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Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 01:20:12 -0400 (EDT)
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------------------------------

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fordtrucks-digest Digest Volume 97 : Issue 114

Today's Topics:

Re: 100mpg How-To ["Jason K. Schechner" ]
64 Ford pickup [Gardner ]
Re: 100mpg How-To ["C.D. Mutch"
Re: 100mpg How-To ["C.D. Mutch"
Re: A special Thanks ["Wagger" ]
Re: 80 MPG???? Beg to differ Sir. [Daver ]
Re: R/R Oil pan and Rear Seal [Daver ]
Re: '47 One-ton wiring harness ["Mitch Miller" ]
Re: 100mpg How-To [Don Grossman ]
Re: 100mpg How-To [Daver ]
Shoulder Seat Belt Retrofit [Randy Collins ]
Modified '78 F100 [Paul ]
Re: Modified '78 F100 [Chris Kelly ]
RE: aod trans [Eric Houkal ]
RE: 100mpg How-To [Kevin Kemmerer ]
Rear Ends [Jason Smith
Re: 80 MPG???? Beg to differ Sir. ["C.D. Mutch"
Re: 100mpg How-To ["C.D. Mutch"
Re: 100mpg How-To ["C.D. Mutch"

Administrivia:

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Message distributed via http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.lofcom.com/
For help send mail with subject "HELP" to:fordtrucks-digest-request lofcom.com
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 18:46:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Jason K. Schechner"
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Wed, 14 May 1997, C.D. Mutch wrote:

> As we all know, fuel will only ignite by an open flame or a spark etc. A
> pressure relief valve would be used in both chambers as a safety
> precaution, and anyway, wouldn't the flow of steam being introduced into
> the catalytic chamber supress the chance of a flame?

Not likely. The methanol vapor will be plenty explosive and if it
gets out of the heating chamber the steam will contribute to
melting/burning things. Remember that paper ignites at 451F, which is
about 234C. It may be steam, but the heat will light things on fire quite
nicely, and provite one heck of an ignition source for the hot methanol.
On the other hand, exhaust gas temperatures tend to be around
1200C (2200F or so) if I'm not mistaken, so you've got the heat available
using it is the problem: it moves through the exhaust system so fast it
can't transfer much heat out to the manifold(s). If you can actually get
the mpg up enough there will be less exhaust gas, so it can stick around
in the manifold/heat-exhcnager longer. Perhaps double-walled exhaust
manifolds (thin to allow heat and then thick outside of that?)
One other thing I was thinking - if these carbs exist why aren't
the enironmentalists shouting about them from the highest rooftops? I
would think this would be their dream come-true. With my 9mpg Broncos it
sure would be *my* dream come-true! :-)
Oh, why not use a computer to control the fuel/steam mixture input
into the heating chambers? It'd certainly make things a lot easier.

-Jason, sceptical, but trying to keep an open mind

-----
Jason K. Schechner - Unix Sysadmin - Oracle Corp
check out www.cauce.org and help ban spam-mail.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 19:40:12 -0500
From: Gardner
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: 64 Ford pickup
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Trying to sell! If interested e-mail cdkelly netgsi.com. It it setup for
a V-8 has 302 setting in it bolted up but not hooked up, 3spd. Body ids
solid. Just don't have time or room as we have 8 vechicles 4 boats and a
tractor something has to go!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 18:25:21 -0700
From: "C.D. Mutch"
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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My sincerest apologies to Ron. I meant no insult in any of my
statements, but I've learned that when you're dealing with the
skeptical, the sarcasm is gonna have to flow both ways. I appreciate
Ron's points as they were very valid and it proved to me that he was
thinking on the subject. Again I mean no ill will to anyone and I
appreciate any further comments on anything I've stated. We're all in
the same boat together.
--
Friends may come and go, but enemies accumulate.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 19:09:00 -0700
From: "C.D. Mutch"
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Thanks for the input Jason. I guess it's important to make sure that the
mixture entering the catalytic chamber is only there long enough to
undergo the chemical transformation (Cracking) into it's lighter fuel
elements. The second it's completed this transformation it should go
directly to the intake for consumption. Again this brings up the
metering problem. Perhaps you're right and it would be best to use a
computer... Although I don't really trust them. A wise old man once said
that simplicity is best, and this is what I'm trying to apply here.

> Perhaps double-walled exhaust
> manifolds (thin to allow heat and then thick outside of that?)

Yes, this could work with a set of home made headers.
Can anybody tell me the exhaust manifold temp (factory exhaust
manifolds) at operating speed (highway-no load) of your typical 351M/400
or 360/390 FE?

> One other thing I was thinking - if these carbs exist why aren't
> the enironmentalists shouting about them from the highest rooftops?

