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Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 19:53:21 -0600 (MDT)
From: owner-fordtrucks80up-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks80up-digest)
To: fordtrucks80up-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #128
Reply-To: fordtrucks80up ListService.net
Sender: owner-fordtrucks80up-digest ListService.net


fordtrucks80up-digest Tuesday, September 23 1997 Volume 01 : Number 128



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 And Newer Trucks Digest
Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
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To unsubscribe, send email to:
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with the word "unsubscribe" in the body of the message. For help, send
email to the same address with the word "help" in the body of the
message.
=======================================================================
In this issue:

learn to weld [tfam swbell.net]
EEC IV [dean etgn14.webo.dg.com (Baruffi)]
Re: Three questions for the Welders in the group. ["Bob Leifer"
Re: Tire Question [Jerad Heffner ]
Re: EEC IV [droberts MIT.EDU (D Robertson)]
Re: Three questions for the Welders in the group. [Filip M Gieszczykiewic]
Re: Source for Technical Service Bulletins [James Federline
Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #127 ["Stephen M. Brown"
FW: 5 speed for my truck? [Ron Madurski ]
Fuel Filters & Transmissions [Steven McCullough
Emissions device info ["Dave Resch"]
Re: '98 Ranger-what do ya think? ["Jim Bielecki"
Late 80's OD 4 speed in F150's [Jim Hodgers ]
Re: '98 Ranger-what do ya think? [Dave Armbruster
Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #127 [Rinerjm aol.com]
Re: FW: 5 speed for my truck? [Joe Maleski ]
Lists are going down for 15-45 minutes for changeover. [Ken Payne
HO or not? [yhtlines surfari.net]
All lists back up. Please read [Ken Payne ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 06:26:42 -0700
From: tfam swbell.net
Subject: learn to weld

Kieth, In reply to your question on learning to weld, I believe that for
hobby purposes the best way might be to find a few good books on welding
at the library and one purcase to keep. find a supply of small pieces of
scrap steel (1 or 2 inches wide by a few inches long ) get access to a
welder, borrow rent or etc., and practice what you read. test your test
welds by putting the pieces in a vise and hammering them apart and
checking the weld for strength. to check for good penetration, hacksaw
accross the weld on your test piece to see. This should allow you to
develop good basic skills and make any paid for classes more
effective. L. D. in K.C. 97 F-250 HD 4X4 52
F-1 50 F-1 panel 95 e-250 company van

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 07:38:23 -0400
From: dean etgn14.webo.dg.com (Baruffi)
Subject: EEC IV

I was wondering if someone could help me. I just purchased a 1997 F-250 HD SC short bed
with a 7.5L and believe that it has the EEC IV PCM. Can someone confirm this? Is it
true that since my GVW is over 8000 lbs that OBD II is not used? I want to get a scan tool
for this vehicle but the auto Xtray 240 says it only goes up to 1995 Fords. Will it work
on my 1997 F250 HD as well? The Xray 240 is on sale for $199.99 with Ford connector included.
I just want to make sure it will work on my truck before I dish out the money.

Thanks in advance.


Dean Baruffi mailto: dean etgn14.webo.dg.com
Holland, MA. Work: 508-898-7369

1997 F-250 HD 4x4 extended cab, short bed, 7.5L :


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 07:50:52 -0400
From: "Bob Leifer"
Subject: Re: Three questions for the Welders in the group.

Hi Keith,

In response to your post on learning to weld: Learning to weld was something
I
was able to do with some (just a little) over the shoulder coaching by an
experienced welder when I worked in an industrial job. I would not consider
my self an excellent welder, but just a "back yard mechanic" type, ( no
insult intended to all those, including myself mechanics, who get things
done without having to go to factory training classes) with good
success. If you want to really learn how to weld professionally, I guess you
COULD go to one of the college or other adult education courses you
mentioned. That would be much cheaper than going to a regular welding
school. I am not 100% sure of the results, but the adult courses I am
familiar with, the instructor is an experienced trade person usually
supplementing his usual income. You could also just get a welding machine
and some rods, scrap pieces of steel and with the machine's owners manual,
or library books, just learn on your own! With practice, and trying to break
your welds apart to test them for strength with a hammer while holding your
test pieces in a vise or something else to support one piece an not the
other.

