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Please do not repost, forward or otherwise publish messages contained in these archives without consent from the respective author(s). These archives may not, in whole or part, be stored on any public retrieval system (FTP, web, gopher, newsgroup, etc.) by individuals or companies, without consent of the respective authors. From: owner-pre61-list-digest  ford-trucks.com (pre61-list-digest) To: pre61-list-digest ford-trucks.com Subject: pre61-list-digest V3 #383 Reply-To: pre61-list ford-trucks.com Sender: owner-pre61-list-digest ford-trucks.com Errors-To: owner-pre61-list-digest ford-trucks.com Precedence: bulk pre61-list-digest Thursday, December 30 1999 Volume 03 : Number 383 ======================================================================= Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1948 - 1948 truck and vans Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - To unsubscribe, send email to: majordomo ford-trucks.com with the words "unsubscribe pre61-list-digest" in the body of the message. ======================================================================= In this issue: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine FTE Pre61 - oil & coolant FTE Pre61 - old motor, found inert FTE Pre61 - Stuff Re: FTE Pre61 - voting on the new list FTE Pre61 - REPLY To Kreig Re: FTE Pre61 - Synchronizer for 3-speed transm. of a 1949 F-1 truck Re: FTE Pre61 - 4 speed trans Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine Re: FTE Pre61 - 1952 F-1 Trailer Hitch ======================================================================= ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 06:21:40 -0500 From: "Joe Michels" Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine Kreig-- So sorry to hear that you are struggling to get your truck started. I think that everyone on the net has had frustration at one time or another---- reading and watching these posts sometimes gives you an idea of "where to go next" if you have not done this before. When I was working on mine, the truck would not start!!!!! I did everything, fuel pump, carb, gas line/tank, points, plug, condensor, rotor, belts, rebuilt the starter--- everything--- and still, no fire!!! I knew that I had gas, air and spark. FINALLY, after LOTS of frustration and REAL CHOICE WORDS-- I told the guys in my office about it. One guy said, "Did you take the distributor out?" I said, "Sure, I had to put the points in," He said, "There is your problem-- get to Top Dead Center on #1 cylinder and see where the rotor is (should point at #1 plug wire on the distributor cap)---- I did that and found that I was pointed at #4--- I had inadvertently reversed the distributor--- it was firing on the exhaust stroke, not the compression stroke--- changed the distributor 180 degrees just turned the rotor with the distributor out), put it back in and VIOLA-- we had IGNITION!!!! It only took 3 months to do so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Trust me, we ALL sympathize with you on this endeavor-- this list is hear to give you all kinds of ideas---- maybe someone close to you in Western Washington will come over and give a look--- Don't get discouraged-- this is part of the process!!! Joebob - ----- Original Message ----- From: Kreig McBride To: Sent: Thursday, December 30, 1999 1:58 AM Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > Oh. Some one recommended I tap the pistons. Guess that option isn't an > option. > This internet thing isn't so good. Now everyone in the whole world knows how > much of a dummy I am. > > Kreig > -----Original Message----- > From: sam fugate > To: pre61-list ford-trucks.com > Date: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 5:03 PM > Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > > > >Hey Kreig, > >How are you tapping the top of the pistons with the heads still on the > >engine? > >The flathead engines valves are directly under the spark plug holes (well, > >almost) not the pistons. The only way to tap the pistons is to remove the > >heads. > >Just a little input. > >Sam in Mount Sterling > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: Kreig McBride > >To: > >Cc: > >Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 5:27 PM > >Subject: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > > > > > >> OK Ok OK > >> Heres the plan with the Ford Flathead V8 > >> I will fill all cylinders to the top with a penetrating liquid. > >> I will gently tap on the piston tops with a wood or soft brass rod to > >> "loosen" the pistons. > >> I will continue to try and rotate the engine using one of several very > >> gentle methods as recommended. > >> When all else fails I will remove the heads