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80-96-list Digest Tue, 13 Mar 2001 Volume: 2001  Issue: 053

In This Issue:
rotor failure
No justice.
Re: Missed the Spring Break shootout
Re: rotor failure
Talking down the 302...
OK I give up  Carburetor
Re: OK I give up  Carburetor
Re: Talking down the 302...
Re: Talking down the 302...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: DTrowbridge webtv.net (David Trowbridge)
Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:25:11 -0600 (CST)
Subject: rotor failure


anyone ever see a rotor just fail?  mine did yesterday in my 85.  the
little metal piece that goes from the coil to each of the spark plug
outputs broke completely off and was extremely distorted with the tip of
it completely missing.  and he inside of the cap has several deep gouges
in it.  i was just curious if anyone has ever seen this happen before.

David
85 F-150 300 I6
C4 3 speed auto 2.47 FDR


------------------------------

From: "Chris and Megan Pollard" <cpollard moosenet.net>
Subject: No justice.
Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:43:47 -0600


Just thought I'd relay my story of the day.

Put the truck in the shop today for a tune-up ... more work scheduled for
Wednesday, including a new carb, exhaust from cat back, and brake work.  Got
the new cap, rotor, wires, plugs, PCV valve, air cleaner, oil change, and
timing done today ... 400 bucks in all.  Drove it back to work, drove it
from work to home, 5 hours later I go to start it and there is no fire.
*sigh*  Looks like a 7am phone call to my mechanic at home to get it
running.  No idea what's wrong.  It caught some spark and fired for a second
or so, then died out.  Then it flooded.  So I waited for it to dry out.  Did
the same thing twice more before I gave up.  Notably I'm not happy ...
especially since I have NEVER had a problem starting this truck in it's
life.  Even after it sat at my parents for 6 months without running ... not
plugged in at -25 ... still fired right over.  I'm guessing when he set the
carb and stuff it took it away from it's little happy place it lived in for
a while now.  We've known the carb was bad, but if I would have known I
never would have taken it for a tuneup!

Gotta love a Ford truck ... beat the snot out of it for years and it will
run forever ... treat it to a tune up and new platinum plugs and it dies.
*sigh*  No justice in the world.


Chris in Canada
74 Gran Torino Brougham ... the toy
84 F150 2WD ... the dead stick in the driveway.


------------------------------

From: "Les Williams" <lesw cyber.net.au>
Subject: Re: Missed the Spring Break shootout
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 19:10:39 +1100



> My
> only real concern is the connection from the second part of the 2 piece
drive
> shaft with the differential. I have broken it twice on launch and carry
and
> extra with me at all times. I am trying to get a local machinists with CNC
> machines to cut me one out of billet aluminum or Stainless steel, but we
are
> still hashing on the price.
>
> Better to be a racer for a moment, than a spectator for a lifetime
> Later,
> Wayne Foy

Hi Wayne,
Yeah, Been down that track.
Replaced the two piece tailshaft on an F350, 351 powered truck, with
a huge, both length & diameter, one piece tailshaft, removing the centre
bearing carrier. It cost a bomb ( about $1500 aud ) to be made and is
so far holding up well. Yes, it is heavy, but I don't really see that as a
significant problem once moving.
When you move up to these dimensions, Real Truck Tailshaft stock now
becomes eligible for use.
Good luck, working it all out ...

Regards

Les, Still lost in the Land of OZ








------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 10:47:09 -0800 (PST)
From: Chuck Badger <chuckbadger yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: rotor failure


Yes, it happened on my 84 B II.  The roter went,
nearly destroyed the cap.  Had to push the truck up
the road half a mile to get it out of traffic.

Chuck

--- David Trowbridge <DTrowbridge webtv.net> wrote:
>
----------------------------------------------------------
> Support FTE - Check out our store:
>
http://www.motorhaven.com/
>
----------------------------------------------------------
>
> anyone ever see a rotor just fail?  mine did
> yesterday in my 85.  the
> little metal piece that goes from the coil to each
> of the spark plug
> outputs broke completely off and was extremely
> distorted with the tip of
> it completely missing.  and he inside of the cap has
> several deep gouges
> in it.  i was just curious if anyone has ever seen
> this happen before.
>
> David
> 85 F-150 300 I6
> C4 3 speed auto 2.47 FDR
>
>
=============================================================
> To  unsubscribe:
> www.ford-trucks.com/mailinglist.html#item3
> Please remove this footer when replying.
>


------------------------------

From: Fred Moreno <fmoreno dualcurve.com>
Subject: Talking down the 302...
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 12:09:55 -0700

Uncle Les commented to Wayne;

I would have pulled the 302 only once and parked it at the back of
the
garage along with the kiddies hoola hoops and bikes.
Now you have moved up a notch or two, in the 'grunt stakes', I
wonder how
long the tranny and diff will be in this world. <VBGrin>

regards

Les, Lost in the land of OZ, with a 351  ...

The Nephew Phred wakes up and jumps in with;

HEY! What are you doing talking down the 302? Just because you live south
of the equator doesn't grant you the reversed logic of etiquette or does it?


