97up-list-digest Friday, January 15 1999 Volume 02 : Number 010



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 97up - 1 of 2 has arrived
Re: FTE 97up - Re: Dead 99 F-350 4x4 PSD
FTE 97up - Fuel Idiot Gauge
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
FTE 97up - Idiot gauges - PSD site
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
RE: FTE 97up - Idiot gauges - PSD site
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
FTE 97up - Fuse blew - no replacement to be found????
Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty
Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
FTE 97up - Re: Fuel Idiot Gauge
FTE 97up - How long have you been waiting for Super Duty
FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
RE: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty
Re: FTE 97up - Fuse blew - no replacement to be found????
Re: FTE 97up - Exhaust & warranty....
Re: FTE 97up - Fuel Idiot Gauge
FTE 97up - Nathan NGS
Re: FTE 97up - re: engine noise 99 F350 psd
Re: FTE 97up - Re: loaner/warranty
Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
Re: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
Re: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
FTE 97up - 5.4 L Piston Slap Problem
Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Gauges
FTE 97up - Re: Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:03:06 -0500
From: Bill
Subject: FTE 97up - 1 of 2 has arrived

My son's F-250 sd, 4wd, auto, 5.4, XLT, just came in, was
ordered 12/6/98. The old man here still waiting for my
F-250 sd, 2wd, auto, V-10, Lariat, ordered 10/5/98. Might
know it would work out this way, my son didn't really want
his before march when his present lease is up. As for me,
I've sold my old truck and need the new one so we can be
Florida bound with the 5th wheel. Guess that's life.




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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:54:07 EST
From: JudgeR aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Dead 99 F-350 4x4 PSD

i AHVE A 1999 SUPERDUTY WITH 18,000 MILES NO TROUBLE SO FAR .HOPE YOURS WORKS
OUT RICHI
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 07:05:23 -0700
From: "Matus, Scott A"
Subject: FTE 97up - Fuel Idiot Gauge

Now that's funny. I busted a gut with that thought.

Scott.

- ------------------------------

Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:09:43 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Gauges

Sorry, but it is true. I have a '99 F-350 XLT SuperDuty / 4X4 / V-10
SuperCab / Longbed / Automatic
and a '98 Expedition 4X4 / automatic / XLT and they both have idiot oil
gauges (but the other gauges are "real" I am told. Just wait until they
make the fuel gauge an idiot gauge!!


Keith


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:25:36 -0000
From: "Greg Gilmore"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

Ken .69? Where are you located?
- -----Original Message-----
From: Ken Payne
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 2:09 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage


>At 01:35 PM 1/13/99 -0800, you wrote:
>>
>>Cheap??? I wish it was still 85cents a gallon. Am I the only one who
>>remembers
>>those days???
>>
>
>Gas station half a mile down the street is 69 cents. Most around
>here are 79 cents.
>
>Ken Payne
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:30:46 -0600
From: DanBrotzman
Subject: FTE 97up - Idiot gauges - PSD site

I to am very disappointed that Ford would use an idiot "gauge". I have a =
99 SD PSD CC 4X4 on order and assumed when they said it comes with the =
"gauges" that they were actually real gauges. I have been an ASE =
certified diesel mechanic since 1975 and rely on gauges to keep me =
informed of whats really happening with an engine. If I could have =
ordered a trans. temp., rear differential temp., engine oil temp., turbo =
boost, and pyrometer gauge I would have. I'm glad there are aftermarket =
companies who see the short comings of the OEM's and provide these types =
of equipment.=20
Can someone tell me how to get connected to the PSD site?
Dan
Wisconsin

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:13:44 GMT
From: alannorthstar mindspring.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

On Wed, 13 Jan 1999 13:46:15 -0500, you wrote:

:
:
:I have put 4000 miles on a 1998 Ford Explorer XLT with a 4.0L SOHC and =
seem
:to only get 15-16 MPG for mostly highway driving. The best I've ever
:gotton was 17MPG. This is pretty disappointing since the window sticker
:advertised 19MPG on the highway.=20

The window sticker doesn't advertise any mileage. It just states
the US Government results, which are based on weight, engine
displacement, etc. etc. -- but not on any real driving tests.=20

The rule of thumb is that this number is *always* about 4 MPG
higher than what people get in the real world.

Be glad you're getting that high a mileage. I have a Ranger 4x4
with the 3.0 engine and the 4-speed ODauto, and I'm getting about
14 mpg with about 2/3 city and 1/3 highway driving. Don't like
that at all!

