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Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:17:41 -0600 (MDT)
From: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks-digest)
To: fordtrucks-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks-digest V1 #209
Reply-To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Sender: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net


fordtrucks-digest Wednesday, September 10 1997 Volume 01 : Number 209



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 And Older Trucks Digest
Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
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email to the same address with the word "help" in the body of the
message.
=======================================================================
In this issue:

6V to 12V or not [Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)]
RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion [marko helix.net (marko maryniak)]
2WD to 4WD Conversion ["Dave Resch"]
RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: Converting to Halogen Headlights ["Dave Resch"]
RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion [Keith Srb ]
Window Stickers ["deconblu" ]
460 Crank Failure ["Dale and Donna Carmine" ]
Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion [Don Grossman ]
2WD TO 4WD CONVERSION [Sleddog ]
RE: 460 Crank Failure [Sleddog ]
window stickers ["Payne, Kenneth" ]
RE: Converting my 66 and my 74 to Halogen Headlights [Tim Baker
Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion ["deconblu" ]
Re: window stickers ["deconblu" ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 14:15:52 -0700
From: Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)
Subject: 6V to 12V or not

Concerning the conversion from 6 volt
to 12 volt. Why do it at all? With an additional
6V battery in the circuit in series everything
runs 6V, except the few items (radio, CB, etc.)
that need 12V. Run them from a separate parallel circuit.

Or if installing a 12V charging system engine, run the
rest of the truck from one of the 6V batteries (golf carts
use 6V batteries, so plenty of them around).

Haven't done this, but would if the right vehicle
came around.

Best of both worlds!

- - Jeff '64 F100 CrewCab

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 14:15:23 -0700
From: marko helix.net (marko maryniak)
Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

I am doing the same thing, only in reverse, putting a clean 71 body from a
2wd onto my 71 f250 4wd once blue, now blue, red, and see-through. And no,
you can't have my running gear!

IF: the frame you buy is straight and the truck is just a rust bucket or
something but otherwise ok, then the way to go, i think, is this:

Drive your 2x while doing a resto on the purchased 4x frame. First, take
your good bed off your 2x and put it aside. Put the bad bed from the 4x
onto the now naked back of the 2x, so you can haul stuff around in it
without damaging the good bed. Then, do your "frame-off" on the 4x.

Reason being, you'll probably have/want to replace suspension bushings,
transfer case mounts, wiring, brake lines/cables, hoses, cab mounts in any
case. The sheer aggro of not finishing a job you thought you'd get a job
done one day (like swapping axles or something) is enough to make you not
want to do this. Besides, it's easier removing and replacing, in the case
of spring bushings, one bolt at a time, rather than having the whole thing
on your shop floor in pieces. Oh yeah, no bonking of the head! Since the
body will be off the 4x frame, you can literally walk around in the running
gear and get easy access to everything.
No insult to your 2 wheeler intended; if both frames are in the same
condition, that's the only thing you'd not be using of the 2x that you could
be. Everything from the frame up can be switched over, and it's WAY easier
to do in that order (stack things on top of a bare chassis) than the other
way around (crawl around under a still lower-slung, unrestored (I'm
assuming) 2wd chassis with a body on it.

just my coupla cents worth, actually 1.6 cents US, 2 Canadian

marko in vancouver
marko helix.net
71 f250 4x4


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:28:16 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

Keith:

The main issue is the frame itself. On some years of Ford trucks (not sure
about '74 specifically), the frame itself is different for the 4x4.
Sometimes, it's just the crossmembers (usually different around the
transmission and transfer case, and maybe different around the front end,
what w/ coil spring twin I-beam on 4x2 and leaf spring live axle on 4x4 -
completely different front suspension systems), and if the frame rails are
identical, w/ different crossmembers just bolted to different holes, you're
ok to switch things over. Otherwise, you might need to completely change
frames (or bodies, depending on your perspective) or go in for a lot of
custom fabrication to work it out.

just my 0.02

Dave R. (M-block devotee)
1980 F250 4x4 351M

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:33:58 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

> From: Keith Srb
> Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion
> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:49:18 -0700

> 4WD Frame. I want to convert my 74 2WD F250 into a 74 4WD F250 by
> using as much of the74 2WD Truck as I can.