and have a look-see. > >> > >> Towing the truck to rotate the engine is not an option. > >> > >> I was hoping to get the engine running and avoid a rebuild but we will > >see. > >> > >> Thanks for all of the help. > >> > >> Kreig in Bellingham > >> > >> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > >> > > > >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > > > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 09:09:52 -0500 From: "Sheldon Rier" Subject: FTE Pre61 - oil & coolant Hi All neither of these questions relates to pre 61's but you are a smart bunch so....... Question A) - ~1970 302 in truck I bought recently that hadn't been ran for long in years thermostat didn't seem to be opening - went to replace tstat & found the thermostat housing and nearby hoses totally plugged with something that looks like cheese - is so tough that the power washer wouldn't loosen it until most of it was loosened with screwdriver - what is it, how did it get there, where else is it likely to be & how do you get rid of it????? Question 2) our one work truck is an old tired 88 F150 with equally tired 302 but still runs/drives OK - oil pressure is very low especially when hot - in the cold weather would we be better to run 5w or 10w oil to insure lubrication on start up or a heavier oil that helps maintain oil pressure when it gets to operating temp Happy New Year Sheldon Ontario, Canada P.S. - I encourage everyone to participate in the FTE charity drive - when I think of the time & money saved through info learned on this list a small donation seems like a bargain-THANKS KEN! == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 10:06:40 -0500 From: 47Fred Subject: FTE Pre61 - old motor, found inert Kreig McBride wrote: > > > I was hoping to get the engine running and avoid a rebuild but we will see. A seized engine is of course one of the most nasty things in the world, and can range from a minor annoyance to major catastrophe. As can be seen from this little series with Mr. McB, everybody has an opinion and, as in most things, there is no one way to set the matter to rights. Second, it's darned hard to second guess what someone running a computer e-mail program has, or is, actually doing to the vehicle, a key bit of information always seems to get lost in the process. follows now the Fred plan: Any vehicle that has a unknown history and has set for more than a few weeks should be approached as if it were frozen stiff until proven otherwise. It should also be assumed that the points are corroded, the clutch is stuck and the carburetor is full of aluminum goo. Step one: rotate the engine by the fan or by the front crank pulley to establish it will turn all the way around, at least one full turn.. Throwing in a battery and wanging the starter into a dead stuck flywheel may well add to your grief. I do this first, 'cause it's the most fun, also if it won't turn, it saves me a lot of prep. work. Step two: pull all the plugs, look for rust and smashed electrodes. Carbon and crud are normal, rust and collision damage are not. (Won't turn plus busted electrode equals broken something.) Step Three: Inspect the points, fuel line and fuel filter bowls, if the bowl and fuel line is full of crud, the carburetor probably is also. Points can be cleaned with a paper matchbook striker, and the matchbook cover makes a good gauge to gap a point set also. Ok, so it won't turn over, if the plugs are not rusty, it's probably not bad, type F automatic transmission fluid into the cylinders, or if you feel flush, Marvel Mystery Oil, but the ATF is just as good, if not better. At least 4 teaspoons, (sounds like Mom?) in every hole. Let the ATF soak at least overnight, and try working the motor with the biggest wrench you can fit onto the crank, a chain wrench or a pipe wrench works if there is no nut. Don't use things like brake fluid, fuel oil, or anything else incompatible with motor oil. Don't forget that a frozen lifer can stop up the whole works too. If the plugs are clean, pop the manifold, and check the cam system. If the plugs had rust in them, hold your nose and plan on pulling the motor, or at least the heads, it's probably toast. A motor full of rust is probably never going to run again with any degree of reliability, even if the thing can be fired, you can bet the rings will be stuck, the cylinders pitted and the whole mess will be full of abrasive iron powder. The valve seats may be shot and the valves ruined or stuck in the bargain. I once did this to a 292, first a stuck valve head broke off and split a piston like a meat ax, then the main bearings let go to the point that the crank sawed the rear main seal retainer in half. Since I only gave $10 for the motor, I wasn't