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Subject: perf-list-digest V2 #278
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perf-list-digest Friday, October 29 1999 Volume 02 : Number 278



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - Performance
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In this issue:

Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - Crate Engines
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - Tire sze change.
Re: FTE Perf - Door seals
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
FTE Perf - Rocker styles ...
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
Re: FTE Perf - Crate Engines
Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 07:26:27 EDT
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

hey man... the P.I. head is a totally different casting than the smog
head... deeper pockets in the exhaust ports. larger intake ports...... still
in my eye.. after the costs of machine work to accept screw in studs and
guideplates... and pop ups to get away from the insulting 8:1 compression.
its much more senseable to purchase a pair of older castings and work with
them...
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 07:29:04 EDT
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

ohh by the way the intake ports on a early head compared to your JUNK d3ve
smog heads do have slight changes... and by the way... i know this.. i race
big block fords and have done alot of head porting and flow testing on all of
the castings.
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 08:37:49 -0400
From: "Gerald Ash"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Well most of us have to work with what we have, it's too late to start to
look when the vehicle is down and you have to show to work the next morning.
However in that attitude the camshaft makers know about street heads and
have made the new dual pattern camshafts that actually work great with the
small valves and exhaust restrictions. That is the fastest and cheapest
route and you have a great engine. It's ok to have the old castings when
you have a custom car that you don't drive often and then baby it but most
of us need something that can be replaced when it breaks fast. Just my
opinion. YES HP COST thats the pits.
- ----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?


> hey man... the P.I. head is a totally different casting than the smog
> head... deeper pockets in the exhaust ports. larger intake ports......
still
> in my eye.. after the costs of machine work to accept screw in studs and
> guideplates... and pop ups to get away from the insulting 8:1 compression.
> its much more senseable to purchase a pair of older castings and work with
> them...
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 09:12:07 -0400
From: Greg Carter
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Crate Engines

At a RESONABLE price, I don't think so :), at least not a performance
engine.

Try http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com was the best prices I could find for
performance crate engines when I looked a month or so ago. I have no idea
as to quality etc, but all the parts seem right.

Greg Carter
Entrust Technologies - http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.entrust.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com/articles/buildup/dana60.html


- -----Original Message-----
From: James Krehmke [mailto:krehmkej worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 10:41 PM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Crate Engines


Ford, who else?

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Shade
To: perf
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 7:12 PM
Subject: FTE Perf - Crate Engines


> Who markets a good 351W or a 302 crate engine for a reasonable price?
>
> later
>
> dan
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 08:26:31 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

> The one I have was my dads High school car, then work bench.
> Body is a lil
> rough, but theres no rust and only 47k miles on it!
>

Must really suck to live in a rust free environment ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 08:32:54 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Tire sze change.

> Is there any problem you know of
> putting a P275/60R15 tire on a 9 inch rim?

Since most of the Mustang crowd is shoving 275/40/17's on their 9" rims, I
don't think you'll have a problem putting a taller tire with the same
section width on the 9" rims ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 20:19:33 -0700
From: "James D"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Door seals

Update on those door seals, I went to the junk yard for a heater switch,
alternator bracket and side view mirror when I stumpled upon an 88 ford van
with seals that where in near perfect condition. I have been scraping off
the old ones and preppin for the new ones. You know that old saying "They
don't make em like the used to"? Well when I pulled the seals off the 88 I
just pulled em off. I had to work at it in like 4 places on the entire van
to get them off in one piece. When I pulled them off of my van, they where a
big pain in the butt. They kept breaking off in small pieces, and the
bottoms of them are "one" with the van itself. I am almost positive that the
seals off the 88 were aftermarket seals. They were attached with regular
house weatherstripping (Double sided tape), which is why the came off so
easily. Is that how ford put on there seals on the newer ones? The ones on
my 79 looked like they had been glued on. But then again, there was quite a
bit of rust that came off with the seals on the 88 as I was removing them so
it looked like they had been there for awhile.
Would be kinda nice if this was a truck. I would have two doors to deal
with instead of seals for 5 :). BTW, if you want to see a pic of my 351W
right before it went into my van go here
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.enol.com/~myph/engine.jpg . My first engine rebuild and it runs
like a charm. I built it stock except I went up to 8.9 to 1 compression on
the pistons and I got a RV cam. It can usually keep up with most any
non-high performance car on the road, which isint to bad considering it's
always pulling around 5500 pounds. If I where to put it in a light weight
stang it would move.

