97up-list-digest Saturday, April 10 1999 Volume 02 : Number 090



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question
Re: FTE 97up - TBS
Re: FTE 97up - Fan clutch follies Part II
Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question
FTE 97up - Screw ford and the $80.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FTE 97up - FYI: Split Sliding Window (Tinted) for '99 F250 in Houston, Tx
FTE 97up - F250 PSD Ready to buy please Help.
Re: FTE 97up - F250 PSD Ready to buy please Help.
Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question
Re: FTE 97up - TBS
FTE 97up - Non-Automatic Transmission Oil Coolers
Re: FTE 97up - Reply to TSB for fuel regulator.

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Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 21:43:15 EDT
From: CERESJohnG aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question

Come On People, get real. Ford is producing a "functional" vehicle not a
concours show car.

Any paint on the undercarriage is and has always been minimal at best. All of
the undercarriage will wind up the standard dirt brown in short order "first
or second rainstorm" anyway. Yes it looks nice and the the paint is there to
look pretty.at delivery. Actually, the paint's there to make it cleaner to
handle at the assembly facility after storage in the outside storage area. If
you want something better and are going to dedicate yourself to the thankless
job of keeping that mess under there in pristine condition, pull the axle
housings out, have them powder coated and put chrome covers on the the
pumpkin. Then spend all your spare time keeping the d--n thing cleaned and
polished. With the trucks as tall as they are, I realize that that portions
of the undercarriage are visible but that axle would FUNCTION and survive
just as well without a drop of paint on it.

John G
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Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 21:56:41 -0400
From: Eric
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - TBS

At 09:41 PM 4/9/99 -0400, you wrote:
>Can anybody give me the TBS for the lowering of the rearend of the superduty.
> A friend at work is having a hard time to get the dealerships approval on
>this. For what I understand, the 4" spacer is removed and a 2" spacer is
>installed. This includes the change out of the brake lines. (5th wheel
>towing)
>
>Thanks
>
>John Patterson
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I just searched the NHTSA web site and can't find anything for this under
1998 or 1999 Super Duty.

You can check out the TSB's for yourself at
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/tsb/servicemmy1.cfm


Eric
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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 02:44:03 GMT
From: tlveik megavision.com (Thomas Veik)
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fan clutch follies Part II

On Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:50:09 -0700 (PDT), Dan Gaudenti
wrote:

> service. I'm going to convert my F-150 to electric (this weekend if I
> don't work and if I can get the stock fan off), I'll let you all know how
> it goes.

How do you sense temperature? Do you add an extra temp sensor, or do
you tie into the F-150's stock temp sensor some how?

Tom
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Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 22:47:18 -0400
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question

In my "Quick Question" I wanted to know if everyones F-250 or 350 4X4 has
rust on the front axle, and if so, do they agree that a new 30K vehicle
should come from the factory that way. I don't think so. You seem to think
that because something can get dirty easy the factory should not bother
putting a protecting coating on it. Jees, sounds like you would not care if
the whole body came rusted. By the way, I have a pressure washer and all my
other cars and trucks (e.g., my old '87 Toyota 4-Runner with 180,000 miles
on it) came from the factory with fully painted (or undercoated) axles and
undercarriage and I have always been able to blast the undercarrieage clean
in no time at all. Sorry, I don't buy your arguement that it is a tough
"thankless" job to keep all the parts of your vehicle clean, if you have the
proper tools (a pressure washer or a good garden hose). [and yes, I do
off-road and snowplow, so I get all kinds of dirt, salt and crap on the
undercarriage]. I think they buyer of a 30K vehicle should have the option
of letting things "below" rust away, or taking care of it so it will last
and look good for 25 years. By the way, a good functioning piece of
equipment is one that will remain functioning for a long time, rust eating
away tie-rods, axle tubes, front spindle bolts and axle flanges make
maintenance and repair more difficult and destructive to the item, resulting
in a decreased FUNCTIONING. I am not asking that all the frame and axle
parts be Gold Plated, just given the basic protective coatings required to
preserve the structural integrity of the part. Heck, they could even
Cosmoline the parts and although they would attract dirt like flypaper until
they were completely covered, at least the metal would be preserved so if
and when disassembly for maintenance and/or repair was required, the pieces
and fasteners would not be rust-fused together.