To be honest, I don't know why the environmentalists act the way they
do. Perhaps they are as skeptical as everyone else... after all they're
only human.
--
Friends may come and go, but enemies accumulate.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 18:53:18 -0600
From: "Wagger"
To:
Subject: Re: A special Thanks
Message-Id:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Ken, and fellow list lovers,
My wifes' 88 Escort was totaled on monday, she and my daughter are a
little banged up but otherwise ok. We needed to get her another car and
were short of cash so I had to use my beautiful 1965 F-250 for a down
payment. I only had this truck for 4 short weeks. But in that time I grew
to love it. My son still has his so he will still be using the list but I
will watch from the sidelines . Thanks to everyone who helped us along the
way and hopefully in the future I'll get another one.
Thanks for everything,
Charlie SR.
Charlie Jr. 1964 F-100

----------
> From: C.D. Mutch
> To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
> Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
> Date: Wednesday, May 14, 1997 8:09 PM
>
> Thanks for the input Jason. I guess it's important to make sure that the
> mixture entering the catalytic chamber is only there long enough to
> undergo the chemical transformation (Cracking) into it's lighter fuel
> elements. The second it's completed this transformation it should go
> directly to the intake for consumption. Again this brings up the
> metering problem. Perhaps you're right and it would be best to use a
> computer... Although I don't really trust them. A wise old man once said
> that simplicity is best, and this is what I'm trying to apply here.
>
> > Perhaps double-walled exhaust
> > manifolds (thin to allow heat and then thick outside of that?)
>
> Yes, this could work with a set of home made headers.
> Can anybody tell me the exhaust manifold temp (factory exhaust
> manifolds) at operating speed (highway-no load) of your typical 351M/400
> or 360/390 FE?
>
> > One other thing I was thinking - if these carbs exist why aren't
> > the enironmentalists shouting about them from the highest rooftops?
>
> To be honest, I don't know why the environmentalists act the way they
> do. Perhaps they are as skeptical as everyone else... after all they're
> only human.
> --
> Friends may come and go, but enemies accumulate.
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________
> Message distributed via http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.lofcom.com/
> For help send mail with subject "HELP" to:fordtrucks-request lofcom.com
> Comments and suggestions are welcome, use: kpayne mindspring.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 22:30:38 -0500
From: Daver
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 80 MPG???? Beg to differ Sir.
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I been to 2 goat ropens and uh county fair and I ain't never seen nuthin
like this before. In other words horse manuer. I do know a few things
about petrochemicals and YOU do not.

Molater

Daver

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 22:43:16 -0500
From: Daver
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: R/R Oil pan and Rear Seal
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Your '68 is like my 67 the oil pan sump sets over the front
crossmember. I hav an FE; however, the mounting is the same and I have
pulled the pan no problem the seal will be a bit trickier. To pull the
pan lift the engine up as high as possible ( you'll probably have to
unhook the exaust) then remove the bolts then pull the pan back rocking
it from side to side until you find the secret path it must take to come
out.

Molater

Daver

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 19:45:04 -0500
From: "Mitch Miller"
To:
Subject: Re: '47 One-ton wiring harness
Message-Id:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

"Does anyone know of a supplier for a wiring harness for a 47 one ton ?
If not, I would be interested in a source for a good diagram."
Jeff


Sure - There is a pretty good section in the 1939-1947 Ford and Mercury
Shop Manual - for Passenger cars and trucks. You can order it from Mac's
Antique Auto Parts.

Toll Free 1-(800) 777-0948 This catalogue is a MUST-HAVE if you are doing
any work on your truck.
(If you are stuck let me know, I could scan it and e-mail it to you, eh?)

Mitch Miller
'46 Pickup
'47 Panel Delivery
mmiller dryden.net

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 19:40:44 +0000
From: Don Grossman
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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C.D. Mutch wrote:
>
> As we all know, fuel will only ignite by an open flame or a spark etc. A
> pressure relief valve would be used in both chambers as a safety
> precaution, and anyway, wouldn't the flow of steam being introduced into
> the catalytic chamber supress the chance of a flame?
>
> Isn't the NWO some sort of Satanic cult??

Some body was telling me about the New World Order thing a while back,
some makes sense and most seems like hogwash. Nato uses white vehicles
all the new cop cars I see are all white that kind of stuff. any way
back to the show.

If you could insulate both chambers this would reduce the heat in the
engine compartment and lower the energy needed up keep the chamber at
the required temp. Use an injector for the fuel and another for the
water or steam that was computer controled for a steady mixture as
needed. And use a metering valve to control the input to the engine
connected to the throtle.

I have not seen any of the plans, am not sure what you are doing and
jumped into the middle of the thread so if I'm way off base please
forgive me.
--
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net

It's hard to do 90 on a speed limit budget.......