Later,
Alan



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 09:09:37 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty

This vin is for a Supercab F-250 Super Duty 4x2 with a Power Stroke diesel.
The trucks are running late again (gota love the railroad). I got a SD
similar to this yesterday, but it was supposed to arrive on 12-10-1998.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Norm Brown
To: 97up-list
Date: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 11:57 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty


>Can anyone decode the following VIN for a '99 Superduty?
>
>1FTNX20FXXEC81464
>
>My dealer tells me this is the VIN for my truck that was manufactured on
>November 16th and is sitting in Kansas City awaiting transportation to
>final destination. The ETA was 11/30/98. Initially, I was told that the
>truck was "in" and would be available for delivery on 12/26/98. While in
>transit to take possession, the dealer called on my cell phone and told
>me not to come - he made a "mistake" and my truck had not yet arrived -
>but assured me (and continues to do so) that it was "on its way". (It's
>a 65 mile trip and I was 15 miles away!) Still waiting for truck
>I just want to verify that the above VIN actually describes the type of
>truck I ordered as I am starting to get concerned that the dealer is not
>being totally up front with me and possibly ordered the wrong truck.
>
>Thanks......Norm
>
>
>
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:16:59 GMT
From: alannorthstar mindspring.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

On Wed, 13 Jan 1999 23:25:29 -0500, you wrote:

:Come-on, I remember being a kid of 16 and buying gas for $0.30/gallon, =
but
:back then $0.30 was harder to come by than $1.15 is today. Yes, gas is
:cheap, cheap cheap. =20

I remember when .29 was the going price, and when there were gas
price wars, the price was .25 per gallon!

Of course, a pretty good annual income in those days was around
$10,000 - so I guess the more things change the more they stay
the same.

Sheesh!
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 07:39:15 -0800
From: "Kevin Mayer"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Idiot gauges - PSD site

The psd site is:

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.abol.com/users/jlester/

The discussion groups provide and amazing amount of information. Studies it
religiously before ordering my psd about 6 months ago. Still visit daily.

Kevin


- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
[mailto:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of DanBrotzman
Sent: Thursday, January 14, 1999 6:31 AM
To: '97up-list-digest ford-trucks.com'
Subject: FTE 97up - Idiot gauges - PSD site


I to am very disappointed that Ford would use an idiot "gauge". I have a 99
SD PSD CC 4X4 on order and assumed when they said it comes with the "gauges"
that they were actually real gauges. I have been an ASE certified diesel
mechanic since 1975 and rely on gauges to keep me informed of whats really
happening with an engine. If I could have ordered a trans. temp., rear
differential temp., engine oil temp., turbo boost, and pyrometer gauge I
would have. I'm glad there are aftermarket companies who see the short
comings of the OEM's and provide these types of equipment.
Can someone tell me how to get connected to the PSD site?
Dan
Wisconsin

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:36:38 -0500
From: "Todd E."
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

Grinding sounds in the steering is usually associated with too little power
steering fluid, but it seems that you would have checked that.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Keith Veren
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 11:26 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage


>Come-on, I remember being a kid of 16 and buying gas for $0.30/gallon, but
>back then $0.30 was harder to come by than $1.15 is today. Yes, gas is
>cheap, cheap cheap. Compare it to times past and factor inflation into the
>equation and you will see that today gas really is cheap. Compare it to
the
>prices in other countries and you will see that what American pay is cheap.
>Enjoy it while you can. By the biggest and best vehicle you can find and
>enjoy the relatively inexpensive cost to drive it. Believe me, one day in
>the future we will all look back to this decade and say "boy, back in the
>mid to late 1990's, gas was really cheap".
>
>Keith
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Alan Wilson
>To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>Date: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 4:37 PM
>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
>
>
>>
>>Cheap??? I wish it was still 85cents a gallon. Am I the only one who
>remembers
>>those days???
>>
>>Keith Veren wrote:
>>
>>> Finally, feel good that gas is so cheap these days, it could
>>> be a lot worse!
>>>
>>> Keith
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: millered pb.com
>>> To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>>> Date: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 1:53 PM
>>> Subject: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage
>>>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >I have put 4000 miles on a 1998 Ford Explorer XLT with a 4.0L SOHC and
>seem
>>> >to only get 15-16 MPG for mostly highway driving. The best I've ever
>>> >gotton was 17MPG. This is pretty disappointing since the window
sticker
>>> >advertised 19MPG on the highway. I've tried removing roof racks and
>>> >putting in 89 Octane instead of 87. Nothing has an effect. Is this
>>> >normal or is there something wrong? (Engine also pings heavily when
>you
>>> >accelerate hard - the dealer checked it out and said there were no
>computer
>>> >codes indicating a problem)
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>> >
>>>
>>> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>
>>--
>>Alan Wilson
>>x3750
>>
>>
>>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:16:23 -0700
From: "Matus, Scott A"
Subject: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

A friend of mine sent me this passage concerning his Dodge Grand Caravan.
This isn't strictly a Ford only issue. Its an American Public issue.

Modern American fuel gauge syndrome has been installed in so many American
vehicles.

