small-list-digest Thursday, April 8 1999 Volume 03 : Number 080



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - Ranger, Explorer, Bronco 2 and Aerostar
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In this issue:

Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans
FTE Small - Re: tire wear
Re: FTE Small - Ford Bronco 2
Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans
FTE Small - 85 B2 4 sale
Re: FTE Small - Bench to Buckets
Re: FTE Small - tire wear
FTE Small - forget my problem
FTE Small - High idle on Ranger
Re: FTE Small - High idle on Ranger
FTE Small - 88 2.3 EFI Help
FTE Small - re: Tire wear
Re: FTE Small - 88 2.3 EFI Help
Re: FTE Small - tire wear
Re: FTE Small - Camera was Whine in 98 Explorer when braking
Re: FTE Small - torsion bar suspension
Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans
Re: FTE Small - tire wear
Re: FTE Small - Re:Check engine light
Re: FTE Small - re:86 Bronco II
Re: FTE Small - RE: Pinging
Re: FTE Small - Re: check engine light
FTE Small - Re: Tire wear
FTE Small - Bench to Buckets

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Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:42:24 -0400
From: Tom Kirkbride
Subject: Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans

22 mpg?!?! Thats insane! My 85 Bronco II gets less than 10. I dont
think the truck was made to ever get more than 15 mpg. And what is this
8 plug engine?

On Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:59:40 -0500 (CDT) Sandman
writes:
>On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, David Herron wrote:
>
>> On another note, what kind of gas mileage are you folks getting
>on a
>> similar truck? This is my first ford pickup, and it seems to be
>getting
>> around 10 mpg... Sounds awful low to me for a 4 cyl 2.3, even with
>140K
>> miles. It doesn't smoke anymore (did when I got it), and runs well,
>but
>> still has a high idle (also has a small leak in the exhaust
>manifold). I've
>> changed all the plugs, air & fuel filters, replaced broken vacuum
>lines, and
>> run some fuel injector cleaners through it. I haven't replaced the
>plug
>> wires yet, but I will soon. Any other ideas to increasing MPG short
>of
>> taking it to the dealer?
>>
>I get around 22 MPG on my 89 2.3. Its a manual and the 89 ups have
>the 8
>plug 2.3 engine(which gets slightly better gas mileage and slightly
>higher
>output.) The engine has 166K on it now. Definatly sounds like
>something
>is worng with your mileage, should be in the 20 MPG area.
>
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 07:58:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: fss altavista.net
Subject: FTE Small - Re: tire wear

>From:ranstl stlnet.com
>Sent:Tuesday, April 06, 1999 8:44 PM
>
>i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear
>on the front of their late model rangers? i have a 98
>with the off road package and my front tires are
>cupping pretty good. i only have 9200 miles on it. as
>much as i hate to say it, i really don't want to have
>to spring for some larger tires real soon!
>

I have 12K on my original Firestones and they're in great shape. Just be sure to rotate your tires every other oil change. I bought an extra rim for my spare and I rotate all five.


+-----------------------------------------------+
Rick Sapir fss altavista.net
Raleigh, NC USA ricks99 netzero.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Cottage/4654
+-----------------------------------------------+

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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:56:00 -0400
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: Re: FTE Small - Ford Bronco 2

At 7:40 PM -0700 4/6/99, Adam McLaughlin wrote:
>Well, we're finally here. I have been reworking the fuel injection sensors
>and the system as a whole. This morning I did the koeo tests, and came up
>with a 11, and did the same under koer several times. Both tests came up
>with 11! I have 160,000 miles on the 2.9L V6, 5 speed. I did have to spend
>several hundred dollars on sensors and connections, but now I'm getting
>about 17 MPG city, 19 HWy on supreme and all is well...
>
>Not too bad for an old Ford....
>Adam

Adam,

Glad to see that it's working out that well for you. The price for
the sensors easily pay for themselves in terms of improved gas
mileage, engine operation and peace of mind.

- -Dave
- --

ICQ# 16458879 AOL/AIM ID: "Mac XR"
1986 Ford Bronco II Gray Manual 2.9 V6 123K Pittsburgh PA

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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 10:59:38 -0400
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans

At 6:42 PM -0400 4/6/99, Tom Kirkbride wrote:
>22 mpg?!?! Thats insane! My 85 Bronco II gets less than 10. I dont
>think the truck was made to ever get more than 15 mpg. And what is this
>8 plug engine?

We get about 28 - 30 mpg highway on our '86 Bronco II with 2.9 V6 EFI.