Anyhow, Keith, I have a used AC adjustable welder for up to 230 Amps, which
is suitable for almost any welding you would normally do, except for very
thin sheet metal. I believe for the sheet metal welding, unless you are
highly experienced at arc welding, you would do better with the welding tip
on the Oxy Acetylene torch. My ac welder is old, but is in almost new
condition. It is by Sears. I had used it in the past for some home projects,
like building a trailer and a log splitter, so it really only has a few
hours on it. I live on Long Island, New York, and if you live local to me,
then it might be a practical deal to make. The welder is pretty heavy, and
shipping it off might cost more than I am looking to get for the welder
itself ( $75 ). Mesa Arizona? guess not close enough? Let me know if you
have any interest in it.
I am at the stage in my life where I don't really want to be building things
any more, and if I had to, then I could just do it at work.

Take Care,

Bob Leifer


- -----Original Message-----
From: Keith Srb
To: 'fordtrucks80up listservice.net' ;
'fordtrucks listservice.net'
Cc: 'Keith Srb'
Date: Monday, September 22, 1997 4:07 PM
Subject: Three questions for the Welders in the group.



>1. Where is the best place to go to learn how to weld? I know some of the
>community colleges offer welding classes, but are they any good?
>2. Ball Park Figure, how much money will it take to get a welder that can
weld
>boxing plates onto the frame as well as welding body panels in place.
>3. Ball Park Figure, Cutting Torch and any other miscellaneous supplies I
will
>need.
>
>Thanks!
>
>Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
>Mesa, AZ
>1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
>1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
>1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box, Style Side.
>1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
>My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two
Wheels!"
>
>
>
>+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 and Newer --------------+
>| Send posts to fordtrucks80up listservice.net, |
>| Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks80up-request listservice.net |
>+-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 07:23:30 -0500
From: Jerad Heffner
Subject: Re: Tire Question

Take a look at Petersen's 4Wheel&Off Rad magazine for October '97. They have a
Tall Tire Pros & Cons: what works - what doesn't when you run big meats. PLus,
all-terrain vs mud tread AND wheel sizing secrets. It also talks about whell
backsapcing tips and has a good comparo between BFG tires (All-terrain, Mud
Terrain, Trail, Baja, and Sport) . Anyway, check it out if you can.

Jerad Heffner
'84 Ranger 4x4

JWater3961 aol.com wrote:

> A bit of a tire question I am looking for tires for my 1995 F150 4X2 and am
> looking to get the widest and biggest tires I can have I do not have a lift
> or anything special like that I was thinking about some 31X12.5 or so how
> does that sound some feedback would be nice
> Thanks
> >From Boston
> Home of the Ford
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 and Newer --------------+
> | Send posts to fordtrucks80up listservice.net, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks80up-request listservice.net |
> +-- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ --+

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 10:02:21 +0100
From: droberts MIT.EDU (D Robertson)
Subject: Re: EEC IV

Dear Dean :

Look at the emissions sticker under the hood , I was checking out my
friends 97 ,F-150 w/4.6 and it stated it had the OBD 2.

Dave
Tewksbury , MA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 09:28:48 -0500 (CDT)
From: Filip M Gieszczykiewicz
Subject: Re: Three questions for the Welders in the group.

You (Bob Leifer) wrote:
[zap]
> Anyhow, Keith, I have a used AC adjustable welder for up to 230 Amps, which
> is suitable for almost any welding you would normally do, except for very
> thin sheet metal. I believe for the sheet metal welding, unless you are
> highly experienced at arc welding, you would do better with the welding tip
> on the Oxy Acetylene torch.
[zap]

Greetings. I was in a similar situation and was told by reliable sources
(ie. friend who runs a body-repair shop) that gas welding introduces
"seeds" of oxidation to the weld itself. Unless you can guarantee some
sprt of moisture-proof environment (which in a car body, with all its
stress points and weaknesses and hitting rocks you can NOT), your weld
will often rust from the INSIDE out. This is bad. I was advised that the
only way was a MIG welder... and that's what I am [borrowing and] using.
I did get a used welder's leather "jacket" and a LCD SpeedGlass helmet
and good gloves. With maybe 40-60 hours of practice, I can say that my
welds are probably as good as the repair shop.... where the guy may be
a LOT better than I am but he's on a schedule and can't "care" as much
as I do. I'm welding up a Bronco II :-)

Take care.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 10:33:38 -0500 (CDT)
From: James Federline
Subject: Re: Source for Technical Service Bulletins

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/tsb/servicemmy1.cfm

The NHTSA TSB site has the summary line included (or parts thereof), and
sometimes you can infer more info about a TSB than is on alldata.

