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Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:28:35 -0600 (MDT)
From: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks-digest)
To: fordtrucks-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks-digest V1 #203
Reply-To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Sender: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net


fordtrucks-digest Monday, September 8 1997 Volume 01 : Number 203



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 And Older Trucks Digest
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=======================================================================
In this issue:

'64 F600 Stake Dump [schrozak idt.net (Chuck Schroeder)]
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: '64 F600 Stake Dump ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: Timing [SuperMagot aol.com]
tree forks and parts remembering [jniolon uss.com]
Re: Timing, plugs ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Spark Plugs ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
pilot bearing update ["Dave Resch"]
RE: ford posi 9" [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking? [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: Timing [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking? [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: Spark Plugs [Kevin Kemmerer ]
lenco transmissions [Kevin Kemmerer ]
Re: lenco transmissions ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["Deacon Blues" ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:20:49 -0400
From: schrozak idt.net (Chuck Schroeder)
Subject: '64 F600 Stake Dump

I'm new to the list (and new to Ford trucks) and would like to find my
niche. Maybe this has some bearing on the "splitting the list" issue ...
maybe not. With apologies for the bandwidth, Here's my story:

I bought my truck a couple of weeks ago for $600. It looked like it had
worked HARD. I gassed it up, put plates on it, asked The Lord for help and
drove it 40 miles to my property near Hancock, NY. Made it! It was a big
day for me. I'd been looking for a vehicle like it for a couple of years,
mostly in the newspapers and in truck mags like Wheels of Time (comes with
a membership to the American Truck Historical Society) and Double Clutch
(Antique Truck Club). The price tag got my attention, and a fellow member
of the Truck Club built my confidence in a medium-duty Ford ("Been buying
them for 35 years. They do the job.").

Now that I have it, I'd like to communicate with folks who have similar
versions of my truck, gather information on it, etc., so I would prefer a
"niche" as opposed to the "'79 and older" group. A '75 F250 may be a
great vehicle and somebody's pride and joy, but it doesn't really interest
me. On the other hand, good advice on general maintenance, etc. from
people who know what they're talking about is valuable. I've already found
Mike Shipley through the Smith Ford link who's helping me with VIN info. I
guess it makes sense to ride with y'all a while and see how much bandwith
is involved.

I've had great luck with older used trucks. In '70 I paid $45 for a '59
Dodge pickup (a.k.a."The Blue Ox"). In '73, $300 for a '66 International
3/4 T Stake ("The Red Iron Horse"). New trucks are a different story. In
'88 I paid $17,000 for an '88 Chev 1500. I didn't name it after an animal,
but "The Dog" would fit.

If my luck with old used trucks holds up, I'm going to be a Ford enthusiast.

Chuck Schroeder
'64 F600 Stake Dump

"A truck driver is somebody who believes you CAN take it with you.
You just have to know where the weigh stations are."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:21:41 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

> From: "Deacon Blues"
> Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:13:36 -0700

> It came from a truck so I didn't think about an oil pan or the
> exhaust manifold. I could go with headers if that's the case. If the
> oil pan is wrong then I'd need a oil pickup and God only knows what

A car type front sump pan will work fine in a PU but not in 4wd, only
2wd.

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:30:14 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

> From: Keith Srb
> Subject: 2WD to 4WD Conversion
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:20:26 -0700

> If I could find a 74 4X4 Donor Truck, could I remove the Axles,
> Drives Shafts, Transfer Case, Transmission and related hardware,
> would I be able to bolt them onto my 74 2WD?

You mean to convert it to 4wd? It would be much simpler to move the
2wd body onto the 4wd chasis believe me. The cross members are
different and you need the transfer case mounts on the frame and
...............and.........and.......

