97up-list-digest Wednesday, October 21 1998 Volume 01 : Number 252



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1997 and Newer Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint
FTE 97up - 1999 SD Diesel
Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?
Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
Re: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint
Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l
Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
FTE 97up - Adding a CD Changer
Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
Re: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint
FTE 97up - Re:Lowering suspention on 4x4
Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l
Re: FTE 97up - Auto-trans change-out volume
FTE 97up - Re: Adding a CD Changer
Re: FTE 97up - Re: Adding a CD Changer
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
FTE 97up - Re:F150 Trailer Light Problem--Jean Marc Chartier
Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?
Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?
FTE 97up - Week #42 commodity projections
Re: FTE 97up - 1999 SD Diesel
Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l
Re: FTE 97up - Re:F150 Trailer Light Problem--Jean Marc Chartier
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
FTE 97up - sorry to all
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)
FTE 97up - RE:Piston Slao in 4.6L
FTE 97up - Re: Replacement antenna for F-150
FTE 97up - ADMIN: Give us your favorite web site addresses
Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l
FTE 97up - Wheels and Tires

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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 05:34:59 -0000
From: "Scott and Lisa Williams"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

is this list not moderated? why, as you say, would i have to "be a brother"
in order to own a lowered vehicle? i would suggest a couple of things to
you: (1) read my first post - i clearly stated that i was NOT taking this
vehicle off-road; (2) find a different forum to spread your ignorance. btw,
i do own a 4x2, it is lowered, and i don't think i'm a "brother"...KMA!!

>Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 19:59:24 EDT
>From: F150DML aol.com
>Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
>
>I proudly own a f-150 4X4 why in God's Holy name would you want to lower
>anything much less a OFF ROAD vehicle. The whole point of having 4X4 is
going
>off-road where clearance is very important. If you feel the need to be a
>brother and lower a truck get a 4X2. That is a disgrace to consider
lowering
>a 4X4, why did you get it? You cannot take it off-road once you have
lowered
>it, like you said its your truck do as you wish. That is my two cents
worth.
>David
>Proud owner of a real 4x4 OFF-ROAD



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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:13:51 +0000
From: Simon Robson Illustration
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

David (Proud owner of a real 4x4 OFF-ROAD)

There are plenty of reasons to own a 4x4 without having to take it off
road! Pulling a boat up a slippery launch ramp, undesirable road
conditions etc. I have a 79 Bronco with 35" Thornbirds, smittybuilts,
softtop so I understand your enthusiasm about taking it on the trails,
but... IMHO I could never take a vehicle worth $35k (can) off road and
enjoy it, it would break my heart if it got scratched or dinged. And I
also like the look of a lowered street cruiser, brother! So a lowered
4x4 may just have the best of both worlds!

Simon Robson
98 F-150 STX, soon to be 99 F-150 Sport
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 09:42:32 -0700
From: Anita Wilson
Subject: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint

Hello,
When I bought my 1998 Ford Ranger 4X4 I had the dealership where
I got it install a couple of add ons such as a bug guard, rain guards on
the windows, and a bed liner. Well the other day I opened up the tail
gate, and was shocked to see that the paint on the bed, just under the
end of the bed was chipping and rubbing off. It looks like the piece of
the bed liner that fits on the inside of the tail gate is rubbing
against the metal and causing the damage.
What I was wondering is since a Ford dealership installed the
bed
liner is there any hope that they will fix the paint or am I basically
out of luck ?
Any information would be appreciated, Thanks in advance :-)

Anita Wilson
98 Ranger LTX 4X4



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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:53:39 -0400
From: daldred epsilon.com
Subject: FTE 97up - 1999 SD Diesel

A friend is contemplating buying 99 SD 4x4 crew cab diesel. What can he
expect for gas mileage.


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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 09:08:21 -0400
From: daldred epsilon.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?

Just out of curiosity do you know what plant your engine was manufactured
at. According to a long thread on f150 online. com there are problems(cold
startup noises) with the 4.6L's manufactured at the Windsor plant, where
the 5.4's are also manufactured. The ones produced at Romeo appear to be
fine. Also the thread states that if you count over 6 digits from left to
right on your VIN if it is a W it was manufactured at Romeo and if it is a
6 it was manufactured at Windsor.
According to that my 98 f150 SC 4x4 was manufactured at Romeo. I have not
experienced any problems. Does this all sound correct to you guys.




"Mike Fairleigh" on 10/19/98 11:24:41 PM

Please respond to 97up-list ford-trucks.com

To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
cc: (bcc: David Aldred/Boston50/Epsilon)
Subject: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?




