97up-list-digest Friday, February 12 1999 Volume 02 : Number 038



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 97up - URGENT: New engine break-in help.
Re: FTE 97up - Fast Idle & Engine Break
Re: FTE 97up - URGENT: New engine break-in help.
FTE 97up - Remote Keyless Entry
Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights
Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350
Re: FTE 97up - Remote Keyless Entry
FTE 97up - THANKS !!!
FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?
FTE 97up - Re: Bug shield--Paint front and back?
Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?
FTE 97up - Re: Tool boxes
Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?
FTE 97up - Re: Computer re-learning and pinging
Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350
Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights
Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights
Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350
FTE 97up - Re: PSD compared to Cummins
FTE 97up - A.R.E. Deck lids
FTE 97up - floor mats for SD...
Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?
Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 04:36:33 PST
From: "Frank Spor"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - URGENT: New engine break-in help.

For all the Turbine engine fans out there...There is no break in.
That said, There are no piston rings.

The Ball, and roller bearings in a free shaft gas turbine engine are
assembled, and installed to tolerances that take into account the
EXTREME temperature variations of the surrounding Very fast moving
parts.

Infant mortality is fairly high.

The compressor on the Alison T63 engine does have a friction fit for
about the first thirty hours of use, But the Outlet temperature only
climbs (or decreases) slightly during that time...

The ceramic lined engines coud be different..

I claim a Quarter....

BY the way, MY 99 F250 which arrived in seven weeks turned 100 Miles
yesterday.

I love it so far.

Frank



______________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:17:09 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fast Idle & Engine Break

I thought it was for running power take-off equipment while you are parked.
In other words, it lets the engine stay at a more optimal RPM so the power
take-off equipment does not "bog" the engine when the equipment is under
strain and needs more power.

Keith


- -----Original Message-----
From: Alevinson aol.com
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, February 10, 1999 11:08 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Fast Idle & Engine Break


>Has anyone has any experience with a Fast Idle system for a PSD? What
purpose
>does it serve besides quicker warmup times?
>
>How about engine breaks? Any comments?
>
>Alex Levinson
>alevinson aol.com
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:17:03 -0500
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - URGENT: New engine break-in help.

Mike Newell wrote:
>
> I'm picking up my fist pickup tomorrow. A '99 F150 with 4.2L V6. What is the
> best way to break-in the new engine. This truck will be primarily used as a
> camping truck for my Boy Scout troop. It will pull a very light trailer and
> some camping gear in the bed. It will get mostly highway use, some local in
> town use.
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Mike Newell
> mnewell onr.com
>

Mike,

Check your owners manual for more precise instructions.
Usually indicates to drive at moderate speeds for the first
500 miles or so, do not tow for the first ??? miles, avoid
jack rabbit starts and try not to stand on the brakes. If
you drive for extended periods on the highway you should
vary the speed. Go for a while at 55 then 60 then 65 than
back down to 55.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

PS Congrats on a great truck! Enjoy.
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 08:23:54 -0600
From: DanBrotzman
Subject: FTE 97up - Remote Keyless Entry

My 99 F350 CC, 4X4, PSD, SRW, LWB, XLT is due to arrive this week or =
early next week. When I ordered it I did not order the remote keyless =
entry option. Since ordering the truck we purchased a 99 ZX2 for one of =
the kids and it has the remote keyless entry. Now I wish I had ordered =
it on the 350 SD. Can this be installed as a dealer add on? Would it be =
with factory parts or aftermarket? The 350 SD was ordered with PL and =
PW. Any idea on cost to install at the dealer if it is possible?
Dan - Wisconsin

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 08:21:31 -0600
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights

I'm curious where they mount. Would it be in the tow-hook cutout?
And is there a wiring connector already in that area for that purpose?

Thanks,

Charles.


johny wrote:

> Thanks. I was wondering about that.
> I pulled apart my SD light switch and noticed that it was set up
> to handle some extra electronics (well plug connectors).
> I then looked at an Expedition.
> >From the exterior, the SD panel and Expedition are different.
>
> But it looked like what "was behind the curtain" could be
> similar, if not the same. Would you know if the internals are the same?
> Meaning, is the little circuit board inside the switch the same from
> factor as an Expedition and Super Duty?
>
> Your answer could dictate whether it's a trip to the salvage yard
> or a dealership :-).
>
> Very clever engineering and assembly type issues were done on
> this switch.
>
> As usual, thanks Nathan.
>
> -john
>
> Union Auto wrote:
>
> > The kit includes a new headlight switch with the pull for fog feature just
> > like the F-150 and Expedition. The lights are the projector style with a
> > glass lens over the top.
> >
> > Nathan
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: johny
> > To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
> > Date: Wednesday, February 10, 1999 5:30 PM
> > Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights
> >
> > >Does this kit use a separate switch, or is it a modifcation to
> > >the existing SD light switch to turn on the fog lights?
> > >Like the Expedition, in which you pull the light switch
> > >to activate the fog lights.
> > >
> > >-john
> > >
> >
> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:33:06 -0500
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350

