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Received: with LISTAR (v0.128a; list small-list); Sat, 12 Feb 2000 20:09:48 -0500 (EST)
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 20:09:48 -0500 (EST)
From: Ford Truck Enthusiasts List Server ford-trucks.com>
To: small-list digest users ford-trucks.com>
Reply-to: small-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: small-list Digest V2000 #4
Precedence: bulk

==========================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts Small Chassis Truck Mailing List

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------------------------------------
small-list Digest Fri, 11 Feb 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 004

In This Issue:
List admin joining the ranks...
ADMIN: No chain emails
Re: Buzzing noise
New 2001 Ranger
Should I recommend a Ranger?
Changing the automatic transmission oil, again.
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: Changing the automatic transmission oil,
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
ADMIN: Trim footers
Reliabilty of Ford
ADMIN: Web search is back up
Re: Reliabilty of Ford
Re: Reliabilty of Ford
Re: Reliabilty of Ford
ADMIN: Chat is back up
Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Re: [Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 23:14:24 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: List admin joining the ranks...

Hi gang, just returned from buying a 2000 Ranger XLT 4 door
Supercab. This makes 3 Ford trucks in the driveway. The
Ranger is FTE's first vehicle purchase. It was getting
really vehicle for Peggy to maintain the online store
inventory with her 98 Escort. Since I just got a $4000
insurance settlement for the 93 Escort, we bit the bullet.

The salesman absolutely hated us. We've been haggling for
a week and since we're incorporated we kept telling him
"we'll need to take this up with the board of directors."
Heh heh! Another thing too, the rebate just went up from
today from $1000 to $1500. This hasn't been announced
in any advertising yet, but I managed to find out from a
contact that Ford introduced it today because the newly
redesigned 2001 was introduced to the public yesterday.

Anyway, to make a long story short, we got a great deal.
Invoice, minus $594 dealer hold-back, minus $1500 rebate
and the convenience package thrown in at no charge. We
took this figure and gave them a few hundred dollars
profit.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts




------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 23:24:10 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: ADMIN: No chain emails

Everyone needs to read the FAQ before posting here.
Chain emails containing urban legends don't belong
here and can quickly get you removed from the list.
These emails are known as gullibility virus. Check
the facts before posting stuff, especially WAY OFF
TOPIC items.

How can email be tracked by the IRS? It can't and
if this were for real, you'd here it on the news
instead of from someone equally uninformed.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com



------------------------------

From: "Ron,Marge,Ted" sunlink.net>
Subject: Re: Buzzing noise
Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 23:24:39 -0500


----- Original Message -----
From: George Kowal earthlink.net>
To: ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2000 9:09 PM
Subject: [small-list] Re: Buzzing noise


> My 94 explorer will do that if you engage the 4 wheel drive then disengage
it and keep driving forward. You are supposed to back up about 10 feet to
disengage the hubs from what I've heard. Mine does this fairly exactly to
what your describing, so try backing up after disengaging the 4 wheel hubs.
>
> "Ron,Marge,Ted" wrote:
>
Hi George,

Thanks for your input. The problem with my wifes Explorer though is that
even when it's in 2 wheel drive, you can be driving along for a few miles
and all is quiet, then all of a sudden, it starts making the buzzing noise.
I've noticed that when this happens, you can make it quiet again by putting
it in 4 wheel drive, this is what makes me think there is something going on
with the hubs. We drove it tonight for almost 40 miles and it was quiet,
other times it starts doing it after only a few miles!

Ron


------------------------------

From: "Jim Bielecki" freeway.net>
Subject: New 2001 Ranger
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 01:59:33 -0500

Check out the this URL:

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.auto.com/2000chicagoautoshow/stories/truck11_20000211.htm

It shows the newly resigned 2001 Ranger.

Jim Bielecki


------------------------------

From: rgstein pacbell.net
Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 21:50:33 -0800
Subject: Should I recommend a Ranger?