Has anyone (Nathan?) heard of the piston slap problem existing in the 4.6l
engines? My '98 F-150 SC makes a sort of "diesel-like" sound - especially
when cold, less so when warm. It was built in November of '97 and I've run
Mobile1 since 4,000 miles.

Also, at all temps, there is a regular clicking sound. From inside the
truck, the clicking is inaudible, but outside it's very noticeable. If I'm
sitting, for example, in a fast food drive-thru, the click is very distinct
as it bounces off the building's walls.

The truck runs great in terms of power, smoothness, etc. But I'm concerned
that there might be a problem (two?) that won't be more obvious until, you
know, 36,001 miles. Thanks for any advice/input.

Mike Fairleigh
mikef sky.net
...Always remembering their sacrifices.



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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 06:44:39 -0700
From: "Michael D. Sheridan"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

Scott and Lisa Williams wrote:
>
> is this list not moderated? why, as you say, would i have to "be a brother"
> in order to own a lowered vehicle? i would suggest a couple of things to
> you: (1) read my first post - i clearly stated that i was NOT taking this
> vehicle off-road; (2) find a different forum to spread your ignorance. btw,
> i do own a 4x2, it is lowered, and i don't think i'm a "brother"...KMA!!
>
> >Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 19:59:24 EDT
> >From: F150DML aol.com
> >Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions
> >
> >I proudly own a f-150 4X4 why in God's Holy name would you want to lower
> >anything much less a OFF ROAD vehicle. The whole point of having 4X4 is
> going
> >off-road where clearance is very important. If you feel the need to be a
> >brother and lower a truck get a 4X2. That is a disgrace to consider
> lowering
> >a 4X4, why did you get it? You cannot take it off-road once you have
> lowered
> >it, like you said its your truck do as you wish. That is my two cents
> worth.
> >David
> >Proud owner of a real 4x4 OFF-ROAD

Lowering a truck is an interesting concept. I am about to buy
a new Ranger 4X2 and I'm not opposed to lowering it as it will never
really carry anything heavy or go off road.

Back when I was in high school in the 50s we use to lower all
our Fords as mostly, in a stock condition, you had to almost
have a step ladder to get into one. And sure, we thought they
looked better lowered too.

We did this with longer shackles which even with a 6 inch drop
didn't make the truck/car look real low.

I'm wondering if these days that there isn't a proper way to
lower a Ranger in order not to cause problems.

If a professional way exists to do this I would be interested in
knowing it. Will the dealer do this before delivery of a new
truck?

Michael
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 07:13:04 -0700
From: "Michael D. Sheridan"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint

Anita Wilson wrote:
>
> Hello,
> When I bought my 1998 Ford Ranger 4X4 I had the dealership where
> I got it install a couple of add ons such as a bug guard, rain guards on
> the windows, and a bed liner. Well the other day I opened up the tail
> gate, and was shocked to see that the paint on the bed, just under the
> end of the bed was chipping and rubbing off. It looks like the piece of
> the bed liner that fits on the inside of the tail gate is rubbing
> against the metal and causing the damage.
> What I was wondering is since a Ford dealership installed the
> bed
> liner is there any hope that they will fix the paint or am I basically
> out of luck ?
> Any information would be appreciated, Thanks in advance :-)
>
> Anita Wilson
> 98 Ranger LTX 4X4

Hi Anita:

I might say that your dealer is 100% responsible for your problem
and it's up to him to make it exactly right for you even if they
have to take out and put in a new bed liner and repaint the entire
truck!

It was my experience years ago with many new cars I bought that
certain things like you have mentioned came up in the course of
the warranty period and I merely returned the car to them and
requested they make it right no matter what they had to do.

In many cases, like the soft tops on Corvettes for example,, they
put on 4 or 5 new tops only because the glue that held in the
plastic back window came loose in an area of about two to three inches.

I can see no reason here that you can't get complete satisfaction.

Michael
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:17:11 -0400
From: Dick_Dorff baynetworks.com (Dick Dorff)
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l

I'm pretty sure that Ford is using two different 5.4l engines. In the '99
combined L/D and S/D brochure, which I think was made available in August, two
different 5.4l engines are listed. In the spec.s section, the new ratings are
listed for the L/D and the old ratings are listed for the S/D. In the fluff
section, the powertrain pages show a graph for the new ratings on the L/D page,
and a graph for the old ratings on the S/D page. I too at first thought that
it must have been a cut-and-paste error. Seeing it so blatantly different
between the L/D and S/D, in the same brochure, in multiple places, caused me to
want to find out for certain. Talking with the two local dealers, and having
heard that Nathan (Union Auto) has asked Ford outright about when the new 5.4l
will be put in the S/D, seems to confirm that it is currently getting the old
5.4l.