According to "Cadillac" people expect to be able to drive a while on a
"full" tank and also expect to be able to drive a while on an "empty" tank.
Because of this engineers have designed fuel gauges to read in a non linear
fashion.

On the van this results in a fuel gauge that comes off of the full mark at
the HALF full level in the tank. By filling the tank with the power on and
observing the gauge and fuel pump, I have determined that the readings on
my fuel gauge all need to be divided by exactly 2. Where 1/2 is really 1/4
and 1/4 is really 1/8 and so on .

What a far cry from the accuracy that I enjoyed in the VW's.

Keep in mind that this is all purposeful in an effort to reduce complaints
by the non critical thinking motorist.

I think that the majority of American motorists have become a society of
non-thinkers. People just accept what the auto/truck manufactures decide to
put on our vehicles. I'm sure that extensive study groups have given the
opinions to shape the function(s) of the vehicle that we buy today. They
never asked, me or anyone from this newsgroup. Ford and others have made
the decision to protect themselves from unwanted complaints. In the
process, they alienated the smaller segment of the buying public that really
take an interest in their investments. Especially when I invested $34,000.
Enough said.

Scott.
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:19:41 -0700
From: "Brandt Dennehy"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

That is soooo funny about the fuel gauge. It is very true though. That is
one thing that bothers me about the fuel gauge in my 99 SD v-10. Just the
slightest incline affects it to a great degree. If I'm inclined just
slightly, it reads more gas that I actually have, and declined it reads
less....kind of annoying...especially with all of the up and down driving I
do in the Rocky Mountains of Montana. I wish the "E" mark meant absolutely
empty, and when the truck was full, it pointed to "F" (not above and beyond
it). Kind of silly if you ask me..

- -Brandt


- -----Original Message-----
From: Matus, Scott A
To: 'F 97 - New'
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 10:26 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"


>A friend of mine sent me this passage concerning his Dodge Grand Caravan.
>This isn't strictly a Ford only issue. Its an American Public issue.
>
>Modern American fuel gauge syndrome has been installed in so many American
>vehicles.
>
>According to "Cadillac" people expect to be able to drive a while on a
>"full" tank and also expect to be able to drive a while on an "empty" tank.
>Because of this engineers have designed fuel gauges to read in a non linear
>fashion.
>
>On the van this results in a fuel gauge that comes off of the full mark at
>the HALF full level in the tank. By filling the tank with the power on and
>observing the gauge and fuel pump, I have determined that the readings on
>my fuel gauge all need to be divided by exactly 2. Where 1/2 is really 1/4
>and 1/4 is really 1/8 and so on .
>
>What a far cry from the accuracy that I enjoyed in the VW's.
>
>Keep in mind that this is all purposeful in an effort to reduce complaints
>by the non critical thinking motorist.
>
>I think that the majority of American motorists have become a society of
>non-thinkers. People just accept what the auto/truck manufactures decide
to
>put on our vehicles. I'm sure that extensive study groups have given the
>opinions to shape the function(s) of the vehicle that we buy today. They
>never asked, me or anyone from this newsgroup. Ford and others have made
>the decision to protect themselves from unwanted complaints. In the
>process, they alienated the smaller segment of the buying public that
really
>take an interest in their investments. Especially when I invested $34,000.
>Enough said.
>
>Scott.
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 14:14:05 -0500
From: "Larry Hackler"
Subject: FTE 97up - Fuse blew - no replacement to be found????

I blew a 50 amp mini female fuse last night. The F150 owners manual calls
them maxi fuses. It was fuse 111, that is described as "Ignition Switch
Battery Feed (Start & Run Circuits). It was my own fault when installing a
remote tire pressure sensor (did not undo battery).

I've been to the Ford dealer and all parts suppliers in a 15 mile radius and
I have not been able to find a fuse. I'm on hold to Ford Customer Service
not and it does not look like they are capable of helping me.

Anybody got a 50 amp fuse for sale or know where I can get one. Without
this fuse, I have to turn on the headlights to get the truck to run. I've
stolen another fuse from another circuit, but I'm not sure I want to keep it
that way.

Larry


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 14:40:32 -0500
From: Jody Villa
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty

But when was it ordered? Thats the question I want to know the answer to. I
ordered my 250 SD PSD CC SWB December 2nd and was told 8 weeks now the
dealer says it might be longer..........no kidding (I say sarcastically).

At 09:09 AM 1/14/99 -0600, you wrote:
>This vin is for a Supercab F-250 Super Duty 4x2 with a Power Stroke diesel.
>The trucks are running late again (gota love the railroad). I got a SD
>similar to this yesterday, but it was supposed to arrive on 12-10-1998.
>
>Nathan Bernard
>Union Auto, Inc.

