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To: perf-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: perf-list-digest V2 #231
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perf-list-digest Friday, September 10 1999 Volume 02 : Number 231



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - Performance
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In this issue:

FTE Perf - Re: Valve Noise
Re: FTE Perf - Re: Valve Noise
FTE Perf - Lifter
FTE Perf - Sad Ford Aftermarket
Re: FTE Perf - Sad Ford Aftermarket

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Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 07:22:06 -0400
From: The Neighbors
Subject: FTE Perf - Re: Valve Noise

Bill Jeffries wrote: "In fact, anyone that can explain exactly how a
hydraulic lifter works would appreciated."

Hydraulic lifters work by magic! Didn't you know that??? Sheesh!
Seriously, a hydraulic lifter consists basically of the lifter barrel
and a tiny little piston. There is a circumferential groove and a hole
in the lifter barrel that feeds oil from the oil hole in the engine's
lifter bores. The lifter is filled with oil, which is incompressible,
like any liquid, which pushes that tiny little piston up against the
bottom end of the pushrod until valve lash is gone. The excess oil fills
the inside of the pushrod, eventually making it to the rocker and oiling
it.
The great thing about hydraulic lifters is that the oil inside them can
vary, allowing for zero lash adjustment. The bad thing is that when an
engine gets dirty, the piston inside the lifter sticks, and you develop
a valve lash problem, and noisy lifters. Some lifters can "pump up" in
hard use, which causes the valves to open WAAAAAYYYYY too early, and
kills your performance, needless to say.
The brave of heart sometimes can take lifters apart, but there's a
little spring inside them which is specially designed to propel lifter
innards across the garage, so it's not something I would do with lifters
I intend to keep.
Any questions?
- --
Don Neighbors
'54 F250 Named Grover

"Any dropped tool or part will automatically fall into the most
inaccessible part of the vehicle."

grover ford-trucks.com
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 11:09:46 GMT
From: "Gerald Ash"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Re: Valve Noise

Just put one quart of CHEVY auto transfluid in the crankcase about 10 miles
prior to oil change and let them clean themselfs. Drain oil and change
filter. ( Bet I get some comments on this one.....)


>From: The Neighbors
>Reply-To: perf-list ford-trucks.com
>To: FTE Performance
>Subject: FTE Perf - Re: Valve Noise
>Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 07:22:06 -0400
>
>Bill Jeffries wrote: "In fact, anyone that can explain exactly how a
>hydraulic lifter works would appreciated."
>
> Hydraulic lifters work by magic! Didn't you know that??? Sheesh!
>Seriously, a hydraulic lifter consists basically of the lifter barrel
>and a tiny little piston. There is a circumferential groove and a hole
>in the lifter barrel that feeds oil from the oil hole in the engine's
>lifter bores. The lifter is filled with oil, which is incompressible,
>like any liquid, which pushes that tiny little piston up against the
>bottom end of the pushrod until valve lash is gone. The excess oil fills
>the inside of the pushrod, eventually making it to the rocker and oiling
>it.
> The great thing about hydraulic lifters is that the oil inside them can
>vary, allowing for zero lash adjustment. The bad thing is that when an
>engine gets dirty, the piston inside the lifter sticks, and you develop
>a valve lash problem, and noisy lifters. Some lifters can "pump up" in
>hard use, which causes the valves to open WAAAAAYYYYY too early, and
>kills your performance, needless to say.
> The brave of heart sometimes can take lifters apart, but there's a
>little spring inside them which is specially designed to propel lifter
>innards across the garage, so it's not something I would do with lifters
>I intend to keep.
> Any questions?
>--
>Don Neighbors
> '54 F250 Named Grover
>
> "Any dropped tool or part will automatically fall into the most
> inaccessible part of the vehicle."
>
> grover ford-trucks.com
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

______________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 09:40:50 -0400
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE Perf - Lifter

Bill J. wants to know the operational characteristics of a lifter.

I'm no teacher, but I'll give it a shot.....