I'd love to know how long I'd have to wait (I think).

Dick Dorff
- ------------

Todd E. wrote:

> You have to take into account that the 99 SD brochures were created for the
> March launch of the SD. Ford will not make 2 different 5.4L engines.
> Expect the new SDs to have the same engine as the new F-150s. Ford isn't
> going to run a whole new printing of their sales brochures for this
> particular change.
>
> Dick Dorff wrote:
>
> > Aaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrggggghhhh.
> >
> > The 5.4l engine in the '99 Super Duty line is not the newly
> > revised one that the Light Duty line is getting!



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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:27:24 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

At 05:34 AM 10/20/98 +0000, you wrote:
>is this list not moderated? why, as you say, would i have to "be a brother"
>in order to own a lowered vehicle? i would suggest a couple of things to
>you: (1) read my first post - i clearly stated that i was NOT taking this
>vehicle off-road; (2) find a different forum to spread your ignorance. btw,
>i do own a 4x2, it is lowered, and i don't think i'm a "brother"...KMA!!
>

No, the lists are not moderated by either Keith Srb (admin of
this list) nor myself. We sincerely hope that people can
conduct themselves as adults, which they mainly do. We don't
censor content although the list server does reject certain
"adult" language words so we can maintain our "all audiences"
rating with RSAC.

Our FAQ states:

"No brutal flaming allowed. Mild flames are a normal and usually
humorous part of Internet life. Again, use common sense here."

Was this a brutal flame? Not really. Was is tasteless and
childish? Yes, IMHO. We have people from all walks of life
here and I think list members need to be sensitive to that
fact.

If the lists were moderated, the admins wouldn't have any time.
It already takes 2-4 hours daily to maintain the lists and
web site.

Ken Payne
CoAdmin,
Ford Truck Enthusiasts


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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:31:59 -0400
From: "Eddie Pettit"
Subject: FTE 97up - Adding a CD Changer

I recently purchased a 97 F150 Super Cab. Now In need to install my
CD-Changer in it. How difficult will this task be? For example how hard is
it to get to the back of the radio when the antenna where the antenna wire
plugs into the radio? Are any special tools needed? Also where is
everybody placing the changer itself? I'm imagining under the drivers seat,
although I haven't really looked yet.

Oh, btw, I've put pictures of the truck online. It's just a stock F150, but
pics can be seen at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pettitcompany.com/photos/truck.jpg and
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pettitcompany.com/photos/insidetruck.jpg if you care to look.

Thanks in advance.
Eddie Pettit
eddie thepettitfamily.org
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thepettitfamily.org/

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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:20:41 -0400
From: Chad Royse
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

Perhaps if you explained why you paid an extra $4,000 for a 4x4 and then wan to
lower it, people would be (maybe) more understanding. Admittedly, I can only
see it useful in a place that has a lot of ice, yet never snows. Some one
mentioned an example of bringing a boat up a ramp. Let's be honest, most boat
ramps are not designed for exclusive 4x4 use. Also, this setup could (should)
only tow a small boat anyway. When you start messing with suspension geometry
and load capacity to that degree, you defeat any real work potential the truck
had. You now have a toy. That's ok too, but be honest about it.

As for road conditions, ice (as I said before) is about the only thing it would
be good on. I doubt anyone is going to put deep lug tires on there low-rider so
snow is near useless. Even if your tires did perform moderately, you would be
stopped by your low front end pushing the snow. And that about covers all the
road conditions, except rain and that is not a real good reason to engage your
4x4 system. As I think Todd was getting to, it's fine for an all-wheel drive
system to use on dry or wet pavement, but a 4x4 isn't. All wheel drive has a
third differential in the transfer case that allows the front and rear axles to
turn at different speeds. Otherwise your driveline will bind up when you turn.
Even on wet pavement it can be quite a bit of stress.

I hope you don't take none of this personally, as far as I understand it this
list is open discussion. Good or bad. So as to sum it up for all us
low-4x4-rider confused... why?

