97up-list-digest Thursday, February 18 1999 Volume 02 : Number 045



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage
Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage
FTE 97up - Spare tire lock
FTE 97up - fuel filter
RE: FTE 97up - fuel filter
FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
FTE 97up - Musty Smell from Air Conditioning system
Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
FTE 97up - Lets tell the Govt. NO
FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!!!] and FDAF
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!
FTE 97up - EPA
FTE 97up - Re: Rust specs
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!
FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Pop-out Windows
FTE 97up - new truck
FTE 97up - RE: F350 Chassis vs Pickup
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - new truck
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
FTE 97up - EPA -Reply
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
Re: FTE 97up - EPA -Reply
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
RE: FTE 97up - fuel filter
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 07:14:39 -0600
From: "NinjaRider"
Subject: FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage

Hello All,

I have a '97 Ranger XLT with the 3.0 liter and 5 speed. The truck has just
over 8000 kms (I am up here in Canada). At the last fill up I calculated my
gas mileage as 14.5 mpg. This seems a bit low to me or is it because the
engine is still breaking in? Should it be getting a higher mileage?

Thanks,
Peter

ninjarider home.com
1986 Kawasaki Zx1000R Ninja
1997 Ford Ranger XLT
"Always try to keep the rubber side down!"

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:26:04 GMT
From: alannorthstar mindspring.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage

On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 07:14:39 -0600, you wrote:

:Hello All,
:
:I have a '97 Ranger XLT with the 3.0 liter and 5 speed. The truck has =
just
:over 8000 kms (I am up here in Canada). At the last fill up I calculated=
my
:gas mileage as 14.5 mpg. This seems a bit low to me or is it because =
the
:engine is still breaking in? Should it be getting a higher mileage?
:
:Thanks,
:Peter
:
I have a 98 Ranger with the 3.0 and the 4-speed overdrive
automatic. (4x4) and 14.5 is at the high end of what I've ever
gotten! In the summer it is about 14, and in the winter it's
averaging around 10mpg.

Later,
Alan
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 09:22:06 -0500
From: "Mike McNany"
Subject: FTE 97up - Spare tire lock

I, too, looked at buy the Ford factory spare Lock. However I didn't. I
bought one of the type that has a rod that goes down through the lug holes
instead. Even though I have to crawl under the vehicle and align the rod and
to lock/unlock it. It was only $20 NOT on sale. The factory ratchet
mechanism has a u-joint that I believe could be broken by a knowledgeable
and prepared thief. Check it out and make your own decision.
Mike McNany

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:33:07 -0700 (MST)
From: montblackburn webtv.net (mont blackburn)
Subject: FTE 97up - fuel filter

The fuel filter on our 99PS has to be the worst designed filter I"ve
ever seen. I waited until NAPA started to carry it after the first of
the year because I refused to pay $64 for a teeny weeny filter. I am
thinking of modifying the fuel line so I can put in a twist-on filter
like my Autocar had.
I agree that there should be some factory installed mud flaps on the
front. Our truck filled the steps up with mud every time our ranch road
was just a little muddy. It took my wife quite a lot of time to dig the
stuff off so I put mud flaps on the front end of the steps. Built them
out of some white flaps from my old Autocar.



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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:19:05 -0500
From: "Gallagher, Frank"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - fuel filter

I agree - but I bought one because I thought no one else had
them. I still can't figure out how to get the darned cover off yet!
Ford's instructions on this are the worst. Took me twenty minutes of
looking around just to find the drain valve, because the picture in the
user manual was very different.

I need to get some front mud flaps that go with the factory steps -
tried to use the ones off of my wife's
626. They didn't fit and I got into big trouble. Guess I'll
have to look at the ford web site to see if they have anything.

frankg


- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
- --------------------------------------------
> The fuel filter on our 99PS has to be the worst designed filter I"ve
> ever seen. I waited until NAPA started to carry it after the first
> of
> the year because I refused to pay $64 for a teeny weeny filter. I am
> thinking of modifying the fuel line so I can put in a twist-on filter
> like my Autocar had.
> I agree that there should be some factory installed mud flaps on the
> front. Our truck filled the steps up with mud every time our ranch
> road
> was just a little muddy. It took my wife quite a lot of time to dig
> the
> stuff off so I put mud flaps on the front end of the steps. Built them
> out of some white flaps from my old Autocar.
>
>
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
> http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:37:03 -0800
From: "Jarchow, Jaye"
Subject: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

What is the wait time when factory ordering a F-150 4x4 XLT SC?
How long will Ford take factory orders for new '99s this year?
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:46:30 -0800
From: "Michael D. Sheridan"
Subject: FTE 97up - Musty Smell from Air Conditioning system

Folks:

I wonder how many of us have about had it with
the musty smell coming from our air conditioning
systems on our new Fords and Rangers from time
to time.

Isn't it about time we get something done about
this with Ford or are we going to sit in there
and breathe that poison from the mildew?

Anyone working on this?