**********************************************************************
Jody Villa jvilla eclipse.net Tewksbury, NJ, USA

**********************************************************************
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 14:46:49 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

I guess the picture boils down to this for me: I am a scientist
(toxicologist) and when measuring anything in a scientific manner we use
instruments and equipment that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST
standards and dependable with redundant systems and error warning features.
I expect that after 100 years of automotive science and technology, the
automotive industry could design, implement and offer (even if as an option)
a gauges that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST standards and
dependable with redundant systems and error warning features. It goes back
to the old saying, "if you are going to do something, do it right".

Keith


- -----Original Message-----
From: Brandt Dennehy
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"


>That is soooo funny about the fuel gauge. It is very true though. That is
>one thing that bothers me about the fuel gauge in my 99 SD v-10. Just the
>slightest incline affects it to a great degree. If I'm inclined just
>slightly, it reads more gas that I actually have, and declined it reads
>less....kind of annoying...especially with all of the up and down driving I
>do in the Rocky Mountains of Montana. I wish the "E" mark meant absolutely
>empty, and when the truck was full, it pointed to "F" (not above and beyond
>it). Kind of silly if you ask me..
>
>-Brandt
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Matus, Scott A
>To: 'F 97 - New'
>Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 10:26 AM
>Subject: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"
>
>
>>A friend of mine sent me this passage concerning his Dodge Grand Caravan.
>>This isn't strictly a Ford only issue. Its an American Public issue.
>>
>>Modern American fuel gauge syndrome has been installed in so many American
>>vehicles.
>>
>>According to "Cadillac" people expect to be able to drive a while on a
>>"full" tank and also expect to be able to drive a while on an "empty"
tank.
>>Because of this engineers have designed fuel gauges to read in a non
linear
>>fashion.
>>
>>On the van this results in a fuel gauge that comes off of the full mark at
>>the HALF full level in the tank. By filling the tank with the power on and
>>observing the gauge and fuel pump, I have determined that the readings on
>>my fuel gauge all need to be divided by exactly 2. Where 1/2 is really 1/4
>>and 1/4 is really 1/8 and so on .
>>
>>What a far cry from the accuracy that I enjoyed in the VW's.
>>
>>Keep in mind that this is all purposeful in an effort to reduce complaints
>>by the non critical thinking motorist.
>>
>>I think that the majority of American motorists have become a society of
>>non-thinkers. People just accept what the auto/truck manufactures decide
>to
>>put on our vehicles. I'm sure that extensive study groups have given the
>>opinions to shape the function(s) of the vehicle that we buy today. They
>>never asked, me or anyone from this newsgroup. Ford and others have made
>>the decision to protect themselves from unwanted complaints. In the
>>process, they alienated the smaller segment of the buying public that
>really
>>take an interest in their investments. Especially when I invested
$34,000.
>>Enough said.
>>
>>Scott.
>>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:21:47 -0500 (EST)
From: fss altavista.net
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Fuel Idiot Gauge

>Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:09:43 -0500
>From: "Keith Veren"
>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Gauges
>
[snip]
>Just wait until they make the fuel gauge an idiot
>gauge!!

They've already done it! Most vechicles (including my '98 Ranger) have some sort of warning light to alert the driver that the fuel tank has only 1-2 gallons left. I guess the gague pointing to "E" isn't enough. Maybe Ford should make a new fuel gague that reads "F" (full), "E" (empty), and "RE" (really empty).




- ----------------------------------------------------------------
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 14:38:33 -0600
From: "Charles Abraham"
Subject: FTE 97up - How long have you been waiting for Super Duty

This last message leads me to ask: who on this list has been waiting the longest
for a
Super Duty?

Beat this if you can,

Sept. 30, 1998, order F250 SD SC SB 4x4 V10 LS3.73 Lariat (L_ASS_O in english).

Charles.

Jody Villa wrote:

> But when was it ordered? Thats the question I want to know the answer to. I
> ordered my 250 SD PSD CC SWB December 2nd and was told 8 weeks now the
> dealer says it might be longer..........no kidding (I say sarcastically).
>
> At 09:09 AM 1/14/99 -0600, you wrote:
> >This vin is for a Supercab F-250 Super Duty 4x2 with a Power Stroke diesel.
> >The trucks are running late again (gota love the railroad). I got a SD
> >similar to this yesterday, but it was supposed to arrive on 12-10-1998.
> >
> >Nathan Bernard
> >Union Auto, Inc.
>
> **********************************************************************
> Jody Villa jvilla eclipse.net Tewksbury, NJ, USA
>
> **********************************************************************
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 13:18:23 -0800
From: "Harald"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors

I have the powered trailer tow mirrors on my 99 F350 and I'm not happy with
them either. The retracting function would be real nice to have, but I knew
they didn't when I ordered the truck. The big gripe I have is the driver
side wide angle view section is glued in crooked. Most of the view is of
the side of my bed and the ground. The passenger side is perfect. Ford has
installed 2 new mirrors and they're all the same. They tried telling me
it's normal and that they're designed that way to which I say, "BS". I'm
waiting for Ford to admit there's a problem and replace it (I probably
shouldn't hold my breath though). Two things I've done is to register my
complaint with Ford customer service and also went to the National Highway
Safety site and register this as a safety defect. Go here:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/hotline/
I figure the squeeky wheel gets the grease, so if enough people squeak it'll
get fixed.