Chad

PS if it's because you have extra money to burn, can you send me some to raise
the front of mine and get some bigger tires! :)

Scott and Lisa Williams wrote:

> i am glad that everyone had their fun with my question about lowering my
> f-150 4x4. thanks to those that e-mailed me directly with your advice - i
> am still working on it. as far as the rest of you that questioned my
> reasoning for lowering my ride, the answer is this - because it's my truck
> and i want to. i believe my previous question was seeking answers from
> those who have had experience or knowledge of the difficulty in lowering a
> 4x4 - not for anyone's personal opinion on whether or not i should do it.
> so, once again, i will pose this question - does anyone know where i can
> find TECHNICAL info. about lowering a 4x4 without sacrificing the truck's
> inherent abilities?
>
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:42:45 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint

Is it a Ford Bedliner? Ford accessories are covered by the vehicle warranty
and would be easier to claim than if you have an aftermarket. I don't know
if Ford would pay it or not but if it was done by an aftermarket bedliner
your chances are slim to none.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Anita Wilson
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, October 20, 1998 8:46 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - Bed liner is chipping the paint


>Hello,
> When I bought my 1998 Ford Ranger 4X4 I had the dealership where
>I got it install a couple of add ons such as a bug guard, rain guards on
>the windows, and a bed liner. Well the other day I opened up the tail
>gate, and was shocked to see that the paint on the bed, just under the
>end of the bed was chipping and rubbing off. It looks like the piece of
>the bed liner that fits on the inside of the tail gate is rubbing
>against the metal and causing the damage.
> What I was wondering is since a Ford dealership installed the
>bed
>liner is there any hope that they will fix the paint or am I basically
>out of luck ?
>Any information would be appreciated, Thanks in advance :-)
>
>Anita Wilson
>98 Ranger LTX 4X4


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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:59:35 -0400
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: FTE 97up - Re:Lowering suspention on 4x4

Scott & Lisa,
I just thought of something else; There are blocks on the rear leaf
springs, if you remove these you will drop at least 2 inches, but you
will need new shorter U bolts, from a 4x2. As for the front I cranked
the adjusters of the torsion bars to raise the front about 1-1 1/2
inches. You might be able to do the opposite and loosen the bars. I
will not speculate on what this will do to your ride quality but it is a
cheap solution. An other thing to consider is the lower front end might
cause your suspension to bottom out ( bang on the bump stops).

Please let me know what route you take. And don't let others with
different opinions bother you. I honestly believe that they ( in their
own way) are trying to help.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 09:51:37 -0700
From: Ken Peterson
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l

>I'd rather not
>get the L/D because for towing a 5th wheel, I like the idea of
>the full-floating rear (& front) axle of the S/D for strength and
>longevity (the L/D rear axle is just semi-floating).

Please, could you explain the difference between these terms (full- vs.
semi-floating)? I can visualize the rear-axle in my 250LD and wonder what
would be different if it were "semi-floating."

- ---------------
Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:17:21 -0700
From: Ken Peterson
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Auto-trans change-out volume

>It is article #6698. Far easier than fooling
>around with the converter.

Quoted at the bottom is the key text of the article. (Thanks for the
reference!)

I have a problem, theoretically, and that is that the TC is the world's
greatest blender, and it holds a great deal of fluid. So while the new
stuff is entering the converter, it is being thoroughly mixed with the old
stuff, in decreasing proportion as the stuff drains back out, of course. So
you end up draining out a *lot* of new fluid with the old as the crossover
occurs. So when do you stop?

This method is used by QT-Lube and other quick-oil-change places around
here. But they buy their oil in bulk and don't have to account for the
resulting purity of the changeout.

I want that changeout as complete as possible. Then, having measured the
old oil removed (or what has been added back in), I can calculate the
percentage of petroleum oil left. I'd like to get 15% or less.

The E4OD holds 16 quarts total; at almost $8 per quart for Red Line ATF, I
don't want to waste any more than I have to.

But this is a really clever method!

- ---------------
Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed + Line-X liner, 4X2, 5.4l,
class-3 tow options, LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks/ABS, load-leveling rear
suspension.

************
Measure the amount of old fluid that drained out
and put only this amount of new fluid back into the
trans fill tube. Disconnect the trans fluid return
line where it connects to the radiator (most likely
the top line going into the radiator). Slip a
clear rubber hose on the end of
this line and put the other end in a bucket.

Check to see what the total capacity of the tranny
is. Subtract the amount of new fluid you already
installed. For example, you drained 5 qts out of
the pan and your total capacity is 12 qts (these
are real numbers for AOD-equipped Crown Vic's).
The difference is 7 quarts. Have this amount of
new fluid ready.

Now, have a "trusty" assistant start the engine and
place the tranny in drive (brake and emerg brake
applied of course!) while you slowly add the
7 quarts of fluid. As you do this the old fluid
will be forced out into the bucket. If you can see
the clear hose, you will see the fluid's
color change from reddish brown (hopefully not
brown) to bright red. When this occurs, all the
old fluid is replaced. Should be about the
time the last quart is added.
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 13:28:27 -0400
From: "Eddie Pettit"
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Adding a CD Changer

Doh! I should have thought of this. It has a bench seat. My main concern
is getting the dash apart and whether it will be an all day job or if it's
kinda easy. My concern with the location is only secondary.