I did this on a van and it took me 3 months of hard work to make
every thing fit the way I wanted. It was worth it but with a PU you
have an option I didn't have, a donor chasis already set up for your
application. If it's rusty weld it up, fix it up, do whatever you
have to so you can use the 4x4 frame since it already has all the
mounting points and correct geometry for front end stuff etc. :-)

Unless the frame is wrecked? Even then I'd seriously look at it :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:55:45 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: '64 F600 Stake Dump

> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:20:49 -0400
> From: schrozak idt.net (Chuck Schroeder)
> Subject: '64 F600 Stake Dump

> Chuck Schroeder
> '64 F600 Stake Dump

Chuck, I had a 62 with a cab over something or other 600, don't
remember if it was a "F" but it had a 330, long stroke truck engine
and Clark 250 5 speed and two speed rear end which I thought was a
lot of fun. I hauled fire wood with it and wish I still had it just
for kicks. I put a PTO on it and ran the drive shaft through the
radiator to run a huge hydraulic pump to split wood with. Probably
the most expensive wood splitting operation you ever saw with a 150
hp engine to run it! You wouldn't believe how much gas you can burn
in a couple of hours doing that! :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:33:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: SuperMagot aol.com
Subject: Re: Timing

Two suggestions ---

1. An older vehicle can build up carbon in the combustion chamber (due to a
long life of rich running) and the carbon builds up heat and can cause
pre-ignition (knocking). The solutions can be drastic or simple depending.
You can yank a head and clean it up or try some of the engine cleaning
additives specifically designed to remove carbon.

2. Try a different spark plug (I believe in your case a "colder" plug or a
plug that does not stick so far into the combustion chamber) this will allow
less heat to enter the plug.

I am not a mechanic so take these suggestions with a grain of salt...

- - Mike

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 13:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: jniolon uss.com
Subject: tree forks and parts remembering

I've been following the thread on the parts people and finding
what you need. and I agree completely...I don't know how they shave
those chimps so closely THEN get them to stand behind that counter
like they really give a sh*t.

ANYWAY....

I'm doing a 53 F-100 frame off and so far its got a '86 Chrysl*r
front end, '75 Lincoln rear end, etc...

I found a nice little book advertised in Custom & Classic Trucks that
list every single part (well nearly) that goes into custom truck
building, giving you places to write in all the details about the
part, year, make, part number, and plenty of detail. Even down to
brake hose maker.

I don't have the name and address right now but will look it up and
have it ready to post, if anyone needs it, leave the appropriate
request or personal e-mail to jniolon uss.com.

It was mentioned in an article on Cher's 56 F-100 for sure.

Hope this will help some of you...it certainly helps me when I buy a
part and then don't use it for 18 months.

culater john

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:09:09 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Timing, plugs

> From: SuperMagot aol.com
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:33:43 -0400 (EDT)
> Subject: Re: Timing

> 2. Try a different spark plug (I believe in your case a "colder"
> plug or a plug that does not stick so far into the combustion
> chamber) this will allow less heat to enter the plug.

Speaking of which, has anyone had any success with those open center
electrode to the side type plugs like the Torque Master type. Wonder
how much voltage it takes to run one of those dudes?

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:42:30 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Spark Plugs

Speaking of spark plugs, I was just looking through my Jeggs catalog
and noticed the plug indexers again and was wondering if anyone has
ever fooled with that? Of course the Torque Masters would eliminate
that problem but how do they work? It looks to me like you buy a
couple of hundred plugs, fit them into the gauge and mark where they
wind up or something? Then you have to match them to the cylinders
based on the thread positions? Can't help it, I'm just danged
curious about every thing :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:02:48 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: pilot bearing update

Well, after staring intently at the pilot bearing in the back of the
crankshaft for what must have been a good 15 minutes, it didn't budge a
micron. However, I thought about the hydraulic method and looked at the
new bearing, which is surrounded by a big bushing piece, and thought about
the potential greasy mess, and decided that for $5.00 tool rental fee, I
didn't have much to lose. Better yet, it turns out that the store let me
"buy" the tool for 29.99 plus tax, and when I brought it back, they
refunded all my money!

Just for you detail-minded aficionados out there, it was Plews Tool part #
72-379, pilot bearing puller. As it turns out, the bearing came out of the
bushing, and then I had to pull the bushing out of the crank flange
separately.