Michael
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:48:53 -0800
From: "Alan Wilson"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Mileage

I have a '98 3.0 liter Supercab Ranger. Initially I got about 15.5
mpg...recently I checked it and I got about 16.2 mpg I have 12,000 miles on it.

alannorthstar mindspring.com wrote:

> On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 07:14:39 -0600, you wrote:
>
> :Hello All,
> :
> :I have a '97 Ranger XLT with the 3.0 liter and 5 speed. The truck has just
> :over 8000 kms (I am up here in Canada). At the last fill up I calculated my
> :gas mileage as 14.5 mpg. This seems a bit low to me or is it because the
> :engine is still breaking in? Should it be getting a higher mileage?
> :
> :Thanks,
> :Peter
> :
> I have a 98 Ranger with the 3.0 and the 4-speed overdrive
> automatic. (4x4) and 14.5 is at the high end of what I've ever
> gotten! In the summer it is about 14, and in the winter it's
> averaging around 10mpg.
>
> Later,
> Alan
> =FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

- --
Alan Wilson - Wilshire Associates, (310) 451-3051 x3750
(310) 260-7350 Direct
(310) 458-2842 FAX


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:12:23 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

F-150's have been coming through quickly for us. It has run 4-8 weeks to
delivery (usually 5-6 weeks) on most F-150's.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.
Union, IA 50258

- -----Original Message-----
From: Jarchow, Jaye
To: '97up-list ford-trucks.com'
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 10:58 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time


>What is the wait time when factory ordering a F-150 4x4 XLT SC?
>How long will Ford take factory orders for new '99s this year?


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:15:46 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: FTE 97up - Lets tell the Govt. NO

Looks like the environazis want to take away out trucks and SUVs. I guess I
will have to start pricing customized cabs for 20,000 pound dump-trucks if I
don't want to be driving an EPA-mandated eggshell with a 12 horsepower motor
and a maximum towing capacity of 1 watermelon. If they take away our big
safe vehicles, we only have ourselves to blame. Let your representatives
know that the EPA is trying to destroy the American Trio of apple-pie,
motherhood and pick-up trucks!


Keith

News Article Below:

Thursday February 18 2:19 AM ET

EPA Said Planning New Auto Emissions Standards
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Environmental Protection Agency is planning to
require light trucks and sport-utility vehicles to meet the same stringent
emissions standards as cars, the Washington Post reported Thursday.

The newspaper, quoting sources who had been briefed on the plan, said the
proposed rules would also require oil companies to produce cleaner gasoline.
Both changes would take effect starting in 2004.

The EPA proposal would require a nationwide average for sulfur in gasoline
of 30 parts per million, phased in from 2004 through 2006, the Post said.
The nationwide average is now more than 10 times that level, or about 330
parts per million.

The proposed rules also aim to reduce emissions of nitrogen oxides, which
contribute to smog. The current standard for emissions of nitrogen oxides
from passenger cars limits them to 0.4 grams per mile, but in the Northeast
beginning this year --and nationally in 2001 -- the standard becomes 0.2
grams.

Under the proposed EPA rules, cars will begin moving to a standard of 0.07
grams per mile in 2004. At the same time light trucks, weighing up to 8,500
pounds, would be required to meet the 0.2 grams-per-mile standard, the
newspaper said.

They would be required to move to the 0.07 standard in 2009. The current
emissions standard for light trucks is 0.7 grams of nitrogen oxides per
mile.

The EPA proposals would also require the manufacturers of diesel vehicles to
produce a cleaner fleet with average emissions of 0.07 grams per mile.

Environmentalists said the new rules would improve air quality and reduce
acid rain. But the rules would also likely increase gasoline and vehicle
costs, the Post said.

Light trucks, pickups, vans, minivans and sport-utility models now account
for 47.5 percent of all new vehicles sold in the United States. As a group,
their average fuel consumption is 20.7 miles per gallon, compared with an
average 27.5 miles per gallon for passenger cars, according to the Post.

The EPA is expected to send the final draft of the new rules to the Office
of Management and Budget for review tomorrow.

One auto industry executive told the Post he believed the proposal went too
far. But he said the industry would ``work hard to put the best light on a
bad situation.''

William F. O'Keefe, executive vice president of the American Petroleum
Institute, which represents the oil companies, said the EPA proposals to
reduce the sulfur content in gasoline could increase the cost of gasoline by
as much as 5 to 6 cents a gallon and would require hard-pressed refiners to
spend $5 billion to $6 billion to retool.



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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:22:02 -0500
From: Doug Moore
Subject: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!!!] and FDAF

Charles,
As for were they honest or not, I like to believe my dealer was. I know
some times mistake just happen. I was a good customer too. The key is what
they do to make it right with you. The owner seemed to do all he could.
Mine was a busy big dealership. They rented parking lot space to hold the
car some times of year. It sounds like your a good customer and they should
be willing to do whatever it takes to make things right before you need a
lawyer to be involved. As with me the price could not be dropped much more.
The first deal was 150.00 over so they dropped another 100.00.

Note for others:
And yes FDAF or Ford Dealer Advertising Fee and GAS has always added for
invoice plus deals. You got to let them make money to stay in business.

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 09:46:23 -0800
From: JJ Thomas
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

Can you tell us what the wait times for the following:
F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V8 (Gas)
F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V10 (Gas)
Econoline Wagon (V8)

I am going to be replacing my Ranger 4x4 in a couple of months and I am
looking at the F-150 SC 4x4, F-350 or the Van.