Eddie Pettit









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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:06:57 -0400
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: Adding a CD Changer

Eddie Pettit wrote:

> Doh! I should have thought of this. It has a bench seat. My main concern
> is getting the dash apart and whether it will be an all day job or if it's
> kinda easy. My concern with the location is only secondary.
>
> Eddie Pettit

Eddie,

The trim around the radio snaps off. The wire for the on/off air bag switch
is attached so becareful. A wise precaution would be to disconnect the battery
and wait 1 minute. This will depleete the air bag battery reserve. You will
see 2 holes about 2 inches apart in each end of the radio face, bend a large
dia coat hanger into a u shape and incert into these holes. You will need 2 u
shape tools. This will disengage the retention clips so you can pull out the
radio.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier


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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:33:52 -0400
From: Dick_Dorff baynetworks.com (Dick Dorff)
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

I only learned of the existence of the difference just last week, so it's all
new to me. I've got the rough idea of how it all fits together mechanically,
but am not certain enough on all the details to describe it to others. That
never stops me from trying anyway.

The axle itself is a solid steel bar inside the large hollow tube that attaches
the differential case to the wheel (hub). The axle is driven by the
differential to turn the wheel, and spins inside the tubular housing.

In full-floating axles, the wheel hubs are attached with bearings on the axle
housing, and the weight of the truck is carried through the axle housing to the
wheels, to the ground. The axle itself carries no load as imposed by the weight
of the truck, and only serves to drive (turn) the wheels. If the axle snaps,
the wheel stays attached to the axle housing.

In semi-floating axles, the wheel hubs are attached with bearings on the axle
itself, so the weight of the truck rests on axle. The axle carries the load of
the truck and the load imposed by driving the wheels. If the axle snaps, the
wheel comes off.

Again, I'm not completely clear on exactly how the wheels are attached to the
axle and/or housing, but I trust that the fellow I learned this from is clear on
it in detail. It was just difficult to describe over the phone to me. I think
I need a visual, or some more audial or written detail (it was his dime, it was
growing to be his $1.75, and I'd already got the point).

Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the front
and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).

Corrections or clarifications are more than welcome. I hope this isn't too far
off base. I'll get clarification next time I see my friend, in person, probably
Sunday, and post any more insights or corrections then if I haven't already been
thoroughly thrashed on the list for all my inaccuracies by then.

Regards,

Dick Dorff.
- -------------
Ken Peterson wrote:

> Please, could you explain the difference between these terms (full- vs.
> semi-floating)? I can visualize the rear-axle in my 250LD and wonder what
> would be different if it were "semi-floating."
>
> >I'd rather not
> >get the L/D because for towing a 5th wheel, I like the idea of
> >the full-floating rear (& front) axle of the S/D for strength and
> >longevity (the L/D rear axle is just semi-floating).
>
> ---------------
> Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
> 1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
> LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:13:45 EDT
From: Gnfishin5 aol.com
Subject: FTE 97up - Re:F150 Trailer Light Problem--Jean Marc Chartier

You provided good info some time back regarding the fuse location for the
trailer stop lights.on my 1998 F150 with factory towing package.

I am 99% sure now that the problem is in the trailer as the stop light fuse
blew in my Jeep some time ago.

Now, for the first time the fuse or relay for the trailer tail and running
lights is open as there is no voltage to the trailer connector off the F150.
(The stop light fuse has not blown for 3000 vehicle miles and 500 trailer
towing miles on my F150).

If you would inform me of the location of the trailer tail and running light
fuse or relay on my F150 it would be appreciated. By the way if it is a
relay--do not relays normally reset themselves?

Thanks in advance for your help and also thanks for your previous advice--you
were ahead of my local ford dealer.

Bob D.
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:51:21 -0500
From: "Mike Fairleigh"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?

It's a Windsor - there's a label on the left valve cover that says so.
Still, I'd like to hear more about this issue before assuming that I've got
a problem. Any suggestions?

Mike Fairleigh
mikef sky.net
...Always remembering their sacrifices.

- -----Original Message-----
From: daldred epsilon.com
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, October 20, 1998 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?


>
>
>Just out of curiosity do you know what plant your engine was manufactured
>at.


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:20:16 -0400
From: Dick_Dorff baynetworks.com (Dick Dorff)
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?

If you haven't done so already, as David Aldred mentioned, check out the thread
on this very topic in the message board of the f150online site
(www.f150 online. com), select "message board", then "engines", then "5.4L Engine
Problems!!!!!!!!!!". It's probably a good place to start.

