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97up-list-digest Friday, April 16 1999 Volume 02 : Number 096 ======================================================================= Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - To unsubscribe, send email to: majordomo  ford-trucks.com with the words "unsubscribe 97up-list-digest" in the body of the message. ======================================================================= In this issue: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? FTE 97up - !999 SD door panel removal ?? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? FTE 97up - EXHAUST CHROME TIPS Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread Re: FTE 97up - Door gaskets Re: FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up FTE 97up - ordered intermed. pipe for 99PSD Re: FTE 97up - End of the Thread FTE 97up - Cruise Recall RE: FTE 97up - Door gaskets FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Subject: FTE 97up - Exhaust chrome tips for PSD. Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150? Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread Re: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall Re: FTE 97up - Door gaskets Re: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Re: FTE 97up - !999 SD door panel removal ?? Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! ======================================================================= ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:44:05 -0400 From: Jean Marc Chartier Subject: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION "Douglas R. Floyd" wrote: > > > > > Jean, > > We are in total agreement on that good sir. > > > > >Do not use the cruise > > control of an affected vehicle it could be dangerous. > > > > Let's all be safe... > > > > C.K. > > > > My issue with this is the fact that the cable was cut without notice. Yes, > do not drive with it, but the owner should have been notified about it being > disabled. A car is not a piece of demoware -- mechanics do not hold the right > to cut things in people's vehicles without permission, or at least giving > notice. > > -- > Douglas R. Floyd | Mirror Mirror on the wall > | True hope lies beyond the coast > Disclaimer: | You're a damned kind can't you see > I speak for myself, not IBM. | That tomorrow bears insanity -- Blind Guardian > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html C.K. No argument there. Do not touch my vehicle unless instructed to do so. Regards Jean Marc Chartier == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:15:40 -0500 From: "Union Auto" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? I looked at 2 1999 Power Strokes, 1 on the lot built 3/2/99 had a sticker that read 250 BHP 2700 RPM, the sticker was white with red, another early 99 (built 4/98) had a black sticer that read 250 BHP 2700 RPM. So they have the same power, but for some reason Ford is only claiming 235HP were Navistar rates them at 250 HP. Makes you wonder if Ford isn't saving that 15 HP incase the competition were to catch up. Nathan Bernard - ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Abraham To: Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 4:04 PM Subject: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? > Just got wind on the Ford Diesel site that the 99.5 PSD got > a boost in horse power, from 235 to 250! Can this be true? > The engine sticker is now said to state 250 HP. > > I'll have to check mine when I get home. > > Charles. > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:18:44 -0500 From: "C. K. Hartline" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? what is the 'b' for in that acronym; BHP, or is that just a standard rating with the 'b' that is usually dropped when referring to horsepower on a vehicle? Just curious, C.K. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:19:52 -0500 From: "Charles Abraham" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? I was wondering too, maybe the "B" is for base or gross, and not net. Charles. "C. K. Hartline" wrote: > what is the 'b' for in that acronym; BHP, or is that just a standard rating > with the 'b' that is usually dropped when referring to horsepower on a > vehicle? > > Just curious, > C.K. > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:32:12 -0400 From: Bill Subject: FTE 97up - !999 SD door panel removal ?? I would like to remove the inside door panels from both front and rear doors on my 1999 F-250 supercab to add some sound deadner behind the panels. I think there held in place with clips and will come out without much problem, but are there any hidden screws that also hold the panel on. Sure would hate to break the plastic. Thanks, Bill == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:37:09 -0500 From: "Charles Abraham" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Found this on the Ford Diesel page, "Brake horsepower is a term that is used because the torque of the engine is measured by putting a brake on the flywheel with the engine on a test stand. Visualize a large brake with an arm attached. The end of the arm is placed on a scale and the brake is applied at each rpm level to measure how much torque the engine is putting out. Horsepower is then calculated by multiplying the torque by the rpms and dividing by 33,000. One horsepower is the ability to raise 33,000 lb one foot in one minute. Brake horsepower is usually obtained by running the engine on the test stand with no accessories (fan, alternator, power steering pump, etc.) attached to it. That gives the maximum horsepower it can put out. The brake horsepower quoted is the maximum (peak of the horsepower curve). Horsepower values quoted without the term "brake" can mean just about anything. We are usually most interested in horsepower delivered at the wheels, as measured on a dynomometer. And that is quite a bit less than the brake horsepower. Unless the horsepower quoted is defined, one needs to know the conditions under which that horsepower is attained to give the term any meaning. HP is usually brake horsepower, BHP, (because that is the maximum the engine can attain)." > > "C. K. Hartline" wrote: > > > what is the 'b' for in that acronym; BHP, or is that just a standard rating > > with the 'b' that is usually dropped when referring to horsepower on a > > vehicle? > > > > Just curious, > > C.K. > > > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 99 12:35:07 -0400 From: tony.zuber sbaonline.gov Subject: FTE 97up - EXHAUST CHROME TIPS Hi Chris Regarding getting exhaust extension, here is what I did