TIA

Julian

At 11:12 02/18/99 -0600, you wrote:
>F-150's have been coming through quickly for us. It has run 4-8 weeks to
>delivery (usually 5-6 weeks) on most F-150's.
>
>Nathan Bernard
>Union Auto, Inc.
>Union, IA 50258
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Jarchow, Jaye
>To: '97up-list ford-trucks.com'
>Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 10:58 AM
>Subject: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
>
>
>>What is the wait time when factory ordering a F-150 4x4 XLT SC?
>>How long will Ford take factory orders for new '99s this year?

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:10:29 -0600
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!

Hi Doug,

I should know tomorrow or Monday latest, if they were able to get me
scheduled once again. Once scheduled, I should be assigned a VIN, then a
build date followed by a delivery date. With my previous order this all happen
rather quickly, after four months of nothing, on Jan. 20, got a VIN and delivery

date of February 8, 1999. (Actually arrived in Chicago's "mixing yard" Feb. 3,
and at the dealership Feb. 11.)

Having the loaner, I would be happy just to get my truck for the original agreed

upon price of $200 over invoice.

I really need to know what my order status is by next week. See I'm sitting on
the check for the loan I took out for my new truck, and next month the payments
kick in. If the new order's a "go", I'll continue to sit on the check until it
comes in
(check is good for 90 days). But if it's going to be longer I'll have to return
the
check. Worst would be that they screw me again - sell to another customer, and
I been paying interest on the loan for several months! But I'll think positive.

No news yet from my lawyer, should of called yesterday. That is what stinks
about this whole process. Unless I do the calling I hear nothing. The one and
only call I got from my dealer on the past order was when he had a VIN.

A little feedback occasionally would be nice don't you think?

Look at Nathan and all the feedback he provides to all of us and we're not
even customers. (Has anyone on this list purchased anything from Union Auto?)
Who knows, if this new deal goes bust, I may call Nathan about ordering me
a new year 2000 Super Duty V10 with improve horse power.

Charles..



Doug Moore wrote:

> Charles,
> As for were they honest or not, I like to believe my dealer was. I know
> some times mistake just happen. I was a good customer too. The key is what
> they do to make it right with you. The owner seemed to do all he could.
> Mine was a busy big dealership. They rented parking lot space to hold the
> car some times of year. It sounds like your a good customer and they should
> be willing to do whatever it takes to make things right before you need a
> lawyer to be involved. As with me the price could not be dropped much more.
> The first deal was 150.00 over so they dropped another 100.00.
>
> Note for others:
> And yes FDAF or Ford Dealer Advertising Fee and GAS has always added for
> invoice plus deals. You got to let them make money to stay in business.
>
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:40:57 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: FTE 97up - EPA

Although my last message may have sounded "anti-government", I am not and I
prefer to work in the system. Expeditions, F-XXX pickups and other large,
heavy vehicles that get 8 to 12 MPG have been targeted by EPA. The CAFE
(corporate average fleet emissions, or something close to that) standards by
which automakers must meet mandate that for every large vehicle made, a tiny
, low-weight high mileage vehicle be produced so the average of the "fleet"
meets the magic number. Currently, large SUVs and pick-up trucks do not
count towards that average. If they did, the automakers could only make a
limited number of them and would also have to off-set them with high-mileage
cars to meet the average. If the EPA is allowed to include SUVs and
pick-ups in the CAFE standards, they will become rare, expensive and
probably "castrated" of their bulk, weight and power. Studies have proven
time and time again that survivability to an accident is a function of
weight (and other factors) and that for every 100 pounds in vehicle weight
reduction, a larger percentage of people will die in collisions. The EPA
would be happy if everyone drove around in tiny 50 mpg tin-can scooter-cars
and is trying to mandate that by law through the "back-door" by promulgating
regulations now for activation at some time in the future (year 2004) to
avoid public discourse and debate. If people in various truck and SUV
clubs, mailing lists and user groups disagree with these proposed
regulations, a concerted effort to inform their respective representatives
could block the implementation.

Just a thought,

Keith

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:12:32 -0800
From: "Harald"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Rust specs

>From: "Todd E."

>I also waxed my truck, 5500 miles, and noticed many >nice little red rust
>spots on the tailgate. I have a cap on the truck, and >apparently all
kinds
>of debris pelts the rear end of the truck.

Todd,
I found rust spots on my super duty also that I had to buff out. I think
they might have come from the rail cars during transport. My truck sat in
lots and on rail cars for over a month last summer while waiting
transportation.

Harald

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary
Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Ben Franklin

This year will go down in history! For the first time, a civilized nation
has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more
efficient and the world will follow our lead into the future! Adolf Hitler

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:35:06 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

These are more of a function of dealer than Ford. I'm running about 6-10
weeks on orders for SD's and V-10's and V-8's seem to be less of an issue
than before. I still hear from other dealers that their backlog could mean
6 months.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: JJ Thomas
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time


>Can you tell us what the wait times for the following:
>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V8 (Gas)
>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V10 (Gas)
>Econoline Wagon (V8)
>
>I am going to be replacing my Ranger 4x4 in a couple of months and I am
>looking at the F-150 SC 4x4, F-350 or the Van.
>
>TIA
>
>Julian


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:39:08 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!