However, the vehicle in question just developed serious tranny
problems and we're currently trying to decide whether to get the
tranny rebuilt for $800-$1100 and get a warranty or buy a used tranny
for $300-$500 with no warranty and install it ourselves. (The tranny
developed a problem with the countershaft and only works in 4th
gear.) Anyone with opinions on what I should do is welcome to tell me
what they think. (I'm in no rush.)

- -Dave
- --

ICQ# 16458879 AOL/AIM ID: "Mac XR"
1986 Ford Bronco II Gray Manual 2.9 V6 123K Pittsburgh PA

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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:10:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: John C
Subject: FTE Small - 85 B2 4 sale

Just wondering if anybody out there was interested in buying an 1985
Bronco 2. It's a very clean Bronco and runs great. Smogged and
registered with oversized tires which are in excellent condition. This
is in Northern California near Sacramento. If interested respond back
with your number or a good way to get ahold of you. Also, it may have
a car dolly that goes with it if someone wanted to tow it behind there
RV.

Thanks
John Carter
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 08:10:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: John C
Subject: Re: FTE Small - Bench to Buckets

I have seen it done and it didn't look like it was that hard. There
may be some brackets that may need to be made, but to answer your
question, yes it can be done.
John Carter

- --- Matt Baldwin wrote:
> Does anyone know if I can swap the bucket seats from
> a mid-80s Bronco II or
> Ranger to a regular cab 85 Ranger with a standard
> bench seat?
>
> Just wondering...my back is killing me!
>
> Matt Baldwin
> Victoria, BC
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 08:50:57 -0700
From: "Alan Wilson"
Subject: Re: FTE Small - tire wear

My 98 3.0 Supercab Ranger tires are still looking good at 14,346 miles....

Randy Collins wrote:

> i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear on the front of their
> late model rangers? i have a 98 with the off road package and my front
> tires are cupping pretty good. i only have 9200 miles on it. as much as i
> hate to say it, i really don't want to have to spring for some larger tires
> real soon!
>
> i've been looking at other rangers, but have been unable to get close
> enough to them to see.
>
> ran
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- --
Alan Wilson - Wilshire Associates, (310) 451-3051 x3750
(310) 260-7350 Direct
(310) 458-2842 FAX


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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 09:14:51 PDT
From: "Joey Ramsey"
Subject: FTE Small - forget my problem

hey,
Forget about the 77 bronco my transmission went.
-Joe

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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:57:40 -0600
From: BJ Tiemessen
Subject: FTE Small - High idle on Ranger

I have a 96 Ranger with the 2.3L and lately every once in a while the
idle will stay at 1000-1500 RPM's. Sometimes it happens as soon as I
start it and it doesn't matter how far I drive it, it stays ideling
high. Just last night it was fine untill I pulled in the parking lot
then it stayed ideling high, I sat in the parking space for 5 minutes to
see if it would fall off but didn't. Anyone have any ideas?
Thanks,

BJ

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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 13:21:50 -0400
From: Tom Kirkbride
Subject: Re: FTE Small - High idle on Ranger

I have a 85 Ranger 2.8 5 speed and occasionally it will idle at about
2000-2250. I dont know why it does this. But if you hit the gas hard in
neutral the idle will drop down. The truck has more than 170,000 miles
but she is still chugging.

On Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:57:40 -0600 BJ Tiemessen
writes:
>I have a 96 Ranger with the 2.3L and lately every once in a while the
>idle will stay at 1000-1500 RPM's. Sometimes it happens as soon as I
>start it and it doesn't matter how far I drive it, it stays ideling
>high. Just last night it was fine untill I pulled in the parking lot
>then it stayed ideling high, I sat in the parking space for 5 minutes
>to
>see if it would fall off but didn't. Anyone have any ideas?
>Thanks,
>
>BJ
>
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:55:44 -0400
From: "Lambert, John (CDTF)"
Subject: FTE Small - 88 2.3 EFI Help

Anyone please help.