- -Jim

On Mon, 22 Sep 1997, Joe Maleski wrote:

> Well... Not really. What Chuck is asking for is the *text* of the
> bulletins, not just the titles. For example, alldata lists two service
> bulletins on my truck as:
>
> 81. ATRATB290 JAN 95 Pump Modification
> 82. ATRATB287 JAN 95 Pump Upgrade
>
> So the 64K question is, how can I find the full text of these two bulletins
> to see if either one of these fixes will solve my pesky vapor lock problem?
>
> Joe (upset because I have to drive the honda instead of the F-250)
>
> >Yes, http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.alldata.com/
> >
> >
> >Charles A. Biggs wrote:
> >
> >> Can Technical Service Bulletins for Ford trucks be found on the web? I
> >> have thenumbers of the specific TBS's that I need but I cannot find the
> >> text for them anywhere on the net.
>
> ************************************
> Joe Maleski


- --
James B. Federline MinnSoft Corporation
Principal Consultant "Actual Solutions To Real Problems"
----------M_____i_____n_____n_____S_____o_____f_____t---(sm)---
Tivoli / Lawson / UNIX Administration / Database Administration

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 14:35:27 -0500
From: "Stephen M. Brown"
Subject: Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #127

> Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 22:59:01 -0400 (EDT)
> From: JWater3961 aol.com
> Subject: Tire Question
>
> A bit of a tire question I am looking for tires for my 1995 F150 4X2 and
am
> looking to get the widest and biggest tires I can have I do not have a
lift
> or anything special like that I was thinking about some 31X12.5 or so how

Hmmm....probably way too wide. On my 95 Bronco (sits a bit higher), my
31x11.5 required some bumper trimming. 31x12.5 would probably rub
suspension components when you turn...If you don't mind, then no problem.
A good tire shop can tell you what you can get away with, but
unfortunately, 86-96 Fords are not built to put big tires on without a
lift. (Course they look pretty cool with a lift & some monster tires....).

I'd see if 31x11.5's would fit on your 4x2. 31x12.5 is rare (I've
actually never seen em) & you'll get a better deal on what is in stock.
31x11.5 is kinda uncommon, but you can usually find them at one of the big
chains.

Good luck
steve

> does that sound some feedback would be nice
> Thanks
> >From Boston
> Home of the Ford
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 16:42:10 -0500
From: Ron Madurski
Subject: FW: 5 speed for my truck?

I tried this question on the fordnatics but got 0 responses. Hopefully you
guys will have some input.


I am going to be replacing the rear main seal (at least it used to be a
seal) and am wondering if there is a 5 spd manual tranny that will bolt in
there. It is an 85 F250 Diesel 4x4 Ext. Cab long bed with a 6.9 L Diesel.

- --
IF there is a winmail.dat file on the end I apologize. I just set up this
mail package and I'm not sure if I have gotten rid of it yet.
I'm sure someone will let me know. :)

- --
ron DRD.Com || If I had all the money I'd spent on cars... ||
918 743 3013 || I'd spend it all on cars! - not sure, wasn't me ||

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 17:03:57 -0500
From: Steven McCullough
Subject: Fuel Filters & Transmissions

Couple of easy questions (I hope)

I have a 1990 F150 w/5.0

1. How do you spot the difference between the AOD and the E4OD - I have the electrical switch to disengage OD

2. My truck has the single high pressure pump in each tank - I have only changed the inline fuel filter mounted on
the frame. I saw a service bulletin mentioning something about a fuel inlet filter screen at the throttle body. Anyone
ever hear of this? If so, how often should it be checked/changed?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 16:50:47 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Emissions device info

Yo dudes:

If you have a '70s through '80s truck w/ carburetor and lots-o-emission
goodies on the engine, I have found a web site to recommend for emissions
device troubleshooting:



It's called the National Center for Vehicle Emissions Control and Safety
(NCVECS), basically like an engineering extension service to support the
I/M240 emissions testing technocracy. They don't really get into the
political considerations of e-testing, but they are basically in bed w/ the
e-testing lobby, providing technical support for the e-testing business.