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 11:32:05 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Pop ups, are not required. a flat top single eyebrow will do fine. The
police heads I have ever seen are either one of 2 styles. A cj head, or a
base head with larger valves.

I don't remember who was asking in the first place, but he said the block
and the heads was about all of the stock engine he would use if i remember
correctly. Well, then he'd be doing the machine work to the heads anyway
and getting new valves and springs etc. So transforming a late head into
adjustable valvetrain is not a big deal. Also, I have used the Crane
conversion from pedastal mounts with no problmes occuring yet. (Though I
don't like that they hide the head bolts.) I generally run bigger than the
average cam too.

Also, running a small popup piston is not a big deal if you need to get
into the high 11's or 12's of compression. Sure, you loose a tiny bit of
combustion efficiency, but that is so minimal it doesn't matter on a street
engine. As for the extra weight - no big deal unless you plan on really
twisting it tail hard, like over 6500 rpm.

Everyone wants the early head, but reality is you spend more, to work less,
to get the same result. not including the CJ heads of course.

Also, If you get a really early head, with the cast rail rockers - toss em!
I don't trust them. Stamped steel rockers will wear through, but cast
iron cracks. And with only a rail t guide the rocker over the valve tip,
more problems can arise.

Kevin

- ----------
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM[SMTP:Bogginf350 AOL.COM]
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 7:26 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

hey man... the P.I. head is a totally different casting than the smog
head... deeper pockets in the exhaust ports. larger intake ports......
still
in my eye.. after the costs of machine work to accept screw in studs and
guideplates... and pop ups to get away from the insulting 8:1 compression.
its much more senseable to purchase a pair of older castings and work with
them...
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 11:45:47 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

OK,
Tell me the changes between my late heads and my early heads in the ports.
And while you are at it, I would appreciatte if you could show me some
flow results, as I am very interested. Please indicate test pressure and
flow bench brand, model.

There might be slight differences that i never found, but noone will ever
feel that in the seat of their pants. I have built many 460's and found
that I save money by using the later heads, and still get the same
performance.

They have all culminated with my current pull truck engine.
You can find details on that engine here:

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/7273/page5.htm

This engine is 521 cubes. It has a roller cam that according to Ultradyne
is a nice street motor cam for that many cubes. But, it is good enough,
from their info, and from mine and freinds experience including some dyno
motors, and 2 different computer simulations for a healthy 850 hp at the
crank with no acceseries. I have room for a Ultradyne prostock sized cam
in this build. That is, basically clearance for over .800 lift cams.

kevin


- ----------
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM[SMTP:Bogginf350 AOL.COM]
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 7:29 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

ohh by the way the intake ports on a early head compared to your JUNK d3ve
smog heads do have slight changes... and by the way... i know this.. i race
big block fords and have done alot of head porting and flow testing on all
of
the castings.
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 11:10:08 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: FTE Perf - Rocker styles ...

Okay folks, here's one for ya, I know text is cool and all, but does anyone
have pics of the differences between shaft and rail rockers ? I think I
understand it, but pics would be really helpful in this case ... just want
to make sure I'm getting everything right in my head ...


Thanks

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 10:40:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: canzus seanet.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

At 08:37 AM 28:10:99 -0400, Gerald Ash wrote:
>Well most of us have to work with what we have, it's too late to start to
>look when the vehicle is down and you have to show to work the next morning.
>However in that attitude the camshaft makers know about street heads and
>have made the new dual pattern camshafts that actually work great with the
>small valves and exhaust restrictions. That is the fastest and cheapest
>route and you have a great engine. It's ok to have the old castings when
>you have a custom car that you don't drive often and then baby it but most
>of us need something that can be replaced when it breaks fast. Just my
>opinion. YES HP COST thats the pits.

An easier way to put it is "How fast do you want to spend". My former
'57 F100 was fast, but had absolutely no bottom end torque. It ran mid
to high 13's, ate clutches on a regular basis because I had to leave at
4000rpm slipping the clutch. You get real good at changing clutches when
you do it twice a year, but OH WHAT FUN WE HAD!!