Granted this engine does not have the cubic displacement of the 351 but
Wayne is correct with his dedication. It takes a skilled & knowledgable
mechanic who can accomplished what he has. His truck is a behemoth compared
to everything else on the track, and he still managed to earn respect. You
were correct when you suspected he did for class. It took class.

You know I drive a 4X4 302 with 5 slots that is stock with 209K miles under
its belt. I won't count the MSD, Vortoc Air Inlet or propane conversion as a
total high performance package but when it comes down to it, my little 302
and I can make the spousal-unit scream in prayer as she plants her feet up
on the dash!
Maybe it takes a little attention and dedication to keep one's engine
properly maintained although I must admit that my truck has been very
forgiving in this area.
Would I take a 351 if it were given to me? Yes I would but I would also be
real careful of the internal components because two employees here have
Bronco's with stock 351 EFI engines (and automatics) and I was not impressed
when one of these came up for sale. Mileage was poor, performance was (yawn)
fair. I expected more from a source of more cubes.

But I do appreciate that "parked it at the back of the
garage along with the kiddies hoola hoops and bikes", at least you didn't
put my dear 302 alongside a Dudge and some import wanna-be SUV's.

I'm sorry Uncle Les, but Aunty Sheila is going to be drawing mustaches on
your photos in the family album after she reads how you flamed the 302.

LOL, Phred

------------------------------

From: "Dawn Chere" <dawnchere qwest.net>
Subject: OK I give up  Carburetor
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 14:00:22 -0800


IF I just tear into my carburetor to take it apart will I screw it up.  I
can't find my blasted Chilton's or was it a Haynes book anywhere.

My husband said something about a float in the carb sticking and that that
might be why its stalling out on me when I take my foot off the gas.  All I
know is I'm sitting 15 miles from the Grocery store or any store for that
matter, The Truck dies (and the break lights are acting up again) and the
Shelby Charger cuts out at 3000rpms and dies as well. . . Tom has the only
working vehicle with him in Colorado Springs 45 miles away.  I have to get
out of this house, and I can't go anywhere so since I can't work on the
Charger I'll work on the Truck.

Cabin Fever is on,
Dawn Chere
Calhan, CO
80 F250 400M auto C6
91 Dodge Shadow ES Convertible
86 Shelby Charger Turbo
79 Porsche 931


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 13:18:38 -0800
From: Bob Kennedy <bobkennedy qwest.net>
Subject: Re: OK I give up  Carburetor


It' not that hard to get the top off, but the float 'sticking' could be a float
that is saturated or a bent tang. It could also be the needle valve is going
out. There are a few more items it could be as well. You'd need the top of the
carb off to diagnose for sure. As a rule, you can't see a sticking float. At
least, I never have. I've seen brass ones develop a leak at a seam and fill up
with gas. The composite one are best weighed to find out if they are saturated.

Price a re-build kit (make sure it comes with a new float). It'll have most of
the components that lead to this type of problem, as well as a very good
diagram to help you through it. If you find the kit, take a look at the diagram
before you decide if you can open it up or not.

Good luck.


Bob




Dawn Chere wrote:

> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Support FTE - Check out our store:
> http://www.motorhaven.com/
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
> IF I just tear into my carburetor to take it apart will I screw it up.  I
> can't find my blasted Chilton's or was it a Haynes book anywhere.
>
> My husband said something about a float in the carb sticking and that that
> might be why its stalling out on me when I take my foot off the gas.  All I
> know is I'm sitting 15 miles from the Grocery store or any store for that
> matter, The Truck dies (and the break lights are acting up again) and the
> Shelby Charger cuts out at 3000rpms and dies as well. . . Tom has the only
> working vehicle with him in Colorado Springs 45 miles away.  I have to get
> out of this house, and I can't go anywhere so since I can't work on the
> Charger I'll work on the Truck.
>
> Cabin Fever is on,
> Dawn Chere
> Calhan, CO
> 80 F250 400M auto C6
> 91 Dodge Shadow ES Convertible
> 86 Shelby Charger Turbo
> 79 Porsche 931
>
> =============================================================
> To  unsubscribe:   www.ford-trucks.com/mailinglist.html#item3
> Please remove this footer when replying.

--
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.2bigbroncos.org
2Big Broncos Organization
227 Bellevue Way NE #717
Bellevue, WA 98004
206-224-3000



------------------------------

From: FLR150 aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 16:38:11 EST
Subject: Re: Talking down the 302...

Get em Phred!!!



Better to be a racer for a moment, than a spectator for a lifetime
Later,
Wayne Foy
94 Flareside SC 351 L powered
ClubFTE #57
NLOC #484
2000 #4 Top Truck
1999 #2 Top Truck
Atlanta GA
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.flareside.com
ICQ#58060858



------------------------------

From: "Les Williams" <lesw cyber.net.au>
Subject: Re: Talking down the 302...
Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:47:21 +1100




Hi Nephew Phred, and anybody else that may be amused by this thread,


> The Nephew Phred wakes up and jumps in with;
>
>  HEY! What are you doing talking down the 302? Just because you live south
> of the equator doesn't grant you the reversed logic of etiquette or does
it?