The best thing about this web site is their section of Anecdotal I/M240
Vehicle Repairs. They give a very thorough rundown of repair and testing
procedures for cars (including an 84 E150 w/ 351W engine) that failed
e-tests. Apparently, they have a budget of about $500 per car and lots of
diagnostic and testing equipment, including dynos. The stories are good
general info about the various emissions stuff on carbureted engines and
they help explain the relationship between various emissions and the
pollution control devices.

Even if you hate this emissions stuff on your engine, if you have a
relatively stock engine (not seriously modified) or if you live in an area
w/ fascist e-testing policies, getting this stuff to work properly is your
only hope of getting adequate performance and staying on the right side of
"the Man."

(Still trying to figure out my nagging EGR problems....)

Dave R. (M-block devotee)
1980 F250 4x4 351M

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:21:44 -0500
From: "Jim Bielecki"
Subject: Re: '98 Ranger-what do ya think?

> > My question to all of you is what do you all think of this new truck?
> > The looks have changed and so has the suspension. They use SLA
> > instead of I-beams and rack-and-pinion steering. I had a '95, and
> > the '98 handles and steers a lot better. Not to mention its a
> > helluva lot faster. I had 2.3L in the '95.
> >
> Hey Josh, congrats on your new truck. I had serious thoughts of
> waiting for the '98 because of the reviews on the suspension
> improvements. I drove the '97 witha handling package and was happy
> with the handling and comfort of the ride. I figured that for the
> difference in price/interest rate, I could live with the '97. I have
> seen the '98's on the lot since I made my purchase (2-1/2 weeks ago)
> and I to admit that I am not used to the looks of the '98's, although
> I am not repulsed by them. Let's just say, I am happy with my
> purchase and hope you are too!!


The front suspension on the '98 Ranger is the same that has been used on
the Explorer for the past couple of years. I plan on getting rid of my '87
Ranger for a extended cab 4wd '98 sometime in October.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 16:39:47 -0600
From: Jim Hodgers
Subject: Late 80's OD 4 speed in F150's

I have a 1970 Toyota Landcruiser. I love it except the
rear end ratio is just too low. Advance adapters makes
an adapter for a small block Ford with the light duty
overdrive 4 speed that was available in 1985 or newer
F150 pickups. Now a 351W and a good 4 speed would be
nice in that vehicle!! Members in my 4WD club are partial to
Chevy conversion into those trucks. Two of them are
warning me that this tranny is very fragile. Now I'm a fairly
conservative driver so if its not too fragile it might bo OK.
I'm somewhat discounting what these guys say as they are
Chevy fans and might be overstating the problems.
converting from 4.11's to 3.73's would also cure the problem
but subtract from off road performance so I'd rather an OD.
Jim
alfiesty chaffee.net
** This message coming to you from the Mts. of Colorado**

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 18:31:19 -0600
From: Dave Armbruster
Subject: Re: '98 Ranger-what do ya think?

Congratulations!

As far as the new looks go, I think they did a great job updating it
without making it radical looking (I personal don't like the new Dodge
Dakota).

Mechanically, I opted for my '97 because the '98 4X4 WASN'T the TTB. My
personal doubt centered on a new system and it's long term ruggedness.
IMHO, the TTB is a better off-road suspension than an IFS system is. I
totally agree that for 2wd (and 4wd that see little dirt), the IFS should
have much better handling and probably won't wear out tires as quick.

Other than that, I understand that new 4.0L is an SOHC, which if that is
true would be awesome, particularly in the 2wd, short cab like yours. The
rack and pinion steering has to help the Ranger feel tighter and less vague
on-center. Ford overall did a good job keeping the Ranger up-to-date.
Enjoy!

Dave
'97 Ranger 4X4 S/C 4.0L

>MR JOSH J TENNEY wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I just received my '98 Ranger, regular cab, shortbox, 4x2 with a 4.0L
>> and 5 speed manual, 3.55 gears, and luxury package interior. I
>> really love this truck!!! It's very fast, comfortable, and I think
>> it looks great. The regular cab is bigger, which is great, and the 4.
>> 0L screams. Thanks for letting me brag.
>>
>> My question to all of you is what do you all think of this new truck?
>> The looks have changed and so has the suspension. They use SLA
>> instead of I-beams and rack-and-pinion steering. I had a '95, and
>> the '98 handles and steers a lot better. Not to mention its a
>> helluva lot faster. I had 2.3L in the '95.
>>
>Hey Josh, congrats on your new truck. I had serious thoughts of
>waiting for the '98 because of the reviews on the suspension
>improvements. I drove the '97 witha handling package and was happy
>with the handling and comfort of the ride. I figured that for the
>difference in price/interest rate, I could live with the '97. I have
>seen the '98's on the lot since I made my purchase (2-1/2 weeks ago)
>and I to admit that I am not used to the looks of the '98's, although
>I am not repulsed by them. Let's just say, I am happy with my
>purchase and hope you are too!!
>
>Thom Cheney
>'97 ranger 4X4 S-cab STX