Steve & the Rockette
63 F100
72 Capri 2000, hers
73 Capri 2600, needs tube frame...
73 MGB GT, Our Toy
94 SHO, SWMBO's
97 Contour, Mine

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 11:21:01 -0700
From: "O'Connell, Dennis M"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

SLEDDOG,

If I remember correctly from some earlier posts your developing some
significant HP and very significant revs(for a Ford Big block) with the
engines you build. Mine sharing that info again?

Dennis
55F100

> ----------
> From: Sleddog[SMTP:kevkem epix.net]
> Reply To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 8:45 AM
> To: 'perf-list ford-trucks.com'
> Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
>
> OK,
> Tell me the changes between my late heads and my early heads in the ports.
>
> And while you are at it, I would appreciatte if you could show me some
> flow results, as I am very interested. Please indicate test pressure and
> flow bench brand, model.
>
> There might be slight differences that i never found, but noone will ever
> feel that in the seat of their pants. I have built many 460's and found
> that I save money by using the later heads, and still get the same
> performance.
>
> They have all culminated with my current pull truck engine.
> You can find details on that engine here:
>
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/7273/page5.htm
>
> This engine is 521 cubes. It has a roller cam that according to Ultradyne
>
> is a nice street motor cam for that many cubes. But, it is good enough,
> from their info, and from mine and freinds experience including some dyno
> motors, and 2 different computer simulations for a healthy 850 hp at the
> crank with no acceseries. I have room for a Ultradyne prostock sized cam
> in this build. That is, basically clearance for over .800 lift cams.
>
> kevin
>
>
> ----------
> From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM[SMTP:Bogginf350 AOL.COM]
> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 7:29 AM
> To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
>
> ohh by the way the intake ports on a early head compared to your JUNK d3ve
> smog heads do have slight changes... and by the way... i know this.. i
> race
> big block fords and have done alot of head porting and flow testing on all
>
> of
> the castings.
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 00:49:46 -0700
From: "James D"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Ok, Im the guy who originally asked the question. So 71 or earlier,
correct? But only if I don't buy after market heads? Then it don't matter?

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 18:24:46 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Sure Dennis,
What do you want to know? I'll tell just about anything. Most of the info
is at my long-due-for-an-update website. Some info has changed, like the
carb next time it runs will be a holley dominator that flows 1225 wet CFM,
with alcohol seats and many small tricks. Just ask, and you shall receive.

Kevin

- ----------
From: O'Connell, Dennis M[SMTP:DMO1 pge.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 2:21 PM
To: 'perf-list ford-trucks.com'
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

SLEDDOG,

If I remember correctly from some earlier posts your developing some
significant HP and very significant revs(for a Ford Big block) with the
engines you build. Mine sharing that info again?

Dennis
55F100


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 18:38:16 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

I don't want to confuse the issue any, but what are you looking for as the
final stage of the build? How much power, reliabilty, $$$, equals what you
want. There is a point where an early head can be a better buy. That
would be, if you are just bolting a set of clean heads onto a motor to ge
tthe higher compression ratio.

If, you are starting from scratch amd buying all new valves/springs/etc,
getting the seats cut, and decking the block and heads/intake flat after
porting and/or port matching, you really don't need the earlier heads as if
you are going this far, you must be getting new pistons. Now, you are
paying for all the machining costs and piston price already, so to make the
same compression with either set of heads, costs the same outside the
higher price of the early heads since everybody wants them.

If you want 700 hp, may as well forget the ford heads, and buy some Blue
Thunder heads, or at least the SVO aluminum CJ heads. But you will still
need porting work to make that power, but at least it will be easier than
trying to do it with the ford cast iron heads, even the CJ head. The cost
or time of porting cast iron is up to 2 times that for aluminum.

If 500 real HP is all you want, the late base head with big valves and a
mild port and normal sized cam with under 10:1 compression is realistic and
very streetable with a very broad torque curve. Ever since i did my low
compression build, I have been amazed at the power that a low compression
motor can make, even compared to my 11.5:1 builds. My puller engine is
down at "only" 12.3:1. That is low compared to some other peoples similiar
builds at 13.5:1.

Kevin

- ----------
From: James D[SMTP:myph enol.com]
Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 3:49 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Ok, Im the guy who originally asked the question. So 71 or earlier,
correct? But only if I don't buy after market heads? Then it don't matter?

== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 18:42:22 -0400
From: "Gerald Ash"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

Yep, you got it James and if you want to sell the cast iorn intake manifold
for a 1965-70 engine I will purchase it as I have one engine that I am
finishing to go in a show car and it had an alum intake.to be original they
have to know it's a stock peice of that year modle. So there we go and here
we are. I have sent bunches to the dump in the past.......
Also when you are thinking of a rebuild the older the block casting usually
the better it is as it's seasoned, the sand is out of it and it contracts
and expands better than newer cast. There is a bow tie builder up here that
purchases engines, takes the guts out and throws them in the back yard for a
year or so before he reclaims them to do a total rebuild............food for
thought.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James D
To:
Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 3:49 AM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?


> Ok, Im the guy who originally asked the question. So 71 or earlier,
> correct? But only if I don't buy after market heads? Then it don't
matter?
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 05:17:00 -0700
From: "James D"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

What I want is
#1. Durability - I don't want to have a blown engine if I decide to floor
it:)
#2. Horsepower - As much for staying totaly reliable but to be realistic
about cost - I would plan on spending around 3 or 4 grand.
#3. Gas milage - I know a 460 has terrible milage, but to stay as high as
possible. That is why I was thinking high compression.
#4. It has GOT to be street legal. It would probably be an everyday driver.
#5. I would probably hook up an nitrous kit to it for an extra 150 - 200 HP
when I need it.

What do you think I could do to stay within these guidelines.

Thanks again

I just got my CompCams catalog in the mail.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Sleddog
To:
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 3:38 PM
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?


> I don't want to confuse the issue any, but what are you looking for as the
> final stage of the build? How much power, reliabilty, $$$, equals what
you
> want. There is a point where an early head can be a better buy. That
> would be, if you are just bolting a set of clean heads onto a motor to ge
> tthe higher compression ratio.
>
> If, you are starting from scratch amd buying all new valves/springs/etc,
> getting the seats cut, and decking the block and heads/intake flat after
> porting and/or port matching, you really don't need the earlier heads as
if
> you are going this far, you must be getting new pistons. Now, you are
> paying for all the machining costs and piston price already, so to make
the
> same compression with either set of heads, costs the same outside the
> higher price of the early heads since everybody wants them.
>
> If you want 700 hp, may as well forget the ford heads, and buy some Blue
> Thunder heads, or at least the SVO aluminum CJ heads. But you will still
> need porting work to make that power, but at least it will be easier than
> trying to do it with the ford cast iron heads, even the CJ head. The cost
> or time of porting cast iron is up to 2 times that for aluminum.
>
> If 500 real HP is all you want, the late base head with big valves and a
> mild port and normal sized cam with under 10:1 compression is realistic
and
> very streetable with a very broad torque curve. Ever since i did my low
> compression build, I have been amazed at the power that a low compression
> motor can make, even compared to my 11.5:1 builds. My puller engine is
> down at "only" 12.3:1. That is low compared to some other peoples
similiar
> builds at 13.5:1.
>
> Kevin
>
> ----------
> From: James D[SMTP:myph enol.com]
> Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 3:49 AM
> To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?
>
> Ok, Im the guy who originally asked the question. So 71 or earlier,
> correct? But only if I don't buy after market heads? Then it don't
matter?
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 19:45:59 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

I would say, that not including nitrous, a real 500-550 hp is there for
that cost, and that includes a total rebuild bottom to top keeping it
streetable and reliable. Toss on 200 hp of nitrous and you are gonna be
asking for some shrapnel unless you spend more. The cast iron crank should
take that amount, but the stock rods are worthless at that kind of power
level. So, yes realistically for that cost you can have a nice runner like
you want, but that nitrous is scary on stock rods.

A hydraulic cam will get you there, and even at a low 9:1 compression you
can get there. For what it is worth, my low compression build i was able
to run ALL the time, on and off the track on the worst gas around with no
problems. That lower price helps the wallet go a little further. The
higher compression might get better mileage at low loads, but will that
make up for the cost difference between 92 and 87 octane?

My 11.5:1 motor liked the good gas.

The CJ heads probobly won't do you much good, but the base head with the PI
size or CJ saize valves in would do great at that level. And for nitrous I
would definatly consider the bigger valves.

I would plan on doing another build after you pump 200 hp of nitrous
through it though. Eagle has a set for the BB ford, but that takes up more
money you could spend on a better intake and bigger valves and machine
work. The eagles though, cost almost half of the really good rods like
Oliver or Crower.