As an interim solution, I wedged some popsicle sticks on the inboard and
lower edges of the mirror to position it partially usable.

Harald

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:31:40 -0700
From: "Don Lewoniuk"
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors

Not that this has anything to do with tow mirrors but I thought I'd comment
anyhow. I always considered that a good philosophy until I heard the
Japanese version of it. "The nail that sticks out gets hammered." All
depends on the situation I suppose.

Cheers, Don

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
> [mailto:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of Harald
> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 1999 2:18 PM
> To: Ford Trucks List
> Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
>
>
> I figure the squeeky wheel gets the grease, so if enough people

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Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:41:45 -0500
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

Keith Veren wrote:
>
> I guess the picture boils down to this for me: I am a scientist
> (toxicologist) and when measuring anything in a scientific manner we use
> instruments and equipment that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST
> standards and dependable with redundant systems and error warning features.
> I expect that after 100 years of automotive science and technology, the
> automotive industry could design, implement and offer (even if as an option)
> a gauges that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST standards and
> dependable with redundant systems and error warning features. It goes back
> to the old saying, "if you are going to do something, do it right".
>
> Keith
>

Keith,

Does it really matter if the water temp is really 200 deg
or just 195. When your beast boils over you will know that
it is 240. I respect that you want a functioning oil
pressure gauge, as do I, but I do not require your
precision. As long as the gauge has some consistency I will
be able to tell when something is starting to go wrong. I
could afford and would pay for accurate gauges but not NIST
standards.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:57:21 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty

The order was submitted November 10th, scheduled (assigned a VIN and build
date) on Nov. 12, and built Nov. 23. It was supposed to arrive Dec 10, and
showed up Jan 14.

Nathan Bernard

- -----Original Message-----
From: Jody Villa
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - VIN for '99 Superduty


>But when was it ordered? Thats the question I want to know the answer to. I
>ordered my 250 SD PSD CC SWB December 2nd and was told 8 weeks now the
>dealer says it might be longer..........no kidding (I say sarcastically).
>
>At 09:09 AM 1/14/99 -0600, you wrote:
>>This vin is for a Supercab F-250 Super Duty 4x2 with a Power Stroke
diesel.
>>The trucks are running late again (gota love the railroad). I got a SD
>>similar to this yesterday, but it was supposed to arrive on 12-10-1998.
>>
>>Nathan Bernard
>>Union Auto, Inc.
>
>**********************************************************************
>Jody Villa jvilla eclipse.net Tewksbury, NJ, USA
>
>**********************************************************************
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 16:14:15 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fuse blew - no replacement to be found????

I found some of these fuses, but they won't be here until Monday afternoon.
Try a local Advance auto parts, Parts America or such. They are littelfuse
brand and this is the only company I could find that makes them. One of
their warehouses might have them and they might get delivery's on the week
end.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Larry Hackler
To: F150 List ; Ford F150 97 up list

Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 1:30 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Fuse blew - no replacement to be found????


>I blew a 50 amp mini female fuse last night. The F150 owners manual calls
>them maxi fuses. It was fuse 111, that is described as "Ignition Switch
>Battery Feed (Start & Run Circuits). It was my own fault when installing a
>remote tire pressure sensor (did not undo battery).
>
>I've been to the Ford dealer and all parts suppliers in a 15 mile radius
and
>I have not been able to find a fuse. I'm on hold to Ford Customer Service
>not and it does not look like they are capable of helping me.
>
>Anybody got a 50 amp fuse for sale or know where I can get one. Without
>this fuse, I have to turn on the headlights to get the truck to run. I've
>stolen another fuse from another circuit, but I'm not sure I want to keep
it
>that way.
>
>Larry
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 16:20:35 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Exhaust & warranty....

Cat back exhaust should not affect your warranty. It wouldn't be covered
under the warranty (of course) and if it fell off and damaged something or
something along those lines which are pretty unlikely.

Nathan

- -----Original Message-----
From: Brandt Dennehy
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 1:45 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Exhaust & warranty....