My 88 2.3 EFI runs good when first started, but then after 5 to 10 minutes
it won't run right at higher rpm's. If I shut the engine off for two or
three seconds and re-start the engine it is fine for the next 5 to ten
minutes, then repeat ......
I replaced the fuel filter, air filter, plugs, cap , rotor.
Obviousily turning the engine off resets something, probably the computer.
The codes said ECT sensor so I replaced that, didn't solve the problem, read
codes again, TPS, replaced, didn't solve. Unplugged oxygen sensor, still
does it, unplugged EGR valve, still does it.
I drive this truck to work every day (65 miles), I've gotten really good at
pushing clutch in and re-starting while driving in high speed traffic.
This trial and error method is getting expensive.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
John Lambert
jlambert genphysics.com

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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 99 17:39:08 EDT
From: CONAN RALVM8.VNET.IBM.COM
Subject: FTE Small - re: Tire wear

>>i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear on the front of their
>>late model rangers? i have a 98 with the off road package and my front

I think "cupping" is supposed to be a sign of weak shocks.

I don't know about the late-model stuff, but all the old Ford Twin-I-beam
trucks were prone to tire problems due to the swing-axle design. The only
real help that I ever heard of was just to keep GOOD quality, heavy-duty
shocks on it. I've been using Bilsteins on my '83 Ranger 4x4 for the last
several years with -0- tire wear problems.
Last I heard, Bilsteins were available for trucks for ~$60each. That's
a "special deal" the factory's been running for a long time now. (used to
be just $50each) They're a LOT more expensive for cars.
Ed in NC
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:47:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: John C
Subject: Re: FTE Small - 88 2.3 EFI Help

Hey John,
I'm John as well. I had an 1982 S-10 that did something similar to
that, only it would just flat out loose power and not go anywhere.
Then after you let it set for about 5 mins, it would be fine. Very
confusing truck, but that's a Chevy for ya! I never figured out the
problem. My suggestion is to have the fuel pump tested for the correct
pressure. Most mechanic shops will be able to help with this, unless
you can do it at home. If that's not it, try taking out the gas tank,
flushing it, flushing out all the gas lines(vent hoese, vapor lines
etc.) and see if that works. Dont' use water to do this.
John Carter, Sacramento, California

- --- "Lambert, John (CDTF)" wrote:
> Anyone please help.
>
> My 88 2.3 EFI runs good when first started, but then
> after 5 to 10 minutes
> it won't run right at higher rpm's. If I shut the
> engine off for two or
> three seconds and re-start the engine it is fine for
> the next 5 to ten
> minutes, then repeat ......
> I replaced the fuel filter, air filter, plugs, cap ,
> rotor.
> Obviousily turning the engine off resets something,
> probably the computer.
> The codes said ECT sensor so I replaced that, didn't
> solve the problem, read
> codes again, TPS, replaced, didn't solve. Unplugged
> oxygen sensor, still
> does it, unplugged EGR valve, still does it.
> I drive this truck to work every day (65 miles),
> I've gotten really good at
> pushing clutch in and re-starting while driving in
> high speed traffic.
> This trial and error method is getting expensive.
>
> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> Thanks
> John Lambert
> jlambert genphysics.com
>
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>

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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 17:35:36 -0700
From: JJ Thomas
Subject: Re: FTE Small - tire wear

I took a quick look at mine. They look fine. 98 Ranger 4x4 24,000 Miles.

- -Julian

At 20:29 04/06/99 -0500, you wrote:
>i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear on the front of their
>late model rangers? i have a 98 with the off road package and my front
>tires are cupping pretty good. i only have 9200 miles on it. as much as i
>hate to say it, i really don't want to have to spring for some larger tires
>real soon!
>
>i've been looking at other rangers, but have been unable to get close
>enough to them to see.
>
>ran
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:18:27 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - Camera was Whine in 98 Explorer when braking

"Michael D. Sheridan" wrote:
>
> Dave Armbruster wrote:
> >

> the truck to the dealer for work when it's handy to do so. Its always
> seems that the dealers do more harm than good when they work on
> these things as we all know. It sure would be fun to have a hidden
> camera and record what they do to them BACK in the BACK ROOM!

Just like any other shop really.. at the mercy of the people that do the
work. I've seen dealer techs I wouldn't let touch my lawn mower and
others I'd send people to for things that had *me* puzzled. But yes.. a
hidden camera will reveal all sorts of oddities sometimes. Make sure
you have a microphone too as our comments are 'priceless' sometimes.

Let the cameras roll.. the more 'hacks' that get exposed the less
competition I have!

>
> If anyone has a Mazda or Ranger like mine I sure would like
> to hear from you as I have the nasty little buzzing noise that
> is driving me nuts when I first take off in low gear. Is it possible
> that it is pinking?

Does it go away if you use premium fuel?