Hope it helps,

Dick Dorff
- ---------------
Mike Fairleigh wrote:

> It's a Windsor - there's a label on the left valve cover that says so.
> Still, I'd like to hear more about this issue before assuming that I've got
> a problem. Any suggestions?
>
> Mike Fairleigh
> mikef sky.net
> ...Always remembering their sacrifices.
>



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:17:52 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: FTE 97up - Week #42 commodity projections

These are estimates For KC region (as always), but should be realistic for
other regions as well.

Windstar-
Quad seats (includes SE and SEL) 85%
SE series 42%
SEL series 14%
LX Quad seats 38%
4th door 68%
Cass.+CD radio (58K) 80%

Expedition
4.6L 25%
5.4L 75%
Power adjustable pedals 19%
Explorer
4.0L OHV total 13%
5.0L 15%
4.0L SOHC 72%
Dual media radio (58K) 63%

Econoline
6,8L 6%
7.3L 11%
Racks and bins 100%
Premium cassette radio 7%
CD and cassette 0%

Ranger
3.0L 63%
2.5L 10%
4.0L 27%
dual media radio (58K) 20%
4 door supercab (63B) 33%
total fixed rear window (non-sliding) 45%

Lt. Duty F-series
5.4L 20%
4.6L 32%
4.2L (total) 48%
4.2L (automatic) 28%
Prem. cass + CD changer 7%

Super Duty F-Series
5.4L 22%
6.8L 22%
7.3L 56%
7.3L automatic 42%
total automatic 71%
F-350 DRW pickup 21%
F-250/350 SRW 4x4 64%
F-350 chassis DRW 1%
Lariat trim 17%
Tutone 25%
Cassette+CD radio (58K) 32%
total pickups 88%
Crew Cabs 19%


These represent the maximum % of the orders that can have these options.

Nathan Bernard
Union Auto, Inc.


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:50:41 -0500
From: "Union Auto"
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - 1999 SD Diesel

I have seen an empty range of 16-24 MPG on 4x4's. Loaded I've seen about
everything, Most people I talk too With 3.73 gears and an auto get about 18
MPG

Nathan

- -----Original Message-----
From: daldred epsilon.com
To: 97up-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, October 20, 1998 8:52 AM
Subject: FTE 97up - 1999 SD Diesel


>A friend is contemplating buying 99 SD 4x4 crew cab diesel. What can he
>expect for gas mileage.
>


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 17:47:16 -0400
From: Jean Marc Chartier
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l

Dick Dorff wrote:

> Aaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrggggghhhh.
>
> SNIP
>
> Dick (my wife we'll kill me if I stretch this long truck search
> process out any further, especially "indefinately") Dorff
>
> or
>
> Dick (just when I had every decision point decided upon) Dorff
>
> Groton, MA
>

Dick,
Why not go with the 6.8L V10? It will out pull any of the 5.4's Is
milage really that important? There is about (what?) a 5 mpg difference
between the V8 and V10. Towing should be close to the same. Think about
it. You will get the power and no piston slap. Just a thought.

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:41:03 -0500
From: Glenn See
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re:F150 Trailer Light Problem--Jean Marc Chartier

On my 97 150 with towing pkg the fuse for the running lights is in the fuse
box on the fender well, the 20 amp in position #1 (next to the wheel). The
stop and turn signal fuse is the 20 amp in the small fuse box aft of the
mains. I had trouble because my trailer vendor wired me up using the hitch
for a ground. After I grounded the white wire on the adapter to the trailer
frame I have had no trouble.

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:23:08 -0700
From: Ken Peterson
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

>Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
>for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the
>front
>and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).

Thanks! Kind of you to explain. One of the reasons I chose a 250 over the
150 was that I took one look at the rear axles on the two trucks and saw
what a beefier assembly it was on the 250 -- much heftier 10.5" diff, much
thicker axle housings, etc. Since I am considering eventual camper use, my
choice was a no-brainer.

So I wonder if I do, indeed, have a full-floating axle. Time to consult
those #$%^ !! expensive shop manuals again . . .

(And do you know, there's not even a bloody electrical wiring diagram in
the things? Have to buy *another* $40-ish manual for that. Grr-r-r.)
- ---------------
Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 18:47:35 -0400
From: "Todd E."
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

Floating Axle: Hollow tube is connected to the wheel hub and differential case,
wheel is connected to this hub. The axle does not bear any weight. You can
actually unbolt and slide the axle out of this hollow tube, while the wheel remains
bolted to the hub.

Semi Floating: Not exactly sure about this, but I think the Hub is attached to the
suspension and the axle is connected to the hub, there isn't the hollow tube
connecting the differential case to the wheel hub, so if you remove the axle, the
differential will not be supported, but the wheel will.