Keith




>Come On People, get real. Ford is producing a "functional" vehicle not a
>concours show car.
>
>Any paint on the undercarriage is and has always been minimal at best. All
of
>the undercarriage will wind up the standard dirt brown in short order
"first
>or second rainstorm" anyway. Yes it looks nice and the the paint is there
to
>look pretty.at delivery. Actually, the paint's there to make it cleaner
to
>handle at the assembly facility after storage in the outside storage area.
If
>you want something better and are going to dedicate yourself to the
thankless
>job of keeping that mess under there in pristine condition, pull the axle
>housings out, have them powder coated and put chrome covers on the the
>pumpkin. Then spend all your spare time keeping the d--n thing cleaned and
>polished. With the trucks as tall as they are, I realize that that
portions
>of the undercarriage are visible but that axle would FUNCTION and survive
>just as well without a drop of paint on it.
>
>John G
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Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 22:14:00 PDT
From: "Max ."
Subject: FTE 97up - Screw ford and the $80.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>From the ford-diesel website.....

my 99.5 did not come with a cat conv. so it is staight all the way
out. no it is not much louder just a deeper tone. i got my pipe from
a big rig buddy who got it from a big rig repair shop.
SUMMET racing equipment a mail order outfit in akron ohio sells a
3.5inch 4 ft. long pipe for 14.99 with free shipping.
call them at 1 800-230-3030

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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 00:13:51 -0500
From: "David Moore"
Subject: FTE 97up - FYI: Split Sliding Window (Tinted) for '99 F250 in Houston, Tx

I have installed a new power rear sliding window (much thanks to Scott
Matus!) and now have my nearly new tinted, split window. If you would like
to replace your single piece rear window in your Fx50 and you live in
Houston, Tx just let me know.

Thanks,
david moore
dmoore dmoore.com

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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:32:26 EDT
From: Ford4x4 aol.com
Subject: FTE 97up - F250 PSD Ready to buy please Help.

I am ready to order a 2000 F250, SD Extra Cab, Lariat, 4x4, Power
Stroke, 6spd, long box, I don't have a trade so it's going to be a straight
forward purchase. I have all my options selected. The only option I ponder
over is my choice of transmission. I've talked to one dealer in the Southern
Oregon area. He said I'd have to wait a few months for the 2000 prices and
particulars. He gave me a price of about $1500 over invoice on a 1999 and
about a 2-3 month delivery time. If I wanted one I'd have to order it
straight away.
He said they won't be able to give $1500 over on the 2000 model,
probably closer to $2500. The reason given was they will be able to sell
there allocation without a problem, so they don't feel they need to discount
the price any further.
I do realize the dealers are in business to make money, however I would
appreciate it if anybody knows of a dealer in the area who is a little more
flexible in pricing. Am I getting the correct information about dealer
allocation? Are there advantages to ordering accessories like bed liners
with the initial order or picking them up later.
I always feel that the automatic transmission is the weak link in these low
revving high torque trucks, is there any truth to that?

Thanks in advance

John
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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:06:29 -0500
From: "C. K. Hartline"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F250 PSD Ready to buy please Help.

Two ways to look at it, either the dealer is gonna take your money or he
isn't...I wouldn't pass up a large dealer holdback because a customer wanted
to pay less than the normal ripping I charge other folks....money is money.
I'd shop around intently and find the guy who's willing to make a sale...say
at the end of the month when things can be pretty tight for
salespeople...rainy days at the end of the month are even better...and don't
be afraid to walk out...check out the site at

www.edmunds.com

I'm not paying more than 500 over invoice...and if I don't get the truck I
want because no Ford dealer will sell it to me, then it doesn't say much for
Ford at all...and believe me I know I can get the truck for that easy. I
had a salesman attempt to tell me he wouldn't come down at all on the MSRP
sticker on the lot because the truck would sell itself on a F250 4x4 V-10
CC. Guess what, the truck is still sitting there...if they want to move it
here in Saint Louis, they'll have to bargain with someone sooner or later.
Or some wealthy idiot will buy it and never care about the money he's thrown
away. Tell them you're ready to deal, if you can, get your financing in
place ahead of time, and have a set price for everything you want...get some
more homework done about costs at the dealership to process the order for
your truck. Be prepared to know your stuff...they'll try to add stuff to
make the profit margin higher if they can. And no, I'm not saying alllll
dealers are like that, there are some places that do sell units to the
public for less and rely on the good sell to give them plenty of return
service work. I guess the ball really sits in your court as to whether
you're willing to let anyone make you pay more than you want for your truck.