Well I at least get first dibs at claiming the blood really did rush to my
head ???!!!

>
>  Granted this engine does not have the cubic displacement of the 351 but
> Wayne is correct with his dedication. It takes a skilled & knowledgable
> mechanic who can accomplished what he has.

Phred, I was involved in Formula V racing for 3 years, some years back,
O.K. - a bloody long time ago, and I can appreciate the work and effort that
goes into wringing out the absolute last drop of HP out of a 40hp Dak Dak
motor. In hindsight, a frustrating time, a waste of three years. Should have
gone drag racing 3 years sooner ...

> His truck is a behemoth compared
> to everything else on the track, and he still managed to earn respect. You
> were correct when you suspected he did for class. It took class.
>
I have had GREAT ADMIRATION for what Wayne has achieved with his combo, I am
well aware at the huge weight penalty he has chosen to run with. I have been
on this list for some time now, with the grace of Ken, and have followed the
adventures of the rebuilds etc, BUT I still feel, If ALL this development
work would have been put into a 351, how much quicker, and further down the
path he would have been. I really do fail to see how I am dumping on the 302
V8.
If the project was being financed by Ford, then that's just fine, but it's a
huge personal price for Wayne to pay, just to prove a point.

>  You know I drive a 4X4 302 with 5 slots that is stock with 209K miles
under
> its belt. I won't count the MSD, Vortoc Air Inlet or propane conversion as
a
> total high performance package but when it comes down to it, my little 302
> and I can make the spousal-unit scream in prayer as she plants her feet up
> on the dash!

Yeah, mine does that too, I say I'm feeling around, checking seat belt
security ...

Phred, with due respect to you and your lovely spousal-unit, and your 4X4
302, I think there is a real casm in the vehicle requirements between 1/4
mile drag racing and an occasional off-roading experience, of course I could
be very wrong ...Hell, Who needs 4X4 drive over a 1/4 mile drag ??? Oh
Bugger ... You mean the vw with the 6 slot audi tranny 4X4 1/4 miler still
under construction???

>  Maybe it takes a little attention and dedication to keep one's engine
> properly maintained although I must admit that my truck has been very
> forgiving in this area.

Your Truck and it's 302 is a damn fine example of Ford engineering, a
careful consideration between performance and economy, built to take some
abuse, but in general, a safe and reliable mode of transport  ...
(Look Aunty Shiela !!, my nose has gone brown ...!!!???)

>  Would I take a 351 if it were given to me? Yes I would but I would also
be
> real careful of the internal components because two employees here have
> Bronco's with stock 351 EFI engines (and automatics) and I was not
impressed
> when one of these came up for sale. Mileage was poor, performance was
(yawn)
> fair. I expected more from a source of more cubes.
>

Now Come on Nephew Phred, You know me better than that. At the risk of
starting yet another flame war, you know I would only accept at a minimum, a
9.6:1 cr, Cleverland 351. For an engine family that was abandoned by Ford 20
something years ago in OZ, it is amazing what new developments are still
being made and available new parts.

>  But I do appreciate that "parked it at the back of the
> garage along with the kiddies hoola hoops and bikes", at least you didn't
> put my dear 302 alongside a Dudge and some import wanna-be SUV's.
>

Oh Yeah ??, only cause I caint spel 'Hi-un-day' or 'Junk-a-roo' ...  ;-))

>  I'm sorry Uncle Les, but Aunty Sheila is going to be drawing mustaches on
> your photos in the family album after she reads how you flamed the 302.
>
> LOL, Phred

She's just going to have to get in line, right after Aunty Flo, and Aunty
Thelma and Aunty Jean, have all had a go ...!!!


I was a little suprised by Wayne's one line comment to your post, so I can
only assume he too has taken my posts out of context, and has been offended.
If that is the case, then please accept my unreserved apology ...


regards

[Uncle] Les, Still lost in the land of OZ











Hey Phred !!











I wonder how many of the other listers have bothered to read this far ...

I do have a serious request of you. A person that is always telling me he is
going to buy an ignition system, I have suggested the MSD 6al based on
personal experience. The annoying part is, he is always going to, but never
quite has made up his mind, I'm sure you know that type of person. Anyway he
turns up yesterday with an armful of yellow boxes  - Ahhh - he's bought
accel - a new electronic dizzy & coil, for his 460.
Now he is on about MSD again - It's all tooo hard - tooo many choices -
tooo confusing - and he has a problem with the concept of multiple spark
discharge. I've talked around this argument before and now my question to
you is 'What is the best one-line comment that will 'close the sale' ? -
short of plugging the HT lead into his underpants and giving him a real
nasty thrill.
You may chose to reply privately, I don't want to be 'flamed' for spamming
!!

regards

[Uncle] Les, Still lost in the land of OZ






------------------------------

End of 80-96-list Digest V2001 #53
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