>I recently had a friend put a new exhaust system and turbo muffler on his
>Ford 460 v8. He said it improved his mileage by 1-1.5mpg and he can tell a
>definite difference in power. Because of his influence, I am considering
>doing the same on my 99 SD v-10. After all of the recent talk about
voiding
>warranties, I am concerned that by adding a new performance exhaust system,
>my warranty will be voided. Any input would be greatly appreciated.
>Thanks,
>
>Brandt
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 16:01:58 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Fuel Idiot Gauge

Actually the Fuel gauges anymore aren't what they used to be. We've had so
many complaints about fuel gauges varying that on vehicles (due to fuel
sloshing in the tank) So as a response several years ago Ford added a
anti-slosh module to make the gauge read more on an average than actual
reading. If you fill up with the truck running you'll notice the gauge
doesn't read full until you restart the truck.

Nathan Bernard

- -----Original Message-----
From: Matus, Scott A
To: 'F 97 - New'
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 8:13 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - Fuel Idiot Gauge


>Now that's funny. I busted a gut with that thought.
>
>Scott.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:09:43 -0500
>From: "Keith Veren"
>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Super Duty Gauges
>
>Sorry, but it is true. I have a '99 F-350 XLT SuperDuty / 4X4 / V-10
>SuperCab / Longbed / Automatic
>and a '98 Expedition 4X4 / automatic / XLT and they both have idiot oil
>gauges (but the other gauges are "real" I am told. Just wait until they
>make the fuel gauge an idiot gauge!!
>
>
>Keith
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 16:08:24 -0800
From: "Gregory E. Schafer"
Subject: FTE 97up - Nathan NGS

Napa Auto Parts can order Base NGS kits from Hickok. The kit comes
with the required OBDII cable but not the software card. The kit costs
approx. $1920. The softward card they carry is for '84-'95 vehicles. It
costs an additional $488. This stuff isn't cheap. Contact the closest
Napa store for details (check Yellow Pages).

InterMotive offers Rotunda NGS kits (same as Ford Dealers use) to Fleet
Accounts that are approved to do their own Ford warranty work. The kit
costs $2200 + Shipping and comes with the most recent software card.
Fleets can contact InterMotive at 707/438-7828.

Greg Schafer

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:52:19 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - re: engine noise 99 F350 psd

Did you ever figure this noise out? I've been very busy lately and haven't
had a chance to check on anything, let me know if your still having
problems.

Nathan

- -----Original Message-----
From: John Edward Nichols
To: 97up-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Date: Monday, December 21, 1998 6:20 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - re: engine noise 99 F350 psd


>Nathan thanks for your response. My truck is an f350 CC 4WD PSD with
>the four speed automatic. It was manufactured on 1-12-98 and it
>currently
>has 15,000 miles. It usually makes the noise after it has been driven
>and then
>shut down for a couple of hours and then re-started. I thought that it
>was being
>caused by the clutch fan so I removed the it but the noise is still
>there. The noise
>started this spring when I bought the truck but seemed to go away this
>summer
>when it got warm out but started again when the temp. cooled again. I
>am now
>thinking that it may be the fast warm up valve on the turbo or maybe the
>torque
>converter. From inside the cab it seems to be coming from the left side
>under the hood.
>Any help would be appreciated.
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:50:03 -0600
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: loaner/warranty

This is a good thing to point out, because it can make a big difference in
the way your treated in the service department. One thing I get a kick out
of is one of my customers who never makes an appointment but thanks to a
dozen or so donuts every time he shows up (candy bars in the afternoon) he
always seems to get in even if were busy, strange how that works.
Mechanics, service managers, etc. are all people and people tend to help
people they like more than others. I notice that when someone comes in and
hollers about their car and complaining the mechanics seem to remember every
can of cleaner, nut bolt and other thing and they make sure the customer
pays for it. If they come in and are pleasant a lot of small stuff gets
forgotten about. I would strongly recommend staying on the good side of
your service representatives. On Ford Vehicles if your the first owner your
"official" warranty ends at 36,000 miles from this point on the dealer can
charge you for every repair. However, If your within a certain parameter (I
think its 5 years, 60K miles, but I'm not positive of those numbers) Ford
has what they call after warranty adjustments. There is a limit of 2 of
these per vehicle. Lets say a transmission went out at 50,000 miles. You
would normally have to pay all of the tab, but if your dealer will do all
the paperwork (and make much less money than if they charged you, Ford
doesn't pay very well for warranty work) Ford will often pay 80% if the
dealer will pay 10% and you pay 10%.
I only do the after warranty adjustments for the cars that were sold
here (or people that are traveling through or just moved to the area). Many
dealers don't do them at all.
My advice would be to just be nice to the dealership employees, don't
condemn the vehicle until you know what's wrong (a lot of times its "the nut
behind the (steering) wheel that's broken") because this can quickly makes a
service manager want to just say what you want to hear to be rid of you. It
seems to be the biggest complainers are often the ones that are the reason
their car doesn't run. And bringing donuts for the mechanics and service
people can often get you much further than you'd ever believe (don't expect
miracles the first time, but if you show up every time with donuts it does
get noticed after a while.). This gets you just as far as tipping a
mechanic and costs much less.

