Return-Path:
Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:16:30 -0600 (MDT)
From: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks-digest)
To: fordtrucks-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks-digest V1 #202
Reply-To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Sender: owner-fordtrucks-digest ListService.net


fordtrucks-digest Monday, September 8 1997 Volume 01 : Number 202



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 And Older Trucks Digest
Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
To unsubscribe, send email to:
fordtrucks-digest-request listservice.net
with the word "unsubscribe" in the body of the message. For help, send
email to the same address with the word "help" in the body of the
message.
=======================================================================
In this issue:

Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["Deacon Blues" ]
Prices For New in '64-65? [Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)]
RE: Timing ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["George Shepherd" ]
Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking? ["John F. Bauer III"
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
RE: "tree forks" ranting [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: "tree forks" ranting [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: 460 for the '73 F100 [Kevin Kemmerer ]
RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking? [Kevin Kemmerer ]
Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking? ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 ["Deacon Blues" ]
Re: 460 for the '73 F100 [Don Grossman ]
Re: Prices For New in '64-65? [Don Grossman ]
2WD to 4WD Conversion [Keith Srb ]
RE: Prices For New in '64-65? [Keith Srb ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:08:15 -0700
From: "Deacon Blues"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

>What engine is in there now? The 460 takes the C-6, big block
>version and you will need L&lygtL mounts and passenger side truck
>manifold or headers to clear the frame and probably a larger radiator
>which you can leave in for both engines (I'd say).

My truck has a recently overhauled (not to be confused with rebuilt) 302
with an Autolite 2bbl, Ford shorty headers and duel exhaust. I have the
extra cooling radiator in it and think it will do. Sure wouldn't mind a
Griffin but they want me to pay for it! Go figure!

>Do you have a quick removeable front clip? I made one like that once
>and would like to do it for the bronco but the fenders fit under the
>cowl which make is rather clutsy IMHO for a tip up so it's on the
>back burner for now. Pull offs generally need two people and then
>you have to put it somewhere so I decided to stay away from that too.

When I overhauled the engine I removed the bumper, grill, radiator and
support! It was the way! Walk up to the engine and didn't need to drape this
40 year old gut over the fender. It took a little longer but worth it! It's
not on the same way now, so the front can come off! A tilt would be nice.
Home made fiberglass front clip wouldn't be to hard to do! A guy on the
fordnatics list made a hood for his Falcon.... You almost got me thinking.
Few years younger and I would have been doing it! But as far as the hood
goes. Can it be made to allow the hood to lay against the cab an use a post
to hold it up for tuning (as most cars are)!

>You've done that too? Ooooooooouuuuuuuuch! Me too :-(

I installed an electric fan! One benefit is not hearing that sound that
makes the most fearless of men jump, bashing the back of their heads into
the hood!

Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:12:37 -0700
From: Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)
Subject: Prices For New in '64-65?

Anybody know what a new '65 F100
sold for in 1964 or 65? I'm gathering info
on my '64 F100 CrewCab purchased
in 1965 by my dad, now owned by me!

- - Jeff '64 CrewCab
Grass Valley, California

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:18:17 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: RE: Timing

> From: Kevin Kemmerer
> Subject: RE: Timing
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:06:24 -0400

> an adjustable timing light alows you to dial in the degrees on the
> light so you really only look at the zero mark on the dampener.

Thanks, Kevin, I wonder how accurate they are? Some kind of chip has
to count pulses and make the compensation I presume?

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:26:14 -0500
From: "George Shepherd"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

Deacon,

Depending, you will need at least a set of motor mounts from L & L. Maybe a
oil pan and dip stick. Passenger side exhause manifold from truck. Again,
depending, a new bellhousing or c6 case.

- ----------
> From: Deacon Blues
> To: fordtrucks ListService.net
> Subject: 460 for the '73 F100
> Date: Monday, September 08, 1997 7:58 AM
>
> I was talking to a friend of a friend last night who has a 460 in his
> yard. He made a remark about giving it to me for my truck. I didn't rush
him
> on it but let him know I was interested in taking it off his hands! I
would
> like to build a quick swap engine that I could pop in for street legal
drags
> at Pamona Raceway. I've setup my engine so I can pull it relatively fast.
If
> I could setup the 460 the same way it could be an interesting alter-ego
for
> the F100! He has the 4x drive train to go with it. I would take it but I
> have no interest in owning another 4x. I could clean-up the gear and sell
it
> to finance the setup of the 460.
> Presently I have a C4 and 3.25s in a 9" rear. Among the parts I would
> need are motor mounts and a way to connect the exhaust. If the engine is
> complete what else would I need for this venture. I haven't seen the
engine
> so I don't know it's condition. The guy is a no BS Biker type and Tramps
> tend not to make offers to Tramps they aren't willing to keep. But high
> hopes are mother to disappoint, so I'm just kicking around the idea for
now!
> Later!
>
>
>
> Deacon Blues
> deconblu gte.net
> '73 F100 302
>
>
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
> | Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
> +-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:17:01 -0400
From: "John F. Bauer III"
Subject: Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