for my F450 Cab and Chassis after the flat bed was installed. I took a scrap piece of 4" stainless steel tubing and cut a section out one side to resize for the exhaust pipe on truck. Then drilled 3 5/16" holes and welded 1/4" nuts and used stainless bolts for set screws. Then cut the other end on 45 degree. Of course if you have to have a shop do this, it could get expensive. Couldn't find anything that would fit right that I liked, so made my own. I have made my own bed, mudflaps and tube steps. This way we have what we want. seeya >Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:30:13 -0700 (PDT) >From: Chris Foye >Subject: FTE 97up - Exhaust chrome tips for PSD. >Hey Ford Listers, >Does anybody have any resources as to who has exhaust >tips, the chrome ones, for the big PSD exhaust? I'm >just looking at getting something that slips over the >existing exhaust so, that I don't have to cut it. >Thanks, >Chris Tony and Janice Zuber Florence Oregon tony.zuber sbaonline.gov t.zuber winfinity.com == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:50:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Gaudenti Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? > I was wondering too, maybe the "B" is for base or gross, and not net. > > Charles. > > "C. K. Hartline" wrote: > > > what is the 'b' for in that acronym; BHP, or is that just a standard rating > > with the 'b' that is usually dropped when referring to horsepower on a > > vehicle? > > > > Just curious, > > C.K. I think it stands for "brake". Maybe way back when they used a brake to load the engine to measure HP? Hey, my guess was pretty close! I just now searched for "brake horsepower" and found: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://tqjunior.advanced.org/4116/Science/horse.htm Danny == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:10:46 -0500 From: "C. K. Hartline" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Well we know for sure that base and gross are never what you get at the end of that paycheck, so if it stands for base or gross horsepower we know we aren't actually getting that power to the rear wheels...which is what counts...going back to the 'spinning' analogy we saw earlier...funny how these manufacturers play with words to get the results they want, to bring in the masses to buy their products. I say they should be mandated to take it to the same shop to find the actual basis for whatever results they are trying to give us across the board. Thats as bad as the computer Cyrix Processor saying it runs a 500 mhz system, when they aren't even measuring the output with the same standards Intel or AMD use for their computer chips. It would be like me saying, muscle disease> "I can bench press 2500 pounds" and you say wow!! lets see you do it, so I go to my bank get 2500 British Pounds from the foreign currency teller in paper bills and lift them....:) Of course at that point you might chuckle or you might think I really cheated you, especially if we a little wager on whether or not I could do what I said. I'm sure there are groups out there like consumer reports that buy and test these vehicles, but I would like to see a more exacting standard used to convey the true reality of the numbers they post. I suppose thats why we have lists like this. Just my rambling 2 cents...ok, so it's more like a quarter! C.K. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:46:45 -0400 From: "John W. Barron" Subject: FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up Well I certainly got a lot of grief for posting the information about dealer sabatoge to my son's truck. What has escaped many folk's notice is that this is not a very serious hazard - otherwise all owners would be required to go to the dealer for a disconnect - cable cutting ceremony. Don't you think the shysters at Ford's legal dept. looked into this? I will wager with anyone that the dealer notice did not include instructions on how to tell a "good" cable from a "bad" one!. Just cut them all, if customer comes in and makes an inquiry about the recall. Otherwise, wait 'till parts come in. Remember, not a single cruise control has "stuck" because of the problem Ford discovered. - -- John W. Barron j.w.barron worldnet.att.net PCS Mobile Phone: 919-272-2384 Avoyelles Parish (LA) Web Page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.mindspring.com/~jwbarron/avoyeles.htm == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 12:53:57 -0500 From: "David Moore" Subject: RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread Yes I agree about the breasts but I can't say that anyone else other than the affected woman would be harmed/killed but the decision to leave a /known/ safety problem in place that could kill others is a bit beyond comparison. david - -----Original Message----- From: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com [mailto:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of Keith Veren Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 10:36 PM To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Subject: FTE 97up - End of the Thread The root of this whole thread: Total lack of communication. The dealer should have let the owner know that it wanted to cut the cable. The car does not belong to the dealer. The dealer should not have cut the cable without communicating the necessity to the owner and getting permission. The letter from Ford specifically states that owners MAY REQUEST that the cable be cut (for free) to ensure the cruise-control is not operated accedentally by the owner or by an unfamiliar driver. We do not lop-off a ladies breast to save her from cancer, even if it is medically necessary to prevent death, unless we have her permission. Keith - -----Original Message----- From: Jean Marc Chartier To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Date: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 10:15 PM Subject: Re: FTE 97up - RECALL ACTION >"C. K. Hartline" wrote: >> >> FWIW, I didn't read menace into what he wrote about his son noticing the >> cruise that was cut by the dealer without his permission. Ford notices a >> problem, but can't fix it, because they don't have the parts, not because >> the customer isn't willing to come in and get it fixed. Instead of being >> told politely not to use the cruise because it was affected, or asking to >> cut the cable, the dealership took it upon themselves to disable the system >> completely without consulting the owner of the vehicle. THAT FOR WHATEVER >> REASON IS SABOTAGE!!!! I understand that it was for a 'good' cause, but >> then what Ford should be doing is notifying customers to bring in their >> vehicles to have the cruise disabled. MOST of these recalls are 'potential' >> problems, not eminant ones. NO, I don't want my cruise going crazy and >> taking control from me, but I don't need anyone taking my vehicle's >> capability and deciding whats acceptable without my permission either. That >> would be like me deciding that in bad weather your truck's big tires are >> potential hydroplaning hazards, so I would just stick a knife in them >> >> dictating to you what I could simply advise you of as a hazard>. I don't >> want to kill anyone on the road, but if a Ford dealership pulled that stunt >> on my NEW TRUCK, I would be madder than . And >> that in and of itself doesn't make me a menace, but it does mean I've been >> sabotaged by my dealership. If we really want to save all the >> mothers,sisters, and children we haven't maimed and killed by out of control >> cars, then lets just go back about a hundred years and go back to horse and >> buggy days, but then horses back then were unpredictable too. And maybe >> just maybe, if the dealership would have been up front with the service the >> boy wouldn't have had a need to see if the cruise still worked. >> >> Personally, after the recall notice I would have avoided using it until the >> parts came in. Obviously they used it until the notice came in and then had >> the dealer check to see if their vehicle was affected, the dealer is at >> fault, not the customer. >> >> My 2 cents worth, >> C.K. >> >> Oh and one last thing! If you have an affected vehicle, use some common >> sense, avoid using your cruise control, and while you're at it, avoid >> getting your vehicle serviced by a dealership you can't trust to level with >> you!! >> >> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > >C.K. > > Did you get a letter from Ford? Do you know of the >contents of this letter? I am not in disagreement about the >dealer's actions. I am disgusted that some ignorant person >would attempt to use cruise control after being warned not >to do so. The recall letter is very clear about this. > > You have attempted to deflect the blatant disregard for >safety by stating that what the dealer did was wrong. It >was wrong but that is not my point... Do not use the cruise >control of an affected vehicle it could be dangerous. > >Kindest regards > >Jean Marc Chartier >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:06:25 -0500 From: "Union Auto" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Door gaskets The part numbers are F81Z 2520758 aa Front and F81Z 26253A24 AA for the rear. The bad news is that Ford won't pay to add them. There's a SSM (special service message) that effective mid year Ford Won't pay to install the strips on trucks with running boards due to the fact that the boards already provide the sound deading. Your dealer might not know this and could possibly cover it under warranty though. Nathan Bernard Union Auto, Inc. - ----- Original Message ----- From: George Rigney To: Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 7:54 AM Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Door gaskets > Nathan, > > It's an XLT crew cab with factory running boards (some posts have suggested > that this makes a difference). It was built in January of this year (I can > get the exact build date and the VIN if you need it). They're missing from > the front doors, but I didn't think to check the back. It's a fantastic > truck and we have no complaints at all. We find the ride extremely quiet > even without the gaskets, but dirt does tend to gather outside the frame > gaskets. When we bring it in for tire rotation in a couple of months, I'm > going to get the gaskets whether they're under warranty or not. My sincere > thanks for the wealth of information you have provided this group. > > George > > 1974 Gran Torino Elite 351W > 1984 LTD Crown Victoria 302 > 1999 F250 SD CC V10 > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:22:53 -0500 From: "C. K. Hartline" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Recall 97 Up I think that gets back to 'potential' problem versus 'iminent' problem. Either way, I'll be glad when they get the parts and things get back to normal... C.K. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:23:20 EDT From: RSnovi aol.com Subject: FTE 97up - ordered intermed. pipe for 99PSD hey guys, hope there isnt any EPA guys listening! Well i ordered the intermediate pipe to retro fit 99 to 99.5 status on my 142"wb F250 SD, out the door was like 70. and change, yikes! For a pipe i could have made probably for 25. I should have it next week. Will give a rundown on swap and performance enhanced , better turbo spool or if i just tossed more money down the drain. Guy at the parts counter did ask me what it was for, i was like uhhh its a piece of exhaust. :) oh btw: thanks nathan for part no.! Ross S. 99 F250SD PSD/SC/4x4 9sec93cobra == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:59:03 -0500 From: "C. K. Hartline" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - End of the Thread Fellas we could all carry this thing waaaaaaay waaaaaaaaaaay out there, I mean, shoot, if you wanna use the 'potential' for killing or maiming, then we should just blow up the world and kill all the people who could be potential killers or maimers...since anyone could be a potential criminal or murderer. Same goes for these vehicles, I mean: you ever have your brakes fade away from you unexpectedly? I have. Did I sue the manufacturer of my car? NO!! Did I go to a mechanic and determine that brake fading problem was a potential for disaster so I just had him cut the ignition wire so the car couldn't be used until the parts came in to fix the problem? NOOOO!!! But if the mechanic, told me not to drive it til we got the brakes fixed, I took his advice. Had my dad not said anything and simply pulled the distributor in an effort to keep me from using the car without even explaning the situation to me.... but I wasn't that stupid!> don't you think I could have simply fixed the distributor problem and driven with bad brakes? And to think this has been about something Ford discovered, but can't fix due to their limitation of proper parts, and then rather than tell the customer up front, they take matters into their own hands. And for what it's worth, removing a woman's breast without her consent would no doubt lead to deep depression in which she would vent her anger on anyone who looked like the doctor who preformed the surgery...This is of course being very facicious...but you get my meaning. Bottom line, Ford dealers have no right to tamper with a customer car that results in destruction of a product if there is POTENTIAL for the product to be defective...doesn't ammunition fall under this category too?