Nathan Bernard

- -----Original Message-----
From: Bud Feuless & Miki Magara
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, January 12, 1999 2:44 PM
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: loaner/warranty


>We often talk about what we should expect from the dealer and what makes
>this dealer or that good or bad, but don't seem to talk often about what
the
>dealer should expect of us or what makes us a good or bad customer. I'm
not
>saying every dealer deserves this consideration. Maybe most don't. But
>those rare gems certainly do.
>
>
>I'd be very interested to hear from Nathan and others who work at
>dealerships... What defines a good CUSTOMER for you and do you go out of
>your way to keep your "good" customers happy... more so than "bad"
>customers? If you're really daring, you might even mention what you think
>makes a "bad" customer, but I'm afraid that might raise the hackles of a
few
>of them who are reading this now ...! My point is, I think that
>when we find a "good" dealership, we need to try to be "good" customers
>there and that we might even end up happier as customers if we do...
>
>Regards, Bud


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:03:41 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

You can tell a lot from a car by watching gauge value trends. To use your
example, assume the water temperature of your engine is always 190 - 192 F.
when towing your houseboat every summer. One day the following summer you
notice it stays at 194 - 195, then the next week you notice that it is
running at 198 - 199, with all the conditions the same as when it ran 190 -
192. Reacting to this trend will allow you to PREVENT problems before they
occur. For example, in the case of a slowly rising temperature, your
thermostat may be going bad, your coolant level may be decreasing and /or
your engine may be running lean and/or the timing may be too retarded and/or
you could be dragging a trailer brake, etc. The same case may be made for
an oil pressure gauge or a manifold vacuum gauge. The key is to have an
accurate, precise gauge with enough resolution to discern small changes in
parameters over time. Calibration need not be NIST-traceable, but should at
least be set from a primary standard.

Keith



- -----Original Message-----
From: Jean Marc Chartier
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"


>Keith Veren wrote:
>>
>> I guess the picture boils down to this for me: I am a scientist
>> (toxicologist) and when measuring anything in a scientific manner we use
>> instruments and equipment that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST
>> standards and dependable with redundant systems and error warning
features.
>> I expect that after 100 years of automotive science and technology, the
>> automotive industry could design, implement and offer (even if as an
option)
>> a gauges that are accurate, precise, calibrated to NIST standards and
>> dependable with redundant systems and error warning features. It goes
back
>> to the old saying, "if you are going to do something, do it right".
>>
>> Keith
>>
>
>Keith,
>
> Does it really matter if the water temp is really 200 deg
>or just 195. When your beast boils over you will know that
>it is 240. I respect that you want a functioning oil
>pressure gauge, as do I, but I do not require your
>precision. As long as the gauge has some consistency I will
>be able to tell when something is starting to go wrong. I
>could afford and would pay for accurate gauges but not NIST
>standards.
>
>Regards
>
>Jean Marc Chartier
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:17:28 -0500
From: "Keith Veren"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors

Yours is a good philosophy. The Japanese "The nail that sticks out gets
hammered." way of life is kind of a social understanding against being a
"squeaky wheel". I do not think that philosophy has served the Japanese
well, though. It stifles invention, discovery, independence and dramatic
"radical" improvement (versus step-by-step continual improvement). Anyway,
while we are on the subject, does anyone know if the Japanese car companies
(primarily Toyota) are going to ever realize that big, wide, beefy
high-sitting powerful pick-up trucks and SUVs sell?? I cannot understand
why at least 10 years ago they did not see the trend towards more people
buying the big Expeditions, Suburbans (sorry for mentioning a Chevy
product), F-250s and F-350s with crew-cabs, SuperCabs, and longbeds. They
could have made a mint if they had started producing them back when
4-Runners were all the rage and before Ford had recovered from the 1990
recession. Oh well, I guess "The nail that sticks out gets hammered."

Keith


- -----Original Message-----
From: Don Lewoniuk
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors


>Not that this has anything to do with tow mirrors but I thought I'd comment
>anyhow. I always considered that a good philosophy until I heard the
>Japanese version of it. "The nail that sticks out gets hammered." All
>depends on the situation I suppose.
>
>Cheers, Don
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
>> [mailto:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of Harald
>> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 1999 2:18 PM
>> To: Ford Trucks List
>> Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
>>
>>
>> I figure the squeeky wheel gets the grease, so if enough people
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:04:17 -0600
From: Glenn See
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

You can tell f fella's age by the gas prices. I can remember .12-.15 gas
and that was just a little more than I got paid for an hour's work---when I
could find a job. Everyone's enjoying the price of gas except those that
used to work on the off-shore rigs. At least gas went down with the price
of crude unlike the price of bacon and sausage. I must also be in another
minority--my 97 150 has had no problems with the exception of a minor radio
one.