Sorry folks, ment to say crank, not cam, it just slipped out. The Ford
service manual seems to make it sound a bit easier than the feedback so far
has mentioned. Even if the oil pan/oil pump can be removed without engine
removal, is it safe to say it would be impossible to simply "slide" in this
new seal without really removing the trans. and inspecting the rear of the
engine for other potential leaks as Gary mentions? Asking this question to
see if I can just take a stab at the seal being the problem, if it is, quick
repair and back in business, if not, then go for the whole major removal and
inspection process and get ready for major time/expense/etc.

Thanks for the tips,
John "cutting corners with fingers crossed"

At 10:52 AM 9/8/97 +0000, you wrote:
>> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 10:09:53 -0400
>> From: "John F. Bauer III"
>> Subject: 460 rear engine seal leaking?
>
>> engine oil pan, oil pump. Dropping cam 1/32" (sounds scarry to this
>> novice, does this 1/32" real make/break the repair), removal/replace
>> seal with new engine oil coated seal and put everything back
>> together.
>
>Don't know why the cam is involved but it's not especially easy if
>you've never messed with an engine before. Actually you need to drop
>the crank a tad not the cam? The cam cannot be "dropped 1/32" since
>it's in round bearings with no breaks in them and has no caps.
>
>The leak could be from one of the rear gallery plugs or intake
>manifold or valve covers so you need to take a good look at the back
>of the engine before tearing it down to make sure there is no other
>possibility.
>
>I've only worked on a few 460's and they have rubber seals with wire
>reinforcement which can be slid around with the crank and rotated out
>and back in by rotating the crank while applying force to the end of
>the seal being very careful no to scratch the crank. If the crank is
>chewed up where the seal goes you will be wasting your time to put in
>a new one since it will just get chewed up agian very quickly.
>
>The swift of foot and slow of wit
>have more off road experiences
>
>-- Gary --
>+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
>| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
>| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
>+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:37:01 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

> From: "Deacon Blues"
> Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:08:15 -0700

> I installed an electric fan! One benefit is not hearing that sound
> that makes the most fearless of men jump, bashing the back of their
> heads into the hood!

But they can come on after the engine is shut off (on new vehicles
anyway) Ooooooouuuuuuch!

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:26:40 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: "tree forks" ranting

there are some good places, like pocono 4wd and ok 4wd in pa and jersey
respectively, but these places are not chains, and the owner is behind the
counter. the other employees do get paid more, but they actually know
something. many parts i need i don't know where they came from. for
example, my front dana 44 is from a 78 bronco, but the hubs/spindles etc.
are from something NOT bronco. the brake line that was on it was from a
different year bronco (how was i to know untill i saw both lines
together?). also, it is hard to get a non factory installed type part to
make something work that no-one else has done before. how do you ask for a
part "that will do this, looks like this, sort of - you know, to go here
with this part from this with maybe a little longer bolt or something?"

when they think they know what they are saying, it really gets me!
"this is the part for your truck - even the computer says so."
so, why the h*ll don't it fit or even look like the old part?
ford part#'s are not always accurate maybe?

it was a small rip in the gasket but i needed it ASAP and all other local
stores did not have in stock that day. they were also bent, dirty a little
and looked like someone had went to use them and then decided to take them
back. it was cork valve cover gaskets, but they did seal until recently.
this particular NAPA i have many problems with - but 20 min. away in
bangor pa is a napa that always treats me like i am their best constumer.
even referring me to places that have what i need (they even call the
place for me first!) and taking 2 hours to find that 25 cent part i need.
(NO PLACE ELSE seems to be willing to do this!)

don't get me wrong, there are good places - but more often than not, i run
into the dumbest of the dunb, or people who can't find a a carb gasket for
a standard bore holley without all the vehicle info.

sleddog

ps-these opinions are mine and mine only - noone elses who may carry this
post or otherwise electronically transmit it etc etc etc...
- ----------
From: Gary, 78 BBB[SMTP:gpeters3 ford.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 5:30 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Re: "tree forks" ranting

> From: Kevin Kemmerer
> Subject: "tree forks" ranting
> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 08:58:39 -0400

> these guys and girls have no clue! Now, even with a receipt at
> parts america, they won't replace my universal joint that broke
> because the part in their new box doesn't look like the broken part
> in my old box. but i haven't bought universals anywhere else since