Tim Turner/Manic Mechanic
Custer Auto Repair
Wilmington NC
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:26:43 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - torsion bar suspension

Troy Reifsnider wrote:
>
> For those of you looking for smooth ride out of your 4wd drive trucks I
> have some advise for you - buy a luxury car!!!
>
> (flame away)
>

Sound like me when people ask about lowering trucks.. ;-)

Seriously though.. the torsion bar is just a straight spring that
'twists' you might be able to soften the ride by taking some of the
tension off, but this will lower the front end.

TT
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 21:37:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: Sandman
Subject: Re: FTE Small - '86 Ford Ranger Auto Trans

The 8 plug 2.3L was first made in 89. One set of the plugs fire on the
power stroke, and the other set fires on the exhaust. This was done for
emission purposes, and higher HP and better MPG happened to be a
byproduct(and most likely the reason the 2.0L engine was discontinued.)
Of course, this makes a tune up expensive and its a pain to get to the
plugs, takes about 2 hours to change them from what I heard(I took it to a
shop that was running a special when I changed mine.) My mileage has gone
as high as 27 MPG on the highway with no a/c running, 22 is most ly what I
get these days, doing about 70/30 highway/city miles.

On Tue, 6 Apr 1999, Tom Kirkbride wrote:

> 22 mpg?!?! Thats insane! My 85 Bronco II gets less than 10. I dont
> think the truck was made to ever get more than 15 mpg. And what is this
> 8 plug engine?
>

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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 22:56:36 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - tire wear

Ryan Penner wrote:
>

> My dad's 150 had some Wranglers that are almost perfect on the inside
> tread, and almost bald on the outside. This is due to the fact that
> they were not rotated for almost 10,000 miles. (This was before he
> drove it)

On a RWD vehicle this means the alignment is off; all the rotation does
in this case) is wear all 4 tires out too soon. (Wheels with non-stock
offset will cause odd wear also.) With a proper alignment the tread
wear should be even across the tire regardless of the position assuming
stock wheels and proper inflation.

In general the causes of tire wear are:

One side only) Toe or camber
Both sides or center only) under/over inflation
cupping/feathering) balance or suspension

FWIW I do *NOT* rotate the tires on any of my vehicles, but do balance
when one is removed. Reasons you ask? I'd rather replace 1-2 tires at
a time than all 4, wheels have a finite life span if impact wrenches are
used (the wheel wears out on the lug seat if overtightened), rotor
warpage due to improper torquing procedure and I'm lazy when it comes to
my vehicles. ;-) In the early 80s the NHTSA experimented with rotation
on its FWD & RWD vehicles and found that RWD was better with rotation
and FWD was *NOT* for tire life. I dont know if this study is still
valid but I suspect so. IMHO rotation is a big rip-off and causes more
problems than it solves if not done *PROPERLY*. (Torqued nuts etc.)

Tim Turner/Manic Mechanic
Custer Auto Repair
Wilmington NC




>
> Ryan Penner
> 92 Ford Explorer
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-small-list ford-trucks.com
> > [mailto:owner-small-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of Randy Collins
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 7:29 PM
> > To: small-list-digest ford-trucks.com
> > Subject: FTE Small - tire wear
> >
> >
> > i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear on the
> > front of their
> > late model rangers? i have a 98 with the off road package and my front
> > tires are cupping pretty good. i only have 9200 miles on it. as much as i
> > hate to say it, i really don't want to have to spring for some
> > larger tires
> > real soon!
> >
> > i've been looking at other rangers, but have been unable to get close
> > enough to them to see.
> >
> > ran
> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
> >
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:29:38 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - Re:Check engine light

Due to some set backs I'm a week behind on the mail. :-( Hope to see
the original post as I go.


Bakend aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 4/2/99 5:39:13 PM Mountain Daylight Time, rkelso usit.net
> writes:
>
> > I would suggest taking your vehicle to the local
> > dealer and having it checked by a factory trained tech.
>
> Umm......... I don't like the factory trained techs (at least not their
> bosses).

The training was probably sound, but the man (woman) makes the
difference and uses the training for more than a piece of paper that
looks good on the service wall. I know a Ford tech here in town I'd
send people to in a skinny minute, BUT I'd counsel to ask for only him
when going to the dealer.

> That is why I am on this list. If I was near enough to our Manic Mechanic

I need to clone myself 50 times to cover the US. ;-) Thanks for the
smile.

> I wouldn't hesitate to take it to him. However, in all my dealings
> with the "factory authorized dealers" I have never been able to find one that
> was honest and really cared about the service he provides once the deal is
> made. This is just my opinion and probably will upset some, but I will
> continue to tinker and get by even if it does cost me more in the long run.