I have intermittent noise on my AM side, always with one station on 1180
MHz my local Rush and J. Gordon outlet. (no comments from the liberals
please) It sometimes it is engine related and sometimes it is antenna
related. I would appreciate any suggestions for a solution from those of
you with expertise in this area.


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 22:02:52 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Ford Explorer Gas Mileage

At 09:34 AM 1/14/99 +0000, you wrote:
>Oh, and I guess you lot don't pay ROAD TAX either? That's another =A3155 a
>year....on top of the tax we pay on our petrol sob sob
>
>Neil
>

Most states have an annual tax based either on the book value,
weight of the vehicle or a combination of both.

Ken

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:59:05 -0000
From: "Greg Gilmore"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors

Keith,

The Toyota Tundra will be launched this spring. I've heard that the
Princeton Ind. plant will support an SUV on its platform by 2001. From
what I understand, the production of 150K per year (Tundra) won't even make
a small dent in the market. I don't think the Japanese will ever seriously
enter this segment of the U.S. market.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Keith Veren
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Friday, January 15, 1999 1:39 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors


>Yours is a good philosophy. The Japanese "The nail that sticks out gets
>hammered." way of life is kind of a social understanding against being a
>"squeaky wheel". I do not think that philosophy has served the Japanese
>well, though. It stifles invention, discovery, independence and dramatic
>"radical" improvement (versus step-by-step continual improvement). Anyway,
>while we are on the subject, does anyone know if the Japanese car companies
>(primarily Toyota) are going to ever realize that big, wide, beefy
>high-sitting powerful pick-up trucks and SUVs sell?? I cannot understand
>why at least 10 years ago they did not see the trend towards more people
>buying the big Expeditions, Suburbans (sorry for mentioning a Chevy
>product), F-250s and F-350s with crew-cabs, SuperCabs, and longbeds. They
>could have made a mint if they had started producing them back when
>4-Runners were all the rage and before Ford had recovered from the 1990
>recession. Oh well, I guess "The nail that sticks out gets hammered."
>
>Keith
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Don Lewoniuk
>To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
>Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 5:34 PM
>Subject: RE: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
>
>
>>Not that this has anything to do with tow mirrors but I thought I'd
comment
>>anyhow. I always considered that a good philosophy until I heard the
>>Japanese version of it. "The nail that sticks out gets hammered." All
>>depends on the situation I suppose.
>>
>>Cheers, Don
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com
>>> [mailto:owner-97up-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of Harald
>>> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 1999 2:18 PM
>>> To: Ford Trucks List
>>> Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Tow mirrors
>>>
>>>
>>> I figure the squeeky wheel gets the grease, so if enough people
>>
>>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 21:37:46 -0600
From: "Jack Lubinski"
Subject: FTE 97up - 5.4 L Piston Slap Problem

I have a few comments to add regarding earlier posts with questions about
5.4 L piston slap noise. This problem has been reported on 1997 - 99 5.4
L engines, and somewhat fewer 1997 - 98 4.6 L engines. As someone
previously mentioned, the f150 on-line web site has lots of information on
this issue.

A dealership advised me before xmas that Ford Motor Co will be making a
decision on corrective measures early in the new year. This is about the
3rd time a response from Ford has been promised only to be delayed again
because the engineers had not ironed out why piston slap occurs on certain
engines and not others. The fellow I talked to said there is a good
possibility Ford will be replacing defective engines that have piston slap.
Personally, I can't see how Ford has a choice considering there are
thousands of 5.4 L and 4.6 L engines out there that do not have this
problem. Secondly, Ford has bought back vehicles from a few people that
went to bat against them on the basis piston slap was a major design defect
on the 5.4 L engine. Third, Ford has a reputation to uphold to all their
customers now and in the future.

My suggestion to anyone who has this problem is go back to your dealership
and demand that they replace your engine on warranty. Specialty oil
products are only going to reduce the piston slap noise at start-up and you
will be stuck with a defective engine in the end.


Jack Lubinski
97 F250 5.4 L 4X4


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Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 22:38:34 -0500
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - "Americanized Gauges"

Keith Veren wrote:
>
> You can tell a lot from a car by watching gauge value trends. To use your
> example, assume the water temperature of your engine is always 190 - 192 F.
> when towing your houseboat every summer. One day the following summer you
> notice it stays at 194 - 195, then the next week you notice that it is
> running at 198 - 199, with all the conditions the same as when it ran 190 -
> 192. Reacting to this trend will allow you to PREVENT problems before they
> occur. For example, in the case of a slowly rising temperature, your
> thermostat may be going bad, your coolant level may be decreasing and /or
> your engine may be running lean and/or the timing may be too retarded and/or
> you could be dragging a trailer brake, etc. The same case may be made for
> an oil pressure gauge or a manifold vacuum gauge. The key is to have an....


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