You should explain the situation to whoever you've financed with no matter
what route you go (hold the check or return it) because after a couple of
weeks they'll start getting nervous about not receiving the title. A quick
call now could save a lot of head aches later. Also they probably have the
wrong VIN on their paperwork so that will probably have to be re done also.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Charles Abraham
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 12:27 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Dirty Trick!


>Hi Doug,
>
>I should know tomorrow or Monday latest, if they were able to get me
>scheduled once again. Once scheduled, I should be assigned a VIN, then a
>build date followed by a delivery date. With my previous order this all
happen
>rather quickly, after four months of nothing, on Jan. 20, got a VIN and
delivery
>
>date of February 8, 1999. (Actually arrived in Chicago's "mixing yard" Feb.
3,
>and at the dealership Feb. 11.)
>
>Having the loaner, I would be happy just to get my truck for the original
agreed
>
>upon price of $200 over invoice.
>
>I really need to know what my order status is by next week. See I'm sitting
on
>the check for the loan I took out for my new truck, and next month the
payments
>kick in. If the new order's a "go", I'll continue to sit on the check until
it
>comes in
>(check is good for 90 days). But if it's going to be longer I'll have to
return
>the
>check. Worst would be that they screw me again - sell to another customer,
and
>I been paying interest on the loan for several months! But I'll think
positive.
>
>No news yet from my lawyer, should of called yesterday. That is what stinks
>about this whole process. Unless I do the calling I hear nothing. The one
and
>only call I got from my dealer on the past order was when he had a VIN.
>
>A little feedback occasionally would be nice don't you think?
>
>Look at Nathan and all the feedback he provides to all of us and we're not
>even customers. (Has anyone on this list purchased anything from Union
Auto?)
>Who knows, if this new deal goes bust, I may call Nathan about ordering me
>a new year 2000 Super Duty V10 with improve horse power.
>
>Charles..
>
>


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 15:09:51 -0500
From: Pat McGowan
Subject: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Thank you for a wonderful forum for information. I just got my new 99
F-250 SD last week and have a couple of questions.
First it is a Short bed 4x4, and does any one know if Ford or
aftermarket has a set of factory looking mud flaps? I just don't want
the cheap looking rubber ones from a dept. store.
Smoking is bad, I know that. My new truck does not have a light in the
ashtray, has one else found this an inconvenience? What have you done
about it? I know the "right" answer is to stop smoking, and I will, but
in the mean time any suggestions?
Last question, being a 4x4, it is a big step up! Does anyone know a any
good looking side steps, like maybe Nerf bars or a like? Any place on
line?

Thank you, Pat McGowan

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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 14:44:43 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ranger Pop-out Windows

I'm not sure. The pop outs aren't available with the four door option and
thats all I keep on the lot. Otherwise I'd look and see what it would take.
You might call a glass installer and see what the glass would cost. The
price of this could make a difference in persuing the issue.

Nathan

- -----Original Message-----
From: Randy Collins
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, February 17, 1999 9:57 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Ranger Pop-out Windows


>Is it possible to add the rear pop-out windows to my 98 Ranger? Nathan?
>Approximate cost? Is this something that could be done in my driveway? Any
>info is appreciated. No answer frfom the small list.
>
>TIA
>ran


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 16:02:10 -0600
From: George Rigney
Subject: FTE 97up - new truck

Hello all,

My wife and I picked up our new truck at last!
1999 F2-250 XLT SD CC V10 SB
We added running boards, a chrome bumper, spare tire, and power windows to
the XLT package. The exterior is dark hunter green, while the interior is
medium graphite cloth split bench seats. We deleted the carpet because we
felt that the black non-skid rubber looked nice and would be easier to
clean. To all those still waiting for their super duty - it is worth the
wait! To all those who are considering orders, post your questions and I
will be glad to give descriptions or any other info I can. The members of
this list were enormously helpful to me when we were deciding options.
We've put on 450 miles after only two weeks, and we don't have a single
complaint except that it takes a long time to wash. ; ) We're getting about
10 mpg, for those who worry about such things. There haven't been any
squeeks, rattles, strange noises, leaks, etc.

I do have one question, though. I have seen people driving around with ice
boxes in the beds of their trucks. How do you get it in there? Do you
build a ramp with some scrap lumber? Is there a type of lift that can be
rented? Anyone who has moved a fridge with a pickup, please advise me.

Regards,

George & Raffy

74 Gran Torino Elite 351W
84 LTD Crown Victoria 302
99 F250 SD CC V10 SB
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:40:44 -0500
From: davesomers
Subject: FTE 97up - RE: F350 Chassis vs Pickup

>>>>Subject: FTE 97up - Re: F350 Chassis vs Pickup

>>>> Why does the 99 F350 DRW CC LWB PSD pickup have a max GVWR of 11200,
yet
>>>> the chassis cab can go to 12500?