Seeing the parts counter employee genealogy line of discussion that has
appeared over the last couple of days, I must say that the place where I
"borrowed" the tool was a Checker store. However, I still look really
closely at any parts they sell me and I always look over their shoulder at
the computer screen when they look it up. When I had to replace the diff
cover gasket on the Dana 60 in my F250, it was pretty frustrating to tell
them what I wanted and have them ask what vehicle it was for. My ranting
to the effect that a Dana 60 was a Dana 60, regardless of what vehicle it
was mounted in was only slightly gratifying to me.

Being the pessimist that I am, the parts counter guy who doesn't know a
pinion seal from a voltage regulator is no more disconcerting than the
sporting goods clerk who swears that GoreTex is a better insulator than
Quallofil, and I consider both of them to be simply further evidence of the
general decline of Western civilization, and besides, they probably drive
Ch*vys!

Dave R. (M-block devotee)
1980 F250 4x4 351M

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:15:24 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: ford posi 9"

i'd send you mine but . . . it is in 2 peices and it didn't split where ford wanted it too . . .

are there no junk yards there? the 9" is the easiest rear to rebuild. and relatively cheap.


sleddog

- ----------
From: jniolon uss.com[SMTP:jniolon uss.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 4:58 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net; fordnatics lists.best.com
Subject: ford posi 9"

looking for a traction loc or limited slip ford 9" differential
something between 2.75 and 3.5 gear...this will be a cruisen machine.

The rearend is cut down and complete so I don't need the housing just
the 3rd member

I'm in Birmingham so one in the Southeast United States is
preferred..freight on those devils is high.

Come on guys,, it's out there under that old tarp and you need to cut
grass there anyway and you if you haven't used it yey you don't need
it anyway.....

thanks john





+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:17:11 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

oh, that reminds me, many leak from the oil sending unit too. check this it is on the back of the engine right behind the intak manifold.

sleddog

- ----------
From: Gary, 78 BBB[SMTP:gpeters3 ford.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 6:52 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 10:09:53 -0400
> From: "John F. Bauer III"
> Subject: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

> engine oil pan, oil pump. Dropping cam 1/32" (sounds scarry to this
> novice, does this 1/32" real make/break the repair), removal/replace
> seal with new engine oil coated seal and put everything back
> together.

Don't know why the cam is involved but it's not especially easy if
you've never messed with an engine before. Actually you need to drop
the crank a tad not the cam? The cam cannot be "dropped 1/32" since
it's in round bearings with no breaks in them and has no caps.

The leak could be from one of the rear gallery plugs or intake
manifold or valve covers so you need to take a good look at the back
of the engine before tearing it down to make sure there is no other
possibility.

I've only worked on a few 460's and they have rubber seals with wire
reinforcement which can be slid around with the crank and rotated out
and back in by rotating the crank while applying force to the end of
the seal being very careful no to scratch the crank. If the crank is
chewed up where the seal goes you will be wasting your time to put in
a new one since it will just get chewed up agian very quickly.

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --





+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:21:55 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: Timing

actually i think it works by holding back the flash of light until one
rotation plus the dialed in degrees. it may not be the same, but the
timing computer i have from msd works as follows:
set max advance on destibuter.
then the computer retards the spark as i set on the box. i think the
electronics in the timing light work similiarly. but, what do i know? i
never did well in my electrical engineering classes.

sleddog

- ----------
From: Gary, 78 BBB[SMTP:gpeters3 ford.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 7:18 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: RE: Timing

> From: Kevin Kemmerer
> Subject: RE: Timing
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:06:24 -0400

> an adjustable timing light alows you to dial in the degrees on the
> light so you really only look at the zero mark on the dampener.

Thanks, Kevin, I wonder how accurate they are? Some kind of chip has
to count pulses and make the compensation I presume?

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:28:12 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

as per my experience, main seal leaks seem to have oil coming from inside
the bell housing - trans. if you wipe everything clean, you may be able to
see where it is coming from to be sure. if it is coming of of the outside
of the enigne so to speak, then the area just inside the bell housing/trans
should not get wet as much. if it is coming out of the cam plug or rear
cam oil gally plug, then it will appear to be a main seal leak.

sleddog

- ----------
From: John F. Bauer III[SMTP:bauerjf ix.netcom.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 11:17 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

Sorry folks, ment to say crank, not cam, it just slipped out. The Ford
service manual seems to make it sound a bit easier than the feedback so far
has mentioned. Even if the oil pan/oil pump can be removed without engine
removal, is it safe to say it would be impossible to simply "slide" in this
new seal without really removing the trans. and inspecting the rear of the
engine for other potential leaks as Gary mentions? Asking this question to
see if I can just take a stab at the seal being the problem, if it is,
quick
repair and back in business, if not, then go for the whole major removal
and
inspection process and get ready for major time/expense/etc.