Dick Dorff wrote:

> I only learned of the existence of the difference just last week, so it's all
> new to me. I've got the rough idea of how it all fits together mechanically,
> but am not certain enough on all the details to describe it to others. That
> never stops me from trying anyway.
>
> The axle itself is a solid steel bar inside the large hollow tube that attaches
> the differential case to the wheel (hub). The axle is driven by the
> differential to turn the wheel, and spins inside the tubular housing.
>
> In full-floating axles, the wheel hubs are attached with bearings on the axle
> housing, and the weight of the truck is carried through the axle housing to the
> wheels, to the ground. The axle itself carries no load as imposed by the weight
> of the truck, and only serves to drive (turn) the wheels. If the axle snaps,
> the wheel stays attached to the axle housing.
>
> In semi-floating axles, the wheel hubs are attached with bearings on the axle
> itself, so the weight of the truck rests on axle. The axle carries the load of
> the truck and the load imposed by driving the wheels. If the axle snaps, the
> wheel comes off.
>
> Again, I'm not completely clear on exactly how the wheels are attached to the
> axle and/or housing, but I trust that the fellow I learned this from is clear on
> it in detail. It was just difficult to describe over the phone to me. I think
> I need a visual, or some more audial or written detail (it was his dime, it was
> growing to be his $1.75, and I'd already got the point).
>
> Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
> for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the front
> and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).
>
> Corrections or clarifications are more than welcome. I hope this isn't too far
> off base. I'll get clarification next time I see my friend, in person, probably
> Sunday, and post any more insights or corrections then if I haven't already been
> thoroughly thrashed on the list for all my inaccuracies by then.
>
> Regards,
>
> Dick Dorff.
> -------------
> Ken Peterson wrote:
>
> > Please, could you explain the difference between these terms (full- vs.
> > semi-floating)? I can visualize the rear-axle in my 250LD and wonder what
> > would be different if it were "semi-floating."
> >
> > >I'd rather not
> > >get the L/D because for towing a 5th wheel, I like the idea of
> > >the full-floating rear (& front) axle of the S/D for strength and
> > >longevity (the L/D rear axle is just semi-floating).
> >
> > ---------------
> > Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
> > 1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
> > LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.
> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 18:51:02 -0400
From: "Todd E."
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - S/D 5.4l

>From the considerable information I have read, there is virtually no
difference in mileage between the V-10 and the V-8 when empty, and the V-10
gets better mileage when towing. 5 mpg is a very large mileage difference,
in my opinion, it would constitute a 35% decrease in mileage for these
trucks, that is very large, luckily it isn't true.

Jean Marc Chartier wrote:

> Dick Dorff wrote:
>
> > Aaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrggggghhhh.
> >
> > SNIP
> >
> > Dick (my wife we'll kill me if I stretch this long truck search
> > process out any further, especially "indefinately") Dorff
> >
> > or
> >
> > Dick (just when I had every decision point decided upon) Dorff
> >
> > Groton, MA
> >
>
> Dick,
> Why not go with the 6.8L V10? It will out pull any of the 5.4's Is
> milage really that important? There is about (what?) a 5 mpg difference
> between the V8 and V10. Towing should be close to the same. Think about
> it. You will get the power and no piston slap. Just a thought.
>
> Regards
>
> Jean Marc Chartier
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 19:04:27 -0400
From: Dick_Dorff baynetworks.com (Dick Dorff)
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

I'm pretty sure that all Light Duties have the semi-floating axle for the rear.
Interesting note though that even though both LD F150 and LD F250 have the
semi-floating type, the F250 LD is perhaps heavier duty. I hadn't checked that
out, but it's not too surprising either.

- -Dick Dorff

Ken Peterson wrote:

> >Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
> >for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the
> >front
> >and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).
>
> Thanks! Kind of you to explain. One of the reasons I chose a 250 over the
> 150 was that I took one look at the rear axles on the two trucks and saw
> what a beefier assembly it was on the 250 -- much heftier 10.5" diff, much
> thicker axle housings, etc. Since I am considering eventual camper use, my
> choice was a no-brainer.
>
> So I wonder if I do, indeed, have a full-floating axle. Time to consult
> those #$%^ !! expensive shop manuals again . . .
>
> (And do you know, there's not even a bloody electrical wiring diagram in
> the things? Have to buy *another* $40-ish manual for that. Grr-r-r.)
> ---------------
> Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
> 1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
> LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 19:16:52 EDT
From: F150DML aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Re: suspension questions

