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To: perf-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: perf-list-digest V2 #269
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perf-list-digest Tuesday, October 19 1999 Volume 02 : Number 269



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - Performance
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In this issue:

RE: [FTE Perf - TFI tester...]
RE: FTE Perf - Superchers
RE: FTE Perf - Anti Freeze
RE: FTE Perf - air intake, hedders, muffler
RE: FTE Perf - Superchers
RE: FTE Perf - Superchers
Re: FTE Perf - Superchers
FTE Perf - Looking for 88 integra head Off list topic......
FTE Perf - Re: The Knock is Gone
RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers
RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers
RE: FTE Perf - Looking for 88 integra head Off list topic......
RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers
RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers
RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers
[none]
FTE Perf - Door seals
FTE Perf - In Seattle
Re: FTE Perf - In Seattle
Re: FTE Perf - In Seattle
Re: FTE Perf - Superchargers

=======================================================================

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Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:39:43 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: [FTE Perf - TFI tester...]

> What a cool idea!! some points though.
>

Some great points in there that I totally agree with, but in the interest of
bandwidth ... ;)


> > Does it work? No idea, no TFI's in my garage.
>
> Still the same basic module on yours, just relocated to the
> firewall/fenderwell for better cooling and called EDIS with
> possibly differing
> connectors depending on the vehicles in your stable.

See sig for the vehicles in the stable ... one is still on points for now
... the other is a distributorless style ... just a couple of coil packs and
a crank trigger ... ;)

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:51:38 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchers

> Well, yeah, Ford SVT supercharges them every day to go into the
> Lightnings.
> They use an Eaton supercharger with 8psi boost (I think).
>

Always a good source as they seem to have all the parts to bolt one up ;)

Also check with Steeda, Saleen, and the other big names in the 'stang market
as most are moving towards the "sport truck" market as well ... I'm about
70% sure that Vortech, Paxton, and possibly ATI (procharger) will have
something out for the 5.4 shortly if its not out already ...


Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:52:47 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Anti Freeze

> I had a question about Anti freeze. Basically, how cold can it get when
> mixed with water before it does freeze? Would the ratio's that the
> manufacture suggest be best, even for EXTREMILY cold conditions? The
> reason I ask is because I am going to build a water block to
> cool the CPU in
> my computer and want to know how cold can I get it?

Check www.zdtv.com about a year ago they had a special on about super
cooling computers for better performance ... its been done before, so maybe
you can glean the info you need off of there ... any "high end" computer
place should know about these at least...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:02:09 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - air intake, hedders, muffler

> When the time comes, would it be better to purchase the Gale
> Banks "system"
> (Powerpack), which includes all three and, I'm sure, has been designed to
> work together OR buy the best K&N intake system, a set of headers/hedders
> (which one? — Hedman, Jardine, Edelbrock, etc.), and a (which
> one? — Borla,
> Gibson, Flowmaster, etc.) muffler/exhaust/cat-back system?
>

I think if you look at the Banks "system" there's really only one or two
unique pieces there, the rest of it you can buy separately ... likely you
save a little buying them all separately if you are careful where you get
the stuff ...


> Banks system comes, I believe, with a K&N filter, but, I do not
> believe that
> it will be the latest and the greatest. I believe it's just a
> filter-element
> replacement for the factory version in the factory housing. I
> would like the
> large, open-air units that K&N makes. Or would it even make a difference?

It may make a difference, and not in a good way ... though this applies to
gas motors, I don't know so much about the diesels. But what happens with
the open element under the hood is that they are exposed to those underhood
temps, which means warmer, less dense air ...

K&N has recently come out with a new system that puts a protective heat
"shield" around the engine side of the filter, but I don't know how those
work yet, if you are off-roading an open element is probably a no-no as you
will just clog it with mud and likely lower it to the point that water can
get in ...