> without the customer's express permission. At the same time, the customer has a direct responsibility to read any correspondence from the manufacturer that has direct bearing on the proper functioning of their vehicle. As I've said before, I would have simply quit using the CC control> until I could get the parts. But then I would seriously have considered a direct conversation with the owner of the dealership after they cut my cable without my permission. And hey, there's always the POTENTIAL to take out a full page ad stating the dealership cut the cable without my permission and without telling me they had done it. We can argue this stuff til we are like allllll soooooo blue in the face that pretty shade of blue they just added to the SD lineup...LOL Although I will say again don't kill me for this good sir> I would not have driven after I got the notice with the cc, I do find it amusing that there hasn't been one incident of the problem occuring on a currently licensed vehicle. Just my next 2 bits worth, C.K. == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:59:09 -0400 From: ryana asg.com (Ryan Allen) Subject: FTE 97up - Cruise Recall Anyone interested in knowing about the recall should visit Ford's website and check their VIN to see if they are involved in the recall. I did that with my 1999 F150 4x4 and it wasn't involved. Then go to the dealer ONLY when the parts are in. My $.02. Cheers, Ryan Y2K Team Lead/Intranet Specialist Internal Y2K Task Force Allen Systems Group http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.asg.com ## Please visit my Personal Page ## ## http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.gate.net/~airwolf ## ## Updated w/New Y2K Information ## == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 15:14:08 -0500 From: George Rigney Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Door gaskets Thank you very much, Nathan. It won't hurt to ask. Even if they won't cover it, I'll spring for them if they're not outrageously priced. George 1974 Gran Torino Elite 351W 1984 LTD Crown Victoria 302 1999 F250 SD CC V10 - -----Original Message----- From: Union Auto [mailto:unionaut adiis.net] Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 2:06 PM To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Door gaskets The part numbers are F81Z 2520758 aa Front and F81Z 26253A24 AA for the rear. The bad news is that Ford won't pay to add them. There's a SSM (special service message) that effective mid year Ford Won't pay to install the strips on trucks with running boards due to the fact that the boards already provide the sound deading. Your dealer might not know this and could possibly cover it under warranty though. Nathan Bernard Union Auto, Inc. - ----- Original Message ----- From: George Rigney To: Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 7:54 AM Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Door gaskets > Nathan, > > It's an XLT crew cab with factory running boards (some posts have suggested > that this makes a difference). It was built in January of this year (I can > get the exact build date and the VIN if you need it). They're missing from > the front doors, but I didn't think to check the back. It's a fantastic > truck and we have no complaints at all. We find the ride extremely quiet > even without the gaskets, but dirt does tend to gather outside the frame > gaskets. When we bring it in for tire rotation in a couple of months, I'm > going to get the gaskets whether they're under warranty or not. My sincere > thanks for the wealth of information you have provided this group. > > George > > 1974 Gran Torino Elite 351W > 1984 LTD Crown Victoria 302 > 1999 F250 SD CC V10 > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:30:46 -0500 From: "Union Auto" Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall As a dealer this recall is very infuriating. Ford sends out letters, but won't support it with parts. I wish some people would threaten buy back to see what happens. As for using the cruise, I would still use mine. Odds of it having problems are slim to none, and if it did just put it in neutral, turn the key off and after the engine stops, turn the key back on. I've had throttles stick on vehicles many times and have never had an accident because of it. Nathan Bernard - ----- Original Message ----- From: David Moore To: Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 12:53 PM Subject: RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread > Yes I agree about the breasts but I can't say that anyone else other than > the affected woman would be harmed/killed but the decision to leave a > /known/ safety problem in place that could kill others is a bit beyond > comparison. > > david > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 16:12:18 -0500 From: "Charles Abraham" Subject: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! I thought this true story was interesting enough to share, A guy that works at the same company I do had recently purchased a new Ford vehicle (not sure of model), on a Saturday and returned it the following Monday because he just didn't like it. Nothing wrong with it, just didn't like it. When he dropped it off on the dealer's lot and informed them that he had changed his mind and did not want this car and was returning it. The dealer said "you can't do that", and he replied "who yes I can". Then the dealer said "if you leave here without that car we'll have it towed to your address and bill you for it", which he then said "go ahead it's your now", and walked. He then stopped at his credit union and had the check for the down payment canceled. About a month later he received his first statement from Ford financing. He called them and informed them that he decided against buying the vehicle and return the following Monday (by Illinois law dealers must be closed on Sunday). And that was the end of it. I never heard of returning a car, everything else but not a car. Apparently, Illinois' also has a law that gives a buyer up to five working days to return anything that they've purchased. Nathan, did you ever get somebody like this at your dealership? == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 16:17:43 -0500 From: "Union Auto" Subject: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Just got word that Week # 17 is the last