65 Ford F-150 4x4 (soon to be 72 Mustang)
63 Ford F-250 4x4

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 22:57:04 -0500
From: Daver
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Don Grossman wrote:
>
> What do you use for fire suppression when you blow a gasket or
> something?
>
> You were talking gas at 500degC, it just got me thinking...
>
> Long live the N.W.O.!
> --
> Don Grossman
> duckdon pacific.net

Good point Don If gaskets translate to o-rings we could have the
Chalinger explotion in rush hour traffic.

Actually in refining reformate (premium gasoline) sees 600 and 700
degrees farenhiet and as long as it is not exposed to air it is ok the
polygas reactor that went at the Phillips plant in Passadena TX was
running around 300 or so I believe and leveled the plant killing 23
people and was visible in downtown Houston 30 miles away.

Molater

Daver

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 23:05:44 -0700
From: Randy Collins
To: "'FORDTRUCKS'"
Subject: Shoulder Seat Belt Retrofit
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Fellow Ford Owners,

A few weeks ago I posted a note regarding my plans to install shoulder =
type belts in my 1975 Supercab. I have already installed bucket seats =
and a console from a 1991 Ford Supercab. =20

I thought some of you might be interested in an update. =20

I finally located the belts I was looking for. They came out of a 1989 =
Chevy Extended cab. For those of you interested in the same install you =
need to look for belts from a 1988 or newer Chevy extended cab. I am =
not absolutely certain but I think there is a possibility that the =
standard cabs and the Suburbans use different belts. The 1988 Extended =
cab belts have a very small retractor box. Unlike all post 1975 Fords =
the Chevy belts bolt directly to the floor. The Ford and most car belts =
mount in recessed area of the cab. They do not mount on the floor like =
the Chevy setup. There is a couple of reasons to locate the post 1988 =
belts. =20

Other that the ease of installation, the newer belt do not say Chevy or =
GM anywhere on the belts. The only logo is TRW. Unless you are really =
observant, the belts will defiantly look like the belong in the truck. =
The other reason for choosing the post 1988 belts is that they are =
designed to be mounted on a completely flat surface. Most of you are =
probably aware that the seat belt setups have inertia switches. If the =
belt retractor isn't mounted at the designed angle they won't operate =
properly. Mounting them level on the floor of the cab is pretty much a =
no brainier. =20

I still haven't installed the upper loop for the shoulder strap of the =
belt, but I am certain I can remove the headliner and lower some type of =
a reinforcing plate with a nut welded to it (welded to the reinforcing =
plate) to the proper location. =20

I already trial mounted the retractor and the stock mounting holes are =
pretty close. I will drill new holes for the retractors a few inches =
further back. =20

The belt setup I bought is from a bench seat truck. The bucket seat =
female ends are different. I will probably mount the female connectors =
I have and keep searching for a set of brown bucket type female =
connections. I will also probably call the local dealer and price new =
ones. =20

I hope this will be of interest to some of you. If you have questions =
feel free to respond. =20

Randy Collins
Boise, Idaho
rcollins micron.net

1975 Ford Supercab Longbed Muscle Truck (mostly in pieces)
Soon to have the following Randy installed options:
F250 4WD 460 C-6

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 00:13:16 -0600
From: Paul
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Modified '78 F100
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Have a '78 F100 short-box step-side, doing a frame off restoration.
Frame is lowered 3" in front, 4" in rear. Looking for any information
regarding shocks. Have been told to use lakewood 50/50 on rear,
ranchero rs9000 on front.Lakewood & moroso do not make a shock to fit
this truck in a 90/10 application. Any die-hard blue oval guys have any
suggestions. Truck has 460 done up with 500hp + 500 ft. lbs , C-6 with
4500 stall, ladder bars , and 4:56 gears. Need to know what will make
this baby stick!

paulc connect.ab.ca

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 08:34:19 -0400
From: Chris Kelly
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: Modified '78 F100
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Paul wrote:
>
> Have a '78 F100 short-box step-side, doing a frame off restoration.
> Frame is lowered 3" in front, 4" in rear. Looking for any information
> regarding shocks. Have been told to use lakewood 50/50 on rear,
> ranchero rs9000 on front.Lakewood & moroso do not make a shock to fit
> this truck in a 90/10 application. Any die-hard blue oval guys have any
> suggestions. Truck has 460 done up with 500hp + 500 ft. lbs , C-6 with
> 4500 stall, ladder bars , and 4:56 gears. Need to know what will make
> this baby stick!
>
> paulc connect.ab.ca
>
> ____________________________________________________________________
> Message distributed via http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.lofcom.com/
> For help send mail with subject "HELP" to:fordtrucks-request lofcom.com
> Comments and suggestions are welcome, use: kpayne mindspring.comhey Paul I would contact edlebrock the have a new shock out on the
market suppose to be really good, or rancho has always made quality
shocks, I have also heard alot of good things about monroe senstracs