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:34:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: Rinerjm aol.com
Subject: Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #127

'88 F-150 4x4 w/5.0 3spd at
I am having problems with hard cold starting. Be it first thing in the
morning or anytime the truck has set for an extended period. Could this be
linked to the coolant temperature sensor or throttle positioning sensor. Any
hints would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, JM

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 17:42:19 -0700
From: Joe Maleski
Subject: Re: FW: 5 speed for my truck?

Maybe I'm naiive, but won't the ZF 5-spd from the newer trucks bolt up
behind your 6.9? It might be costly, though.

Joe

>I am going to be replacing the rear main seal (at least it used to be a
>seal) and am wondering if there is a 5 spd manual tranny that will bolt in
>there. It is an 85 F250 Diesel 4x4 Ext. Cab long bed with a 6.9 L Diesel.

************************************
Joe Maleski
Santa Clara, CA
1994 F-250HD SuperCab, 460/5-spd, The Silver Camel

mailto:jmaleski auspex.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:12:29 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Lists are going down for 15-45 minutes for changeover.

Subject says it all....

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 17:11:43
From: yhtlines surfari.net
Subject: HO or not?

Bob asked about his 95 302 F150?

1) Is the motor in my truck a 5.0 or a 5.0 H.O. ? What is the
difference ?

I called SVO and they said they ran out of the heavy duty 302 truck
blocks about 1988, and when they ran out, they just started using the HO
blocks, same as Mustangs. I suspect strongly a different cam, but forgot to
ask. Heck, the Mustangs have had at least three or four cams since the HO
motor premiered in 1985, (carbed in 85, EFI in 86). The changeover to HO
also gave the F150, the roller cam.

2) Does my truck have the Speed Density or Mass Air intake on it ?
we have an 88 F150 and it is definitely SD. However the 95 we just
sold has an additional gadget right next to the air cleaner on the driver
side, that I believe is the MAF unit for the Mass air set up. Forget what
year they changed over

3) If it has the Speed Density, Who makes a mass air kit for it ?
I have the Ford Motorsport catalog here, and they dont list one
for the E4OD, only a manual and the AOD. Whats the difference ?
Are they street legal ?
see 2 above.

4) Why do they say you have to have Mass Air to do any
engine modifications ? I want to install a set of headers, a
new intake, 1.7 rockers, and possibly a new cam. Why would it make
a difference ? ( And what would you suggest as far as what I
have listed ? )
The SD setup, is pretty cranky by itself. I have one in an 86 Mustang,
and it does not like certain driving conditions and will "load' up the
engine and get to be a real bear in stop/go traffic. I then look like "joe
Hotrodder" trying to blow it out in first gear, mufflers just a rattlin'
away. Lots of head turning. The 5.0 boys all say that SD will not handle
any mods that change air/fuel flow. Just not enough inputs I guess. I can
believe them.

I am not looking for a hot-rod truck, just one that has a little more
"Umph"... If I bought a Lightning short block, what would be involved
in getting it to work in my truck ? Would the heads, etc. from my 5.0
fit on it ? What extra stuff would I have to buy to make the conversion
work ?
My 95 is a reg cab, with 3.55 gears. I'm afraid after driving a 350
GM product, that cubic inches is the answer for torque. Comparing the two,
with equal rear gears, the 302 has more "at speed" Horsepower, for passing
etc. But the extra low end torque of the 350 is helpful. We just put an
"RV" cam in my son's 88 F150 302 4x, with 3.55's, and he is very happy.
Hey, anything you do will eat more gas. Have you done the TPS voltage
setting, and bumping timing to 13 deg?
Dave Lampert

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:06:19 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: All lists back up. Please read

All the lists are back up. 1980 and newer list members
should not be affected and can post normally.

The 1961-1979 list addresses are:
fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net (postings)
fordtrucks61-79-request ....


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