I think it depends a lot on the specific store you go to. I like the
AutoZone store in Adrian and I like the NAPA store in Blissfield and
Murray's has lots of good stuff at good prices but you do need to
know what you're doing most of the time to get the right stuff in any
case. When I build a "Mutt" I try to remember where all the parts
came from and ask for that model rather than the one I'm getting it
for or if I find a part from a different model I like better I jott
it down so next time I can get that instead. I personally
wouldn't want to work for the wages they make and so don't expect
very much from them since I'm sure many of them move on to better
things and don't get too deeply involved in selling parts. What can
be irritating to me is when the owner doesn't know much but tries to
come off like he does. I quit going to one place because I got tired
of being insulted all the time. (when you experiment a lot you can
get labled a trouble maker :-))

> napa once gave me ripped gaskets, but refused to go back into the
> warhouse

The box was ripped or the gaskets? Just curious :-)

The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:45:52 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: "tree forks" ranting

that's why i always try to have the old part to put under their noses.

- ----------
From: Deacon Blues[SMTP:deconblu gte.net]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 10:10 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Re: "tree forks" ranting

Not in defense of auto part store employees but their intellectuals
compared to computer store counter jerks! Back to the subject. When I was
looking for valve seals for my truck I was told they needed to order them
every where I went. It turned out they were looking at valve guides. They
had over 100 seals in stock. Now I look at the screen when their looking up
my parts.


Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302







+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:44:27 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: 460 for the '73 F100

the c6 is beefier parts wise. i am not aware of the exzct differences..
holds more oil (i think)
an auto for drag racing is generally considered the best at a decent price.
lenco transmissions are THE BEST. manuals are more efficient, but more
inconsistant (human error). the stall converter also can be tailored to
the motor/weight/gears for better 0-60 and 1/8 mile times. unfortunatley,
the c-6 doesn't have many gear ratio options, and the 2nd gear band is the
weekest link. i have totally destroyed more than one hitting 2nd gear at
WOT too many times. if you use one, make sure it is the heavy duty band.
the c-6 uses power to turn though. i have heard estimates up 60hp but
usually around 40hp losses. (compare that with the 2 speed slush boxes of
GM fame, which i understand take 20 or less!)

GER makes very durable c6 tranneys for racing using kevlar clutches and
full roller bearings throughout. i recommend Amsoil synthetic ATF if you
run an auto and if you feel real eager, a remote oil filter.
GER also has a lifetime warrenty to fix the tranny, never costing more than
$180 dollars parts-labor.
(i am not affiliated with GER, just think they have a good product at a
very good price - 1/2 of places like B&M)

sleddog

oh, also, for quick swaps, if yuo use a cable shifter, an auto will swap
much easier and faster than a standard or even a auto with a column or
floor shifter.
.


- ----------
From: Deacon Blues[SMTP:deconblu gte.net]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 9:53 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

>a C6 tranny would help! i don't think even a built c4, (if the bolt
pattern would match?) can take the brute of a 460 in a heavy truck.
>sleddog

It has a C6 bolted to it but I'm counting it out. I believe some one
asked some time ago about replacing a C6 in their 4X with one from a 2X and
it was posted that the tail shaft was different. Is this correct? I would
like to switch both when doing this. It makes it quicker and easier than
just switching the engine. Out of curiosity what makes the C6 stronger?
Also
is an automatic the best for the application.




Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302









+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:52:14 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
Subject: RE: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

things can go wrong, and in a hurry (especially if you are in ahurry!)
yes, the crank must be dropped a little - don't forget to properly toque
the main caps again!!!!!
but it is not an undoable job for the weekend warrior. make sure you get
the proper torque specs and sequence for the main bearing caps! and be
sure to check everything else out while you are under there. like make
sure if you must drop the pump, that it still turns without jumps and
starts or better yet, look inside and take a peek. i would just spin it,
but then make sure you fill it with oil before assy it so it pumps right
away! chack out the pan for any bad stuff and clean it out real nice too.
the hardest part of the job may be getting the pan gasket back on right
and leak proof.

sleddog

- ----------
From: John F. Bauer III[SMTP:bauerjf ix.netcom.com]
Sent: Monday, September 08, 1997 10:09 AM
To: fordtrucks ListService.net
Subject: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

Group:

I recently noticing more and more engine oil leaking where the C6 bolts
onto
my 77 E250 460 (bottom where the bell housing meets engine "plate", hope
that explains it, can you tell I'm a novice?) In discussing this with
others who haven't seen my van, they immediately point to the rear engine
seal as the culprit. I've noticed when on an incline sloping towards the
front the engine, no noticible oil drips, when on an incliding sloping
towards the back of the engine, notice oil drips. Definitely notice loss
on
engine oil on the dip stick with no change in trans. oil level.

Is this rear seal the bad guy?