real heartbroken, that's when the 312 went in, but that's another story. Once a SALVAGEABLE motor is free, and the points, clutch and fuel system are in good order, I always mix up a batch of fresh gas with about 2 ounces per gallon of ATF, a littler stronger if I suspect a totally dry engine. My '57 spends a good deal of its time in the barn these days, I run it about once a year, but it always gets a fix of gas/ATF, smokes like heck, but its doing all the moving parts exposed to fuel good. Don't forget the oil either, a fresh charge and a new filter BEFORE you start it, and quick compression check (just a finger in every hole works, if it doesn't suck and blow, watch out) will let you know if there is a stuck valve. 47Fred == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 15:11:11 EST From: FiftySevenF100 aol.com Subject: FTE Pre61 - Stuff Howard - Great looking truck. Makes the new ones look like the paint was toweled on. Way, WAy, WAY out of my league financially! Krieg - look on the bright side - at least your not sharing with the world how you cracked a flathead block! Glenn in TN == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 17:19:16 EST From: JRFiero aol.com Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - voting on the new list In a message dated 12/19/1999 6:51:24 AM Eastern Standard Time, jniolon wans.net writes: > Why have only 52 people voted ??? - - Because its the wrong question. Should instead be a carefully worded question about allowing limited discussion of non-Ford parts. - - Because numerous of us, I bet, never (almost never) go to the website. I just did, it took me an inordinate amount of time to find the 'voting' area, and even then I didn't vote, 'cause of response 1 above. - - Because we don't know what a 'No' vote means. I don't think there should be separate list, but that's because 1) I get too much mail from various lists already, and 2) I don't think the valid Ford content and experience of those who have non-Ford engines should be removed from the lists I do pay attention to (or, to which I do pay attention). So a 'no' vote could mean all that, or it could mean I don't want to hear about non-Ford stuff. - - Therefore, I'm not voting. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 17:22:05 EST From: VegmanOCF aol.com Subject: FTE Pre61 - REPLY To Kreig In a message dated 12/30/1999 2:52:01 AM Pacific Standard Time, owner-pre61-list-digest ford-trucks.com writes: > Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 14:27:02 -0800 > From: "Kreig McBride" > Subject: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > > OK Ok OK > Heres the plan with the Ford Flathead V8 > I will fill all cylinders to the top with a penetrating liquid. > I will gently tap on the piston tops with a wood or soft brass rod to > "loosen" the pistons. > I will continue to try and rotate the engine using one of several very > gentle methods as recommended. > When all else fails I will remove the heads and have a look-see. > > Towing the truck to rotate the engine is not an option. > > I was hoping to get the engine running and avoid a rebuild but we will see. > > Thanks for all of the help. > > Kreig in Bellingham > Kreig, the spark plug hole is not directly over the piston, so you won't be able to 'tap' on the piston through the spark plug hole. I'd advise saving yourself a lot of trouble (and expense) by pulling the heads and checking out the problem before you make things worse. Flatheads that have been sitting a long time often develop rust between the valves and valve guides, causing the engine to lockup. Forcing it to turn may well result in stripping the teeth off the cam gear, breaking the camshaft, bending valves, etc. You might want to just pull the intake manifold and look at the intake valves and see if the stems are covered with rust. Good luck. Phillip == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 17:23:32 EST From: JRFiero aol.com Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Synchronizer for 3-speed transm. of a 1949 F-1 truck In a message dated 12/19/1999 4:51:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, pierre.yves.leduc DMI.USherb.CA writes: > Hi! I am looking for a synchronizer for the 3-speed transmission of my 1949 > F-1 pickup truck. Actually, the parts I realy need (if they could be found > and/or http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.earthlink.net/~dwentz - Dan used to have a tranny from his '50 (think its a '50) free. Only he knows how bad a condition it's in ... == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 17:28:59 EST From: JRFiero aol.com Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - 4 speed trans In a message dated 12/20/1999 12:30:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, billyrob digitalexp.com writes: > I'm looking for a 4 speed trans to put in my '50 F-1. > Is a 4 speed interchangable w/ the stock 3 speed? > I assume you know already, but the 4-spd from '50 is a fully crashbox - no sychros at all. When I was young and foolish, I put a 4-spd in my '52 and was then horrified by the noise and shifting. Interestingly enough, I believe in '52 there was a synchro 4-spd, so mine was probably a '51 or earlier. But interchangeable, yes, as long as its from a little truck. My first attempt at a 4-spd was a monster out of some school bus or something, no way it was going to fit. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 17:35:30 -0800 From: sainey impop.bellatlantic.net Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine I doubt you could consider yourself to be a dummy. Anyone who is working on an old truck has to expect a lot of trial and error/hit and miss no matter what the experience level of the individual. I'm a certified auto mechanic and you should have been around when I rebuilt the rear axle in my 39. I ended up swapping the axle housings around three times after I put it back in the truck till I finally figured out what was going on. When you read the manuals on these old trucks, there's so many things that the writers automatically thought you knew (including the valves are under the sparkplug hole on a flathead). The only option for us is to try and figure out what's going on and when you can't, get on the list and ask. Everyone here is more than willing to help, even if you think it is something foolish. Everyone has to start somewhere. And if anyone ever needs to know how to rebuild a banjo axle rear end. I can give them explicit instructions on what not to do. :) Steve 39 1/2 ton Hopped up Flathead Kreig McBride wrote: > Oh. Some one recommended I tap the pistons. Guess that option isn't an > option. > This internet thing isn't so good. Now everyone in the whole world knows how > much of a dummy I am. > > Kreig > -----Original Message----- > From: sam fugate > To: pre61-list ford-trucks.com > Date: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 5:03 PM > Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > > >Hey Kreig, > >How are you tapping the top of the pistons with the heads still on the > >engine? > >The flathead engines valves are directly under the spark plug holes (well, > >almost) not the pistons. The only way to tap the pistons is to remove the > >heads. > >Just a little input. > >Sam in Mount Sterling > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: Kreig McBride > >To: > >Cc: > >Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 5:27 PM > >Subject: FTE Pre61 - Re: still trying to start truck engine > > > > > >> OK Ok OK > >> Heres the plan with the Ford Flathead V8 > >> I will fill all cylinders to the top with a penetrating liquid. > >> I will gently tap on the piston tops with a wood or soft brass rod to > >> "loosen" the pistons. > >> I will continue to try and rotate the engine using one of several very > >> gentle methods as recommended. > >> When all else fails I will remove the heads and have a look-see. > >> > >> Towing the truck to rotate the engine is not an option. > >> > >> I was hoping to get the engine running and avoid a rebuild but we will > >see. > >> > >> Thanks for all of the help. > >> > >> Kreig in Bellingham > >> > >> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > >> > > > >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > > > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 18:52:58 EST From: JRFiero aol.com Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - 1952 F-1 Trailer Hitch In a message dated 12/26/1999 8:32:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, shark4 pop.dn.net writes: > It looks like > the stock rear bumper will support pulling a medium-sized > trailer, When I think back to the ungodly loads I pulled with the welded-on hitch on the bumper of my '52 panel, I shudder. But nothing ever went wrong, scared myself with the braking effort, and undoubtedly shortened the clutch life, but the bumper and brackets held up nicely. Me and my ruddy brown primer '52 towed my white and rust '56 Karmen Ghia autocross car all over the place. Ripped the center out of the clutch disc coming into a toll booth on route 95 in CT, just waved and drove right through (wouldn't disengage). Had to discuss this with the State Troopers when I managed to get to the side of the road. They left; I unhitched the Karmen Ghia and drove it to Long.... To access the rest of this feature you must be a logged in Registered User Of Ford Truck Enthusiasts
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