Kevin

- ----------
From: James D[SMTP:myph enol.com]
Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 8:17 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

What I want is
#1. Durability - I don't want to have a blown engine if I decide to floor
it:)
#2. Horsepower - As much for staying totaly reliable but to be realistic
about cost - I would plan on spending around 3 or 4 grand.
#3. Gas milage - I know a 460 has terrible milage, but to stay as high as
possible. That is why I was thinking high compression.
#4. It has GOT to be street legal. It would probably be an everyday driver.
#5. I would probably hook up an nitrous kit to it for an extra 150 - 200 HP
when I need it.

What do you think I could do to stay within these guidelines.

Thanks again



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:05:37 EDT
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

have you ever even looked at the different castings to compare them? ever
seen the alum. prototype early ford heads for nascar? i am running the true
P.I heads on my truck right now. also have a set of the cj castings that i
ran last year with a cam motions roller cam. i will retrieve the results from
the flow bench. which jay riddle racing in morton il. flow tested. please
argue on... and tell me more about your juice cam, insulting compression,
overheating pull truck motor.
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:10:37 EDT
From: JUMPINFORD AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

In a message dated 10/28/99 6:06:46 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
Bogginf350 AOL.COM writes:


overheating pull truck motor. >>

Alright, this has gone a lil overboard I think. Lets save this for arguing
with the Bow-Tie guys.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:31:24 EDT
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

ok, all the guy asked was....... he was going to purchase an (so called)
early ford motor..... and to keep him from getting ripped off I told him the
casting numbers of the more desireable heads and the common smog heads that
you can purchase for a dime a dozen... i would like to leave this subject
with this again for reference....look for a casting number
c8ve-c
c9ve-c
dove-c
dove-a
these are all the smaller chamber bb heads
dooe-r is the cj-scj casting
d2oe-ab is the P.I. casting
d2 + d3ve-a2a are junk.....
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 22:25:55 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

I didn't insult your ride, lay off mine. I built it. Noone really cares
about the early prototype NASCAR heads anyway. That technology is extinct.
The new SVO prostock and hemi heads are good parts, but affording them is
not easy. So, my truck overheats. You ever build something from almost
ALL USED PARTS?? Ever run a block that is concreted to the water hole??
Ever run electric H2O pumps? Ever know you can make it work and will, but
haven't yet? I am damn proud of the job I did (that's ME, yes ME, I built
it, I used my fingers to put the assembly lube on the bearings, I used MY
arms to torque MY rod bolts and chose the componants to use MYSELF.)
Machine work I can't do without machines, but if i had them i'd have done
all that MYSELF too.

Some friends of mine, built a new motor last year, comparable to mine but
more cubes and a bit more cam. Theirs, ended up in pieces after 2 runs.
Mine, is still together.

So, exactly what, makes the compression insulting? too low?? too high??
And what exactly is a "juice cam"?? I am taking it as an insult, since
you seem to be on that track.

I am getting bored of this already, but please, email me off-list if you
want to continue. I do prefer to learn and teach instead of insult and
argue. I asked you a question on your statements about the differences in
the intake ports of the early and late castings. I have not found them,
and yes, i compared. So, tell me if you may. If you have some knowledge
to teach me, I will listen with an open mind. If you insult me I will
insult you back and ignore your ramblings.

My first post, was posted in reflection of your calling later heads JUNK.
I still stand by my statement that they are not junk. If you want to
continue this, please take it off-list, I have wasted enough of Ken's and
everyone else's bandwidth on this today.

Kevin

- ----------
From: Bogginf350 AOL.COM[SMTP:Bogginf350 AOL.COM]
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 9:05 PM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?

have you ever even looked at the different castings to compare them? ever
seen the alum. prototype early ford heads for nascar? i am running the true
P.I heads on my truck right now. also have a set of the cj castings that i
ran last year with a cam motions roller cam. i will retrieve the results
from
the flow bench. which jay riddle racing in morton il. flow tested. please
argue on... and tell me more about your juice cam, insulting compression,
overheating pull truck motor.
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 22:46:42 -0500
From: "Jason & Kathy Kendrick"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Crate Engines

What??!! No FE's?? What kind of a company is this? :-)

Jason
>
> Try http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com was the best prices I could find for
> performance crate engines when I looked a month or so ago. I have no idea
> as to quality etc, but all the parts seem right.
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 01:47:47 EDT
From: FLR150 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - What year 460s?....


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