My good friend and electronics bench technician, Paul, has just bent a
rod in his Subaru wagon. It's time for him to replace the car. Since he
carts his cello to rehearsals, his last few cars have been station
wagons. In recent years, cars have been getting increasingly hard to
work on, with the engines jammed into decreasing spaces (like an
Aerostar).
After a few years when the repairs start becoming more frequent, a
modern passenger car is too expensive to keep. Paul has always worked on
his own vehicles, and would like to continue. A used car that he can
afford is no longer a practical option. I recommended that he consider
a small pickup truck with a camper shell.

Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable, my
friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar (which
I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as being
conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed by
accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent Ford
employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue to
do so as long as I own this vehicle.

After watching his brother replace the heater core in his Taurus, Paul's
opionion of Ford products is pretty low, too. He has witnessed, too, the
outrageous cost of ownership of my Aerostar, caused by absurd premature
parts failures and maintenance obstructions.

Can we trust a manufacturer who puts the slave cylinder inside the
transmission? What other nasty surprises lurk within their merchandise?

What I'd like to see Paul driving is a small pickup truck with real
bumpers, enough space around components to allow sensible repair access,
good materials and parts, the ability to work on it with normal tools,
the ability to diagnose it himself without $1,000 in diagnostic
equipment, reasonably-priced repair manuals, and an all-around sturdy
machine. Can this be had in a Ranger, or must he return to the Japanese
companies in order to get a vehicle that makes sense to own? My
neighbor just told me that he's gotten 15 years out of his Nissan pickup
already.

Can you guys say some good words about your Ford Rangers? If so, what
years/versions would you recommend for my friend? He's only got between
$3,000 and $5,000 to spend.

Richard



------------------------------

From: rgstein pacbell.net
Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 22:01:23 -0800
Subject: Changing the automatic transmission oil, again.

Here's another, possibly safer, way to routinely change our automatic
transmission fluid. I'd like to hear some comments.

I found a contraption in the JC Whitney catalog: "Vacuum pump operated
oil changer kit." This is a hand pump/2.5 gallon tank unit with a
flexible hose coupled (via a bulge) to a 4.5 foot hard plastic tube. For
a price of $47.99, I expect that this may be a quality product (as
opposed to all that garbage that JCW sells).

I'd like to do my own ATF change, and would be nervous to try it with
the transmission pump running. I'm also afraid to disconnect a cooler
line and discover that I'd cracked some Martian (Chinese?) fastener
piece that I could never buy or even describe, even after I'd bought the
special $50 Ford removal tool. To use with a dipstick tube pump, my
Aerostar 3.0 presents a special problem: the transmission dipstick is
super long, guided through a tube with a downward bend buried in
obstructions (way to go, Ford, once again).

Assuming that I could feed this "kit's" tube through the dipstick tube
and it could negotiate the bend, would it get low enough to get enough
of the fluid out, and does the dipstick dip into the transmission oil
pan or into the torque converter?

For those of you who want to look it up, it is on P. 167 of the latest
big JC Whitney catalog, #634x.xx. #14JE7418A.

(It's the pump that doesn't say, "Miracle," or "A Famous Scientist
Writes.")

Would this be practical?

Richard


------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 07:55:41 -0500
From: Mason Phillips <63nova psouth.net>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?

> I am a die hard Ford Ranger guy. I wouldnt own any other small truck
> IMHO.. I would recommend the 83-88 style Ranger with a V-6. I have had
> mine for going on now 7 years I bought it used with 140,000 and its still
> rolling beautifully with aproaching 200,00 miles. Reasons for
> recommending... parts are rather easy to get any Ranger or Bronco of those
> eras are practically interchangable with one another. Another reason...
> Ease of maintaniance.... everything is easily accessable. you can change
> most anything on the truck with a disassembling3/4 of the truck. Just my
> .02 cent worth and to some its not worth that..

Mason Phillips
87 Ranger 4X4 (The Little Beast)



------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 08:32:13 -0500
From: Kevin Crain warpten.com>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?

My 1999 Ranger is my first American truck, having owned a Nissan and a
Toyota previously. I test drove a new Chevy S-10 and it rattled, squeaked,
had sloppy steering, and generally felt like a 200K-mile rental. Tried two
others just to get more breadth in the study, they sucked too.

The Ford felt at least as solid as the Nissan or Toyota, how well it holds
up past 150K miles will determine whether Ford gets more business from me.
It's at 15K miles now, and I absolutely love it.