> I can't remember which one. Is a hedder just a hedder or does someone out
> there have it "dialed-in" and no one else does?
>

This is kind of a tossup ... depends what you're going for ... there are
tuned headers, equal length, non equal lenght, shorty, long tube ... all
kinds of stuff there ... the shorty headers will bolt up to the exhaust
exactly like the factory ones, but flow better ... the tuned ones are
supposed to help at certain revs that they are "tuned" for ...(sounds flat,
push in just a touch :) ... all in all the goal is the same, better power
through less restrictive flow ... again your engine may be the limiting
factor as there may not be lots and lots to choose from...


> Cat-back. Power & performance between manufacturers is probably
> pretty equal.
> What I'm concerned about is SOUND! P&P also. But, sound is
> utmost on my mind.
> I would prefer a slightly low(er) sound (from stock), not too
> harsh though,
> NOT TOO LOUD, basically something a bit "noticeable."
>

No comments here, this is ALL personal preference ... listen to the vehicles
you hear that you like the note on ... I like the borla sound on trucks, but
I think for my car it would be a bit much (not to mention pricey!) ...
flowmaster has gotten some pretty bad press lately, that they really aren't
making the power they claim, and aren't as good as they say ... I still
loved the sound of the 2-chambers on a buddy's GTO ... they were great
sounding, but I think its hard to make that 389 sound bad ...


> 2000 F-250 SD/SC 4WD V-10 Auto LWB/LB Lariat
>
> What are YOUR thoughts, list?
>

I think you've got most of my thoughts ... I see you have the V10, when you
said the banks kit I was thinking you had a diesel, sorry for the confusion
...

The V10 probably doesn't have many headers available for it yet, one guy in
Las Vegas I think it was, swapped one of these into a Mustang and was able
to use FMS Shorty headers with an additional bump welded on and they worked
fine for him (still used stock exhaust then too!)

Hope this helps a little ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:58:13 -0500
From: jmann living.com
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchers

So where do I get an SVT Catalog?? I saw one years ago when they called it
SVO.

I looked at the SVT site and they don't sell or list any parts there.

- -----Original Message-----
From: William S. Hart [mailto:wish iastate.edu]
Sent: Monday, October 18, 1999 8:52 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchers

> Well, yeah, Ford SVT supercharges them every day to go into the
> Lightnings.
> They use an Eaton supercharger with 8psi boost (I think).
>

Always a good source as they seem to have all the parts to bolt one up ;)

Also check with Steeda, Saleen, and the other big names in the 'stang market
as most are moving towards the "sport truck" market as well ... I'm about
70% sure that Vortech, Paxton, and possibly ATI (procharger) will have
something out for the 5.4 shortly if its not out already ...


Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 11:25:43 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchers

> So where do I get an SVT Catalog?? I saw one years ago when
> they called it
> SVO.
>
> I looked at the SVT site and they don't sell or list any parts there.
>

I got mine from california mustang ...free with an order of $10 ... a great
gimmick that got nearly a hundred of mine, if the Saleen pedals ever show up
...

Anyway I saw it listed in Jeg's as well ... its $5.00 from most places, I
think Jeg's had it at $5.39 or you can find your local FMS dealer (Ford
Motorsports SVO) and they should have one ...

If you want the one from Jeg's, lemme know I'll get a part number for you
... or california mustang should be on the web as well ...

FMS will do mail-order for a catalog, its on their site where to send the
five bucks ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 12:34:03 EDT
From: FLR150 AOL.COM
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Superchers

You can get the FRPP (Ford Racing Performance Parts) catalog at most any Ford
dealer. The cost of the catalog is $5.
Later
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside SC
14.83 91mph
#2 national points holder for the Top Truck class, Fun Ford Weekend series.
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 13:10:29 EDT
From: ACMERCG AOL.COM
Subject: FTE Perf - Looking for 88 integra head Off list topic......

I found out today that my oil pump crapped out. The exhaust cam has
sucessfully eaten into my head. The cap and the journal is bad. PLEASE
HELP!!!!!!