I am sorry if you were offended it was not my intention to upset you.
However, I simply would like to know why you find it nessary to lower a 4X4?
That is a complete waste of a fine truck. Like you said it is your truck, and
if wasting 2 thousand dollars on a 4X4 you will NEVER use then go right ahead.
Why not save yourself the money and put it into something else or do you enjoy
and or have extra money to waste.
Very Truly Yours,
David '97 XLT 4X4 Off-Road 4.6L
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 19:23:34 EDT
From: F150DML aol.com
Subject: FTE 97up - sorry to all

First off let me say I enjoy this web page very much. I have no intention of
unpsetting anyone. If I have done so I am very sorry! A list member's letter
concerning lowering a 4X4 vehicle struck me as odd and I responded without
thinking. For that I am sorry, it will not happen again. I understand why
someone would wish to lower a 4X4 now. I still do not agree but that is the
great thing about this country we can disagree. Bottom line its a Ford truck
and its ok with me.
David '97 F-150 XLT 4.6L 4X4 Off-Road
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 17:08:41 -0700
From: Mountain Charlie
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

I'm pretty sure the Dana 80 in the rear of Dodge 2500HD and 3500 is full
floating as well. Don't know about Chevy, but Ford certainly does not have
a corner on this technology.

charlie

>
>Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
>for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the
>front
>and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).
>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 20:21:47 -0400
From: "Todd E."
Subject: Re: FTE 97up - Full-floating Axles (was S/D 5.4l)

if its a 4x4 then both axles are full floating.

Ken Peterson wrote:

> >Apparently Ford is the only one of the big-three to offer full-floating axles
> >for the rear of a 250-type truck, and the only one to offer it on both the
> >front
> >and rear (Super Duty 250s and up).
>
> Thanks! Kind of you to explain. One of the reasons I chose a 250 over the
> 150 was that I took one look at the rear axles on the two trucks and saw
> what a beefier assembly it was on the 250 -- much heftier 10.5" diff, much
> thicker axle housings, etc. Since I am considering eventual camper use, my
> choice was a no-brainer.
>
> So I wonder if I do, indeed, have a full-floating axle. Time to consult
> those #$%^ !! expensive shop manuals again . . .
>
> (And do you know, there's not even a bloody electrical wiring diagram in
> the things? Have to buy *another* $40-ish manual for that. Grr-r-r.)
> ---------------
> Ken Peterson, Portland, OR
> 1998 F-250LD Lariat, extended cab, short bed, 4X2, 5.4l, class-3 tow options
> LT245X16/steel rims, 4W disks + ABS, load-leveling rear suspension.
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 20:10:30 -0500
From: "Ronald R. Palmer"
Subject: FTE 97up - RE:Piston Slao in 4.6L

Mike

The clicking noise you are hearing MAY just be the fuel injectors.

Ron

On Tuesday, October 20, 1998 5:12 AM, 97up-list-digest [SMTP:owner-97up-list-digest ford-trucks.com] wrote:
>
>
> Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 22:24:41 -0500
> From: "Mike Fairleigh"
> Subject: FTE 97up - Piston slap in 4.6L?
>
> Has anyone (Nathan?) heard of the piston slap problem existing in the 4.6l
> engines? My '98 F-150 SC makes a sort of "diesel-like" sound - especially
> when cold, less so when warm. It was built in November of '97 and I've run
> Mobile1 since 4,000 miles.
>
> Also, at all temps, there is a regular clicking sound. From inside the
> truck, the clicking is inaudible, but outside it's very noticeable. If I'm
> sitting, for example, in a fast food drive-thru, the click is very distinct
> as it bounces off the building's walls.
>
> The truck runs great in terms of power, smoothness, etc. But I'm concerned
> that there might be a problem (two?) that won't be more obvious until, you
> know, 36,001 miles. Thanks for any advice/input.
>
> Mike Fairleigh
> mikef sky.net
> ...Always remembering their sacrifices.
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 21:59:16 -0400
From: Philip Street
Subject: FTE 97up - Re: Replacement antenna for F-150

>My new 1999 F-150 4x4 fits in my garage, but the darn radio antenna is
>too tall and will really scrape up the door molding and underside of the
>garage door unless I remove (unscrew) it before entering the garage.
>This is getting to be a real drag. Does anyone know of a shorter
>replacement antenna mast that might make my life simple and let me use
>the existing Ford antenna base?

Lou,

I had the same problem with my 98 F-150 4x2. I found a replacement rubber
antenna at Wal-Mart for $4.96 that's 14" high and came with an adapter
screw that fit into the Ford antenna base. Works great!

Phil

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 21:59:03 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: FTE 97up - ADMIN: Give us your favorite web site addresses

FTE is planning to expand the links pages considerably.
Please send us (kpayne ....

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