BTW that low-$ PC for Ford employees thing kinda chaps my butt, too!! I
read about all the problems 3.8L engines are having with head gaskets
blowing just out of warranty coverage, my mother in law had the same thing
happen to her Taurus and it's a tad annoying knowing it's this widespread a
problem. Soo...line workers having PCs w/ Internet service will help solve
this??

-Kevin "Ford truck, VW car" Crain


At 09:50 PM 2/11/00 -0800, you wrote:

>Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable, my
>friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar (which
>I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as being
>conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
>integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed by
>accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent Ford
>employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue to
>do so as long as I own this vehicle.


------------------------------

From: "Mike Fisher" gte.net>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 09:06:21 -0600

Why don't you tell your friend to go buy a rice-burner? Some people will
only be happy with the perceived quality of Japanese junk, so don't even try
to tell him anything different. Better yet, tell him to read Consumer
Reports. The only brand they seem to like is Toyota.

Of course, if he wants real bumpers, troubleshooting without $1000 in
diagnostic equipment, reasonably priced repair manuals and an all-around
sturdy vehicle, he won't get that in a Jap product either.

Mike Fisher
'97 AWD Mountaineer
K&N/Borla/31x10.5 BFG ATs/PIAA/Edelbrock IAS

----- Original Message -----
From: pacbell.net>
To: ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2000 11:50 PM
Subject: [small-list] Should I recommend a Ranger?


> My good friend and electronics bench technician, Paul, has just bent a
> rod in his Subaru wagon. It's time for him to replace the car. Since he
> carts his cello to rehearsals, his last few cars have been station
> wagons. In recent years, cars have been getting increasingly hard to
> work on, with the engines jammed into decreasing spaces (like an
> Aerostar).
> After a few years when the repairs start becoming more frequent, a
> modern passenger car is too expensive to keep. Paul has always worked on
> his own vehicles, and would like to continue. A used car that he can
> afford is no longer a practical option. I recommended that he consider
> a small pickup truck with a camper shell.
>
> Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable, my
> friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar (which
> I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as being
> conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
> integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed by
> accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent Ford
> employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue to
> do so as long as I own this vehicle.
>
> After watching his brother replace the heater core in his Taurus, Paul's
> opionion of Ford products is pretty low, too. He has witnessed, too, the
> outrageous cost of ownership of my Aerostar, caused by absurd premature
> parts failures and maintenance obstructions.
>
> Can we trust a manufacturer who puts the slave cylinder inside the
> transmission? What other nasty surprises lurk within their merchandise?
>
> What I'd like to see Paul driving is a small pickup truck with real
> bumpers, enough space around components to allow sensible repair access,
> good materials and parts, the ability to work on it with normal tools,
> the ability to diagnose it himself without $1,000 in diagnostic
> equipment, reasonably-priced repair manuals, and an all-around sturdy
> machine. Can this be had in a Ranger, or must he return to the Japanese
> companies in order to get a vehicle that makes sense to own? My
> neighbor just told me that he's gotten 15 years out of his Nissan pickup
> already.
>
> Can you guys say some good words about your Ford Rangers? If so, what
> years/versions would you recommend for my friend? He's only got between
> $3,000 and $5,000 to spend.
>
> Richard
>
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> message.
>
>


------------------------------

From: MykeSS aol.com
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 10:51:53 EST
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?

In a message dated 02/12/2000 10:07:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
mdfisher gte.net writes:

<< Why don't you tell your friend to go buy a rice-burner? Some people will
only be happy with the perceived quality of Japanese junk, so don't even try
to tell him anything different. Better yet, tell him to read Consumer
Reports. The only brand they seem to like is Toyota. >>

Seems like sort of a hostile response to someone asking for practical
experience from owners of Rangers which is entirely reasonable to me. If
you, Mark, own a Ranger or can give some helpful feedback how about doing
that instead of the caustic approach?