Joe
Lost in Jersey
88 Integra
92 F-150
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:19:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bill
Subject: FTE Perf - Re: The Knock is Gone

>Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 21:42:45 EDT
>From: FLR150 AOL.COM
>Subject: Re: FTE Perf - The Knock is Gone

>Bill,
>How much is this rebuild costing you?
>Later
>Wayne Foy
>'94 Flareside SC

Wayne,

The shortblock is gonna cost me about $1500 (parts and machine work).
I paid $150 for the heads already reworked and all the speedshop is
doing to them is tearing 'em down, inspecting and lubricating since
they have been sitting for a few years.

Bill

PS... I got the numbers on the cam:

Duration Lift
214 Intake 472 Intake
224 Exhaust 496 Exhaust

and 112 Centerline


BTW.. I am running "stock" exhaust manifolds off a 1970 Mustang Mach I
and a 2.25 inch exhaust from the manifolds to the end of the tail
pipes. Was gonna do headers but decided not to as it would have meant
a lot of fabricating to get any to fit, plus I just didnt want to
hassle with them.

Ignition is a "hybrid".. Duraspark distributor off a 1979 Cougar
(rebuilt and recurved for a max of 30 degrees of timing at the same
shop that is doing the rebuild) and an ACCEL 300+ module and coil.
Mallory Distributor cap (large style) and Ford Motorsport 9mm wires.

Transmission is out of a 1976 Maverick (C4 that I rebuilt last year)
that was mated up behind a 302 (the engine I originally put in the
truck) and I am running 3.25 gears in the 9 inch... makes for an
interesting ratio.. runs about 2400 rpm at 60mph. Only problem is on
launch.. need to find a good posi and some wider tires :-).

I think that about covers it.. sorry to ramble on so...

Bill in Texas
'64 F100 Shortbox (1970 351W/C4)


=====

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 16:12:48 -0500
From: jmann living.com
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers

Thanks for the info guys.

Can anyone tell me the advantages and disadvantages between the
Paxton/Vortex type superchargers and the Eaton Roots-type that is in the 99
Lightning?

Ok, here's an opportunity for you Gearheads to show off your stuff!

Also does anyone know the Eaton Superchager model that used on the 99
Lightning?

Joe




- -----Original Message-----
From: FLR150 AOL.COM [mailto:FLR150 AOL.COM]
Sent: Monday, October 18, 1999 11:34 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Superchers

You can get the FRPP (Ford Racing Performance Parts) catalog at most any
Ford
dealer. The cost of the catalog is $5.
Later
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside SC
14.83 91mph
#2 national points holder for the Top Truck class, Fun Ford Weekend series.
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 16:44:17 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers

> Can anyone tell me the advantages and disadvantages between the
> Paxton/Vortex type superchargers and the Eaton Roots-type that
> is in the 99
> Lightning?
>

Sure can ... the Paxton/Vortech chargers are centrifical style chargers,
they work just like a centrifical pumps ... the bonus is they are self
limiting based on the speed they are spun, you can't over-boost them 'cause
the vanes just won't support the flow ...

the other style is a positive displacement ... they have 2 "screws" that
spring and overlap each other ...as they spin they compress the air and
force it into the intake manifold ... pretty cool stuff :) If I only had
the guts to run one ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 16:45:15 -0500
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Looking for 88 integra head Off list topic......

> I found out today that my oil pump crapped out. The exhaust cam has
> sucessfully eaten into my head. The cap and the journal is bad. PLEASE
> HELP!!!!!!
>


Okay ... I don't have one laying around and haven't seen one in the salvage
yard lately .... You have my condolences for having to mess with one if
that's what you were looking for ... ;)

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 4.6L
73ish F100 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 18:03:30 -0400
From: Greg Carter
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers

Mostly it is the rpm range that they make FULL boost. Centrifugal (Paxton,
Vortex..) wont make full boost till higher rpm, where as roots will do it
sooner, and even better is a whipplecharger. For around town driving you
want low rpm boost.

Order the Kenne Bell catalogue, no web page, 909-941-6646, the only maker of
the whipplecharger. While I don't particularly like the organization of the
info (scattered throughout) in the book and accompanying flyers it does have
a lot of useful information. However it must be read like any other
marketing pamphlet. It even contradicts itself in places, stating that the
4.6 and 5.4 don't require aftermarket exhaust because the factory is already
optimized (which I would believe), however it came with an added flyer
selling their own exhaust for these engines. Also misleading is their info
on Intercoolers, mostly because it would be damn near impossible to fit an
intercooler to a roots/whipplecharger, well at least with their design...

