1685911. The NWRA cross reference number is X-45048.

Stock F-2/F-250 16" wheels will fit on your front, but not your back axle because of drum clearance. We've had guys say that they've had luck finding modern 16" wheels that fit, but I've seen no list of donors to use as a proper reference.

There is only one other period 17" multi-part wheel, and it will fit only your front axle. It is a Chevy wheel used on the early 1950s 3/4 and one ton models. I have one of these and know it will not fit a rear. It will also not accept a Ford hub cap.

Other options get iffy. I personally was not aware that the newer Dodge models still have the 8 x 6.5" pattern as you said. I've assumed that all manufacturers had, like Ford, switched to the metric sizing. The 7" width of the Dodge wheels would maybe be an issue, but the stock Ford 16s and 17s were 6" wide so the extra inch might not be an issue. You'd have to make sure the offset/backspace would be compatable.

As for finding wheels, you have come to the best source in my eyes. I remember one 49 F-3 owner that connected with another member on a full set of the 17.5s. With all the "dark side" work being done to F-250s, there are no doubt many wheels sitting in shops taking up space. Hopefully a member will speak up. Stu

Thanks Stu, your post is much appreciated and gives me a clearer understanding, sort of(!), of which way to go. Hopefully someone will as you say contact me if they happen to have a set of 17.5"s lying around which would be awesome. The dodge wheels I found were to be honest a google search which brought me to a company called 2003 Dodge Truck 3500 Rims, 2003 Dodge Truck 3500 Wheels at OriginalWheels.com not sure if anyone has used them but their repro wheels I mentioned were $80 per rim which didn't seem too bad. Pretty in-offensive and painted black would look ok I think. Pic as below:

Click the image to open in full size.


Kenjh - See my post for a few pics of my truck http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/10...a-1949-f3.html


Cheers
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-13-2011, 02:14 PM
truckdog62563's Avatar
truckdog62563 truckdog62563 is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 5,965
truckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to behold
Andrew - Looks like it might work, but if it were me I'd leave it to a last option. But then, too, I don't know what your time frame demands are. I've been searching for my odd ball trucks' Budd wheels for years, so admit my perspective might be unusual.

Here is a picture of the 17.5, to just show you that it looks very stock.

Click the image to open in full size.

Ok, so it sounds like I overwhelmed you with detail in my above posting. But there's a reason. If no other FTE member steps forward with wheels, I'd suggest using the descriptions I posted to email or call yards in the US to see if they have any of those trucks for parts, or already have the wheels in parts inventory. I'd suggest focusing your search on yards in the US southwest, west, or northwest. Less risk of rust. I'll list yards that I know of out west, and perhaps other members can add to the list for you. The biggest of yards is Desert Valley Auto Parts in Casa Grande, AZ. I've visited them a few times and know they have good inventory. Here's their web site.

Parts » DVAP

Then there's Neal Freman's in Montana. I've bought wheels from them and had good experience.

Freman's Auto

Then there is a yard that our member Number Dummy recommends. It is Southern California Truck Wrecking. The manager's name is Marty (talk to only him) and the phone is (323) 587-3144. I'm not sure, they might have a web page. Another is Easy Jack's in Kansas. Phone number is (785) 238-7161. This is a big yard, and I know they have a '57 F-250 in the yard but don't know about its wheels. So, that's a start. Maybe other members can suggest other sources. Stu
__________________
Stu McMillan
'52 F-3 Marmon-Herrington 6R32-4 - in progress
'51 R3-4; '51 LD7-4 Ranger; '50 R3-4 - pending projects
'51 F-3; '51 F-3; '52 R32-4, '53 6M254 -parts/donors
'97 F-250 4WD/460/ZF5 - trailer duty
'03 E-450 Fun Mover; '07 E-350 parts hauler; '13 E-350 Lab taxi
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-13-2011, 03:30 PM
49truck 49truck is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Easton on the Hill, UK
Posts: 31
49truck is starting off with a positive reputation.
Great help, thanks. I will try some of those contacts.