Union Auto wrote:
>
> I did some research and F-250 and F-350 SRW use the same frame, axles, and
> brakes. The only difference I can find is the rear springs.
>
> Nathan Bernard
>

Nathan,

Would you please investigate the F-150 vs the F-250 LD?
I was hoping that the F-250 frame would be stronger than the
150. If it is not i will not pay the extra to get the
250LD.

Thanks

Jean Marc Chartier
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 06:51:49 -0800
From: Kent Tombs
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Remote Keyless Entry

DanBrotzman wrote:
>
> My 99 F350 CC, 4X4, PSD, SRW, LWB, XLT is due to arrive this week or early next week. When I ordered it I did not order the remote keyless entry option. Since ordering the truck we purchased a 99 ZX2 for one of the kids and it has the remote keyless entry. Now I wish I had ordered it on the 350 SD. Can this be installed as a dealer add on? Would it be with factory parts or aftermarket? The 350 SD was ordered with PL and PW. Any idea on cost to install at the dealer if it is possible?
> Dan - Wisconsin
>
> =FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

I believe you will get the keyless entry with that package.
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:58:27 -0600
From: "Mike Newell"
Subject: FTE 97up - THANKS !!!

Thanks for the quick response and the advise !

Mike Newell
mnewell onr.com


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 10:34:20 -0600
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?

Thanks to a member of this list I was informed that last week,
Feb. 3rd, my new Super Duty was delivered to the "mixing"
yard in Chicago. I then became overly excited at the thought of
having my new truck real soon (my wife too since it's her truck
I'm now driving).

Well, seven working days have gone bye and still no truck. (I
know that doesn't sound long - but I've been waiting now 4-1/2
months). The dealer had originally told me Feb. 8th, as he was
expecting three Super Duty delivered on that date. I'm beginning
to think this is the longest part of the journey.

How long does it usually take, from mixing yard to dealer's lot
some 80 miles away? Does the dealer have any control over
this?

Thanks,

Charles.

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 12:05:26 -0500
From: "Mike McNany"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Bug shield--Paint front and back?

Mike, I'd just keep the painted shield. Sounds like the painter is giving
you a great guarantee. Half the reason of painting a bug shield on the back
is so that a Do-It-Yourselfer CAN have paint runs that won't show from the
front. I'd guess that the autobody shop wouldn't accept the paint runs,
quality wise. If they were noticeable, even from the rear, that would
reflect poorly on them. The Lund sticker should have been removed prior to
painting.
another Mike

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 11:38:04 -0600
From: "Christopher T. Patrick"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?

At 10:34 AM 2/11/99 -0600, you wrote:
>How long does it usually take, from mixing yard to dealer's lot
>some 80 miles away? Does the dealer have any control over
>this?

i dont know much about shipping cars, but we regularlly get containers of
computer parts via rail/trucking. theres been several times when the train
comes into the local yard, (which i can see from my store) and weve waited
3 days for the union workers to quit playing poker and pull the container
for shipping. then another day for the city trucking teamsters to drive it
about 3 miles to out dock. they are not even unpacking the container..
just putting it on wheels and hauling it over.

if it were me, i would tell the dealer that you want to cancel the order if
he cant get you the truck in 48 hours. then find one similar on another
dealers lot and go get it.
==========================================
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.877pcparts.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.inlink.com/~cpatrick
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.jeepthing.com ||
CHRIS PATRICK | || \
360 ci ______| _||___\____
Th400 (|==== |_____| ___ | |]
SOA (>| = \___________/ = \____|=
4"lift *** '84 CJ-8 ***
Dana44 ** **'98 F150 ** **
35"x16.5 ** ** ** **
BOGGERS *** ***
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 22:21:04 -0600
From: "Bud Feuless & Miki Magara"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Tool boxes

A completely different and certainly unique (possibly stupid) idea might be
to use the hatches and hatch liners/tackle trays sold for boats. They are
pretty much what you are talking about and can be configured with just a box
under the lid or with pull out trays. The neat thing is you can mount them
inside a sidewall or you could even mount them right in the bed too, as long
as you stay clear of load bearing stress points (might be a good idea to
reinforce around them by using aluminum backing around the inside of the
mounting flange). These hatches are generally rugged, vibration and
corrosion resistant and completely waterproof, as they are made for offshore
boating. What's also pretty unusual is that they are cheap. Various
catalogs from Boat/US, WestMarine, BassPro, etc... list many different types
for $50 to $100.