week for Scheduling Super Duty's. We just started Week #15 today, so that means all trucks to be built should be scheduled in the next three weeks. I don't know if this is just for the KC region or national, but even if other regions are different (but I think this is national), they won't be far behind. This means that Ford will schedule the rest of the years trucks in the next three weeks. Usually this means that allocation doubles, but that means that the time from scheduling to actually being built stretches out. If your planing on ordering a '99 SD I'd recommend doing it very soon or it probably won't stand a chance of getting built (still might not even if you order today). The fax stated that they were going to try to get all retails built, but if you didn't have allocation you wouldn't get units. Nathan Bernard Union Auto, Inc. Union, IA 50258 == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:04:47 -0400 From: RAY WRIGHT Subject: Subject: FTE 97up - Exhaust chrome tips for PSD. I ordered a stainless steel tip from exaust specialist,in Manchester Ct. 50.00 includes them welding it on,don't bother getting a chrome one they don't last long at all.Should be in,in about a week.If you are interested,e-mail me at tworites home.com maybe I can hook you up with one. Ray Wright == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:18:59 -0500 From: "C. K. Hartline" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Nathan, this is very interesting, because I called a Ford dealer and was told I could order a new Ford up until the first part of June factory order on the phone> ...Obviously they are gearing up to complete retail builds to set up for next year's model...are they that far behind that they quit giving dealers trucks two months before they quit taking factory orders? This seems very very strange. C.K. Saint Louis, Missouri == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:19:08 -0700 From: "Matt Adams" Subject: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150? Has anyone installed a second battery into their f-150's? If so what type, and where did you mount it? I am installing two more sets of lights into my truck, and I have the feeling I have entirely too much attached to my battery (I have my 350 watt amp, will be up to three sets of lights, and my topper, or can I have that much all attached to the stock battery without any problems? The lights I have now are Hella 550's, the lights I will be installing are PIAA 520 Fog LIghts and PIAA 910 Driving Lights (both with remotes). Matt == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:45:08 EDT From: CERESJohnG aol.com Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? The b is for brake as in brake horsepower. The earliest dynomometers were called prony brakes as a type of design. The idea was that you but a brake shoe aginst a rotating shaft hooked to the engine and you measured the amount of torque needed to keep the brake from rotating. You kept dialing up the torgue until you could no longer keep the engine at that rpm setting despite throttle setting. Torque and rpm will give you HP. It was called bhp. The friction brake worked OK for 25, 35 hp engines, Today horspower is measured on larger dynomometers, generally tied to a hydraulic pump wher you measure gpm and pressure or a big generator with a resistive load. In any case the the principle is the same. You hold the engine at a constant speed and keep adding load until it won't hold a given rpm. It's still officially called brake hp though. And by the way, it's usually measured at the flywheel possibly with no accessories. Ford may be quoting the number with accessories or may be quoting it at the transmisson output or even at the real wheels though I doubt it. The mfrs used to quote raw engine bhp with no alternato/generator or even the fan or water pump to get higher ratings. They caught a lot of critcism for that and standardized the vehicle hp measurementto include at least some of the support hardware. I suspect that is where the difference is. Fords might more closly represent available HP while the Navistar number is the peak hp the engine is capable of producing. Just a guess but 15hp is about the difference I would expect to see in that situation. John G == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:07:35 -0700 From: "Rob Bryan" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? > Ford may be quoting the number with accessories or may be quoting it at the > transmisson output or even at the real wheels though I doubt it. The mfrs > used to quote raw engine bhp with no alternato/generator or even the fan or > water pump to get higher ratings. They caught a lot of critcism for that and > standardized the vehicle hp measurementto include at least some of the > support hardware. I suspect that is where the difference is. Fords might > more closly represent available HP while the Navistar number is the peak hp > the engine is capable of producing. Ford (and all other manufacturers since around 1972 or so) quote net HP ratings. This is with all belt-driven accessories, the air filter, and the exhaust system attached, but recorded at the flywheel. The earlier numbers were gross hp and these were determined with no belt-driven accessories, open intake, and no exhaust system. Does the Navistar label say something like "Net HP"? Rob == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:16:22 EDT From: CERESJohnG aol.com Subject: Re: FTE 97up - second battery in my f-150? Suspect the battery might be OK but your alternator may be sucking wind. I would get out there and look for the highest ampeage alternator you can get in there. I think standard these days they come wth about 85 to 95 amps. Some of the shops that specialize in super big auto stereos---- 1000 watt stuff you know the Honda Civic going down thr road going THUMPA Thumpa Thumpa and you can see the sheet metal flexing. The driver either has ear plugs or is stone deaf BUT ITS COOL.