Just my 2 cents,
C.K.

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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:18:29 -0700
From: Gene Ball
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Quick Question

Like mine too no new truck should have rust anywhere!
I wonder if that rust is covered under the warranty?
Gene

Keith Veren wrote:

> Just a quick question to everyone with a '99 F-250 and/or 350 Super/Duty
> 4X4:
>
> Did your truck's front axle (axle tubes and pumpkin) and front hubs/rotors
> (backside) come from the factory rust and/or cheaply painted which then
> quick became rust???
>
> I have talked to many people at my dealership (mechanics) who say that they
> notice that just about all the axles (but especially the front ones from
> Dana) come rusty from the factory. On my F-350, the rear axle (Ford
> Corporate) is fairly well painted; however, the the paint seems to be only
> one thin layer and there is no evidence of primer. Is it just me, or does
> everyone buying a new 30K truck seem to agree that one should get rust-free
> metal on all the parts??
>
> Keith
>
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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 01:37:32 -0700
From: Gene Ball
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - TBS

I will email the TBS directly to anyone who wants it!
Gene

JPatte5238 aol.com wrote:

> Can anybody give me the TBS for the lowering of the rearend of the superduty.
> A friend at work is having a hard time to get the dealerships approval on
> this. For what I understand, the 4" spacer is removed and a 2" spacer is
> installed. This includes the change out of the brake lines. (5th wheel
> towing)
>
> Thanks
>
> John Patterson
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 02:51:39 EDT
From: SchmidP aol.com
Subject: FTE 97up - Non-Automatic Transmission Oil Coolers

(First Post on this list.)
I have not seen an answer to the question:
"Why would a manual shift transmission have an Oil Cooler".
included>>

Having some experience with Transmission Overheating on manual shift units I=20
will try to explain why Oil Coolers are used.

When the Transmission is in direct drive (1: to 1: ratio) the heat buildup=20
within the transmission is minimal, however when in overdrive OR in a reduce=
d=20
gear, power going through the cluster gear in the transmission generates a=20
great deal of internal heat.

Now, if we add a PSD in front of and a load (trailer or what ever) behind=20
this unit and pull a long Grade, we may just have the brute torque to pull=20
this rig west across Kansas, through to Denver in Overdrive.
This may not seem like a hill but it's up all the way.
Now, we are starting up the hill to the Eisenhower Pass, my guess is that=20
direct gear won=92t pull it thus we wiggle the stick a little and end up in =
a=20
reduced gear, again generating heat. =20

In the winter this may be no big deal, but a lot of people travel in the=20
summer when the temp. is higher under the truck. Lets take an 80 degree=20
ambient temperature, reflect the Sun off the black top road surface, air=20
going through the Air Conditioner Condenser, Engine Radiator, Turbo Inner=20
Cooler, and put an exhaust system in front of, and beside the transmission. =20
Need I say more?

As for me, when I get my PSD, give me a BIG Transmission Cooler.

Regards,
Paul S.

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Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 05:28:06 EDT
From: FISHNG1 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Reply to TSB for fuel regulator.

Scott, you are correct the TSB is 98-17-16.
I had them change mine because on some earlier post I saw that there was a
TSB on the regulator and also a bad o-ring when attached to engine. They had
said that it made a tapping sound similar to a lifter noise on a gas engine.
I seem to have this noise that is not always in rythem with the diesel
clatter. I still have this noise and will see the dealer to have them ride
with me and to tell me if it is normal. I do not remember this noise when I
first got the truck. (5500 miles now) They do say they get noiser after they
are broke in.

By the way, I ran into a guy who had a 99 F-350 that was built on 1-08-99
and he had the T/C noise. He did not know anything about it and when he
listened to mine and I told him that I had a new T/C, he could not believe
how quiet mine was next to his. He will be making a trip to the dealer. His
did have all the 99.5 changes though. His Turbo was different than mine and
was wrapped with a foil insulation and his had the new airbox design. Mine
does too....Now! He also had a leveling kit installed with 315 - 75R16 tires
on his stock rims. Looked good.
He then took me for a ride, because he said that he had installed a
DynoSource (???) Chip in it and that it made a big difference. He jumped on
it and let me tell you that mine is a Dog compared to his with the chip. I
think I am going to look into that.
And one last thing, when he jumped on it, the rear end started shuddering
, kind of sounded like spring wrap, he said he had that since day one. Mine....

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