Mike Schell-Smith

------------------------------

From: "Mike Fisher" gte.net>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 10:05:21 -0600

When somebody writes to the list asking for advice, then proceeds to tell
everyone why he and his friend think Ford products suck, how do you take
that? Is he doing the same thing on a Toyota/Nissan/Mazda/Mitubishi/etc.
list? I don't think so.

Mike Fisher

----- Original Message -----
From: aol.com>
To: ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 9:51 AM
Subject: [small-list] Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?


> In a message dated 02/12/2000 10:07:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> mdfishergte.net writes:
>
> << Why don't you tell your friend to go buy a rice-burner? Some people
will
> only be happy with the perceived quality of Japanese junk, so don't even
try
> to tell him anything different. Better yet, tell him to read Consumer
> Reports. The only brand they seem to like is Toyota. >>
>
> Seems like sort of a hostile response to someone asking for practical
> experience from owners of Rangers which is entirely reasonable to me. If
> you, Mark, own a Ranger or can give some helpful feedback how about doing
> that instead of the caustic approach?
>
> Mike Schell-Smith
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> message.
>


------------------------------

From: "Steve B. Hall" zdnetonebox.com>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 08:10:14 -0800

I Have a 96 ranger ext. cab with a camper shell and also play music.
I play bluegrass and haul my doghouse (excuse me the double bass for
those orchastra players out there, I play bluegrass) and still have enough
room for a few other things. I would recommend a thick piece of foam
under your instrument cut to the form of the bed of the truck he probably
has a hard case but this will keep the hardshell case from sliding around
the bed and I do mean foam about 3- 4 inces thick to also cushion any
hard roads(In MO we tend to have highways with pothole problems!)I also
had a 88 ranger but with out the shell, but with a spider cargo net and
the foam worked great to except in the rain I would use a 2 king size
matress bags and cover it fit great kept the soft case dry!!!! and protected
it through a small hail storm while driving to a gig in Iowa. If he
has 3-5,000$ for a down payment He could find one on lot with payments
bein reasonable and the camper thrown in the payments if the dealer works
with a local camper dealer.

--
Steve Hall
hallsbzdnetonebox.com - email
(202) 777-2645 ext. 1363 - voicemail/fax



---- "Mike Fisher" gte.net> wrote:
> Why don't you tell your friend to go buy a rice-burner? Some people
> will
> only be happy with the perceived quality of Japanese junk, so don't
> even try
> to tell him anything different. Better yet, tell him to read Consumer
> Reports. The only brand they seem to like is Toyota.
>
> Of course, if he wants real bumpers, troubleshooting without $1000
> in
> diagnostic equipment, reasonably priced repair manuals and an all-around
> sturdy vehicle, he won't get that in a Jap product either.
>
> Mike Fisher
> '97 AWD Mountaineer
> K&N/Borla/31x10.5 BFG ATs/PIAA/Edelbrock IAS
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: pacbell.net>
> To: ford-trucks.com>
> Sent: Friday, February 11, 2000 11:50 PM
> Subject: [small-list] Should I recommend a Ranger?
>
>
> > My good friend and electronics bench technician, Paul, has just bent
> a
> > rod in his Subaru wagon. It's time for him to replace the car. Since
> he
> > carts his cello to rehearsals, his last few cars have been station
> > wagons. In recent years, cars have been getting increasingly hard
> to
> > work on, with the engines jammed into decreasing spaces (like an
> > Aerostar).
> > After a few years when the repairs start becoming more frequent,
> a
> > modern passenger car is too expensive to keep. Paul has always worked
> on
> > his own vehicles, and would like to continue. A used car that he
> can
> > afford is no longer a practical option. I recommended that he consider
> > a small pickup truck with a camper shell.
> >
> > Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable,
> my
> > friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar
> (which
> > I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as
> being
> > conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
> > integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed
> by
> > accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent
> Ford
> > employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue
> to
> > do so as long as I own this vehicle.
> >
> > After watching his brother replace the heater core in his Taurus,
> Paul's
> > opionion of Ford products is pretty low, too. He has witnessed, too,
> the
> > outrageous cost of ownership of my Aerostar, caused by absurd premature
> > parts failures and maintenance obstructions.
> >
> > Can we trust a manufacturer who puts the slave cylinder inside the
> > transmission? What other nasty surprises lurk within their merchandise?
> >
> > What I'd like to see Paul driving is a small pickup truck with real
> > bumpers, enough space around components to allow sensible repair
> access,
> > good materials and parts, the ability to work on it with normal tools,
> > the ability to diagnose it himself without $1,000 in diagnostic
> > equipment, reasonably-priced repair manuals, and an all-around sturdy
> > machine. Can this be had in a Ranger, or must he return to the Japanese
> > companies in order to get a vehicle that makes sense to own? My
> > neighbor just told me that he's gotten 15 years out of his Nissan
> pickup
> > already.
> >
> > Can you guys say some good words about your Ford Rangers? If so,
> what
> > years/versions would you recommend for my friend? He's only got
> between
> > $3,000 and $5,000 to spend.
> >
> > Richard
> >
> >
> > ==========================================================
> > To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> > the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> > message.
> >
> >
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> message.
>
>