---------carry oversize alternators. They ain't cheap though. Bottom line is, the battery is like a water tank, if you pull water (current) out fster than you put it in it will eventually go dry. Two batteries will only delay the inevitable. I was able to put two batteries in my old 86 Blazer but it had provisions for a deisel and GM always had two batteries in the diesel so a new left side battery tray and away we went.. The F150 doesn't have that option though and you are just going to have to find a hole wher you can mount a battey tray. Generally if you can move the washer tank or the overflw tank you can get enough room. Check and see if the 6 cyl has them in a different location. There are some high capacity gel batteries out there as well. They are about half the width and can be mounted on their side. So two can go in a single battery tray. GOOD 4x4 flolks should be aware of of these or check with 4 wheel drive (Peterson Publishing) They had a write up or mention of them about a year back. Good Luck Suggestion, check with you local RV folks for hookup ideas. You will want to isolate the two batteries so that one cannot discharge the other but still have the alternator charge both. They never die together unless they are linked in parallel. It's always neat to be at a gas staion and pull out the jumper cables and give yourself a jump. The cables coming out generally get snickers until you start youself, then jaws drop == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:35:51 -0700 From: Roger J Hutflesz Subject: Re: FTE 97up - door gaskets F250, Diesel, long bed 1999, with no running boards. Did come with the gaskets. Roger H. On Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:23:13 -0400 GEORGE CROLL writes: >Went to the local dealer and tried to get him to put gaskets on the >bottom of my doors for free. While arguing with him >we looked at all of the SD trucks on the lot. The only trucks without >the gaskets are ones with factory running >boards. The dealer "assumes" that the gaskets are not necesssary if >the running boards are on the truck. Any truth >to this??? > >George Croll >EPA-OAR-ARD >(202)564-0162 >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info >http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:36:28 -0400 From: zman Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. I talk to a few dealers here in the Cinci area and they tell me I can order one at any time. I found this VERY hard to believe but that is what they said. Are the Y2K SDs getting a price increase? joe Union Auto wrote: > Just got word that Week # 17 is the last week for Scheduling Super Duty's. > We just started Week #15 today, so that means all trucks to be built should > be scheduled in the next three weeks. I don't know if this is just for the > KC region or national, but even if other regions are different (but I think > this is national), they won't be far behind. This means that Ford will > schedule the rest of the years trucks in the next three weeks. Usually this > means that allocation doubles, but that means that the time from scheduling > to actually being built stretches out. If your planing on ordering a '99 SD > I'd recommend doing it very soon or it probably won't stand a chance of > getting built (still might not even if you order today). The fax stated > that they were going to try to get all retails built, but if you didn't have > allocation you wouldn't get units. > > Nathan Bernard > Union Auto, Inc. > Union, IA 50258 > > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:45:51 -0400 From: GEORGE CROLL Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread got to agree with the rear wheel HP argument. In four wheeler magazine the mag put several trucks to the true Dyno test with some surprising results. the V-10 (with automatic) Ford was only marginally better in rear wheel HP than the new chevy 5.3 Vortec, both at about 180 HP and the dodge ISB diesel (with manual) was tops with about 220 HP or so. The Torque curve was even worse with the ISB putting 500+ ft lbs to the rear wheels and the V-10 ford putting far less (in the 300 or below range. the chevy 5.3 did even worse. the good news is that the PSD would probably put huge numbers to the rear wheels, the bad news for me as a V-10 owner is that the V-10 auto is pretty anemic. the mag did state that the V-10 was new and they thought after a good break in it would improve but I think all the gas motors would. this thread of thought led me to the following. One thing I have wondered is how much do you really lose in rear wheel HP when using an automaitc vs using a manual. I assume that the auto converts a lot of power to heat in the process while the manual gets only internal bearing friction losses when transferring power. If ford is building the auto to stand up to the huge torque of the PSD for durability reasons does it lead to a really inefficient unit which loses a lot of power in the process? I think this is fine for the PSD which has torque to spare but it might help explain the rather anemic rear wheel HP of the V-10 when using the same auto. I guess the good news is that the V-10 will never break the auto designed to hold up to the PSD. any automatic tranny experts out there? George Croll EPA-OAR-ARD (202)564-0162 == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 21:03:01 -0400 From: "Keith Veren" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall Agreed, Nathan. However, if you do turn the engine off with the key while driving, make sure you do not lock the steering column! I do not know if the new vehicles have a prevent-mechanism, but in many older vehicles it was possible to lock the steering wheel (and gear selector) by turning the key off (to "Lock") while driving! Keith - -----Original Message----- From: Union Auto To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Date: Thursday, April 15, 1999 4:30 PM Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall > As a dealer this recall is very infuriating. Ford sends out letters, >but won't support it with parts. I wish some people would threaten buy back >to see what happens. As for using the cruise, I would still use mine. Odds >of it having problems are slim to none, and if it did just put it in >neutral, turn the key off and after the engine stops, turn the key back on. >I've had throttles stick on vehicles many times and have never had an >accident because of it. > >Nathan Bernard > >----- Original Message ----- >From: David Moore >To: >Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 12:53 PM >Subject: RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread > > >> Yes I agree about the breasts but I can't say that anyone else other than >> the affected woman would be harmed/killed but the decision to leave a >> /known/ safety problem in place that could kill others is a bit beyond >> comparison. >> >> david >> > > >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 21:08:09 -0400 From: "Keith Veren" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Door gaskets Nathan, could you please let us know the part numbers for the door gaskets in a SuperCab? ['99 F-350 SuperDuty / XLT / SuperCab / V-10 / Longbed / Factory "Running Boards" / 4X4 / etc.] Thanks! Keith From: George Rigney To: '97up-list ford-trucks.com' Date: Thursday, April 15, 1999 4:21 PM Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Door gaskets >Thank you very much, Nathan. It won't hurt to ask. Even if they won't >cover it, I'll spring for them if they're not outrageously priced. > >George > >1974 Gran Torino Elite 351W == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:08:33 -0700 From: JJ Thomas Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Cruise Recall I don't recall if I said this here or not. But as part of my drivers education, via my uncle the sheriff, stomped on the gas pedal and told me, "Deal with it!" I learned, very quickly how to deal with a stuck throttle. He also taught me how to stop a car without the main brakes: gear down and parking brake. For driver ed, I has to stop the car going down hill. I have had a stuck throttle; massive brake fade, going down a hill; engine fire; blown clutch (twice); loss of steering; total loss of traction on black ice. I survived by knowing what to do in an emergency. Okay, the black ice I had help from the big guy above. I knew of a person that drove several miles, in rush hour traffic, with a stuck throttle, pressing hard on the brakes. What finally stopped this person, was another car. And they blamed the driving public because they honked the horn trying to get help. This person had no business operating a vehicle! Okay, that is my $.02. Now, I think this horse is dead. - -Julian At 14:30 04/15/99 -0500, you wrote: > As a dealer this recall is very infuriating. Ford sends out letters, >but won't support it with parts. I wish some people would threaten buy back >to see what happens. As for using the cruise, I would still use mine. Odds >of it having problems are slim to none, and if it did just put it in >neutral, turn the key off and after the engine stops, turn the key back on. >I've had throttles stick on vehicles many times and have never had an >accident because of it. > >Nathan Bernard > >----- Original Message ----- >From: David Moore >To: >Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 12:53 PM >Subject: RE: FTE 97up - End of the Thread > > >> Yes I agree about the breasts but I can't say that anyone else other than >> the affected woman would be harmed/killed but the decision to leave a >> /known/ safety problem in place that could kill others is a bit beyond >> comparison. >> >> david >> > > >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:12:30 -0700 From: JJ Thomas Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. Hi Nathan, I am looking at replacing my Ranger with a SD 4x4 about the end of August. My quandary is that I can not afford to pick up the truck until at least August. Should I order now and hope that it does not come in early, or should I wait till the summer? I live in Seattle, btw - -Julian At 16:17 04/15/99 -0500, you wrote: >Just got word that Week # 17 is the last week for Scheduling Super Duty's. >We just started Week #15 today, so that means all trucks to be built should >be scheduled in the next three weeks. I don't know if this is just for the >KC region or national, but even if other regions are different (but I think >this is national), they won't be far behind. This means that Ford will >schedule the rest of the years trucks in the next three weeks. Usually this >means that allocation doubles, but that means that the time from scheduling >to actually being built stretches out. If your planing on ordering a '99 SD >I'd recommend doing it very soon or it probably won't stand a chance of >getting built (still might not even if you order today). The fax stated >that they were going to try to get all retails built, but if you didn't have >allocation you wouldn't get units. > >Nathan Bernard >Union Auto, Inc. >Union, IA 50258 > >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:18:43 -0700 From: "Rob Bryan" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Rear wheel HP thread > got to agree with the rear wheel HP argument. In four wheeler magazine the > mag put several trucks to the true Dyno > test with some surprising results. > > the V-10 (with automatic) Ford was only marginally better in rear wheel HP > than the new chevy 5.3 Vortec, both at > about 180 HP and the dodge ISB diesel (with manual) was tops with about 220 > HP or so. The Torque curve was > even worse with the ISB putting 500+ ft lbs to the rear wheels and the V-10 > ford putting far less (in the 300 or below > range. the chevy 5.3 did even worse. That must have been a VERY fresh V10! In the latest Truck Trend chassis dyno test, the GM 5.3 put out 182.8hp 4750r/min and 221.7ft/lb 3750r/min with 3.73 gears. The Dodge 5.9 (gas) put out 194.7hp 4500r/min and 257.5ft/lb 3500r/min with 3.92 gears. The Ford 5.4 (260hp version) put out 209.2hp 4250r/min and 281.2ft/lb 3000r/min with 3.55 gears. All of the trucks were automatics (the F-150 had a 4R100). The Chevy numbers here seem to agree with the Four Wheeler numbers, but it seems like the 5.4 is doing much better than the 6.8, which doesn't seem right, even with the 5.4L's improved heads. But then again, I've heard that the Tritons are VERY tight when new. Rob == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 21:07:55 -0500 From: "Karl Nyhus" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Balance out. >JJ Thomas wrote: >I am looking at replacing my Ranger with a SD 4x4 about the end of >August. My quandary is that I can not afford to pick up the truck until >at least August. Should I order now and hope that it does not come >in early, or should I wait till the summer? I ordered my '97 F150 in October 1996 for delivery "sometime" the following May so I could build up my down payment. My salesman came through as promised and delivered it to me on May 9th, 1997. The only problem came along about March when I began wishing I could get it sooner but found out that the schedule was pretty well locked in... Karl == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:21:31 -0700 From: Kent Tombs Subject: Re: FTE 97up - !999 SD door panel removal ?? Bill wrote: > > I would like to remove the inside door panels from both > front and rear doors on my 1999 F-250 supercab to add some > sound deadner behind the panels. I think there held in > place with clips and will come out without much problem, but > are there any hidden screws that also hold the panel on. > Sure would hate to break the plastic. Thanks, Bill > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html The front door you pull up on the black piece your