>>Dave, the weight of the pickup box is a big chunk of that 1300#
difference.
>>- --
>> Gary
>> in Florida's Ocala National Forest


>>There is a large difference in frame size, also I have seen pickups
delivered with 5 leaf springs and a 11200 GVWR.
>>While these trucks have the same FACTORY rating, I regularly load my 6
F-350s to 15000 & would not consider the pickup model for that use.
>>Actually...the body company advised me not to buy a SD after all they
showed him was a F-350 pickup with "box removal" option.
>>You can find more info from the Ford "Bodybuilder's Guide Book" avail (to
borrow) at your Ford dealer or your truck body dealer.
>> Lee Haefele


Actually, the bed weight is not in the 1300# difference! We're talking
about the GVWR (rating) not the curb weight here.
The bed weight has already been added to the empty weight of (about) 7500#
for the pickup versus the (about) 7100# of the Chassis Cab. (These are
fully loaded diesels-gas engines and base packages are much lighter.)
That makes the effective payload about 1600# different without a body,
although most utility bodies weigh more than the bed does.
The additional leaf springs appear to come with the "heavy duty suspension"
or "camper" package.
I've seen both pickup and chassis cabs with / without them.
I did get a moment to look at a pickup and chassis cab side by side (but
the pickup left the dealer's lot before I could go back in daylight).
They both looked identical below the frame. (Front end frame looked the
same too).
I only used my fingers to measure the frame, but they were real close in
size, but different in shape.

I never looked that closely at older chassis cabs, but I always got the
impression that the rear frame was shaped similarly to the pickups in the
height (bumped up over the rear axle) , but was narrower (the two rails
were closer together). I get the impression that the purpose of the 99SD
"bed delete" option was to allow folks with older service bodies to
transfer them to the new truck without major modifications.
It looked to me like the rear wheels on an old DRW chassis cab tracked
centered on the front wheel, whereas the pickup had the inner wheel in line
with the front.
On the 99SD, the rear track width is the same either way.

- -longhair




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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:41:39 4
From: "Vaughn (VDB)"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Hi,

I smoke too, but I don't use the ash tray.
As for mud flaps I ended up getting a set
from an auto parts store. They are not
as big as I'd like them to be but they basicly
work.
I put SmittyBilt Sure Steps on, they are easy
to install, look and work great and are heavy duty.

Vaughn
99 F250 SD SC XLT SB 4X4 5.4






Thank you for a wonderful forum for information. I just got my
new 99 F-250 SD last week and have a couple of questions. First
it is a Short bed 4x4, and does any one know if Ford or
aftermarket has a set of factory looking mud flaps? I just
don't want the cheap looking rubber ones from a dept. store.
Smoking is bad, I know that. My new truck does not have a light
in the ashtray, has one else found this an inconvenience? What
have you done about it? I know the "right" answer is to stop
smoking, and I will, but in the mean time any suggestions? Last
question, being a 4x4, it is a big step up! Does anyone know a
any good looking side steps, like maybe Nerf bars or a like?
Any place on line?

Thank you, Pat McGowan

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:14:38 -0800
From: Dan Healy
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Try Ranch Hand Equipment, in Boerne Texas 1-800-366-9712.. All are trucks
are outfitted with their Bumpers/Brush guards, Running boards and Headache
Racks!
Great Stuff!

Pat McGowan wrote:

> Thank you for a wonderful forum for information. I just got my new 99
> F-250 SD last week and have a couple of questions.
> First it is a Short bed 4x4, and does any one know if Ford or
> aftermarket has a set of factory looking mud flaps? I just don't want
> the cheap looking rubber ones from a dept. store.
> Smoking is bad, I know that. My new truck does not have a light in the
> ashtray, has one else found this an inconvenience? What have you done
> about it? I know the "right" answer is to stop smoking, and I will, but
> in the mean time any suggestions?
> Last question, being a 4x4, it is a big step up! Does anyone know a any
> good looking side steps, like maybe Nerf bars or a like? Any place on
> line?
>
> Thank you, Pat McGowan
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:14:20 EST
From: RSnovi aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - new truck

In a message dated 99-02-18 17:08:59 EST, you write:


make yourself a ramp! that looks like the best way, maybe some kind of
aluminum scrap yard could help with some ideas.

RS


Date:99-02-18 17:08:59 EST
From:George.Rigney WSNelson.com (George Rigney)
Sender:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
Reply-to:97up-list ford-trucks.com
To:97up-list ford-trucks.com ('97up-list ford-trucks.com')

Hello all,

My wife and I picked up our new truck at last!
1999 F2-250 XLT SD CC V10 SB
We added running boards, a chrome bumper, spare tire, and power windows to
the XLT package. The exterior is dark hunter green, while the interior is
medium graphite cloth split bench seats. We deleted the carpet because we
felt that the black non-skid rubber looked nice and would be easier to
clean. To all those still waiting for their super duty - it is worth the
wait! To all those who are considering orders, post your questions and I
will be glad to give descriptions or any other info I can. The members of
this list were enormously helpful to me when we were deciding options.
We've put on 450 miles after only two weeks, and we don't have a single
complaint except that it takes a long time to wash. ; ) We're getting about
10 mpg, for those who worry about such things. There haven't been any
squeeks, rattles, strange noises, leaks, etc.

I do have one question, though. I have seen people driving around with ice
boxes in the beds of their trucks. How do you get it in there? Do you
build a ramp with some scrap lumber? Is there a type of lift that can be
rented? Anyone who has moved a fridge with a pickup, please advise me.