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 07:52:20 -0500
From: Eric Houkal
To: "'fordtrucks lofcom.com'"
Subject: RE: aod trans
Message-ID:
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----------
From: Jesse Marcellus[SMTP:MrsSlix66 msn.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 1997 5:04 AM
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: RE: aod trans

Eric, If you find out anything can you e-mail me at MrsSlix66 msn.com? =

Reason being is my husbands Mark VII has the same disease. On his =
tranny, the=20
overdrive is gone but drive and reverse are alright. Enough people have =
told=20
me that drive and reverse are on the same belt since this happened, but=20
because I'm female, I get fed more absolutely wild advise than most. =
Why is=20
it that I no sooner get my truck paid off and start to really work on it =
than=20
something else happens to suck out cash flow!!! =20

Thanx - Kristen
1966 Ford F100 Custom Cab=20

Guess it's one of Murphy's laws. So far yours is pretty much the only =
response I've gotten. After this amount of time, I'd say it's the only =
one I'm gonna get. I guess we're on our own, huh?
My feeling is that very few people mess with these things, and those =
that do work for trans shops! I'll keep your msg on file just in case =
some kind soul takes pity on me, but I'm not holding my breath:-)
Eric
____________________________________________________________________
Message distributed via http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.lofcom.com/
For help send mail with subject "HELP" to:fordtrucks-request lofcom.com
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Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 21:21:19 -0400
From: Kevin Kemmerer
To: "'fordtrucks lofcom.com'"
Subject: RE: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

----------
From: C.D. Mutch[SMTP:cmutch mb.sympatico.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 1997 6:50 PM
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To

RLR Wrote:
> To give some context, the shell on a typical automotive catalytic
> converter might reach 500degC on a long highway trip. This is some
> serious heat under your hood.

YES!! If this is your estimate as to the temp. of a catalytic converter
shell, what do you estimate the temp of the exhaust manifolds themselves
are?? =20
New idea... for those of you who don't find an imagination necessary RON
;) , to build a simple heat exchanger, try winding the fuel line around
the exhaust pipe and wrapping it in non-flammable insulating material.
Run it into your first chamber. Your second chamber can be built and
attached (bolted) directly to the exhaust manifold and insulated as
well. Surely if the catalytic converter gets this hot, the exhaust
manifolds should be the same temp. if not hotter. This idea for a
catalytic chamber shouldn't need any additional electric heating because
it will be working off of othwerwise wasted heat energy.

NO, CAT CONVERTERS GENERATE HEAT ON TOP OF EXHAUST HHEAT DUE TO THE =
CHEMICAL
REACTION INSIDE. THEY CAN ACTUALLY BE HOTTER THAN THE COMBUSTION =
CHAMBER. (BECAUSE THE COMBUSTION CHAMBER PARTS GET COOLED DOWN EACH =
CYCLE AND BUY OIL AND COLLANT!
JUST MY $.02!

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Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 10:45:12 -0500 (EST)
From: Jason Smith
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
cc: "'fordtrucks lofcom.com'"
Subject: Rear Ends
Message-ID:
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I have recently aquired a 1987 FWD F250 with a 6.9L Diesel. It has a
4.10 limited slip rear end according to the door axle code. I am
currently getting about 14-15 mpg and I am wondering if going to a higher
ratio would improve my mpg's very much. I am also wondering how much
work would be invloved in changing the rear end. Do I have to get a
whole new rear end or just change the gears? Any advice will be greatly
appreciated.

J.T.S.
77 F150 351M
87 F250 6.9L

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Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 10:28:25 -0700
From: "C.D. Mutch"
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 80 MPG???? Beg to differ Sir.
Message-ID:
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Helloo Daver.
Seein' iz how a fart smeller... I mean smart feller as yerself knows so
much about petro chemikills, mebee you could share your smarts un help
me out with a solution. Yup yer right 'bout all dem accidents that
happened, but the idea here is to make it safe. I need fresh ideas, not
yesterday's news.
--
Friends may come and go, but enemies accumulate.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 10:46:49 -0700
From: "C.D. Mutch"
To: fordtrucks lofcom.com
Subject: Re: 100mpg How-To
Message-ID:
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> If you could insulate both chambers this would reduce the heat in the
> engine compartment and lower the energy needed up keep the chamber at
> the required temp. Use an injector for the fuel and another for the
> water or steam that was computer controled for a steady mixture as
> needed. And use a metering valve to control the input to the engine
> connected to the throtle.
>

Right on Don!! For jumpin' in in the middle of the thread you're quick
to catch on. The idea which you've stated here has already been built,
tested successful and patented. The guy who built it is looking for big
investors so he could mass produce it but as of yet... no success. If
anyone wants to know the Canadian patent number just say so.....

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