___________________________________________________________________
To get your own FREE ZDNet onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax,
all in one place - sign up today at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.zdnetonebox.com


------------------------------

From: "William Hickey" hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 08:10:26 PST

My experience with Ford vehicles has been positive. We now own a 98 Escort
wagon, a 99 Ranger SC 4X4 and a 97 Cobra. The Cobra was used when we
purchased it but the other two were purchased new. Both vehicles have a
approx. 30K on them and have not had major any problems. The Escort is
defect free (so far) but the Ranger has a problem with the wipers having a
mind of their own. The problem is with the switch which the dealer is going
to replace next week under warranty. Prior to the 99 Ranger, I had a 93 SC
4X2 which I purchased new. This truck had a manual tranny and the 4 banger
in it. A very RELIABLE truck and defect free. I never had to return to the
dealer over a problem. When I sold it, it had over 160K and ran like new.
During that time the only things I replaced it it were a set of shocks, two
mufflers, a starter and a tail pipe. The transmission was starting to whine
though, probably because the fluid had leaked out and I didn't catch it on
time. I also had lifted it and was running 31 inch GoodYears. I liked the
truck and would have kept it, but the engine just wasn't strong enough to
pull those 31s. Also a relocation from Florida (flat)to Virginia (hilly
country roads) didn't help. Several years ago I purchased a 1986 Ranger for
my son. It was an old farm truck and had over 100k on it. It was a short
bed and had no options on it (power steering and the normal stuff). It was
rusty and beat up looking but lasted him through high school until he went
to college. Although it was an ugly little booger, it always started and
got him to where he had to go safely. So far, my experience has been good
with Ford vehicles and
I would recommend them to anyone.

Regards,
Bill
99 Ranger SC 4X4
98 Escort Wagon
97 Mustang Cobra

















______________________________________________________


------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 12:02:45 -0500
From: David Cooley bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Changing the automatic transmission oil,

At 10:01 PM 2/11/00 -0800, you wrote:
>Here's another, possibly safer, way to routinely change our automatic
>transmission fluid. I'd like to hear some comments.


That would work to get out what's in the trans pan, and would probably be a
good idea the first time to get the fluid out so you could pull the pan
without taking a shower in the pretty red stuff!
Once the pan is off however, you could install a drain plug kit (B&M makes
them) so it would be as easy as changing the oil the next time.

===========================================================
David Cooley N5XMT Internet: N5XMTbellsouth.net
Packet: N5XMTKQ4LO.#INT.NC.USA.NA T.A.P.R. Member #7068
We are Borg... Prepare to be assimilated!
===========================================================


------------------------------

From: "Tony Rio - (Chicago)" tigroupchicago.com>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 11:48:47 -0600

I would try to push him towards either a small truck, or a full sized (i'm
partial to the full size myself)

I used to haul my bass rig around in our Explorer, but that got rough after
awhile... There just wasn't the room, and the wife didn't want me gouging
the plastic trim.

Your buddy will probably be disappointed because it doesn't ride like his
Subaru, but hey, it's a truck! And if he won't buy Ford trucks because he
didn't like a Ford car, well that's kinda like comparing apples to oranges.