Regards,

George & Raffy

74 Gran Torino Elite 351W
84 LTD Crown Victoria 302
99 F250 SD CC V10 SB
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Subject: FTE 97up - new truck
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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:16:31 EST
From: RSnovi aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

In a message dated 99-02-18 18:11:44 EST, you write:

i was thinkingof getting a front bumper from them, it looks like you could
really do some damage to something with some of there stuff its super strong.

RS


Date:99-02-18 18:11:44 EST
From:dhealy adsnet.com (Dan Healy)
Sender:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
Reply-to:97up-list ford-trucks.com
To:97up-list ford-trucks.com

Try Ranch Hand Equipment, in Boerne Texas 1-800-366-9712.. All are trucks
are outfitted with their Bumpers/Brush guards, Running boards and Headache
Racks!
Great Stuff!

Pat McGowan wrote:

> Thank you for a wonderful forum for information. I just got my new 99
> F-250 SD last week and have a couple of questions.
> First it is a Short bed 4x4, and does any one know if Ford or
> aftermarket has a set of factory looking mud flaps? I just don't want
> the cheap looking rubber ones from a dept. store.
> Smoking is bad, I know that. My new truck does not have a light in the
> ashtray, has one else found this an inconvenience? What have you done
> about it? I know the "right" answer is to stop smoking, and I will, but
> in the mean time any suggestions?
> Last question, being a 4x4, it is a big step up! Does anyone know a any
> good looking side steps, like maybe Nerf bars or a like? Any place on
> line?
>
> Thank you, Pat McGowan
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:43:27 -0800
From: Gene Ball
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Ford has a Super Duty F-Series Accessories Catalog!
Get one from your dealer, The mud flaps are not listed but they do
exist! I have a set myself $40.00, all 4. They are nice!
You do not drill any holes in the metal : )
By the way, they make two different styles.
I have the the plastic ones, I think they make a diamond plate to?
1999 SD CC SB 4X4 Lariat V10
Gene Ball



Pat McGowan wrote:

> Thank you for a wonderful forum for information. I just got my new 99
> F-250 SD last week and have a couple of questions.
> First it is a Short bed 4x4, and does any one know if Ford or
> aftermarket has a set of factory looking mud flaps? I just don't want
> the cheap looking rubber ones from a dept. store.
> Smoking is bad, I know that. My new truck does not have a light in the
> ashtray, has one else found this an inconvenience? What have you done
> about it? I know the "right" answer is to stop smoking, and I will, but
> in the mean time any suggestions?
> Last question, being a 4x4, it is a big step up! Does anyone know a any
> good looking side steps, like maybe Nerf bars or a like? Any place on
> line?
>
> Thank you, Pat McGowan
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 14:55:58 -0900
From: Perry Klein
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

They make a long and a short in plastic. The shorts looked more like they
were for show to me. I went for the long ones and they help keep all of
the junk off my step. The long ones could be larger. I guess the
designers balanced appearance with effectiveness.

For those of you that were interested in the rubber seal that snaps into
the base of the door. I purchased mine since the truck didn't come with
them. Installation was a snap, took 2 minutes tops. They aren't the end
all best seal but it has made a difference in the amount of crap that
builds up right below the final door seal. Having it both ways I would
recommend them.


>Ford has a Super Duty F-Series Accessories Catalog!
>Get one from your dealer, The mud flaps are not listed but they do
>exist! I have a set myself $40.00, all 4. They are nice!
>You do not drill any holes in the metal : )
>By the way, they make two different styles.
>I have the the plastic ones, I think they make a diamond plate to?
>1999 SD CC SB 4X4 Lariat V10
>Gene Ball


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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:31:19 -0500
From: GEORGE CROLL
Subject: FTE 97up - EPA -Reply

there are other ways to let EPA know you are not happy with a certain regulation. I do not know what particular
"law" you are talking about but I will be glad to help identify ways to comment on the regulation you are talking about
if you could let me know where it is in the regulatory process. Is this a bill in congress? If it is it is not listed on our
website yet.

Or is it a new regulation being proposed by EPA to meet a law already passed by congress. If this is the case
lobbying your legislator will not work. How do I know this? I work for EPA here in DC. Relax I'm not spying on you
all I just also happen to own a new 99 SD 4x4 v-10. I also own a 66 CJ-5 and like to go wheeling. You might say I
am not an average EPA employee. But let me explain where I think EPA is in the CAFE regulation. the clean Air Act
of 1990 is the law passed by congress which gives EPA the right to establish the CAFE standards. I haven't read
those sections but I think that the Act does not prescribe the CAFE standard only that EPA must determine what they
must be to meet the Air Quality Standards which have already been established for Ozone, NO, CO, SO2 and
particulate.

I think what is happening now is that the agency is revising the current standards to include SUV's and light trucks
into the same class as cars. What really happened is that in 1990 or so EPA decided that trucks and SUV's should
have a different CAFE standard than minivans and cars. When this happened minivans and cars got more fuel
efficient smaller engines while SUV's and trucks were allowed to have less fuel efficient (more powerful) engines.
The result has been a dramatic increase in the sales of the more powerful SUV's and light trucks which EPA did not
anticipate. Ever seen a big v-8 in a minivan?? Now you know why. Has the air quality improved, no because 50%
of us are driving SUV's and trucks instead of the minivans and cars EPA thought we would be driving now. The
moral of the story is that Americans want bigger more powerful cars and they will buy the vehicle with the most
power. The big SD trucks are also in a different EPA class. That's why they don't have fuel economy numbers on
the factory sales tag but the lighter F-150's do. Vehicles over 8500 GVWR are considered medium duty trucks and
don't need to do fuel economy like light duty trucks.