Now we're back where we started :-) If you have a rolled frame then
it's no good to use but if you find a frame in good condition it's
MUCH easier to bolt the body back on to a 4wd frame than to modify a
2wd frame to accept the 4wd parts and get all the geometry right. I
did it on a 75 van but if you want to do the work you will find the
front end a real challenge to line up correctly and new mounting
brackets etc. for trasnfer case is a pain and the frame won't be
shaped right for the axle up front, steering box won't work either
etc..

That's all I was trying to say. It's doable, just easier the other
way, much easier IMHO :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:48:50 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Re: Converting to Halogen Headlights

Keith:

The sealed beam halogen headlights use exactly the same packaging (lamp
size, plug configuration, etc.) as the old style sealed beam headlights, so
they're a direct plug-in replacement.

Sealed beam halogen headlights have the halogen bulb sealed inside a
conventional glass unit. If you use these type headlights, you don't have
to worry about precautions about touching the halogen bulb, since it isn't
accessible; they handle just like the old filament type lights. The sealed
beam halogens are not too expensive compared to the European type lights
(Hella, et al) with their replaceable bulb elements and expensive lenses
($6-$8 vs $50 or more per headlight).

One thing you can get now in sealed beam halogens is so-called Long Life or
Hi Output bulbs that use a 55 watt low beam element (max legal for street
use per USDOT). Conventional halogen sealed beams use a 35 watt low beam
element. All street legal halogens use a 65 watt high beam element.

One thing you might want to do to improve your lighting system, aside from
the switch to halogens, is to set up a remote relay to supply power to the
headlights directly from the battery, rather than through the headlight
switch in the cab. I made this change on my truck and the voltage measured
at the headlight (with engine running) went from 10.45 going through the
stock setup to 13.2 volts going through the relay. The light output is
substantially better.

Dave R. (M-block devotee)
1980 F250 4x4 351M

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:41:08 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

I am sure it would be easier to change bodies, but this is going to be a
project truck. I took a lot of time finding a solid truck to start with. I
live in Arizona, should I not have to worry too much about rust. I do not care
how long, or how much money it will take to do the restoration and upgrades.
Other than the fact that it is 2WD, I love this truck and have no plans of ever
selling it.

Seven years ago, I took my Harley, which was in running condition and in good
shape, and tore it down to the frame. It took me Six Years and $3000.00, I
originally paid $3300.00 for the Bike in 1982, to get everything the way I
wanted it. Yes I missed driving it for those Six Years, but after riding it for
a year, and getting a lot of comments, it was well worth the wait. That is
generally how I do things! Take it slow, do it my way while I still make sure
it is done right.


Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"


- -----Original Message-----
From:Gary, 78 BBB [SMTP:gpeters3 ford.com]
Sent:Wednesday, September 10, 1997 10:34 AM
To:fordtrucks listservice.net
Subject:RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

> From: Keith Srb
> Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion
> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 13:49:18 -0700

> 4WD Frame. I want to convert my 74 2WD F250 into a 74 4WD F250 by
> using as much of the74 2WD Truck as I can.

Now we're back where we started :-) If you have a rolled frame then
it's no good to use but if you find a frame in good condition it's
MUCH easier to bolt the body back on to a 4wd frame than to modify a
2wd frame to accept the 4wd parts and get all the geometry right. I
did it on a 75 van but if you want to do the work you will find the
front end a real challenge to line up correctly and new mounting
brackets etc. for transfer case is a pain and the frame won't be
shaped right for the axle up front, steering box won't work either
etc..

That's all I was trying to say. It's doable, just easier the other
way, much easier IMHO :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --



+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:55:17 -0700
From: "deconblu"
Subject: Window Stickers

I was just wondering what happened to us getting window stickers. Did they
fly out the window? I've been thinking of making something up for my truck.
Every time I see a Ford truck on the road I feel like yelling out "Hey, do
you know about the Ford Truck List" but with everyone afraid of drive-by
shootings and car jacking it's not wise yelling at motorist in the Southland
(So.Ca.). So, what up Homey!



Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:00:50 -0500
From: "Dale and Donna Carmine"
Subject: 460 Crank Failure

Last summer I was driving a company truck, '78 F-250 460 C-6, down the
highway at 55 mph and the crank sheared cleanly right behind the number one
main. I could crank the engine and the front pulley wouldn't turn at all.
The mechanic who rebuilt the 460 said he has seen this before. He said it
is caused by regrinders who don't put enough radius at the edge of the main
journals causing a stress point.
Has anyone else seen this type of failure? How common is it?
Why does it break at the front main? This would seem to be the lowest
stress point on the crank.
Maybe just a casting flaw?

Worst part is I had to drive a chevy 305 for a month while the 460 was
being rebuilt! :-(

dale c

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:04:02 -0800
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

Keith Srb wrote:
> Lets try this again. I would like to find a 4X4 that has been rolled, or
> totaled in some way and is sitting in a wrecking yard. I am would like to take
> all of the 4x4 parts, Front Axle, Rear Axle , Driveshafts, Transfer Case,
> Steering Parts, what every I need off of it. I then plan on bringing them
> home, cleaning them up and attaching them to my 74 F250 2WD Frame. Once this is
> done, I am going to apply some type of black paint to this setup and then
> proceed to put as many of my 74 F250 Parts back onto the 74 F250 4WD, don't
> lose me hear, this is the 74 2WD Frame converted to a 74 4WD Frame. I want to
> convert my 74 2WD F250 into a 74 4WD F250 by using as much of the74 2WD Truck
> as I can.
>
> I hope it all makes more sense now.
>
> TTFN
>
> Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
> Mesa, AZ


I think most of us got you the first time. ;)

For all the time of putting all the little things on the 2x frame it
would be quicker to use the 4x frame. I know you have all the time in
the world but this is JMO here. Lets start from rear to front here.....
Taking the rear springs and hangers off the frames and reattaching in
the proper location. The 2x used a thinner spring than the 4x's. Also
changing the rear end if the gear ratios are different. The T-case will
be a divorce mount style so you will have to remove the frame x-member
from the 4x and add to the 2x. You may need something to spread the
frame apart to get the crossmember out of the 4x and into the 2x. I was
looking at some and they can be a tight fit. If both trucks are the
same WB you can reuse the drive shafts except it one is an auto and the
other is a stick transmission, you could change trannys to match or have
custome shafts made.

Front end here. 2x use coil springs and 4x use leaf springs. You will
be removing all the coilspring towers shock mounts and radius arm mounts
and reattaching the 4x springs and hangers from the 4x. Most likely
will have to drill a few extra holes here and there to match up. I
might be wrong but the frames are different just a little between the 4x
and 2x.

If that frame crossmember under the engine isn't in the way the oilpan
might be. You might need to add a lift to clear the oil pan or
crossmember. Off come the front and rear springs and on go the lifted
springs. I can't see your truck from here so this might not be needed.

Steering:
next is the removal of the 2x steering box. I'm working off the top of
my head here so I might be wrong in the location of the steering box but
is it behind the front axle under the cab? This will have to come off
and the 4x box added in front of the new 4x axle. Some models mounted
inside the frame with an arm on the outside moving front to rear. IF
you happen to get the Power Steering option you will be adding the
pumpand brackets to the engine and attaching the lines.

I am sure I have missed a few steps but they will be filled in at 2 a.m.
when you come accross them.

Come to think of it the frame horns are different. The 2x and 1/2 ton
4x have rounded frame horns and the 3/4 4x's have square frame ends for
the crossmember to attach.

Laters
- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net


63 Ford F-250 4x4 67' 390, t-98, Spicer 24, Dana 60, Dana 44

Phase 172: rebuild front suspension

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:04:45 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: 2WD TO 4WD CONVERSION

it is easier to swap bodies than it is to swap running gear. if you decide
to swap running gear then be prepared for a long dirty aggrivating job
ahead. look at the 4wd frame and the 2wd frame and figure out how to hold
the transfer case. there are 2 ways - bolted to the tranny and seperated
from tranny with drive shaft betwwen. which 4wd chassis you find, look at
it. there are good/bad things about each way. you'll have to decide for
yourself how you want to do it. custom mounts or using frame sections -
cross members from the 4wd chassis is not easy either way. and then there
is the front axle swap! oh boy!