Personally, I would never want to own a Sable, Taurus, or Aerostar, but
that's just me. No offense to anyone who owns one, but my opinion of their
fit and finish, and styling is pretty low. Each manufacture excels in a
certain area, and I think Fords area is their truck line. Just like I think
their low spot is their current 4x4 offerings and econo-cars. But again,
just my $0.02.

Just ask your friend this... of all the old-rusted-dented-POS trucks he sees
on the road, what brand are they? And I mean the REAL beaters. Around
here I see Fords at least 4 to 1 over anything else. They may not be
pretty, but hell, they're still running!



> > My good friend and electronics bench technician, Paul, has just bent
> a
> > rod in his Subaru wagon. It's time for him to replace the car. Since
> he
> > carts his cello to rehearsals, his last few cars have been station
> > wagons. In recent years, cars have been getting increasingly hard
> to
> > work on, with the engines jammed into decreasing spaces (like an
> > Aerostar).
> > After a few years when the repairs start becoming more frequent,
> a
> > modern passenger car is too expensive to keep. Paul has always worked
> on
> > his own vehicles, and would like to continue. A used car that he
> can
> > afford is no longer a practical option. I recommended that he consider
> > a small pickup truck with a camper shell.
> >
> > Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable,
> my
> > friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar
> (which
> > I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as
> being
> > conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
> > integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed
> by
> > accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent
> Ford
> > employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue
> to
> > do so as long as I own this vehicle.
> >
> > After watching his brother replace the heater core in his Taurus,
> Paul's
> > opionion of Ford products is pretty low, too. He has witnessed, too,
> the
> > outrageous cost of ownership of my Aerostar, caused by absurd premature
> > parts failures and maintenance obstructions.
> >
> > Can we trust a manufacturer who puts the slave cylinder inside the
> > transmission? What other nasty surprises lurk within their merchandise?
> >
> > What I'd like to see Paul driving is a small pickup truck with real
> > bumpers, enough space around components to allow sensible repair
> access,
> > good materials and parts, the ability to work on it with normal tools,
> > the ability to diagnose it himself without $1,000 in diagnostic
> > equipment, reasonably-priced repair manuals, and an all-around sturdy
> > machine. Can this be had in a Ranger, or must he return to the Japanese
> > companies in order to get a vehicle that makes sense to own? My
> > neighbor just told me that he's gotten 15 years out of his Nissan
> pickup
> > already.
> >
> > Can you guys say some good words about your Ford Rangers? If so,
> what
> > years/versions would you recommend for my friend? He's only got
> between
> > $3,000 and $5,000 to spend.
> >
> > Richard
> >
> >
> > ==========================================================
> > To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> > the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> > message.
> >
> >
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> message.
>
>

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 13:24:28 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: ADMIN: Trim footers

Can everyone discipline themselves to remove the unsubscribe
information footer from the bottom of messages when replying?
It's getting old seeing 4 of them on a multiple message reply.
If the list can't self-police themselves with this, I'll have
to set up a filter to bounce such posts.

Thanks,
Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts



------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 11:31:01 -0800
From: Adam McLaughlin jps.net>
Subject: Reliabilty of Ford

I have a 1989 Ranger STX. It has 420,000+ miles on it running. It is a
2.9, 4x4, 5 speed with all of the options.

It has cost me a water pump, two clutches and two transmissions. Apart
from this, the motor has NEVER had a bolt turned on it. Right now, the
transfer case is starting to get drippy, but other than that, this truck
is bullet proof. Everything is original except for these parts.

The next cars that I buy in my lifetime, will be fords.

Long live the 2.9!

Adam



------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 14:33:37 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: ADMIN: Web search is back up

The Ford Truck Enthusiasts web search is working again.
It's very fast and will search about 200 meg of content
in about 2-5 seconds.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts



------------------------------

From: "Neil Brownlee" offroading.freeserve.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Reliabilty of Ford
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 20:11:04 -0000

Speaking as someone from the UK, you may (or may not) remember me, I was the
unlucky guy who had the FIRST frame swap on an Explorer in the UK. You will
notice in my sign-off that I now do not own the vehicle. I bought a far
superior offroader :) (Piglet)

Ford failed on all counts to satisfy even the most basic rudiments of
customer service. Personally I loved my Explorer, it was MY vehicle, it
performed perfectly, it was maybe a bit too long for some off the offroad
work I used to torture it with, but I loved it. However, I cannot ever see
myself purchasing another Ford, because dealer backup was non-existant (they
could not even get the coolant level right!- I HAD TO POINT OUT THE COLD
FILL LEVEL!), customer relations was laughable, and after they had *broken*
my engine, they tried to SUE me!!!

Anyway, if any of you see a long haired guy complaining about Ford UK on a
consumer program..it's me.

P.S. Just to prove I'm not having a go at the vehicles...I'm currently
putting a 109" Land Rover Series III onto an Explorer Rolling Chassis....now
that is going to be a fun offroader...and as far as I know the first one of
it's kind! That 4.0 V6 under an aluminium body...tee hee!!!

-------------------------------------------------------------

Neil

1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet'
1981 Land Rover Stage One V8 - 'Henry'
1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet'




------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 16:08:39 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: Re: Reliabilty of Ford

At 08:11 PM 2/12/00 +0000, you wrote:

-snip-
>Ford failed on all counts to satisfy even the most basic rudiments of
>customer service.


Correction..... The dealer failed on all accounts. You
can't blame that on FoMoCo. If you don't own a Ford, why
are you hanging out on a Ford list? I'm curious.









------------------------------

From: "William Hickey" hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Reliabilty of Ford
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 13:49:51 PST

>-snip-
> >Ford failed on all counts to satisfy even the most basic rudiments of
> >customer service.
Neil,
I do remember your posts concerning problems with Ford in the UK. I was
always curious why you even considered purchasing a 'Yank' designed Explorer
over there. I assume that Ford doesn't invest much money into their service
organization over there. How often do you see an Explorer or Ranger on the
road ? I have been told that there a few, but our trucks and SUVs are
certainly not big sellers over there. I would not lay the blame on
'LandRover' or another British manufacturer if I puchased a 'Brit' designed
truck over here in the USA and had problems with the 'Yank' dealer
organization. If I lived over there, I would not buy a Ford vehicle that
was primarily marketed over here for the same reason why I wouldn't purchase
a British designed truck over here ...... lack of service facilities and
questionable training of the service organization by the parent
manufacturer.

Regards,
Bill
______________________________________________________


------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 18:08:39 -0500
From: Ken Payne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: ADMIN: Chat is back up

It's been a productive day so far. The Ford Truck
Enthusiasts web chat is back up. The Java VM we're
running is a much newer version than the one on our
previous server. It should be much more stable.
However, as a precautionary measure, it will restart
every hour until I'm comfortable with its operation.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts



------------------------------

From: "mikah vosekuil" hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?
Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 17:07:19 PST

i own 2 rangers. one is an plain jane 87 2.3l 4cyl manual steering, manual
trans, 2wd. the other is an 86 2.9l power steering, manual trans, 4wd. you
could not pay me enough to get rid of these trucks. i bought the 86 a year
and a half ago for $1000 and stuck roughly $800 in it including tierods,
exhaust, radiator hoses, new brake pads , rotors, warn manual hubs,
battery, o2 sensor, and 4 u-joints. the truck has 167,000 miles on it now
and has never left me stranded. i average 21mpg with 33 inch tires. i've
had it buried in mud halfway up the doors and drove right out. i pull
fullsizes out all the time with it. it never burns, leaks oil, or smoke. i
put 65,000 on it since i bought it and have nothing to complain about. when
i bought it i expected it to be just basic transportationand it is far from
that. id like to see your "friend" buy a rice grinder for $1000 and stick
as little money in it as i did for a 14 year old vehicle. the parts i put
in my truck would cost him probably $2000 alone. i'n not saying ranger
front ends are indestructable but they sure are a lot stronger than the
chincy front ends found on most imports. my 87 never gave me a problem
either. i bought it with 72,000 miles and it now has over 200,000. within
a year i plan to pull out the 2.3 and put in a high output 302. i'd push my
truck before i'd consider getting something else. so tell your "friend"
that if he wants a reliable truck find a ranger. they pretty much grow on
trees so it won't be hard to find one.