If so, checked the Ford service manual (thanks Cleveland Public Library
system!) and they list a procedure involving removal of engine oil pan, oil
pump. Dropping cam 1/32" (sounds scarry to this novice, does this 1/32"
real make/break the repair), removal/replace seal with new engine oil
coated
seal and put everything back together.

Is it really this easy or can things go wrong in a hurry?

Any advice someone could pass along to this novice would be greatly
appreciated!

John

77 E250 4WD 460, C6 custom
96 F150 2WD daily driver







+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1979 and Older --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks listservice.net, |
| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks-request listservice.net |
+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:57:06 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:17:01 -0400
> From: "John F. Bauer III"
> Subject: Re: 460 rear engine seal leaking?

> removing the trans. and inspecting the rear of the engine for other
> potential leaks as Gary mentions? Asking this question to see if I
> can just take a stab at the seal being the problem, if it is, quick
> repair and back in business, if not, then go for the whole major
> removal and inspection process and get ready for major
> time/expense/etc.

Doing the seal isn't a corner cutter, inspecting rear of the engine
could be. Isn't this in a van? Can't you look at the rear by taking
off the engine cover? Most of the gallery plugs should be visible
outside the bell housing as I recall and the manifold and valve
covers for sure.

In a PU this is a relatively easy thing to do but in a van dropping
the pan, dropping the pump into the pan and then getting a rear sump
pan off the crossmember can be a challenge. Then you still have to
get that pesky seal to rotate out without scratching the crank.


The swift of foot and slow of wit
have more off road experiences

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:13:36 -0700
From: "Deacon Blues"
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

>Depending, you will need at least a set of motor mounts from L & L. Maybe
a
>oil pan and dip stick. Passenger side exhause manifold from truck. Again,
>depending, a new bellhousing or c6 case.

It came from a truck so I didn't think about an oil pan or the exhaust
manifold. I could go with headers if that's the case. If the oil pan is
wrong then I'd need a oil pickup and God only knows what else! This is
starting to get ugly and it hasn't started yet! Why is it when ever I hear
free, I'm going broke

Thanks!



Deacon Blues
deconblu gte.net
'73 F100 302

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 09:35:01 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: 460 for the '73 F100

Deacon Blues wrote:
>
> I was talking to a friend of a friend last night who has a 460 in his
> yard. He made a remark about giving it to me for my truck. I didn't rush him
> on it but let him know I was interested in taking it off his hands! I would
> like to build a quick swap engine that I could pop in for street legal drags
> at Pamona Raceway. I've setup my engine so I can pull it relatively fast. If
> I could setup the 460 the same way it could be an interesting alter-ego for
> the F100! He has the 4x drive train to go with it. I would take it but I
> have no interest in owning another 4x. I could clean-up the gear and sell it
> to finance the setup of the 460.

> Deacon Blues
> deconblu gte.net
> '73 F100 302

Is there any details o the 4x parts you might want to share. Like where
is his yard!

- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net


63 Ford F-250 4x4 67' 390, t-98, Spicer 24, Dana 60, Dana 44

Phase 172: rebuild front suspension

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 09:44:50 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: Prices For New in '64-65?

CARVER, JEFFREY D wrote:
>
> Anybody know what a new '65 F100
> sold for in 1964 or 65? I'm gathering info
> on my '64 F100 CrewCab purchased
> in 1965 by my dad, now owned by me!
>
> - Jeff '64 CrewCab
> Grass Valley, California

I'm gona go over there and take a look at your truck one of these days.
If you see someone laying under it don't start shooting it's just me.
:)

A Crewcab would be an aftermarket build. To my knowlege Ford didn't
make a factory CrewCab in 64. I was thinking about making an extended
cab out of mine.
- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net


63 Ford F-250 4x4 67' 390, t-98, Spicer 24, Dana 60, Dana 44

Phase 172: rebuild front suspension

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:20:26 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: 2WD to 4WD Conversion

If I could find a 74 4X4 Donor Truck, could I remove the Axles, Drives Shafts,
Transfer Case, Transmission and related hardware, would I be able to bolt them
onto my 74 2WD?

TTFN

Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:16:22 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: RE: Prices For New in '64-65?

According to my AZ Registration, my 66 F100's original purchase price was
$2150. But then again, they did not take into consideration any options, or
lack of those options, for the Truck either.

Hope this helps.

TTFN

Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"....


To access the rest of this feature you must be a logged in Registered User Of Ford Truck Enthusiasts

Registration is free, easy and gives you access to more features.
If you are not registered, click here to register.
If you are already registered, you can login here.

If you are already logged in and are seeing this message, your web browser is blocking session cookies. Change your browser cookie settings to allow session cookies.




Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Policy - Jobs

This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. Ford is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.