The way EPA is changing the rule is to put light duty trucks and SUV's into the same fuel economy class as cars and
minivans resulting the problem described. If you could describe the regulation you are talking about in more detail I
might be able to locate the address of where comments should be sent.

Late
George Croll
EPA-OAR-ARD
(202)564-0162
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 15:48:51 -0800
From: JJ Thomas
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

I'm confused. I thought the dealer had to wait for Ford to built the
vehicle. How is that more of a function of the dealer then it is of Ford?
It would seem to me that it is was more of a function for the dealer, I
could just shop around for a dealer that could give me the truck faster.
Up here in the Puget Sound region, I see dealers with wall to wall SD, and
others with one or two on the lot. Would I be better off going to a dealer
that is wall to wall, or go to my previous dealer?

Thanks for answering, btw.

- -Julian

At 13:35 02/18/99 -0600, you wrote:
>These are more of a function of dealer than Ford. I'm running about 6-10
>weeks on orders for SD's and V-10's and V-8's seem to be less of an issue
>than before. I still hear from other dealers that their backlog could mean
>6 months.
>
>Nathan Bernard
>Union Auto, Inc.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: JJ Thomas
>To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 12:01 PM
>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
>
>
>>Can you tell us what the wait times for the following:
>>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V8 (Gas)
>>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V10 (Gas)
>>Econoline Wagon (V8)
>>
>>I am going to be replacing my Ranger 4x4 in a couple of months and I am
>>looking at the F-150 SC 4x4, F-350 or the Van.
>>
>>TIA
>>
>>Julian
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:26:28 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - EPA -Reply

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. Implementation of the 1990 CAA allows,
as you said, the EPA to promulgate regulations concerning vehicle fuel-use
and pollution standards. The trouble is that by trying to reduce pollution
for the ultimate benefit of everyone's health and well being, the
regulations dictating "de-facto" lighter and smaller cars are, in fact,
increasing the risks of adverse effects to everyone's health and well-being
although the "scales of the greater good" may be on the side of protecting
the air.

What is going to happen when light truck and SUVs are required to be
underpowered, downsized, and otherwise "neutered" to meet CAFE standards?
The same thing that is happening today, only instead of buying the light
trucks and SUVs (which will become tiny trucks and cute-utes) people will
purchase medium-duty trucks and vans and whatever else they can to get the
power size and security they want. I am sure many people are thinking "no
one will buy medium-duty trucks to replace the downsized SUVs" but 15 years
ago if you had predicted the current sales figure of trucks and large SUVs
with their associated size and power you would have been called loony.
Anyway, I am glad you enjoy 4-wheeling and hope you like your '99 SuperDuty
V-10 as much as I do!!

Keith

PS. I am an environmental toxicologist and risk-assessor, and I like clean
air and water as much as everyone else, I just do not believe the CAA CAFE
standards implementation is the way to achieve environmental goals.


- -----Original Message-----
From: GEORGE CROLL
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 7:29 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - EPA -Reply


>there are other ways to let EPA know you are not happy with a certain
regulation. I do not know what particular
>"law" you are talking about but I will be glad to help identify ways to
comment on the regulation you are talking about
>if you could let me know where it is in the regulatory process. Is this a
bill in congress? If it is it is not listed on our
>website yet.
>
>Or is it a new regulation being proposed by EPA to meet a law already
passed by congress. If this is the case
>lobbying your legislator will not work. How do I know this? I work for
EPA here in DC. Relax I'm not spying on you
>all I just also happen to own a new 99 SD 4x4 v-10. I also own a 66 CJ-5
and like to go wheeling. You might say I
>am not an average EPA employee. But let me explain where I think EPA is in
the CAFE regulation. the clean Air Act
>of 1990 is the law passed by congress which gives EPA the right to
establish the CAFE standards. I haven't read
>those sections but I think that the Act does not prescribe the CAFE
standard only that EPA must determine what they
>must be to meet the Air Quality Standards which have already been
established for Ozone, NO, CO, SO2 and
>particulate.
>
> I think what is happening now is that the agency is revising the current
standards to include SUV's and light trucks
>into the same class as cars. What really happened is that in 1990 or so
EPA decided that trucks and SUV's should
>have a different CAFE standard than minivans and cars. When this happened
minivans and cars got more fuel
>efficient smaller engines while SUV's and trucks were allowed to have less
fuel efficient (more powerful) engines.
>The result has been a dramatic increase in the sales of the more powerful
SUV's and light trucks which EPA did not
>anticipate. Ever seen a big v-8 in a minivan?? Now you know why. Has the
air quality improved, no because 50%
>of us are driving SUV's and trucks instead of the minivans and cars EPA
thought we would be driving now. The
>moral of the story is that Americans want bigger more powerful cars and
they will buy the vehicle with the most
>power. The big SD trucks are also in a different EPA class. That's why
they don't have fuel economy numbers on
>the factory sales tag but the lighter F-150's do. Vehicles over 8500 GVWR
are considered medium duty trucks and
>don't need to do fuel economy like light duty trucks.
>
>The way EPA is changing the rule is to put light duty trucks and SUV's into
the same fuel economy class as cars and
>minivans resulting the problem described. If you could describe the
regulation you are talking about in more detail I
>might be able to locate the address of where comments should be sent.
>
>Late
>George Croll
>EPA-OAR-ARD
>(202)564-0162
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:30:38 -0800
From: Gene Ball
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Perry, I would like to see the short ones?
I think mine are a little long, for me! But they work well!
Do you know where I can find a picture of the short ones?
Thanks Gene