I was only considering the Dodge rims to get the truck rolling as in a couple of months I should have it ready for the road. Its sometimes not that easy searching and contacting the states for all the bits and finding people willing to ship to the UK!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-13-2011, 03:55 PM
truckdog62563's Avatar
truckdog62563 truckdog62563 is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 5,965
truckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to behold
I understand. I did plenty of this going the other direction on my Frogeye and previous Mk1 Cooper S. There was no internet then, however. Stu
__________________
Stu McMillan
'52 F-3 Marmon-Herrington 6R32-4 - in progress
'51 R3-4; '51 LD7-4 Ranger; '50 R3-4 - pending projects
'51 F-3; '51 F-3; '52 R32-4, '53 6M254 -parts/donors
'97 F-250 4WD/460/ZF5 - trailer duty
'03 E-450 Fun Mover; '07 E-350 parts hauler; '13 E-350 Lab taxi
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-30-2013, 09:24 PM
SoupSandwich SoupSandwich is offline
New User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2
SoupSandwich is starting off with a positive reputation.
Good evening all, I am in the process of buying my first 49 F3, and I have been reading about the options for the widowmakers that Stu has provided. If I was going to have some made, what is the back spacing info for the original wheels? Thanks for the info!
Tim
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-30-2013, 09:47 PM
truckdog62563's Avatar
truckdog62563 truckdog62563 is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 5,965
truckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to behold
Your stock 17" widow maker is Budd #49380. It's 5.5" wide and has 9/16" of positive offset. That means the center disc is positioned 9/16" outward from the center line. So to determine back spacing you have 2.75" to the center line of the rim on each side, then add the 9/16" forward placement of the disc, to yield 3 5/16" back spacing. Stu
__________________
Stu McMillan
'52 F-3 Marmon-Herrington 6R32-4 - in progress
'51 R3-4; '51 LD7-4 Ranger; '50 R3-4 - pending projects
'51 F-3; '51 F-3; '52 R32-4, '53 6M254 -parts/donors
'97 F-250 4WD/460/ZF5 - trailer duty
'03 E-450 Fun Mover; '07 E-350 parts hauler; '13 E-350 Lab taxi
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09-30-2013, 09:50 PM
SoupSandwich SoupSandwich is offline
New User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2
SoupSandwich is starting off with a positive reputation.
Thanks Stu, I believe that was the fastest reply I have seen on any forum.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09-30-2013, 09:52 PM
FortyNiner's Avatar
FortyNiner FortyNiner is online now
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: u-rah-rah Wisconsin
Posts: 1,661
FortyNiner has a great reputation on FTE.FortyNiner has a great reputation on FTE.FortyNiner has a great reputation on FTE.FortyNiner has a great reputation on FTE.FortyNiner has a great reputation on FTE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoupSandwich View Post
Thanks Stu, I believe that was the fastest reply I have seen on any forum.
Should earn the man some rep points, right? Click the heart looking icon on the upper right of his response.

DW
__________________

19 and 49 F1 jes' like Henry II built

DW
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-30-2013, 10:05 PM
truckdog62563's Avatar
truckdog62563 truckdog62563 is online now
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 5,965
truckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to beholdtruckdog62563 is a splendid one to behold
Before you spend the money on custom made, check Josh's ads in the classifieds. He has 17.5s listed and the 19.5" Kelsey-Hayes ones still available I believe. His Budd 71410s are I know spoken for. Also I swapped notes today with Mark (thundersnow70) and confirmed he has three 17.5s which would get a set started. Stu
__________________
Stu McMillan
'52 F-3 Marmon-Herrington 6R32-4 - in progress
'51 R3-4; '51 LD7-4 Ranger; '50 R3-4 - pending projects
'51 F-3; '51 F-3; '52 R32-4, '53 6M254 -parts/donors
'97 F-250 4WD/460/ZF5 - trailer duty
'03 E-450 Fun Mover; '07 E-350 parts hauler; '13 E-350 Lab taxi
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-01-2013, 12:36 AM
jmadsen's Avatar
jmadsen jmadsen is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Across the hall from Havi
Posts: 3,181
jmadsen has a very good reputation on FTE.jmadsen has a very good reputation on FTE.jmadsen has a very good reputation on FTE.jmadsen has a very good reputation on FTE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckdog62563 View Post
Before you spend the money on custom made, check Josh's ads in the classifieds. He has 17.5s listed and the 19.5" Kelsey-Hayes ones still available I believe. His Budd 71410s are I know spoken for. Also I swapped notes today with Mark (thundersnow70) and confirmed he has three 17.5s which would get a set started. Stu
THANKS STU!
yes I've got a few wheels still available. The 19.5" wheels do have a new home and will be shipped this week. I have the 17.5" 's that you mention as well as some random wheels.

I found more 19.5 and 17.5's recently but they have yet to be adopted. I still need a couple more to complete another set

Thanks for the plug on those 19.5"'s. Lunch on me next time your through Salt Lake or wherever we may meet up.
Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2013, 12:36 AM
 
 
 
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Want to change 6 lug "widowmaker" wheel setup on 1965 F350 csk201 1961 - 1966 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 2 12-09-2013 08:58 PM
Widow Maker Replacement The Horvaths 1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 9 09-30-2012 09:07 PM
17.5 inch Rims on an F3 Skirouled! Brakes, Steering, Suspension, Tires, & Wheels 6 07-15-2011 05:13 PM
yes, widowmaker replacement questions one more time 44seagrave 1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 10 10-05-2010 03:28 PM
Wheels and Tires (AGAIN?) '49 F3 1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks 9 03-18-2009 08:19 AM


Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Older, Classic & Antique Trucks > 1948 - 1956 F1, F100 & Larger F-Series Trucks

Tags
175, 1952, 1956, 34, 60s, chevy, f150, ford, lug, removal, rim, tire, ton, wheel, widowmaker, width

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7 AC1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. Ford® is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup