97up-list-digest Saturday, April 17 1999 Volume 02 : Number 098



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.
Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread
RE: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP?
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?
Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread -Reply
RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread
Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread
Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!
RE: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!
FTE 97up - Cat Replacement Pipe Q
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?
FTE 97up - airbag switch on f150
Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?
Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets
FTE 97up - Re: Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!
FTE 97up - Lower Door Weatherstripping. Just Ask and You Shall Receive.
Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets
FTE 97up - Stereo system
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.
FTE 97up - SD Ballance out.
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.
Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread
Re: FTE 97up - airbag switch on f150
RE: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread
RE: FTE 97up - Cat Replacement Pipe Q
Re: FTE 97up - Re: Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!
FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise
Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION
Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread
Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?
Re: FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise
Re: FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise
FTE 97up - oil drain plug
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.
Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:45:47 -0400
From: "John Luft"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up

>>> "John W. Barron" 04/15/99 01:46PM wrote:
>>>


I will wager with anyone that the dealer notice did not include
instructions on how to tell a "good" cable from a "bad" one!. Just cut
them all, if customer comes in and makes an inquiry about the recall.
Otherwise, wait 'till parts come in. Remember, not a single cruise
control has "stuck" because of the problem Ford discovered.
- --------------------------------------------

FWIW, I had my 250 SD CC in for its first oil change and asked them to
check the cruise control. When I picked up the truck they said they were
required to disconnect the cable for "liability reasons". On my way home (I
had to try it out) I found it was still working. I called and they said the
cable part number I have isn't affected by the recall. I entered my VIN at
the web site that was posted here a while back and it came back as not being
affected. However, I did get a letter from Ford about the recall. Given
all this, who would you believe??
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:59:21 -0500
From: "C. K. Hartline"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.

Don't they go up every year?

C.K.

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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:47:29 -0400
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread

Agreed. My V-10 (F-350 superduty) has only 1,200 miles on it now, but the
motor is completely different than it was at 300 miles. Much more pull and
faster reving.

Keith






>But then again, I've heard that the Tritons are VERY tight when new.
>
>Rob
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:10:02 -0500
From: George Rigney
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP?

In 1972 the car manufacturers started using net horsepower, which they
defined as being measured behind the transmission with ALL accessories
running. Somewhere along they way it started getting fuzzy, and now I don't
know what the ratings mean, since they simply say 'horsepower' without
reference to 'net' or 'brake'. I think the most honest way to look at
performance is to compare 1/4 miles, 0-60 times, etc. I don't think you
lose as much to your accessories these days as you did in the past. 15 hp
sounds reasonable to me.

George

1974 Gran Torino Elite 351W
1984 LTD Crown Victoria 302
1999 F250 SD CC V10

- -----Original Message-----
From: CERESJohnG aol.com [mailto:CERESJohnG aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 6:45 PM
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP?


The b is for brake as in brake horsepower. The earliest dynomometers were
called prony brakes as a type of design. The idea was that you but a brake

shoe aginst a rotating shaft hooked to the engine and you measured the
amount
of torque needed to keep the brake from rotating. You kept dialing up the
torgue until you could no longer keep the engine at that rpm setting despite

throttle setting. Torque and rpm will give you HP. It was called bhp. The
friction brake worked OK for 25, 35 hp engines, Today horspower is measured
on larger dynomometers, generally tied to a hydraulic pump wher you measure
gpm and pressure or a big generator with a resistive load. In any case the
the principle is the same. You hold the engine at a constant speed and keep
adding load until it won't hold a given rpm. It's still officially called
brake hp though. And by the way, it's usually measured at the flywheel
possibly with no accessories.

Ford may be quoting the number with accessories or may be quoting it at the
transmisson output or even at the real wheels though I doubt it. The mfrs
used to quote raw engine bhp with no alternato/generator or even the fan or
water pump to get higher ratings. They caught a lot of critcism for that and

standardized the vehicle hp measurementto include at least some of the
support hardware. I suspect that is where the difference is. Fords might
more closly represent available HP while the Navistar number is the peak hp
the engine is capable of producing.

Just a guess but 15hp is about the difference I would expect to see in that
situation.

John G
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:18:40 -0400
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

Matt Adams wrote:
>
> Has anyone installed a second battery into their f-150's? If so what type,
> and where did you mount it? I am installing two more sets of lights into my
> truck, and I have the feeling I have entirely too much attached to my
> battery (I have my 350 watt amp, will be up to three sets of lights, and my
> topper, or can I have that much all attached to the stock battery without
> any problems? The lights I have now are Hella 550's, the lights I will be
> installing are PIAA 520 Fog LIghts and PIAA 910 Driving Lights (both with
> remotes).
>
> Matt
>
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Matt,

It isn't the battery that you must attend to it is the
alternator. If your alternator doesn't put out enough to
cover the increased drain from your accessories you will run
down your battery (ies). How many watts are the lights you
have and the ones you plan to install?

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:17:07 -0400
From: GEORGE CROLL
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread -Reply

I was under the impression that the 6.8 was a 5.4 with two extra cylinders on it. If the 5.4 got improved heads to go
from 235 to 260 HP is that how the V-10 went to 300 HP in 2000. If so I guess it would take a lot to upgrade a 99
V-10 to the 2000 specs. Too bad if that is true.

thanks for the Truck Trend info. In rear wheel dyno testing do you use the direct drive gear when performing the
test, first gear or what? does the rear end gear ratio matter?
George Croll
EPA-OAR-ARD
(202)564-0162
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:42:58 -0500
From: "Chris Patrick"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread

> the affected woman would be harmed/killed but the decision to leave a
> /known/ safety problem in place that could kill others is a bit beyond
> comparison.
> david

I love all this discussion about safety. is there anyone here that can claim
to:

a) ALWAYS WEAR THIER SEATBELTS, AND MAKE ALL PASSENGERS WEAR SEATBELTS 100%
OF THE TIME WITH NO EXCEPTIONS?

b) NEVER ALLOW PASSENGERS IN THE BED AREA OF THIER TRUCK, AT ANY SPEED OVER
ANY DISTANCE, EVEN ACROSS THE YARD?

c) HAVE **NOTHING** IN THE BED OF THIER TRUCK THAT IS NOT TIED DOWN
SECURELY, NO TIRES, NO BAGS OF SAND, ETC... (these things are VERY
dangerous when in an ACCIDENT...)

d) ALWAYS WALK AROUND THIER TRUCK BEFORE THEY DRIVE IT ANYWHERE, 100% OF THE
TIME, NO EXCEPTIONS, AND INSPECT THE TIRES, RUNNING GEAR, BRAKES, FLUIDS,
CONDITION OF THE BODY, ETC, EVERY TIME, NO EXCEPTIONS.

e) NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE EXCEED THE SPEED LIMIT, EVER, REGARDLESS OF
THE EXCUSE.

f) NEVER DRIVE IN THE RAIN, OR SNOW, OR AT NIGHT, OR ANY CONDITION OTHER
THAN PERFECTLY CLEAN,DRY PAVEMENT, ON A BRIGHT SUNNY DAY (BUT NOT INTO THE
SUN WHERE GLARE COULD BE A PROBLEM).


each of these incidents is (statistically) at least 500 times, and in some
cases 15000 times more likely to be the cause of an accident, injury, or
fatality TO SOMEONE OTHER THAN THE DRIVER, according to several industry
sources(not Ford) than a mechanical defect from the factory...

SOOOOOOOO unless you can answer YES to all the items above, please shut your
pie-hole about the safety of the recall situation.. and if you CAN answer
yes to all of the above, please kindly unsubscribe, and go back to the
retirement home you escaped from.


thank you, and lets get back to discussing trucks.


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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:37:55 -0500
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread

Interesting that the same auto in the PSD - and V10, is also slated for Ford's new F-150 Lightning,
a 360 horse power supercharged beast!

Also, one week into break-in on my new PSD, and this thing continues to surprise me. Just starting to
"play" with it on the country roads and long hills in my area of northern Illinois. And it's learning: at stop
signs when I touch the accelerator pedal I can sense its wanting to go . Reminiscent of breaking in a horse.

Or maybe I need to stop using diesel fuel as an after shave lotion?

Anyway, having fun with my new pony,

Charles.


GEORGE CROLL wrote:

> I think this is
> fine for the PSD which has torque to spare but it might help explain the rather anemic rear wheel HP of the V-10
> when using the same auto. I guess the good news is that the V-10 will never break the auto designed to hold up to
> the PSD.
>
> George Croll
> EPA-OAR-ARD
> (202)564-0162
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:42:27 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!

No, I've never heard of this. He must not have put many miles on the car or
the dealer probably could have really goten him for devaluation of the
vehilce.

Nathan

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Charles Abraham
To:
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 4:12 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!


> I thought this true story was interesting enough to share,
>
> A guy that works at the same company I do had recently
> purchased a new Ford vehicle (not sure of model), on a
> Saturday and returned it the following Monday because he
> just didn't like it. Nothing wrong with it, just didn't like it.
>
> When he dropped it off on the dealer's lot and informed them
> that he had changed his mind and did not want this car and
> was returning it. The dealer said "you can't do that", and he
> replied "who yes I can". Then the dealer said "if you leave here
> without that car we'll have it towed to your address and bill you
> for it", which he then said "go ahead it's your now", and walked.
>
> He then stopped at his credit union and had the check for the
> down payment canceled.
>
> About a month later he received his first statement from Ford
> financing. He called them and informed them that he decided
> against buying the vehicle and return the following Monday
> (by Illinois law dealers must be closed on Sunday). And that
> was the end of it.
>
> I never heard of returning a car, everything else but not a car.
> Apparently, Illinois' also has a law that gives a buyer up to
> five working days to return anything that they've purchased.
>
> Nathan, did you ever get somebody like this at your dealership?
>
>
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:01:10 -0500
From: "Chris Patrick"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!

> In a message dated 99-04-15 17:18:43 EDT, you write:
>
>
> its 3 days to reconsider here in FL

check with the STATE laws regarding it. MOST states have a loophole of 3-7
days. you ARE however responsible for milage, and damages. in Missouri, you
have 7 days, but its a fight to get the dealers to do anything.

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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:15:59 -0600
From: "Matus, Scott A"
Subject: FTE 97up - Cat Replacement Pipe Q

Has anyone installed the Cat replacement pipe on their pre Dec.7 PSD Long
bed CrewCab? I initially started to investigate the purchase of the pipe
before Nathan supplied us all with the part numbers. I purchased a pipe
that my parts guy said would fit, It does not fit. After receiving Nathan's
part number list I find that the part number I received is not correct for
my truck. Build date 9-17-98 F350 172"wb Crewcab. They sold me the pipe
for a 176"wb part number - XC3Z 5A212 GA .

I find the pipe being too Short, Yes I said "Too Short". My GA pipe
measures +/- 69 inches in length from Longest end of the bolt flange to the
other end. My truck requires the pipe to be closer to 70+ Inches. It would
be an inch short inside the flange and u-bolt pressure would not hold it in.

Is it possible that the 176"wb Chassis CrewCab use a shorter pipe than a
172"wb Longbed CrewCab?

Can someone supply the length (Procedure described above) for part number -
XC3Z 5A212 CA for 172" wb? Could I get the measurement from someone with a
Post Dec.7 built truck?

Thank you for your help,

Scott
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:17:48 EDT
From: ATUMLAW aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

In a message dated 4/15/99 8:21:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
CERESJohnG aol.com writes:


Some of the shops that specialize in super big auto stereos---- 1000 watt
stuff you know the Honda Civic going down thr road going THUMPA Thumpa
Thumpa and you can see the sheet metal flexing. >>

I have a pretty serious stereo in my truck and sometimes have problems with
getting enough juice for it, with the lights and a/c and stuff. I had read
about some Super Duties having dual alternators. I have the 5.4 L in my 99
F-150, could I purchase another alternator and use the brackets and belt from
a Super Duty eqiupped truck to up my juice.

Thanks,

Atilla Babacan
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:18:42 -0700
From: "Rivera, Max"
Subject: FTE 97up - airbag switch on f150

I have heard many different opionions on use of the on and off switch for
disabling the airbag for small children. I would like to know if there are
any experts out there what their recommendations, for a seven year old
child. Should i disable or enable the airbag. I have heard that small
people including adults can be hurt or killed.

Thanks

Maximo D. Rivera
*Email mailto:max.rivera compaq.com

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Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:42:35 -0700
From: William Street
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION

The key words here being 'competent driver'. I agree with you regarding the
dealer and his actions but 'competent driver' is somewhat of an oxymoron at
least here in California.

Bill

JJ Thomas wrote:

> I disagree. Any competent driver would know how to deal with a stuck
> cruise control. I do not think the determination of a driver competency
> belongs to the dealer, or their mechanics. The dealer was wrong to cut the
> cable, and was dishonest for not telling the owner.
>
> -Julian



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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:35:00 -0400
From: Bill
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

>From my experience running amateur radio equipment mobile,
your best route is running 2 high capacity batteries (1000
CCA or larger). If your mainly in town (stop and go or a
lot of sitting idling) it becomes another problem of not
enough rpm's to maintain high alternator output. Just my .02
worth.

ATUMLAW aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 4/15/99 8:21:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> CERESJohnG aol.com writes:
>
>
> Some of the shops that specialize in super big auto stereos---- 1000 watt
> stuff you know the Honda Civic going down thr road going THUMPA Thumpa
> Thumpa and you can see the sheet metal flexing. >>
>
> I have a pretty serious stereo in my truck and sometimes have problems with
> getting enough juice for it, with the lights and a/c and stuff. I had read
> about some Super Duties having dual alternators. I have the 5.4 L in my 99
> F-150, could I purchase another alternator and use the brackets and belt from
> a Super Duty eqiupped truck to up my juice.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Atilla Babacan
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:39:23 -0600
From: "Joseph L. Casey"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets

1999 F-350 Supercab, Lariet, dually with running boards does have weather
stripping/gaskets on the bottom of the supercab doors.

Roger J Hutflesz wrote:

> F250, Diesel, long bed 1999, with no running boards. Did come with the
> gaskets.
>
> Roger H.
>
> On Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:23:13 -0400 GEORGE CROLL
> writes:
> >Went to the local dealer and tried to get him to put gaskets on the
> >bottom of my doors for free. While arguing with him
> >we looked at all of the SD trucks on the lot. The only trucks without
> >the gaskets are ones with factory running
> >boards. The dealer "assumes" that the gaskets are not necesssary if
> >the running boards are on the truck. Any truth
> >to this???
> >
> >George Croll
> >EPA-OAR-ARD
> >(202)564-0162
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> >
>
> ___________________________________________________________________
> You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
> Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
> or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 07:53:05 -0700
From: "Jarchow, Jaye"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!

Same in Washington state. According to the Attorney General's web page,
"Once you sing the contract, you own the car and are obligated to make
all payments"

By the way, Martial, do you really spell your name that way?

>>
>> We do not get any "cooling off period" in California.
>>
>> When you sign it is yours.
>>
>> Martial

>Texas, it is the same -- you buy the truck, it is yours.


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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:04:11 -0400
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: FTE 97up - Lower Door Weatherstripping. Just Ask and You Shall Receive.

I have a F-350 SuperDuty / XLT / SuperCab / Factory Running boards / V-10 /
LongBed / etc. and just called my dealer, Acton Ford (Massachusetts). The
parts guy said he would be glad to order me the lower weatherstrip pieces
for the doors at no cost.

Keith


- -----Original Message-----
From: Joseph L. Casey
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Friday, April 16, 1999 10:46 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets


>1999 F-350 Supercab, Lariet, dually with running boards does have weather
>stripping/gaskets on the bottom of the supercab doors.
>
>Roger J Hutflesz wrote:
>
>> F250, Diesel, long bed 1999, with no running boards. Did come with the
>> gaskets.
>>
>> Roger H.
>>
>> On Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:23:13 -0400 GEORGE CROLL
>> writes:
>> >Went to the local dealer and tried to get him to put gaskets on the
>> >bottom of my doors for free. While arguing with him
>> >we looked at all of the SD trucks on the lot. The only trucks without
>> >the gaskets are ones with factory running
>> >boards. The dealer "assumes" that the gaskets are not necesssary if
>> >the running boards are on the truck. Any truth
>> >to this???
>> >
>> >George Croll
>> >EPA-OAR-ARD
>> >(202)564-0162
>> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
>> >http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>> >
>>
>> ___________________________________________________________________
>> You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
>> Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
>> or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
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>
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:01:59 -0500
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets

I'm hearing now that those with gaskets - and no running boards, aren't to
crazy about the gaskets. Seem they're more trouble than worth. Apparently,
they tend to freeze to the body in cold weather and tear out of the mounting
holes as soon as the door is opened.

Charles.

Roger J Hutflesz wrote:

> F250, Diesel, long bed 1999, with no running boards. Did come with the
> gaskets.
>

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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 08:08:43 -0700
From: "Jarchow, Jaye"
Subject: FTE 97up - Stereo system

I just ordered my F-150 4x4 SB SC this week! Can't believe it. I spent
over a year researching exactly what I
wanted. Many thanks to the contributors to this newgroup who have provided
so much helpful info.

Question: Nathan, maybe you know. When you upgrade to the CD/AM/FM stereo,
do you get
any better speaker system than the standard cassette/AM/FM? My dealer just
told me Ford is out of
stock of the CD/AM/FM units, so I decided to order the standard unit and
replace it with the CD from
my car (which I will sell) rather than delay delivery of my truck. Am I
getting jipped out of anything?
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 09:51:04 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.

Ask the dealer your going to buy from. Some might be willing to take the
chance that it will come in at that time and if it comes in early will hold
it for you. Your odds of this working are much better at a small dealer.

Nathan

- ----- Original Message -----
From: JJ Thomas
To:
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.


> Hi Nathan,
>
> I am looking at replacing my Ranger with a SD 4x4 about the end of August.
>
> My quandary is that I can not afford to pick up the truck until at least
> August. Should I order now and hope that it does not come in early, or
> should I wait till the summer? I live in Seattle, btw
>
> -Julian
>


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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:14:17 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: FTE 97up - SD Ballance out.

This info is for KC region, but gives an idea for national.

Super Duty Balance out
The region currently has 270 orders for 5.4L engines. We're allocated
aprox. 150 5.4L engines, we have placed a priority 02 (region can prioritize
1-9, but 10 is the best a dealer can do). If a 5.4L order doesn't have a 02
priority it is a serious risk of being built. ------note the priority 02
part is for KC region other regions may not be doing this-----

Premium alluminum wheels are also in short supply (Lariat SRW) with 335
retail orders and a regional allocation of 350 we will try to schedule these
retails, but future retails will not be able to be scheduled.

All other retails and commodities arae CURRENTLY in good shape, however, as
we proceed through balance out other commodities will become serious risks.
Retails will only be scheduled within allocation so make sure they are
prioritzed correctly.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:07:23 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.

I'm sure he didn't mislead you intentionaly. I thought we had a couple of
months left to order (still do on most other vehilce lines), but all of the
sudden they announced this. This will be all orders (Fleet quit a couple of
weeks ago). Dealers will not be able to get Super Duty's except to dealer
trade after balance out.

Nathan
- ----- Original Message -----
From: C. K. Hartline
To:
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.


> Nathan, this is very interesting, because I called a Ford dealer and was
> told I could order a new Ford up until the first part of June
a
> factory order on the phone> ...Obviously they are gearing up to complete
> retail builds to set up for next year's model...are they that far behind
> that they quit giving dealers trucks two months before they quit taking
> factory orders? This seems very very strange.
>
> C.K.
> Saint Louis, Missouri
>


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:03:25 -0400
From: Chris Akers
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread

GEORGE CROLL wrote:
> One thing I have wondered is how much do you really lose in rear
> wheel HP when using an automaitc vs using a manual. I assume that
> the auto converts a lot of power to heat in the process while the manual

I've seen that rear wheel dyno HP is generally 18-20% loss from the
SAE NET horsepower with an automatic in 1:1 drive gear. Manual trannys
are usually in the 15-17% ballpark... so the automatic will typically
lose 3% more than the manual counterpart. I'm not sure about
our truck automatic trannys - they may lose more power due to their heavy
duty design. Rear gear ratio and even tires also will effect the
rear wheel horsepower shown on a chassis dyno. Different dynos
will also have slightly different numbers. Can you tell I'm not
a huge dyno fan? Take it to the track - those numbers don't lie. :-)

HTH,
jC. '67 Camaro, '95 Z, '98 F150 - lugnutz.com
- --
Chris Akers mailto:jca celotek.com
Celotek Corporation phone:919-462-1900 x259
P.O. Box 14285 fax:919-462-1933
Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.celotek.com
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:22:17 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - airbag switch on f150

Fords recomendation is that the airbag should be off for anyone under the
age of 13.

Nathan

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Rivera, Max
To:
Sent: Friday, April 16, 1999 9:18 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - airbag switch on f150


> I have heard many different opionions on use of the on and off switch for
> disabling the airbag for small children. I would like to know if there are
> any experts out there what their recommendations, for a seven year old
> child. Should i disable or enable the airbag. I have heard that small
> people including adults can be hurt or killed.
>
> Thanks
>
> Maximo D. Rivera
> *Email mailto:max.rivera compaq.com
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:31:38 -0500
From: "Chris Patrick"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread

i dunno about the larger trucks, BUT on the 4.2 litre f150...

i drove identical trucks, one with the mazda 5 speed, and one with the
automatick..
THE AUTOMATIC IS A POOCH. extremely sluggish off the line, and slow through
the gears.

with the stick, the 4.2 is quite sporty. as to actual numbers, i dunno, but
the "feel" between the two is completely different.


i recently swapped a turbo 400 auto into my 360 powered jeep cj-8. at the
REAR WHEELS, due to torque multiplication of the converter, my idle-1700 rpm
TORQUE is actually greater.. but in the upper rpms, i lose as much as 17% at
the rear wheels...


>
> GEORGE CROLL wrote:
> > One thing I have wondered is how much do you really lose in rear
> > wheel HP when using an automaitc vs using a manual. I assume that
> > the auto converts a lot of power to heat in the process
> while the manual
>
> I've seen that rear wheel dyno HP is generally 18-20% loss from the
> SAE NET horsepower with an automatic in 1:1 drive gear.
> Manual trannys
> are usually in the 15-17% ballpark... so the automatic will typically
> lose 3% more than the manual counterpart. I'm not sure about
> our truck automatic trannys - they may lose more power due to
> their heavy
> duty design. Rear gear ratio and even tires also will effect the
> rear wheel horsepower shown on a chassis dyno. Different dynos
> will also have slightly different numbers. Can you tell I'm not
> a huge dyno fan? Take it to the track - those numbers don't lie. :-)
>
> HTH,
> jC. '67 Camaro, '95 Z, '98 F150 - lugnutz.com
> --
> Chris Akers mailto:jca celotek.com
> Celotek Corporation phone:919-462-1900 x259
> P.O. Box 14285 fax:919-462-1933
> Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.celotek.com
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
> http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:03:58 -0700
From: "Jeff Schapker"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Cat Replacement Pipe Q

Picked up my pipe this mourning and I just finished installing it. Fits like
a glove! The hardest part of the installation was separating the muffler and
the intermediate pipe. With this part you would never know my truck came
from the factory with a catalytic converter. It was definitely worth $76.00.
The part numbers Nathan gave us are right on the money. Thanks again
Nathan!!!

Has anyone installed the Cat replacement pipe on their pre Dec.7 PSD Long
bed CrewCab? I initially started to investigate the purchase of the pipe
before Nathan supplied us all with the part numbers. I purchased a pipe
that my parts guy said would fit, It does not fit. After receiving Nathan's
part number list I find that the part number I received is not correct for
my truck. Build date 9-17-98 F350 172"wb Crewcab. They sold me the pipe
for a 176"wb part number - XC3Z 5A212 GA .

I find the pipe being too Short, Yes I said "Too Short". My GA pipe
measures +/- 69 inches in length from Longest end of the bolt flange to the
other end. My truck requires the pipe to be closer to 70+ Inches. It would
be an inch short inside the flange and u-bolt pressure would not hold it in.

Is it possible that the 176"wb Chassis CrewCab use a shorter pipe than a
172"wb Longbed CrewCab?

Can someone supply the length (Procedure described above) for part number -
XC3Z 5A212 CA for 172" wb? Could I get the measurement from someone with a
Post Dec.7 built truck?

Thank you for your help,

Scott


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:09:17 -0700
From: "mlester"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!

Hi Jaye.

I spell it that way. It started with my grandfather and the first born in
each generation has been a boy so they got Martial.

My son and grandson are the first born in their respective generations so
the also got Martial.

It sure gets spell a lot of different ways though.

Happy trucking

Martial

- -----Original Message-----
From: Jarchow, Jaye
To: 'Ford Truck Enthusiasts'
Date: Friday, April 16, 1999 7:56 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it!


>Same in Washington state. According to the Attorney General's web page,
>"Once you sing the contract, you own the car and are obligated to make
>all payments"
>
>By the way, Martial, do you really spell your name that way?
>
>>>
>>> We do not get any "cooling off period" in California.
>>>
>>> When you sign it is yours.
>>>
>>> Martial
>
>>Texas, it is the same -- you buy the truck, it is yours.
>
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 10:16:01 +700
From: bwat wa.freei.net
Subject: FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise

****** Forwarded Message Follows *******
>To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>From: bwat wa.freei.net
>Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 13:31:23 +700
>My '99 SD also has more road noise when the backseat is down. I am thinking

>of gettting some sort of insulating batting to hang or glue in behind the "hanging

>carpet". Any thoughts on this?.
>
>As far as engine noise on this V10, I notice it most around 1900RPM, kind of

>a high pitched sound. My only bothersome rattle is the fold-down center console..I'm

>working an that too.
>Maybe Velcro so the door doesn't bounce around ?
>
>Is the guy with with the spring loaded drain plug for the 460 still out there?

>
>
>BWAT in the great Northwest, lovin my truck!
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 11:20:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Neal Moon
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION

since we live in a society that is always looking for "easy money" the
dealer should disconnect the cruise control to keep FoMoCo and
themselves out of a lawsuit when sombody hurts or kills somebody
when/if the cruise control sticks. the dealer is/was trying to limit
his liability. we live in a society where if you spill hot coffee in
your lap, you can sue for millions of dollars even though you were the
one that did something stupid. i agree that the dealer should have
told you that they cut the cruise contol cable but he should not have
left the cruise alone.
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:01:25 -0400
From: "Frank Wanicka"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread

fwiw, Four Wheeler did test a 99 and got 245 RWHP and 590 ft-lbs of torque.
that was when they first came out. i can'r remember if it was a stick or
auto. turbodiesels generally dyno very well. they almost always show
RWHP/RWTQ equal to or greater than the factory rating.
__________________
Frank Wanicka
99 SD F-250 PSD

> I've seen that rear wheel dyno HP is generally 18-20% loss from the
> SAE NET horsepower with an automatic in 1:1 drive gear. Manual trannys
> are usually in the 15-17% ballpark... so the automatic will typically
> lose 3% more than the manual counterpart. I'm not sure about
> our truck automatic trannys - they may lose more power due to their heavy
> duty design. Rear gear ratio and even tires also will effect the
> rear wheel horsepower shown on a chassis dyno. Different dynos
> will also have slightly different numbers. Can you tell I'm not
> a huge dyno fan? Take it to the track - those numbers don't lie. :-)
>
> HTH,
> jC. '67 Camaro, '95 Z, '98 F150 - lugnutz.com
> --
> Chris Akers mailto:jca celotek.com

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 15:05:39 EDT
From: Ccdolf aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION

I'M WRITING THIS IN REGARDS TO THE "PROBLEM" BEHIND THE CRUISE CONTROL
STICKING. I UNDERSTAND THE PROBLEM AND IT'S POSSIBLE AFFECTS. HOWEVER, THEY
ARE WAYS AROUND THIS STICKING. FOR ONE IF IT DOES STICK WHILE ON AN
INTERSTATE HIGHWAY, YOU CAN ALWAYS SHIFT TO NEUTRAL, YOUR ENGINE WILL STAY AT
IT'S PRESET CRUISE RPM AND NOT ACCELERATE, YOU CAN THEN PULL OFF THE HIGHWAY
AND DISCONNECT YOUR CRUISE CABLE TO LET YOUR ENGINE RESUME IDLE RPM. THIS IS
NOT AN ANSWER OR DEFENSE FOR FoMoCo BY ANY MEANS. I UNDERSTAND THE PROBLEM
AND ALSO WOULD LIKE A POSSIBLE ATTEMPT ON IT'S SOLVING. HOWEVER, KNOWING
SOME SIMPLE SAFETY TIPS ON HOW TO UNSTICK A STUCK ACCELERATOR OR CRUISE
CONTROL, CAN GO A LONG WAY IN FUTURE PROBLEMS.

ONCE AGAIN, I'M NOT TRYING TO DEFEND FORD MOTOR CO AND SAY IT'S OK
LIKE IT IS. I'M JUST SIMPLY STATING SOME OF MY OWN SAFETY PRACTICES.

THANX-WILLIAM
Ccdolf aol.com
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 16:05:24 EDT
From: CERESJohnG aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

Doubtful that SD brackets would work, buy maybe. I beleive I read awhile back
that the dual alternator option was available only for the ambulance option.
Whether that option is avaiable with the V8 don't know, I sort of doubt it.
In any case, that option is only available from fleet dealers and their
parts counter. It's worth a look, as an option but a single bolt on high
output alternator is probably a simple boltup.

John G
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 14:52:12 -0700
From: "Matt Adams"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?

Jean Marc

Based on the threads Ive been reading sounds like I should be allright... I
have the heavy duty altenator that came with the towing package. by the
way, the PIAA 910's are 110 watts, the PIAA fog lights are 85 watts, and the
Hella Driving Lights (which I am pretty sure that I will bet aking off, but
am still unsure of), and the amp is 350 watts. Thats a heck of alot of
wattage! :).

Matt
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jean Marc Chartier
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Friday, April 16, 1999 6:24 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150?


>Matt Adams wrote:
>>
>> Has anyone installed a second battery into their f-150's? If so what
type,
>> and where did you mount it? I am installing two more sets of lights into
my
>> truck, and I have the feeling I have entirely too much attached to my
>> battery (I have my 350 watt amp, will be up to three sets of lights, and
my
>> topper, or can I have that much all attached to the stock battery without
>> any problems? The lights I have now are Hella 550's, the lights I will
be
>> installing are PIAA 520 Fog LIghts and PIAA 910 Driving Lights (both with
>> remotes).
>>
>> Matt
>>
>> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>Matt,
>
> It isn't the battery that you must attend to it is the
>alternator. If your alternator doesn't put out enough to
>cover the increased drain from your accessories you will run
>down your battery (ies). How many watts are the lights you
>have and the ones you plan to install?
>
>Regards
>
>Jean Marc Chartier
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 12:06:30 -0400
From: Bill
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise

I have a F-250 supercab and was noticing a lot of noise from
the backseat area. Under the back seat there is no deadner
except for the carpet. I removed the back seat, covered the
2 rear vents to the outside with duct tape then pulled the
carpet back and glued another piece of heavy carpet to the
portion that had no deadner and up the back of the cab to
the bottom of the window. Reinstall the seat and took for a
test drive, what a difference in the rear noise level. I
did not see any negative results from covering the 2 cab
vents. Also removed all door panels and installed carpet
padding behind them. Did not notice as much improvement
from doing this as I did the rear area fix. I will next
attact the dash area, to much thin plastic and no deadner
under it. Maybe do that next week.

wat wa.freei.net wrote:

> >My '99 SD also has more road noise when the backseat is down. I am thinking
> >of gettting some sort of insulating batting to hang or glue in behind the "hanging
> >carpet". Any thoughts on this?.
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 19:09:04 -0600
From: "Joseph L. Casey"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fwd: Noise

bwat wa.freei.net wrote:

> >Is the guy with with the spring loaded drain plug for the 460 still out there?

Here is the address, et al, for the drain plug

>
>
> Oil Drain Valve
> Fumoto Eng. of Amer
> 12328 Northrup Way
> Bellevue, WA 98005
> 425-869-7771 phone
> 425-869-2558 fax
> F-111 for PS
> F-106 for 460 see letter

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 19:26:06 -0600
From: "Joseph L. Casey"
Subject: FTE 97up - oil drain plug

> bwat wa.freei.net wrote:
>
> > >Is the guy with with the spring loaded drain plug for the 460 still out there?
>
> Here is the address, et al, for the drain plug
>
> >
> >
> > Oil Drain Valve
> > Fumoto Eng. of Amer
> > 12328 Northrup Way
> > Bellevue, WA 98005
> > 425-869-7771 phone
> > 425-869-2558 fax
> > F-111 for PS
> > F-106 for 460 see letter
>
>

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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 18:34:58 -0700
From: JJ Thomas
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out.

I just got a notice that my dealer is changing hands, been sold. Work has
been crazy and I have not had a chance to chase this down... but I plan to
call the dealer and see what they are doing. From there I have also been
working with the Zone Manager and I'll check in with him.

If I place an order in June, would I be looking at a 99 or a 00? When does
Ford start delivering the 00's? I am also thinking I might do a plain
trade. If I do a lemon swap, I go difference in MSRP between the old and
new. But if I can get the new F-350 at about $1000 over cost, I pay about
the same and I am not restricted to dealing with the original dealer.
Unfortunately, someone gets my problem Ranger. I am sure the reselling
dealer will not disclose its defects to the new buyer.:-( So there is a....


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