i just found a 78 f-250 with a wasted bed, cab, and universal joints and
front driveshaft, but good chassis, engine, tranny, t-case, rear, front
axle, tires, wheels, etc. $150 to go. this truck is ideal to put put my
77 cab (from 2wd frame) right on. swapping axles into the 2wd frame would
be harder than my other current idea of tossing the dana 80 and 60 front
from my 78 1-ton under my 77 f150 while still retaining the f150 radius
arms and steering gear.

sleddog

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:32:08 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: 460 Crank Failure

the front is subjected to side loads from accesories and torsional
vibration dampening is at the front. the front is were the dampaner is and
the torsional vibrations get damped starting there, and traveling back
through the crank. so the front takes more "abuse" than the rest of the
crank.
you can see how hard the v-belts pull on the crank during a rebuild as the
front main is usually worn much worse than the rest.

sleddog.

- ----------
From: Dale and Donna Carmine[SMTP:dcarmine inetnebr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 1997 7:00 PM
To: Ford Trucks
Subject: 460 Crank Failure

Last summer I was driving a company truck, '78 F-250 460 C-6, down the
highway at 55 mph and the crank sheared cleanly right behind the number one
main. I could crank the engine and the front pulley wouldn't turn at all.
The mechanic who rebuilt the 460 said he has seen this before. He said it
is caused by regrinders who don't put enough radius at the edge of the main
journals causing a stress point.
Has anyone else seen this type of failure? How common is it?
Why does it break at the front main? This would seem to be the lowest
stress point on the crank.
Maybe just a casting flaw?

Worst part is I had to drive a chevy 305 for a month while the 460 was
being rebuilt! :-(

dale c






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 19:42:18 -0400
From: "Payne, Kenneth"
Subject: window stickers

At 03:55 PM 9/10/97 -0700, you wrote:
> I was just wondering what happened to us getting window stickers. Did
they
>fly out the window? I've been thinking of making something up for my
truck.
>Every time I see a Ford truck on the road I feel like yelling out "Hey,
do
>you know about the Ford Truck List" but with everyone afraid of
drive-by
>shootings and car jacking it's not wise yelling at motorist in the
Southland
>(So.Ca.). So, what up Homey!
>

I'm waiting for our domain name so that the web address on the sticker
will be valid. I sent domain registration out a little over a week
ago so we should have a domain any day now (InterNIC claims about
2 weeks for a domain). I'd hate to produce stickers with
www.ford-trucks.com (which is a huge address to put
on a sticker) when our new address is just around the corner.
The old address will still be valid but the new one can follow us
to any provider. Don't want to give out the address just yet, I
want confirmation first from InterNIC and Dragonfire. Hint:
it will be very easy to remember.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:57:28 +0100
From: Tim Baker
Subject: RE: Converting my 66 and my 74 to Halogen Headlights

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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

No just go to your parts store and get the halogen replacements---they are more efficient and brighter---no extra work required

- ----------
From: Keith Srb
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 1997 9:12 PM
To: 'fordtrucks listservice.net'
Subject: Converting my 66 and my 74 to Halogen Headlights

Can I replace my old style headlights in my 66 & 74, with halogen headlights?
If so do I need to make any modifications to the truck, Alternator, Wiring
Harness, Headlight Bucket, Etc?

TTFN

Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"






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Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:37:04 -0700
From: "deconblu"
Subject: Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

>I am sure it would be easier to change bodies, but this is going to be a
>project truck. I took a lot of time finding a solid truck to start with. I
>live in Arizona, should I not have to worry too much about rust. I do not
care
>how long, or how much money it will take to do the restoration and
upgrades.
>Other than the fact that it is 2WD, I love this truck and have no plans of
ever
>selling it.

Right on Bro! I'm the same way. What I want is what's important not what
people think I should do! What amazes me is you did a frame up on a Hog for
3g. I'm no fan of the Harley Co. but I am a fan of what you have. Built by a
Biker for a Biker! What your doing to your cage is the same you did for your
sled. It's not for everyone just you! Good luck Bro!

Just a Tramp!

Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302

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Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:05:35 -0700
From: "deconblu"
Subject: Re: window stickers

>I'm waiting for our domain name so that the web address on the sticker
>will be valid. I sent domain registration out a little over a week
>ago so we should have a domain any day now (InterNIC claims about
>2 weeks for a domain). I'd hate to produce stickers with....

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