However it does give some good info on superchargers in general, and the
results are impressive:

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/1273/garage/garage.html
(on a Mustang)

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.arrowweb.net/casey/cDrag_nf.shtml
(351w Ford F150 4x4)

Bye.

Greg Carter
Entrust Technologies - http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.entrust.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com/articles/buildup/dana60.html


- -----Original Message-----
From: jmann living.com [mailto:jmann living.com]
Sent: Monday, October 18, 1999 5:13 PM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers


Thanks for the info guys.

Can anyone tell me the advantages and disadvantages between the
Paxton/Vortex type superchargers and the Eaton Roots-type that is in the 99
Lightning?

Ok, here's an opportunity for you Gearheads to show off your stuff!

Also does anyone know the Eaton Superchager model that used on the 99
Lightning?

Joe




- -----Original Message-----
From: FLR150 AOL.COM [mailto:FLR150 AOL.COM]
Sent: Monday, October 18, 1999 11:34 AM
To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Superchers

You can get the FRPP (Ford Racing Performance Parts) catalog at most any
Ford
dealer. The cost of the catalog is $5.
Later
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside SC
14.83 91mph
#2 national points holder for the Top Truck class, Fun Ford Weekend series.
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:51:31 -0500
From: Jordan Dean
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers

At 04:12 PM 10/18/99 -0500, you wrote:
>Thanks for the info guys.
>
>Can anyone tell me the advantages and disadvantages between the
>Paxton/Vortex type superchargers and the Eaton Roots-type that is in the 99
>Lightning?
>
>Ok, here's an opportunity for you Gearheads to show off your stuff!
>
>Also does anyone know the Eaton Superchager model that used on the 99
>Lightning?
>
>Joe

I believe it's the fact that roots type make their full pressure at a lower
rpm (better for trucks.)


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Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:21:17 -0700
From: "Hogan, Tom"
Subject: RE: FTE Perf - Superchargers


> Also misleading is their info
> on Intercoolers, mostly because it would be damn near impossible to fit an
> intercooler to a roots/whipplecharger, well at least with their design...

Yes but,..... FORD DID IT!!! As I remember the T-bird super coupe had a
roots type supercharger mounted on top of the V-6. The supercharger intake
was on the bottom of the charger it blew out the top thru an intercooler
mounted to the front of the car and back to the bottom of the blower where
the entrance to the intake manifold was. (Never said it would be easy)

Tom H.
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:39:42 -0700
From: "James D"
Subject: [none]

Anyone know where I can order some aftermarket door and windows seals for my
79 E-150 Van?

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:41:13 -0700
From: "James D"
Subject: FTE Perf - Door seals

anyone know where I can get some seals for my doors and windows in my 79
E-150? Preferably inexpensive ones

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 21:24:51 -0600
From: William A Whited
Subject: FTE Perf - In Seattle

Well guys I'll be in Seattle next week. I believe
they have me staying downtown. If any FTE members want
to get together for dinner let me know. I have to
leave there that following Fri.

- --
William A Whited
74 F100 RANGER SUPERCAB 390
77 F150 CUSTOM 460
EL Paso, TX
SEMPER FI


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:39:42 EDT
From: "Gerald Ash"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - In Seattle

William,
First have a good trip and watch out for the shaking ground. Now one quick
question. Will the 351M motor mount towers work on a 1978 F150 and a 460
engine or do I need to get different ones. I currently have a 300 6 cyl.
and I know that they don't work.
Thanks
Gerald
Augusta, Ga.

______________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 21:47:31 -0600
From: William A Whited
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - In Seattle

I'm almost positive that you have to use different
motor mounts.

- --
William A Whited
74 F100 RANGER SUPERCAB 390
77 F150 CUSTOM 460
EL Paso, TX
SEMPER FI


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