The area of the lifter that the pushrod seats in is merely a very close
toleranced "piston" held up by hydraulic pressure that enters the lifter near
the center of the vertical barrell portion and a very weak spring inside the
lifter. As the lifter begins its upward stroke the oil inside comes under
tremendous pressure from the valve train and valve spring resistance. The
"piston" tries to collapse downward and this forces oil upwards through a very
small hole in the center of the lifter that is aligned with the hole in the
pushrod. Hence oil to the rocker. It happens very rapidly and of course very
often as these things open/close with every other revolution of the engine.
When lifters "clatter", usually the engine oil pressure is too low to maintain
sufficient oil pressure to keep the lifter "pumped up".

Hope this didn't confuse you and helps.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 22:50:25 -0400
From: Greg Carter
Subject: FTE Perf - Sad Ford Aftermarket

I sit here working late because I spent another day surfing the web looking
for engine parts when I should have been working...

I have been looking at putting in a built 351w into my truck. About the
best I have found (price wise) is:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com/365-351W.htm (2399)

but I really want:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com/350-396W.htm (3199)

which if you add up all the parts, machine shop costs (not including
assembly), is a lot cheaper than I could do myself.

But its still pricey when compared to a Chev and it sucks, and I haven't
even included what it is going to cost me to convert to mass air and upgrade
the EFI (injectors, performance intake...). 8 years ago I rebuilt a 289 for
my Mustang, and I remember having to pay more for parts just because it was
a Ford. I thought back then "boy wont it be great with all these new 5.0
Mustangs and all the new aftermarket parts.", but nothing has changed.

If I had a Chev 350 I could go to the FACTORY and get a bran new 330 hp
engine assembly http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.gmgoodwrench.com/parts/pdf/008-013.pdf, for just
under $2000. No used block, no used crank, rods, right from the factory.

What does Ford have, an SVO 351 for $4500, sure you get a water pump and
distributor, or I could get the short block with no cam for $1700, what a
deal.

You can get a good set of performance heads (on above engine) from Chev
fully assembled for the 350 for $414 a pair
(http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.paceparts.com/small_block_chevy_heads.htm, part #12558060), you
can't even get one assembled GT-40 head for that.

Am I missing something, just not looking in the right places?

PS, the reason I know about the Chev stuff is because my friend with a Chev
has been nice enough to point out how much cheaper it is.


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 23:04:43 -0700
From: "Tom Ewing"
Subject: Re: FTE Perf - Sad Ford Aftermarket

You know Greg, there's not much one can say except you've stated
the facts, I think, pretty much as they really are. I don't know enough
to know why Ford Racing(SVO) chooses to price things as high as
they do. I too have many times wanted to buy from Ford--like a shift
lite tach that they offer, but I can't find anyone who charges that MUCH
for exactly the same thing, except it doesn't have the Ford Racing
logo. I'm a Ford fan. I've got a 2.3L Ranger that I race on Wed nights
at the local bracket racing 1/4 mile drags, and I'm also restoring a
58Ford F100 with a 429, C-6 . All I can say is that performance Chevys
are everywhere. I'm not enough of a mechanic to argue the merits of
the Ford versus whatever, but I've just always been more of a Ford
fan. So I just live with it. But like you, I can't imagine why Ford can't
compete better price wise with General Motors. I understand the
high volume of aftermarket goods might make Chevy stuff more
price wise competitive, but when we're talking Mr Goodwrench versus
Mr Ford--price wise anyway--its hard not to notice.
Tom
- -----Original Message-----
From: Greg Carter
To: 'perf-list ford-trucks.com' ;
'80-96-list ford-trucks.com'
Date: Thursday, September 09, 1999 8:00 PM
Subject: FTE Perf - Sad Ford Aftermarket


>I sit here working late because I spent another day surfing the web looking
>for engine parts when I should have been working...
>
>I have been looking at putting in a built 351w into my truck. About the
>best I have found (price wise) is:
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com/365-351W.htm (2399)
>
>but I really want:
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ford-power.com/350-396W.htm (3199)
>
>which if you add up all the parts, machine shop costs (not including
>assembly), is a lot cheaper than I could do myself.
>
>But its still pricey when compared to a Chev and it sucks, and I haven't
>even included what it is going to cost me to convert to mass air and
upgrade
>the EFI (injectors, performance intake...). 8 years ago I rebuilt a 289
for
>my Mustang, and I remember having to pay more for parts just because it was
>a Ford. I thought back then "boy wont it be great with all these new 5.0
>Mustangs and all the new aftermarket parts.", but nothing has changed.
>

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