The only upset I get is the one I always have.. people that *think* they
are a mechanic and are a damn sight far from being a technician. I
suspect many of the readers on this list would do a better job solving a
drivability problem (with list help sometimes) than many 'mechanics'. I
might disparage DIYers at times, but I know that I only see the results
of the 'not so good' ones as the rest I never see since they have no
need of me. :-) To the good ones... well I guess that's why I
subscribe to the lists I do and help as I can. My father is a dyed in
the wool DIY to the point of taking aircraft tests to work on his plane
rather than spending the $$ a A&P would ask.

I salute all the list members for taking the time/initiative to do what
they can and knowing when to ask for help rather than screwing things up
beyond belief..

Tim Turner/Manic Mechanic
Custer Auto Repair
Wilmington NC
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:38:58 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - re:86 Bronco II

J Cope wrote:
>
> [] ... Check the EGR Valve. While it is running, wait for it to act up,
>
> []
> What and where is the EGR valve, and what does it do?

Takes a bit of exhaust gas and puts it back into the engine to reduce
temperatures in the combustion chamber for emissions. the most common
failure is chunks of carbon holding the valve open. Take the valve off
(near the rear of the plenum on the passenger side) and clean the bottom
side out; if this doesn't help then replace the valve and it's sensor.

TT/MM
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:43:22 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - RE: Pinging

Jeff wrote:
>
> Thanks Ding.
>
> Anyone have suggestion on a good plug besides Bosch? In 100K miles, I'm on my
> second set.
>

I like the autolite platinums or the AC double plats.. Bosch seems to
hold up OK, but I just dont like that tiny center electrode..

TT
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Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 23:52:30 -0400
From: Tim Turner
Subject: Re: FTE Small - Re: check engine light

Mike McNany wrote:
>

> dealer. They checked the error codes, and replaced the throttle position
> indicator (a frequently observed code that requires extra testing to verify)

Agreed on the common failure,but amazed on the extra charge... it's only
3 wires to check; 5V, Ground and signal. 10 minutes tops.

TT
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Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 22:26:26 -0400
From: Tom Kirkbride
Subject: FTE Small - Re: Tire wear

I dont think cupping has anything to do with shocks. Its the amount of
air pressure in the tires. You need to make sure the pressure is the
same for all tires. Over inflated ones will experience faster tread wear
on the middle of the tire. Underinflated, the opposite.

On Wed, 7 Apr 99 17:39:08 EDT CONAN RALVM8.VNET.IBM.COM writes:
>>>i'm curious if anybody else is seeing heavy tire wear on the front
>of their
>>>late model rangers? i have a 98 with the off road package and my
>front
>
> I think "cupping" is supposed to be a sign of weak shocks.
>
> I don't know about the late-model stuff, but all the old Ford
>Twin-I-beam
>trucks were prone to tire problems due to the swing-axle design. The
>only
>real help that I ever heard of was just to keep GOOD quality,
>heavy-duty
>shocks on it. I've been using Bilsteins on my '83 Ranger 4x4 for the
>last
>several years with -0- tire wear problems.
> Last I heard, Bilsteins were available for trucks for ~$60each.
>That's
>a "special deal" the factory's been running for a long time now. (used
>to
>be just $50each) They're a LOT more expensive for cars.
> Ed in NC
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
>http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 10:25:07 -0700
From: rgstein pacbell.net
Subject: FTE Small - Bench to Buckets

Matt Baldwin wrote ----------------------------------------------------

Does anyone know if I can swap the bucket seats from a mid-80s Bronco II
or
Ranger to a regular cab 85 Ranger with a standard bench seat?

Just wondering...my back is killing me!

Matt Baldwin
Victoria, BC

Me -------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt, "Ah feel your pain." (Couldn't resist: Yankee joke).
Possible solutions: A few years ago I came across an impressive line of
replacement seats from Brazil, marketed in the US by a company called
Scat Industries, in Southern California. They make/made two grades of
racing-style buckets (unfortunately with side bolsters to wedge-out all
but skinny-butted drivers), and also a nifty top-of-line bucket with
inflatable lumbar support, adjustable thigh support, and ability to
accomodate the girth of older folks. I was told that this line is still
available, but I can't find Scat any more. I also don't know the name
of the Brazilian mfr. The prices were quite reasonable, and the cutaway
comparisons with other seats were impressive. It was possible to
install these seats in any vehicle on the planet because the mfr
provided a wide range of custom and universal mounting brackets and....


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