Perry Klein wrote:

> They make a long and a short in plastic. The shorts looked more like they
> were for show to me. I went for the long ones and they help keep all of
> the junk off my step. The long ones could be larger. I guess the
> designers balanced appearance with effectiveness.
>
> For those of you that were interested in the rubber seal that snaps into
> the base of the door. I purchased mine since the truck didn't come with
> them. Installation was a snap, took 2 minutes tops. They aren't the end
> all best seal but it has made a difference in the amount of crap that
> builds up right below the final door seal. Having it both ways I would
> recommend them.
>
> >Ford has a Super Duty F-Series Accessories Catalog!
> >Get one from your dealer, The mud flaps are not listed but they do
> >exist! I have a set myself $40.00, all 4. They are nice!
> >You do not drill any holes in the metal : )
> >By the way, they make two different styles.
> >I have the the plastic ones, I think they make a diamond plate to?
> >1999 SD CC SB 4X4 Lariat V10
> >Gene Ball
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 16:50:25 -0900
From: Perry Klein
Subject: FTE 97up - 1999 F-250 SD Questions

Sorry no pic's. My dealer had them in stock so I took a look at both.
That might be the best way to go unless some one else has the short ones
here on the bb and can shoot you a picture.

pk


>Perry, I would like to see the short ones?
>I think mine are a little long, for me! But they work well!
>Do you know where I can find a picture of the short ones?
>Thanks Gene
>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:40:14 -0500
From: "Todd E."
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

Dealers have a limited allotment of trucks they can order per month, with
those that sold more trucks the year before, getting a higher allotment. If
you order with a low allotment dealer, they may only be able to order 3
trucks per month, and you might be on a waiting list for the dealer, before
you can even make it to the factory waiting list. Even a high allotment
dealer could have such high demand that you can still be on a waiting list.


- -----Original Message-----
From: JJ Thomas
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time


>I'm confused. I thought the dealer had to wait for Ford to built the
>vehicle. How is that more of a function of the dealer then it is of Ford?
>It would seem to me that it is was more of a function for the dealer, I
>could just shop around for a dealer that could give me the truck faster.
>Up here in the Puget Sound region, I see dealers with wall to wall SD, and
>others with one or two on the lot. Would I be better off going to a dealer
>that is wall to wall, or go to my previous dealer?
>
>Thanks for answering, btw.
>
>-Julian
>
>At 13:35 02/18/99 -0600, you wrote:
>>These are more of a function of dealer than Ford. I'm running about 6-10
>>weeks on orders for SD's and V-10's and V-8's seem to be less of an issue
>>than before. I still hear from other dealers that their backlog could
mean
>>6 months.
>>
>>Nathan Bernard
>>Union Auto, Inc.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: JJ Thomas
>>To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>>Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 12:01 PM
>>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time
>>
>>
>>>Can you tell us what the wait times for the following:
>>>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V8 (Gas)
>>>F-350 SD Reg Cab 4x4 V10 (Gas)
>>>Econoline Wagon (V8)
>>>
>>>I am going to be replacing my Ranger 4x4 in a couple of months and I am
>>>looking at the F-150 SC 4x4, F-350 or the Van.
>>>
>>>TIA
>>>
>>>Julian
>>
>>
>>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:39:00 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time

What happens is when a order is scheduled it will take 6-8 weeks to be built
and arrive at the dealership. However, some dealers don't have the
allocation to get the unit scheduled. Thats why one dealer can get a truck
in 8 weeks while the one next to it might have to wait 5 months for the same
truck. Also the number of Super Duty's on the lot doesn't necessarily mean
quicker delivery, some dealers are hoarding these trucks to sell for an
outlandish price. While their holding these trucks Ford won't allocate more
as they assume they have a good supply. They call in turn and earn, meaning
the more you sell the more you get. Confusing, huh?

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: JJ Thomas
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 7:32 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - F150 XLT 4x4 wait time


>I'm confused. I thought the dealer had to wait for Ford to built the
>vehicle. How is that more of a function of the dealer then it is of Ford?
>It would seem to me that it is was more of a function for the dealer, I
>could just shop around for a dealer that could give me the truck faster.
>Up here in the Puget Sound region, I see dealers with wall to wall SD, and
>others with one or two on the lot. Would I be better off going to a dealer
>that is wall to wall, or go to my previous dealer?
>
>Thanks for answering, btw.
>
>-Julian
>
>At 13:35 02/18/99 -0600, you wrote:
>>These are more of a function of dealer than Ford. I'm running about 6-10....


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