power switches are in , you will then find a 9/32 bolt, Pop out the red reflector down at the bottom side of door , you will find a second 9/32 bolt. Once the bolts are removed the door panel lifts up , it is on hooks. The rear door you remove the two phillips screws holding on the rear window latch, then pull the panel off straight towards you. You can then see two 9/32 bolts remove them, you will also see black plastic pop rivet type devices, push the center into the door and the outer part will come out, you then lift up on the bottom panel it is on hooks, reach inside and grab the pop rivet type things from bottom of door. Assembly is the reverse order. Sorry if not in perfect detail but I think you will understand if you try taking apart. Hope this helps == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 22:29:20 EDT From: RSnovi aol.com Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! In a message dated 99-04-15 17:18:43 EDT, you write: its 3 days to reconsider here in FL RS Date:99-04-15 17:18:43 EDT From:abrahamc agcs.com (Charles Abraham) Sender:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com Reply-to:97up-list ford-trucks.com To:97up-list ford-trucks.com I thought this true story was interesting enough to share, A guy that works at the same company I do had recently purchased a new Ford vehicle (not sure of model), on a Saturday and returned it the following Monday because he just didn't like it. Nothing wrong with it, just didn't like it. When he dropped it off on the dealer's lot and informed them that he had changed his mind and did not want this car and was returning it. The dealer said "you can't do that", and he replied "who yes I can". Then the dealer said "if you leave here without that car we'll have it towed to your address and bill you for it", which he then said "go ahead it's your now", and walked. He then stopped at his credit union and had the check for the down payment canceled. About a month later he received his first statement from Ford financing. He called them and informed them that he decided against buying the vehicle and return the following Monday (by Illinois law dealers must be closed on Sunday). And that was the end of it. I never heard of returning a car, everything else but not a car. Apparently, Illinois' also has a law that gives a buyer up to five working days to return anything that they've purchased. Nathan, did you ever get somebody like this at your dealership? == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- Return-Path: Received: from rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (rly-zc01.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.1]) by air-zc01.mail.aol.com (v59.4) with SMTP; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:18:43 -0400 Received: from ford-trucks.com (ford-trucks.com [192.41.63.203]) by rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id RAA15469; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:18:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (fordtruc localhost) by ford-trucks.com (8.8.5) id RAA28042; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:16:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bootstrap.agcs.com (bootstrap.agcs.com [130.131.48.11]) by ford-trucks.com (8.8.5) id RAA27938; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:16:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gnmail.agcs.com (gnmail.agcs.com [130.131.174.180]) by bootstrap.agcs.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA20630 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:14:46 -0700 (MST) Posted-Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 14:14:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from agcs.com ([130.131.178.101]) by gnmail.agcs.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.54) with ESMTP id AAA2114 for ; Thu, 15 Apr 1999 16:13:23 -0500 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 16:12:18 -0500 From: "Charles Abraham" Organization: AG Communication Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Subject: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com >> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 23:05:38 EDT From: CERESJohnG aol.com Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 99.5 PSD 250 HP? Thanks Rob. I knew they made that change in measurement approach but not sure when it was. John G == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 21:42:57 -0700 From: "mlester" Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! We do not get any "cooling off period" in California. When you sign it is yours. Martial - -----Original Message----- From: RSnovi aol.com To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com Date: Thursday, April 15, 1999 7:36 PM Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Customer Returns Car - Didn't Like it! >In a message dated 99-04-15 17:18:43 EDT, you write: > > >its 3 days to reconsider here in FL > >RS > > Date: 99-04-15 17:18:43 EDT > From: abrahamc agcs.com (Charles Abraham) > Sender: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com > Reply-to: 97up-list ford-trucks.com > To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com > > I thought this true story was interesting enough to share, > > A guy that works at the same company I do had recently > purchased a new Ford vehicle (not sure of model), on a > Saturday and returned it the following Monday because he > just didn't like it. Nothing wrong with it, just didn't like it. > > When he dropped it off on the dealer's lot and informed them > that he had changed his mind and did not want this car and > was returning it. The dealer said "you can't do that", and he > replied "who yes I can". Then the dealer said "if you leave here > without that car we'll have it towed to your address and bill you > for it", which he then said "go ahead it's your now", and walked. > > He then stopped at his credit union and had the check for the > down payment canceled. > > About a month later he received his first statement from Ford > financing. He called them and informed them that he decided > against buying the vehicle and return the following Monday > (by Illinois law dealers must be closed on Sunday). And that > was the end of it. > > I never heard of returning a car, everything else but not a car. > Apparently, Illinois' also has a law that gives a buyer up to > five working days to return anything that they've purchased..... To access the rest of this feature you must be a logged in Registered User Of Ford Truck Enthusiasts
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