Just thought I'd share that odd idea... - Bud


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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 11:53:05 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?

The dealer has no control over this, he call call and get the unit " hot
listed" but this doesn't seem to make any difference. The mixing centers
are the dumbest thing Ford has ever done and they won't change back for some
reason. There is usually a one to two week delay from mixing center to
dealer. However if we get bad weather (ours come from Chicago mixing center
also) it really mixes things up.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Charles Abraham
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 11, 1999 10:50 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?


>Thanks to a member of this list I was informed that last week,
>Feb. 3rd, my new Super Duty was delivered to the "mixing"
>yard in Chicago. I then became overly excited at the thought of
>having my new truck real soon (my wife too since it's her truck
>I'm now driving).
>
>Well, seven working days have gone bye and still no truck. (I
>know that doesn't sound long - but I've been waiting now 4-1/2
>months). The dealer had originally told me Feb. 8th, as he was
>expecting three Super Duty delivered on that date. I'm beginning
>to think this is the longest part of the journey.
>
>How long does it usually take, from mixing yard to dealer's lot
>some 80 miles away? Does the dealer have any control over
>this?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Charles.
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 12:07:40 -0600
From: "Bud Feuless & Miki Magara"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Computer re-learning and pinging

Hey guys...

My truck pings pretty badly when towing these days and will ping in normal
driving if I use 87. It will also idle rough after a warm start. I've been
using 91-93 for some time and thought it might be worthwhile to start by
re-learning the computer, and then take it from there. My thinking is that,
by using the high octane, I might have taught it to believe that the knock
sensor was dead. My octane level might have been so high that the computer
could not force the engine to ping, no matter how far it advanced the
timing. This would cause the computer to assume that the knock sensor was
dead, since it could not get a ping. This could cause the computer to use a
preset ignition retard timing, which might hurt performance and also
actually cause pinging (I think) with low octane gas.

Well, I ran the tank down, put in 87 and disconnected the battery for about
8 hours this weekend and reconnected. I thought I had it, but the pinging
is back today with 87. I'm not sure if I left the battery disconnected long
enough and now need to look for other problems, or if I did not leave it
disconnected long enough. I did not experience the "engine rev hunting" I
expected at startup. I would have expected this while the CPU was in
learning mode for the first 100 miles. Anyone know how long I need to leave
the battery disconnected?

By the way, I'm not saying this is necessarily the problem. I'm just going
through an initial process of eliminating problems that could confuse the
issue. Once I go through the top-level stuff, I'll be able to get into the
nitty-gritty and know that I am not being confused by the computer or other
aspects.

Your thoughts, as always, are appreciated!

Regards, Bud



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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:03:53 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350

Yes F-250 SD Vs F-350 SD.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Keith Veren
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, February 10, 1999 8:02 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350


>Nathan, I presume you mean the '99 F-250 SuperDuty, not the '99 F-250.
>


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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:13:40 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights

I'm not sure, but it does come with the outer panel that has the light to
tell you when the switch is on. So I doubt it a F-150 switch would work,
but it might be worth doing some more reaserch.

Nathan
- -----Original Message-----
From: johny
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, February 10, 1999 6:59 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights


>Thanks. I was wondering about that.
>I pulled apart my SD light switch and noticed that it was set up
>to handle some extra electronics (well plug connectors).
>I then looked at an Expedition.
>>From the exterior, the SD panel and Expedition are different.
>
>But it looked like what "was behind the curtain" could be
>similar, if not the same. Would you know if the internals are the same?
>Meaning, is the little circuit board inside the switch the same from
>factor as an Expedition and Super Duty?
>
>Your answer could dictate whether it's a trip to the salvage yard
>or a dealership :-).
>
>Very clever engineering and assembly type issues were done on
>this switch.
>
>As usual, thanks Nathan.
>
>-john
>


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:08:26 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights

I think you have to run the wiring. They mount in the opening between the
tow hooks. The kit comes with templates to trim the valence so they fit.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Charles Abraham
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 11, 1999 8:39 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights


>I'm curious where they mount. Would it be in the tow-hook cutout?
>And is there a wiring connector already in that area for that purpose?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Charles.
>
>
>johny wrote:
>
>> Thanks. I was wondering about that.
>> I pulled apart my SD light switch and noticed that it was set up
>> to handle some extra electronics (well plug connectors).
>> I then looked at an Expedition.
>> >From the exterior, the SD panel and Expedition are different.
>>
>> But it looked like what "was behind the curtain" could be
>> similar, if not the same. Would you know if the internals are the same?
>> Meaning, is the little circuit board inside the switch the same from
>> factor as an Expedition and Super Duty?
>>
>> Your answer could dictate whether it's a trip to the salvage yard
>> or a dealership :-).
>>
>> Very clever engineering and assembly type issues were done on
>> this switch.
>>
>> As usual, thanks Nathan.
>>
>> -john
>>
>> Union Auto wrote:
>>
>> > The kit includes a new headlight switch with the pull for fog feature
just
>> > like the F-150 and Expedition. The lights are the projector style with
a
>> > glass lens over the top.
>> >
>> > Nathan
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: johny
>> > To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>> > Date: Wednesday, February 10, 1999 5:30 PM
>> > Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Superduty foglights
>> >
>> > >Does this kit use a separate switch, or is it a modifcation to
>> > >the existing SD light switch to turn on the fog lights?
>> > >Like the Expedition, in which you pull the light switch
>> > >to activate the fog lights.
>> > >
>> > >-john
>> > >
>> >
>> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>
>> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 16:51:15 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350

First off you want to price both anyway. I sold a Regular cab 4x4 the other
day and due to the fact that he wanted trailer towing and the 8 ply tires
(LT) on the F-150 the F-250LD was only $200 more. As for differences I'll
compare Regular cab 4x4's XLT's (but all others should be comparable in the
same way.):

Frame: F-150: Ladder type with front box section, 6 crossmembers, 50,000
PSI steel.
F-250: Same
F-150 Section Modulus: 3.98 Cubic inch
F-250 4.0 Cubic Inch

Brakes: F-150 Front: Disc 12.13" dia
F-250 Front Same.
F-150 rear: Book still lists drum brakes so I don't know
current size.
F-250 rear: Disc 13.2" dia

Axles F-150 Front: SLA 3900LBS capacity
F-250 Front SLA 4150 lbs capacity
F-150 rear: Semi floating Ford axle :4200 lbs w/5.4L 3800lbs
with 4.6 or 4.2L
F-250 rear semi floating Ford 5300lbs


The springs and shocks are also different. The F-250LD also has 7 bolt
wheels Vs. 5 bolt for F-150 and 8 bolt for F-250 SD.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jean Marc Chartier
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, February 11, 1999 8:49 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - '99SD GVWR 250 vs 350


>Nathan,
>
> Would you please investigate the F-150 vs the F-250 LD?
>I was hoping that the F-250 frame would be stronger than the
>150. If it is not i will not pay the extra to get the
>250LD.
>
>Thanks
>
>Jean Marc Chartier


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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 19:21:13 -0500
From: "Mr Ron"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: PSD compared to Cummins

Pardon me for budding in but,

You should also consider your comparing a 6cyl to an 8cyl and
almost 100 cubes difference in size.

Ron
.

>Re: FTE 97up - Re: PSD compared to Cummins
>
>Yes it's the whole electronic system that makes the response better.
>



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 20:11:44 -0500
From: kathryn phillips
Subject: FTE 97up - A.R.E. Deck lids

I have had a A.R.E. deck lid on my 98 F-150 for over a year, the paint
and fit are still great. The A.R.E. lid was worth the money. My truck
is moon light blue and the paint matches almost perfect.
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 20:10:36 EST
From: RSnovi aol.com
Subject: FTE 97up - floor mats for SD...

I know someone just mentioned the part number for floor mats f/r in a med.
prairie tan for a F250 SD supercab, I was just trying to order them from the
ford online accessories page but doesn't seem to be working... any help would
be appretiated

thanks
Ross Smith
RSR Inc.
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Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 21:02:12 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?

Forwarded for: "Jack"

My truck sat at the mixing center for 10 days and I eventually drove over
myself to get it. Either try to c*ncel the order (but don't) or ask to go
and get it.

Keep us updated.

jack

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Charles Abraham
To:
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 1999 10:34
Subject: FTE 97up - Railroad Mixing Yard to Dealership Time?


>Thanks to a member of this list I was informed that last week,
>Feb. 3rd, my new Super Duty was delivered to the "mixing"
>yard in Chicago. I then became overly excited at the thought of
>having my new truck real soon (my wife too since it's her truck
>I'm now driving).
>
>Well, seven working days have gone bye and still no truck. (I
>know that doesn't sound long - but I've been waiting now 4-1/2
>months). The dealer had originally told me Feb. 8th, as he was
>expecting three Super Duty delivered on that date. I'm beginning
>to think this is the longest part of the journey.
>
>How long does it usually take, from mixing yard to dealer's lot
>some 80 miles away? Does the dealer have any control over
>this?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Charles.
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html


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