Thanks for the tips,
John "cutting corners with fingers crossed"

At 10:52 AM 9/8/97 +0000, you wrote:
>> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 10:09:53 -0400
>> From: "John F. Bauer III"
>> Subject: 460 rear engine seal leaking?
>
>> engine oil pan, oil pump. Dropping cam 1/32" (sounds scarry to this
>> novice, does this 1/32" real make/break the repair), removal/replace
>> seal with new engine oil coated seal and put everything back
>> together.
>
>Don't know why the cam is involved but it's not especially easy if
>you've never messed with an engine before. Actually you need to drop
>the crank a tad not the cam? The cam cannot be "dropped 1/32" since
>it's in round bearings with no breaks in them and has no caps.
>
>The leak could be from one of the rear gallery plugs or intake
>manifold or valve covers so you need to take a good look at the back
>of the engine before tearing it down to make sure there is no other
>possibility.
>
>I've only worked on a few 460's and they have rubber seals with wire
>reinforcement which can be slid around with the crank and rotated out
>and back in by rotating the crank while applying force to the end of
>the seal being very careful no to scratch the crank. If the crank is
>chewed up where the seal goes you will be wasting your time to put in
>a new one since it will just get chewed up agian very quickly.
>
>The swift of foot and slow of wit
>have more off road experiences
>
>-- Gary --
>+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
>| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
>| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
>+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+
>
>







+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:32:58 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

just as easy, or haed, to put your truck on top of the 4x4 chassis!

sleddog

- ----------
From: Keith Srb[SMTP:herbie netvalue.net]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 1:20 PM
To: 'fordtrucks listservice.net'
Subject: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

If I could find a 74 4X4 Donor Truck, could I remove the Axles, Drives Shafts,
Transfer Case, Transmission and related hardware, would I be able to bolt them
onto my 74 2WD?

TTFN

Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"








+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:37:20 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: Spark Plugs

that the way it works. i am not sure if you can use differetnt wadher
thickness or not though. i have only heard of going through a lot of
plugs, usually with the head off the engine, or by marking the plug and
wreching untill you find the right one.,

sleddog

- ----------
From: Gary, 78 BBB[SMTP:gpeters3 ford.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 11:42 AM
To: bigbroncos off -road. com
Cc: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Spark Plugs

Speaking of spark plugs, I was just looking through my Jeggs catalog
and noticed the plug indexers again and was wondering if anyone has
ever fooled with that? Of course the Torque Masters would eliminate
that problem but how do they work? It looks to me like you buy a
couple of hundred plugs, fit them into the gauge and mark where they
wind up or something? Then you have to match them to the cylinders
based on the thread positions? Can't help it, I'm just danged
curious about every thing :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:56:02 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: lenco transmissions

i know i have the info somewhere, but it is probably at the bottom of the stack as i knew i never quit had the money to get one.
i'll look into it as soon as i can.

ever consider a clutch hooked to an auto trans? it is called the poor man's lenco!

sleddog

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:08:15 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: lenco transmissions

> From: Kevin Kemmerer
> Subject: lenco transmissions
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:56:02 -0400

> i know i have the info somewhere, but it is probably at the bottom
> of the stack as i knew i never quit had the money to get one. i'll
> look into it as soon as i can.
>
> ever consider a clutch hooked to an auto trans? it is called the
> poor man's lenco!

Wouldn't be pure stock then would it?

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:20:18 -0700
From: "Deacon Blues"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

>Don Grossman
>Is there any details o the 4x parts you might want to share. Like where
>is his yard!

Sure he mentioned Arlington in Riverside Ca. Now all you need to do is find
....


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