>From: rgsteinpacbell.net
>Reply-To: small-listford-trucks.com
>To: small-listford-trucks.com
>Subject: [small-list] Should I recommend a Ranger?
>Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 21:50:33 -0800
>
>My good friend and electronics bench technician, Paul, has just bent a
>rod in his Subaru wagon. It's time for him to replace the car. Since he
>carts his cello to rehearsals, his last few cars have been station
>wagons. In recent years, cars have been getting increasingly hard to
>work on, with the engines jammed into decreasing spaces (like an
>Aerostar).
>After a few years when the repairs start becoming more frequent, a
>modern passenger car is too expensive to keep. Paul has always worked on
>his own vehicles, and would like to continue. A used car that he can
>afford is no longer a practical option. I recommended that he consider
>a small pickup truck with a camper shell.
>
>Many of you seem happy with your rangers. Yet after owning a Sable, my
>friend Gary will never buy another Ford product, and my Aerostar (which
>I drive mostly for physical reasons) and Gary's car impress me as being
>conceived by an advertising agency, designed by engineers with the
>integrity of Homer Simpson, with final design stupidity contributed by
>accountants. I take no solace from the knowledge that the recent Ford
>employee bonuses came out of this customer's hide, and will continue to
>do so as long as I own this vehicle.
>
>After watching his brother replace the heater core in his Taurus, Paul's
>opionion of Ford products is pretty low, too. He has witnessed, too, the
>outrageous cost of ownership of my Aerostar, caused by absurd premature
>parts failures and maintenance obstructions.
>
>Can we trust a manufacturer who puts the slave cylinder inside the
>transmission? What other nasty surprises lurk within their merchandise?
>
>What I'd like to see Paul driving is a small pickup truck with real
>bumpers, enough space around components to allow sensible repair access,
>good materials and parts, the ability to work on it with normal tools,
>the ability to diagnose it himself without $1,000 in diagnostic
>equipment, reasonably-priced repair manuals, and an all-around sturdy
>machine. Can this be had in a Ranger, or must he return to the Japanese
>companies in order to get a vehicle that makes sense to own? My
>neighbor just told me that he's gotten 15 years out of his Nissan pickup
>already.
>
>Can you guys say some good words about your Ford Rangers? If so, what
>years/versions would you recommend for my friend? He's only got between
>$3,000 and $5,000 to spend.
>
>Richard
>
>
>==========================================================
>To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
>the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
>message.
>

______________________________________________________


------------------------------

Date: 12 Feb 00 20:11:54 EST
From: Tim Turner netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [Re: Should I recommend a Ranger?]

"Mike Fisher" gte.net> wrote:
> Why don't you tell your friend to go buy a rice-burner? Some people will
> only be happy with the perceived quality of Japanese junk, so don't even
try
> to tell him anything different.

Too true..

> Better yet, tell him to read Consumer
> Reports. The only brand they seem to like is Toyota.

Ever since the Camry came out CU seems to have a bent for Toys. Great until
they DO break and then... well.. if you think Ford parts are high $$ try Asian
or European parts.

>
> Of course, if he wants real bumpers, troubleshooting without $1000 in
> diagnostic equipment, reasonably priced repair manuals and an all-around
> sturdy vehicle, he won't get that in a Jap product either.

Lets compare my '85 B-II and my '86 Mazda B-2K on those points.

Bumpers: B-II front slightly pushed up and in but essentially straight, B-2K 3
corners bent/warped and the 4th corner is MIA with some body damage from the
cheesy bumper.

Diagnostics: B-II codes can be retrieved with a VOM to aid in diag's, B-2K
has no codes available so start measuring EVERYthing until you find it. B-II
manual somewhat clunky for the computer system, B-2K manual asinine and often
leads to improper diagnosis if followed to the letter. (OEM manuals) Both
have Haynes or other manuals for sale though.

Sturdy: Haven't rolled either one yet! Seriously though; having seen Asian &
American vehicles after rolling over in the dunes and dirt I'll stick with the
Ford. (Of course blowing out both rear windows in a B-II pretty well totals
it as expensive as they are..)

Tim

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------------------------------

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